History Headscratchers / RiseOfTheGuardians

** Outside of Australia, the only continent whose majority is located in the Southern Hemisphere in South America. Africa appears to have more land situated north of the equator than south of it, and Bunny only said there would be springtime ''on'' every continent; it's not like he said it'd be ''all over'' every continent. This still leaves open the question of Australia, of course, but maybe Bunny doesn't consider that a continent or, since it's his homeland, he regards it as existing within his sphere of influence, so to speak, which means it doesn't need to fall in line with the others... If that makes sense.

** Outside of Australia, the only continent whose majority is located in the Southern Hemisphere is South America. Africa appears to have more land situated north of the equator than south of it, and Bunny only said there would be springtime ''on'' every continent; it's not like he said it'd be ''all over'' every continent. This still leaves open the question of Australia, of course, but maybe Bunny doesn't consider that a continent or, since it's his homeland, he regards it as existing within his sphere of influence, so to speak, which means it doesn't need to fall in line with the others... If that makes sense.

** Possibly, Bunny wanted to verify with a view from the outside that the aurora being emitted were a signal for the Guardians to assemble and not just a particularly flashy but otherwise natural northern lights show. He's mentioned to be in a rush at the moment trying to prepare for Easter, so he wouldn't want to tunnel directly in if it's not worth his time.
** It also might not be possible to tunnel into the workshop, for security reasons. True, Bunny is able to tunnel ''out'' of the workshop later on, but that's a different story than being able to tunnel in.

** The mouse is a European equivalent to the tooth fairy myth. It was a nod to other fairy tales. And if I had to guess, it's just about who woke up at the time. Remember timezones are a factor. So while other kids woke up, several others were still asleep. The European division doesn't cover places like North America.

** Just standard kids movie stuff. If there's not a trope for Adults Don't Believe, there ought to be.

** It's subtly implied that "belief" in a Guardian constitutes believing in their ''center'' more than actually thinking they're real, or celebrating their holiday. We aren't meant to take it that children across the globe stopped believing in Santa and the Easter Bunny just because they've stopped having dreams - it's rather that they've lost their senses of wonder and hope, which is what North and Bunny are all about. Children who don't believe in Santa himself may not be able to see North, but as long as they have some sense of wonder in them, they're still considered a believer. (This also explains how Jack is still powerful despite no one believing in him - they dismiss the ''character'' of Jack Frost as "just an expression," but their fun and enjoyment still gives him strength.)

** When Pitch first reveals himself at the Tooth Palace, there's no indication that he knows that much about Jack, apart from that children don't believe in him and he doesn't usually hang out with the Guardians. Later on, he shows some intrigue in learning why Jack is so concerned about the teeth he stole, which is probably what inspired him to do a little digging into Jack's past -- hence him taunting him about it in his lair. He could have viewed him as a kindred spirit at that point, but was still using his usual fear tactics to turn him off from the Guardians in order to prove to Jack that they were alike. And he would go back to being a bully once Jack rebuffed him; that's what he's been doing the entire movie, after all. If all this was true, it would just mean that his feelings about Jack changed accordingly with what he knew about him.

* What was it that prompted Jack to offer to take Sophie home after the egg-decorating scene? The other Guardians reminded him that he would be their best bet for bringing Easter to the surface if Pitch showed up, and he's just found out that all of them could use some more time spent with children...So even though he couldn't have foreseen Pitch using his memories to lure him off-track, why didn't he just let one of them return her home through a quicker method, like a snow-globe or those tunnels in the ground?

* Jack rebuffs Pitch's offer to join forces when they meet in Antarctica, but instead of doing anything more to stop him, he just turns and walks away. Was he really going to turn his back like that? He might've been able to defeat him right then?

** Let's assume that he can't bring people back from the dead whenever he pleases (like, 300 years later), so he made Jack a spirit at the time he died because it was either then or never. It's also safe to assume he knew ''exactly'' what would happen in the future and when (most {{Big Good}}s with this much cosmic influence are omniscient) and the best way to move the pieces to win the game. Why couldn't he have just told Jack who he was, how he died, exactly how he would be needed in 300 years, what his job would be, make him a Guardian immediately, and give him all the information and power he would need for an easy victory? Because would Jack have become the type of person who ''could'' defeat this enemy under those circumstances? He would have spent years pining for the family he knew he had but couldn't speak to, he might not have embraced his power so eagerly, he probably wouldn't have spent so much time bonding (albeit, one-sided) and playing with kids if he had such a huge responsibility on his shoulders and a dangerous battle to look forward to, and he wouldn't have proven himself like we see him do both in battle and through the choices he makes. A person doesn't become a hero -- the type who's strong and smart enough to defeat evil -- by having everything handed to them; you have to learn things and prove yourself on your own. That's what TheHerosJourney is for. Manny gave Jack his SupernaturalAid, but Jack had to undergo the journey himself, just like how a teacher gives students all the knowledge they need but can't take the test for them. (Maybe Jack thought he needed more information handed to him instead of wanting to find it himself, but given how he ended victoriously, he had exactly what he needed.)

