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** In sword fighting that is much more practical than any of the robes that the Jedi wear. Which would rather have your robe instantly catching on fire from the convection of super heated plasma or fighting in only a loincloth/bra and panties.
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** I say the slave army of canon fodder is more warcrimey than a single child soldier.
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*** You're probably right and she's a different race of Togruta, but the puberty thing is disproved by a youngling extra in Attack Of The Clones. (Her name was Ashla, I believe, which is very close to Ahsoka, but that's an [[WMG entry for another page]] )
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*** You're probably right and she's a different race of Togruta, but the puberty thing is disproved by a youngling extra in Attack Of The Clones. (Her name was Ashla, I believe, which is very close to Ahsoka, but that's an [[WMG [[WildMassGuessing entry for another page]] )
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*** You're probably right and she's a different race of Togruta, but the puberty thing is disproved by a youngling extra in Attack Of The Clones. (Her name was Ashla, I believe, which is very close to Ahsoka, but that's an [[WMG entry for another page]] )
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** No programming or training is ever perfect.
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***** Obi-Wan ''does'' mention that the Queen has a bit of a "My Way or the highway" attitude, and it's entirely possible that she's trying to enforce the major pacifism thing so that it doesn't just get tossed aside. The fact the Mandalorians had gone through a whole civil war which killed her family only twenty years prior doesn't help. She probably wants to avoid another.
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***** Obi-Wan ''does'' mention that the Queen has a bit of a "My Way or the highway" attitude, and it's entirely possible that she's trying to enforce the major pacifism thing so that it doesn't just get tossed aside. The fact the Mandalorians had gone through a whole civil war which killed her family only twenty years prior doesn't help. She probably wants to avoid another.
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* If clones are "programmed" to be loyal and obey without question, how did Slick manage to avert this?
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**** It's just weird, because you have Clan Skirata's brand of pacifism, where Mandalorians keep their armor, honor code and other warrior traditions, but will only fight for their own cause, to protect themselves instead of being just thugs for hire, which Boba Fett uses as Mandalore's foreign policy in the Legacy of the Force novels. And then you have Duchess Satine's brand of pacifism, which is to dress up nice, sit put, and completely refuse to fight ''at all'', relying on the government for help and support. Even if Mandalore switched foreign policy that doesn't mean that they'd instantly lose all their military background and gritty resourcefulness seen in the non-The-Clone-Wars EU. From what we see in the books Mandalorians are practical and... well, have you seen her outfits? She's still a ''Mandalorian'', not the queen of freaking Naboo.
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**** It's just weird, because you have Clan Skirata's brand of pacifism, where Mandalorians keep their armor, honor code and other warrior traditions, but will only fight for their own cause, to protect themselves instead of being just thugs for hire, which Boba Fett uses as Mandalore's foreign policy in the Legacy of the Force novels. And then you have Duchess Satine's brand of pacifism, which is to dress up nice, sit put, and completely refuse to fight ''at all'', relying on the government for help and support. Even if Mandalore switched foreign policy that doesn't mean that they'd instantly lose all their military background and gritty resourcefulness seen in the non-The-Clone-Wars EU. From what we see in the books Mandalorians are practical and... well, have you seen her outfits? She's still a ''Mandalorian'', not the queen of freaking Naboo. Naboo.
***** Obi-Wan ''does'' mention that the Queen has a bit of a "My Way or the highway" attitude, and it's entirely possible that she's trying to enforce the major pacifism thing so that it doesn't just get tossed aside. The fact the Mandalorians had gone through a whole civil war which killed her family only twenty years prior doesn't help. She probably wants to avoid another.
***** Obi-Wan ''does'' mention that the Queen has a bit of a "My Way or the highway" attitude, and it's entirely possible that she's trying to enforce the major pacifism thing so that it doesn't just get tossed aside. The fact the Mandalorians had gone through a whole civil war which killed her family only twenty years prior doesn't help. She probably wants to avoid another.
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**** First in the show, anyway. He did it first in the Jabiim story arc in the comics.
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*** That scene was probably meant to give some weight to Bane. It took ''three'' powerful Jedi to break him. The writers just kind of forgot that the Jedi would probably question such a decision a bit more.
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*** It's worthy of an Imperial March because that is Anakin's theme song as Vader, and this is the first recorded use of Vader's signature move.
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*** OR whatever ends up happening to Ahsoka is at least indirectly caused by her being uncomfortable with wielding a lightsaber in its proper orientation. Vader later sees this as a liability in an apprentice and doesn't bother to correct Starkiller.
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*** Except the timeline for the Clone Wars was adjusted to allow the series to take place during the start of the war.
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*** Mm, as far as I know, even non-American countries don't allow people as young as 14 to enter the military. And isn't age of consent in most places closer to 16? I know it was a big deal that Canada had it at 14 for a looooong time.
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** The EU books say that the troopers, being raised in a completely military world isolated from the rest of the galaxy, and spend most of their time outside fighting a war, can't really fathom what they're missing. It's like not having eaten candy you're entire life. Once you've tried it, you'll want more, but since you haven't, you really don't know what there is to enjoy about it. The books say that given a choice, clone troopers would rather stay in the army and live a life they're familiar with (or rather, the life they have flash-trained into their minds), fighting for "the glory of the Republic", because the point is ''they just don't know what they're missing that all of us take for granted.''
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** The EU books say that the troopers, being raised in a completely military world isolated from the rest of the galaxy, and spend most of their time outside fighting a war, can't really fathom what they're missing. It's like not having eaten candy you're entire life. Once you've tried it, you'll want more, but since you haven't, you really don't know what there is to enjoy about it. The books say that given a choice, clone troopers would rather stay in the army and live a life they're familiar with (or rather, the life they have flash-trained into their minds), fighting for "the glory of the Republic", because the point is ''they just don't know what they're missing that all of us take for granted.'' ''
*** Plausible. Still, part of their job involves interacting with civilians sometimes. So you'd think that a clone troopers might see a family spending the day together sometime and wonder what having a family of his own would be like.
*** Plausible. Still, part of their job involves interacting with civilians sometimes. So you'd think that a clone troopers might see a family spending the day together sometime and wonder what having a family of his own would be like.
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** Basically, this can be chalked off to the [[RuleOfFunny Rule Of Funny]]. Remember Episode 1 of the prequel trilogy? The B1s were connected to a main computer, but they were still superior to an army of Gungans. Attack of the Clones still had them as fairly competent robot soldiers achieving victory by overwhelming the opponent with sheer numbers. B1 security droids are still ables to arrest Anakin and Obi-Wan in Revenge of the Sith, albeit briefly, but in The Clone Wars? BAM! They're forgetting orders, crashing into each other and ''just screwing up''. The reason is because now they have to get chopped up for comic relief, because The Clone Wars is a series marketed at 5-year-olds to sell toys.
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** The EU books say that the troopers, being raised in a completely military world isolated from the rest of the galaxy, and spend most of their time outside fighting a war, can't really fathom what they're missing. It's like not having eaten candy you're entire life. Once you've tried it, you'll want more, but since you haven't, you really don't know what there is to enjoy about it. The books say that given a choice, clone troopers would rather stay in the army and live a life they're familiar with (or rather, the life they have flash-trained into their minds), fighting for "the glory of the Republic", because the point is ''they just don't know what they're missing that all of us take for granted.''
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**** It's just weird, because you have Clan Skirata's brand of pacifism, where Mandalorians keep their armor, honor code and other warrior traditions, but will only fight for their own cause, to protect themselves instead of being just thugs for hire, which Boba Fett uses as Mandalore's foreign policy in the Legacy of the Force novels. And then you have Duchess Satine's brand of pacifism, which is to dress up nice, sit put, and completely refuse to fight ''at all'', relying on the government for help and support. Even if Mandalore switched foreign policy that doesn't mean that they'd instantly lose all their military background and gritty resourcefulness seen in the non-The-Clone-Wars EU. From what we see in the books Mandalorians are practical and... well, have you seen her outfits? She's still a Mandalorian, not the queen of Naboo.