** Jack does mention having tried to break into the complex at the North Pole in the past, but was never able to get past the yetis. And the way North reacts to this implies he was never made aware of these attempts It's presumably a case of poor communication; he could've approached one of the Guardians personally, but as noted, he didn't really think they could help him and was too carefree to seriously consider trying.

** The Tooth Fairy has mice working for her in Europe instead of tiny hummingbird-fairies, so presumably Guardians can adjust their motif to suit different cultures and regions. Possibly once he takes up responsibility for children year-round, rather than just amusing them in winter, he can become known as Jack ''Fun'' in winter-free regions and summertime. Tropical specialty? Ice cream and shave ice.

** Also, they aren't keeping it secret. People still pass down stories of Santa and the Easter Bunny and tooth fairy, all of them...The Guardians rely on those stories (along with their respective holiday roles) to instill their importance in children. It's only up to the children whether they choose to believe.

* If Tooth hadn't known that Jack couldn't remember his past, that hints at it being normal for a Guardian to be able to remember their life before they became a Guardian. So...that brings us back to this enigma - why can't Jack remember his? Unless the man in the moon took away his memories, and he would have no reason to, since it only delayed him stopping Pitch because of his indecision...

** Perhaps the idea was that Jack was too free-spirited to ever consider slowing down and connecting with any child on such a deep, personal level. As much as he boasts about understanding kids more than the other Guardians do, the problem is that he only connect with them on a relatively surface level that doesn't leave a lasting impact.

* Why does the Man on the Moon care about the Happiness and wellbeing of Human Children?

* Everywhere I look says Jack drowned in the lake. But... if the water was cold enough to freeze over, wouldn’t he have froze to death long before he could drown? Also, his family lived next to a lake, you’d think he’d know how to swim...
** Even in cold water, it can take an hour or more to succumb to hypothermia. Comparatively, being exposed to rapid cold like that triggers an instinctive gasping reflex that could’ve caused Jack to breath freezing water directly into his lungs. Overall, it’s not that big of a deal exactly what it was that killed him; people simplify it by just saying he drowned because it’s easy shorthand for “He fell into a lake and died.”

* The movie doesn't spell out the centers for all the Guardians, but in addition to North's being wonder, it can be inferred that Sandy's is hope and Sandy's is dreams and creativity. But what is Tooth's meant to be? She only says she safeguards the memories stored in people's baby teeth, not any virtues or aspects of childhood contained in the teeth.

[[folder:Jack Carrying Sophie]]

[[folder: Jamie Being The Last Light]]

[[folder:Jack's Staff]]

[[folder: Jack's Clothes]]

[[folder: How Did Jack Defeat Pitch?]]
* There is a scene (just after Sandy's death) when Jack goes against Pitch all by himself, ''totally owns him'', and even guardians ask "how did you do that?" For some reason, it's never explained, why exactly he could do that. The closest thing to an explanation I may find, is that element fun and laughter is a natural counter to fear and nightmares; but it's merely blind guessing, which lacks proof.
** What you have listed seems the most likely case, in addition to the fact that Jack, unlike the others, doesn't have power that is only proportional to how many children believe in him. Notice how once Jamie becomes able to see Jack, he is unable to use the same attack to defeat Pitch as before, though this was also due to Pitch growing stronger through the fear of the children.
** HeroicRROD brought on by seeing a good friend of his killed.
** It's not that confusing: Jack is incredibly powerful even with ''no'' believers. While the others start powerful and revert to their "baseline" states as the movie progresses--states which are pretty much powerless--Jack is ''already'' at his baseline throughout the entire movie. Yet he is incredibly powerful and only becomes ''moreso'' after becoming a Guardian, according to WordOfGod. All in all, Sandy and Jack are by far the most powerful members of the group. [[spoiler: Further, it's quite fitting that Jack, when able to focus and not doubt himself, could be a combative match for Pitch. According to the book series--to which the movie is a sequel--Jack was the one to seal Pitch away in the first place back when Jack was Nightlight.]] And honestly, when you have no believers and you're still powerful enough to control the weather, the only lack of belief that can damage you is your lack of belief in yourself.
*** Actually, it’s implied that Jack is so powerful because even though his character is dismissed as “just an expression”, his center is something that children never really stop believing in. It’s possible to lose your sense of wonder and hope at times, but just having fun is as natural as breathing to a child.

* Bunnymund says "I'm bringing spring to every continent, an' I'm bringin' hope with me!" ... ... except for Africa, South America, and what's that last one, oh, yes, ''Australia.'' How can the Easter Bunny forget that Easter doesn't align with springtime in his home continent?
** When North America doesn't get their presents or Easter eggs, the news probably spreads to the Southern Hemisphere. And where does it say Bunnymund is Australian? Sure, he has the accent, but he was never stated to be born in Australia. Also, are bunnies typically found in Australia?
*** According to the other wiki, yes.
*** Given the [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabbits_in_Australia rabbit epidemic]] that occurred when settlers decided to introduce rabbits (see: animals with no indigenous predators), I'd say yes, though it's more controlled now.
*** Um, excuse me, just to pull you up on this, but Bunnymund is modeled off a kangaroo. And it's not just an accent, he uses boomerangs as weapons. And he drops so many cliche Australian slang words that I feel like I'm choking on my own culture. He's Australian, and it bugged me as well that they put Easter in springtime, when here it's smack in autumn.

** I'm from Michigan, so I could very well be wrong about this, but don't the seasons in the Southern Hemisphere have the same names as the northern ones? I thought it was the weather in each season that was switched around.
*** Nope, the names are switched too. "Winter" is always the cold season, whether that's January or July. That is why there are so many Australians complaining about Bunny's unthinking association between Easter and Spring.
*** I see...I kind of figured that, to be honest. In that case, though, I think Bunny's center might be even more applicable to the Southern Hemisphere. He says that Easter is about new beginnings and hope, which to me would be more important during autumn when everything tends to be withering and dying out - a celebration of hope reminds you that things will be better once the cold season is over. Whereas celebrating it when I do up here means that there's very little "hope" involved, since all that new life we're "hoping" for is already kind of here. (The "springtime" line is still a little insensitive even by this logic, but remember that "springtime" isn't what his center is. What he's concerned with protecting is hope.)
** If you want to get technical, outside of Australia, the only continent whose majority is located in the Southern Hemisphere is South America. Africa appears to have more land situated north of the equator than south of it, and Bunny only said there would be springtime ''on'' every continent; it's not like he said it'd be ''all over'' every continent. This still leaves open the question of Australia, of course, but maybe Bunny doesn't consider that a continent or, since it's his homeland, he regards it as existing within his sphere of influence, so to speak, which means it doesn't need to fall in line with the others... If that makes sense.

[[folder: Why is the Bunny Australian?]]
* North's accent and costumes make sense, Santa is modeled on St Nick, who was originally a Scandinavian and Northern European folklore, so him wearing Russian (?) style hats and so on makes sense. So why is Bunnymund so obviously Australian when rabbits are major destructive introduced pests in that country? Surely the Easter Bunny has been around longer than the 150 years or so rabbits have been in Australia?
** It seems that people have the myths first, then the Man in the Moon (eventually) selects guardians to represent that belief.
** As for Easter Bunny from Australia - [[WildMassGuessing Bunnymund was originally an ordinary rabbit]] who survived the rabbit extermination emerged in a new world, and became the first of its kind to truly feel hope and understand new beginnings. [[ComicBook/GreenLantern He is thus transformed, elevated above the others]]. Hope is born. And thus '''[[MundaneMadeAwesome Easter Bunny]]'''.
** And as for the question mark after "Russian"... St. Nicholas of Myra, on whom North and Santa are based, is the patron saint of Russia.
*** I think it may just be because he was voiced by Hugh Jackman, who is Australian.

[[folder: Believing is Seeing?]]
* This is something made somewhat unclear in the movie. if enough people believe in a specific guardian, does that mean that everyone can automatically see him or her? Or is it only people who believe in a specific guardian that can see that specific guardian?
** The latter, I believe is the case.
** However, if you know Santa Claus is real, you'd probably be more inclined to believe in Easter Bunny, etc. So it helps.
** I thought it was pretty clear, myself. When they all meet in Jamie's room after having collected the teeth, Jamie, who believes in all of them sans Jack, can ''see'' all of them sans Jack. And when Jamie is the only person who believes in all of them, he can still see all of them regardless of what the entire rest of the world believes.
[[/folder]]
[[folder: Insufficient Snow?]]

** Speaking from experience, that's pretty natural for the area where Jamie lives. (Pennsylvania, going by the location of his light on the globe.) In locales like that, snowfall is rare enough and day temperatures high enough for schools, even small-town colleges, to declare snow days where a good deal of the stuff will be melted away by late morning. It's all about how dangerous traveling is at the time that school starts.