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**** It's just weird, because you have Clan Skirata's brand of pacifism, where Mandalorians keep their armor, honor code and other warrior traditions, but will only fight for their own cause, to protect themselves instead of being just thugs for hire, which Boba Fett uses as Mandalore's foreign policy in the Legacy of the Force novels. And then you have Duchess Satine's brand of pacifism, which is to dress up nice, sit put, and completely refuse to fight ''at all'', relying on the government for help and support. Even if Mandalore switched foreign policy that doesn't mean that they'd instantly lose all their military background and gritty resourcefulness seen in the non-The-Clone-Wars EU. From what we see in the books Mandalorians are practical and... well, have you seen her outfits? She's still a Mandalorian, ''Mandalorian'', not the queen of freaking Naboo.
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** It doesn't help that she comes of very much as TheWesley. Remember that time when Dooku escaped from Anakin and Obi-Wan and Ahsoka proceeds to chew them out for it? And worse, Anakin and Obi-Wan just take it lying down? Bullshit, if Anakin had spoken that way to Obi-Wan in Episode II, Obi would have shut him up immediately, so it ''really'' grates to see not just Obi-Wan, but Anakin "lightning temper" Skywalker let this brat mouth off to them. Honestly, this show wouldn't surpise me if it had Ahoka show Anakin and Obi-Wan up by defeating Dooku single handedly.
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** It doesn't help that she comes of very much as TheWesley. Remember that time when Dooku escaped from Anakin and Obi-Wan and Ahsoka proceeds to chew them out for it? And worse, Anakin and Obi-Wan just take it lying down? Bullshit, if Anakin had spoken that way to Obi-Wan in Episode II, Obi would have shut him up immediately, so it ''really'' grates to see not just Obi-Wan, but Anakin "lightning temper" Skywalker let this brat mouth off to them. Honestly, this show wouldn't surpise me if it had Ahoka show Anakin and Obi-Wan up by defeating Dooku single handedly. handedly.
*** Actually, having just seen "Storm Over Ryloth", one of the reasons I like the tv show better than the prequels is precisely ''because'' Anakin is not a JerkAss Jedi Master to Ahsoka the way Obi-Wan was to him in Episode II. In "Storm Over Ryloth", Ahsoka fucks up BAD and feels terrible about it afterwards. The episode description said something about Anakin having to "teach Ahsoka about respecting authority" and I was thinking "Oh, well that's just great, here comes another story where the Jedi Master acts like his position entitles him to show his Padawan horrible disrespect and basically treat him or her like complete shit. He's probably going to tell her that she has no business thinking for herself and to 'remember her place', which is just submissively doing whatever the hell she's told as though she's a goddamned slave instead of a comrade in arms. I'm going to hate this." Turns out that whoever wrote the description wasn't paying attention to the episode; Anakin patiently explains to her why what she did was wrong, and that in a battle it's important for people to follow orders. He doesn't yell at her, because she already feels crappy enough. When she points out that ''he'' doesn't always follow orders himself, instead of biting her head off he says "All that means is that I understand what you're going through." Furthermore, unlike Obi-Wan in Episode II, he is interested in hearing Ashoka's opinions regarding the best course of action instead of being all like "I'm the Master, you're the Padawan, so shut the fuck up and do what I say." Finally, when she disagrees with him about whether his idea is a good one and tells him why she thinks it's too dangerous, his response is basically "After thinking about it, you made some good points, so I'm going to alter my plan a bit. I'm still going through with it though." If Obi-Wan had been this kind of Jedi Master to Anakin in Episode II, I would have enjoyed that movie a LOT more. As it was, all of the interaction between Obi-Wan and Anakin in that film was one enormous WallBanger for me.
*** Actually, having just seen "Storm Over Ryloth", one of the reasons I like the tv show better than the prequels is precisely ''because'' Anakin is not a JerkAss Jedi Master to Ahsoka the way Obi-Wan was to him in Episode II. In "Storm Over Ryloth", Ahsoka fucks up BAD and feels terrible about it afterwards. The episode description said something about Anakin having to "teach Ahsoka about respecting authority" and I was thinking "Oh, well that's just great, here comes another story where the Jedi Master acts like his position entitles him to show his Padawan horrible disrespect and basically treat him or her like complete shit. He's probably going to tell her that she has no business thinking for herself and to 'remember her place', which is just submissively doing whatever the hell she's told as though she's a goddamned slave instead of a comrade in arms. I'm going to hate this." Turns out that whoever wrote the description wasn't paying attention to the episode; Anakin patiently explains to her why what she did was wrong, and that in a battle it's important for people to follow orders. He doesn't yell at her, because she already feels crappy enough. When she points out that ''he'' doesn't always follow orders himself, instead of biting her head off he says "All that means is that I understand what you're going through." Furthermore, unlike Obi-Wan in Episode II, he is interested in hearing Ashoka's opinions regarding the best course of action instead of being all like "I'm the Master, you're the Padawan, so shut the fuck up and do what I say." Finally, when she disagrees with him about whether his idea is a good one and tells him why she thinks it's too dangerous, his response is basically "After thinking about it, you made some good points, so I'm going to alter my plan a bit. I'm still going through with it though." If Obi-Wan had been this kind of Jedi Master to Anakin in Episode II, I would have enjoyed that movie a LOT more. As it was, all of the interaction between Obi-Wan and Anakin in that film was one enormous WallBanger for me.
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**** Okay, maybe he ''can'', but that doesn't necessarily mean he ''should''. When Lucas contradicts canon like that it's kind of a slap in the face to anybody who liked those earlier stories. I originally got into the EU books because ''LucasFilm itself'' touted them as the canonical sequels to the original trilogy, which I took to be just as good as WordOfGod. Years later, after I'd bought dozens of novels and become just as emotionally invested in those stories as I had been in the movies, Lucas goes and makes prequels which contradict a lot of the EU stuff, as if to say "Those stories you liked so much? Never happened as far as I'm concerned." I don't agree with Traviss on everything (such as her belief that Force-sensitives shouldn't be allowed to fall in love, or the fact that she's responsible for one of my favourite characters getting killed off), but I don't blame her one bit for walking away from the EU. What's the point of writing stories and fleshing out a culture if your work can just be undone and shit on like that?
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**** It's just weird, because you have Clan Skirata's brand of pacifism, where Mandalorians keep their armor, honor code and other warrior traditions, but will only fight for their own cause, to protect themselves instead of being just thugs for hire, which Boba Fett uses as Mandalore's foreign policy in the Legacy of the Force novels. And then you have Duchess Satine's brand of pacifism, which is to dress up nice, sit put, and completely refuse to fight ''at all'', relying on the government for help and support. Even if Mandalore switched foreign policy that doesn't mean that they'd instantly lose all their military background and gritty resourcefulness seen in the non-The-Clone-Wars EU. From what we see in the books Mandalorians are practical and... well, have you seen her outfits? She's still a Mandalorian, not the queen of Naboo.
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It's the new official story or something; read the other comments.
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correct a terrible did not do the reaserch by another troper
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*** WTF are you going on about last troper? Grevious never wanted to be a jedi, he was a keelesh warlord who was involved in a shuttle crash arranged by palpatine so he could turn grevious into a more powerful cyborg that could lead the droid armys and match a jedi. Count dooku had his brain inplanted with a divice that allowed him to weild lightsabers. Read the ep.3 visual dictionary if you don't belive me (which is a lot more canon - orentated than the cartoon seires).
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****** ...which is somehow better? The important thing is that for no good reason the "New Mandalorians" are now officially the best-known and "official" Mandalorian faction by the time period of the show, which doesn't gel at all with anything else.
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***** ...it's not a "rulers of the planet who were deposed later" thing, it was a cultural shift over a thousand years of peace. Deathwatch romanticizes the old warrior ways and wish to bring Mandalore back to its former glory.
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**** YMMV, but sometimes a PlanetOfHats is just better without putting in some unnecessary coats.
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**** YMMV, but sometimes a PlanetOfHats is just better without putting in some unnecessary coats.coats and saying they were the rulers of the planet for a while until later they were deposed again.
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**** YMMV, but sometimes a PlanetOfHats is just better without putting in some unnecessary coats.
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*** Yes he can. He owns the property. It's his. Anyway, they didn't throw out all details. They were retconned enough so that they had actual ''depth'' as a culture instead of being a one-note ProudWarriorRace thing. The whole Mandalorian Wars and ProudWarriorRace thing still ''happened'' in the past, but Mandalore became a more peaceful planet over the millenia since then. The plot of the episodes is about the vocal "Deathwatch" splinter group who want to return Mandalore to its ProudWarriorRace roots, wear the old Mandalorian armor, and wish to continue their battles against the Jedi and the Republic.
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* Seriously, what's up with the Mandalorians in this series? Throughout the entire Star Wars universe Mandalorians are [[BadassNormal Badass Normal]] characters like Jango and Boba Fett from Attack of the Clones and The Empire Strikes Back respectively, Canderous Ordo from Knights of the Old Republic, and most characters from the Karen Traviss novels, but in The Clone Wars the three-part episode putting Mandalorians in the spotlight poytrayed them as ''pacifists''. This troper missed the TV release, but when watching a clip of the episode online featuring the ''Duchess'' of Mandalore he immediately stopped the clip before the halfway mark. What used to be a tough, gritty and resourceful warrior race was reduced to a bunch of space hippies represented by a Jedi-dating woman with an elaborate-yet-impractical hairdo sitting in a fancy room pleading for the Republic Senate to respond to her pleas for help. [[FlatWhat What.]] I know [[WordOfGod Word Of God]] says that Lucas's original vision for Mandalorians was more like this but you can't just throw all continuity out the window to realize his vision. At least the pacifists are all [[DoomedByCanon Doomed By Canon]].
**Plus this portrayal of Mandalorians indirectly led to Karen Traviss's refusal to write the last book of the Republic/Imperial Commando series.
**Plus this portrayal of Mandalorians indirectly led to Karen Traviss's refusal to write the last book of the Republic/Imperial Commando series.
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*** Tell that to the Mandalorians. They're nomadic warriors as well, and they're pretty much encased in armor.
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**** Given that we read about Ben almost losing his virginity to Tahiri at the age of 13, [[SoYeah yeah]].
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**** Given that we read about Ben almost losing his virginity to Tahiri at the age of 13, [[SoYeah yeah]].yeah.
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* One thing that bugs this troper is Ahsoka's appearance in relation to others of her species. All the other Togruta in the canon have had red skin and large patches of white over their eyes. Ahsoka, however, is orange, with small, stripey white markings. Also, Togruta typically have dark eyes, but Ahsoka's eyes are very distinctly and obviously blue. [[FlatWhat What.]]
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* One thing that bugs this troper is Ahsoka's appearance in relation to others of her species. All the other Togruta in the canon have had red skin and large patches of white over their eyes. Ahsoka, however, is orange, with small, stripey white markings. Also, Togruta typically have dark eyes, but Ahsoka's eyes are very distinctly and obviously blue. [[FlatWhat What.]] ]]
**She might be part of a different race of Togruta. [[PlanetOfHats Not all aliens look the same]] in the Star Wars Universe. She's young as well, maybe the white patchs come with puberty.
**She might be part of a different race of Togruta. [[PlanetOfHats Not all aliens look the same]] in the Star Wars Universe. She's young as well, maybe the white patchs come with puberty.