[[folder: Why Doesn't He Burrow Directly In?]]
* Why didn't the Bunny just set the tunnel entrance to the inside of Santa's workshop, rather than outside?
** RuleOfFunny
** Yetis, elves, and Santa himself are constantly moving around in the workshop, Bunny didn't want to take the chance that someone was in the area the hole opened to and would fall in, and even if he knew for a fact no one was there, if one wasn't paying attention where they were walking, they could fall in before he jumped out and closed the hole and hurt him or themselves.

[[folder: What's the Deal with the Mouse?]]
* What was with the mouse? Did he work for the tooth fairy or something? And if so, and if she still had people out there working for her, why were so many kids still losing faith so fast if they were outsourcing their work?

[[folder: Adults Don't Matter?]]
* Why do only children count? I mean, I'm sure the parents would notice that they weren't replacing any teeth with quarters (or ''[[NoKillLikeOverkill Christmas trees]]''), or that there were a lot of gifts they hadn't bought, etc., so they have every logical reason to believe that either there's some weirdo creep in every neighborhood in the world or the legends are all real.

** Possibly only children are valid because the Guardians only protect children?

[[folder: I Don't Celebrate Your Holiday]]
* What about all the kids who aren't celebrating Christmas or Easter-there's plenty of Jewish kids...

** Not to mention, both Easter and Christmas are both related to even older holidays celebrating the solstices.

[[folder: How Does Pitch Feel Towards Jack?]]
* That isn't very clear about the film, but what were Pitch's actual feelings about Jack? That's sure, they both are enemies, but according to the scene in Antarctica, Pitch seems to see him more as he offered Jack to join him. The question is: was Pitch's only goal in this scene was manipulating Jack as usual or was he truly sincere about the fact that he felt alone in not being believed in. It looks like that's one of few scenes where he was shown as sincere and showed some true empathy toward him, as he sounded very sad about not being believed in. And the fact that he had when Jack refused his offer showed he was genuinely sad about being rejected, so maybe he was truly sincere about the offer. But before this event, Pitch mocked Jack for not being believed in, spent all his time torturing him, and even tried to apart Jack from the other Guardians by giving him the teeth of his memories. So, were these actions were planned from the beginning to make Jack join his side, or was it something he did to break Jack down more than he already did?
** He does say that they both know how it feels to be cast out, so maybe it was because he saw Jack as a kindred spirit.
** Why not both? He could have genuinely wanted Jack to join him but saw manipulating him against the other guardians to be more important. He may have just seen it as a way to do both. Also, he believed he was in complete control and was going to win regardless. So he had no real reason to manipulate Jack other than to join his side.
** I see so was that a twisted way to gain friendship, wasn't it? However, another point about this Antarctica scene: why did he want Jack to join his side? The first reason why he was interested in Jack was his powers, wasn't he? However, if he only wanted his powers and being unstoppable if Jack joined his side, why did he just take the staff in exchange for Baby Tooth then just broke it right afterward? The staff is an extension of Jack's powers, so he could have just kept it for himself. Or did he do it because of Jack's rejection?
** There's never any indication that the staff contains ice powers independent of Jack's, or that Pitch would be able to use them even if it did - at best, he may be able to use it as an extension of his power over shadow and fear, but that's pretty doubtful. If breaking it is what seems to weaken Jack even further, then why not?

[[folder: Powers as Proof]]
* Okay, if Jack's powers affected the world, couldn't he have, for example, used his ice and such to write his name and animate ice sculptures to bring attention to it? I don't accept him being, if he was, illiterate as an excuse. He had enough time to learn and his wind can carry books if he couldn't have done that.
** Maybe he didn't want to and was mostly interested in having fun. Or he tried it a few times early on, it didn't work, and he gave up. Or he never thought of it before. Or RuleOfDrama.
** True belief in something involves having faith in it even when it may not be there. That's not nearly the same as being shown or told firsthand that something's real and just accepting it like that. Jack pretty much says so at the end of the film. Note how Jamie doesn't see Jack until Jack creates a frost-bunny that causes it to start snowing in his room, by exposing his center in the shadow of Jamie's fear and despair.

[[folder: Baby Teeth, Teen Memories]]
* How could Jack's baby teeth contain memories up until the moment he died? When he died he was in his later teens at least, long after he was done having baby teeth.
** The same way the other kids' teeth could give their memories back, even though the kids in question were scattered around the world. [[AWizardDidIt They were still connected.]]

[[folder: Ice Skating Barefoot?]]
* Why did human Jack go ice skating barefoot? Even if he was too poor to afford skates, intentionally going barefoot on winter ice is potentially deadly.
** He had ice skates too. You can see this in the scene with his sister. He probably took them off when his sister was trapped on thin ice.
** He took them off to avoid breaking the ice. Ice skates are, effectively, a boot with a blade on the bottom. The blade means the full weight of the wearer is on two thin strips of ice, whilst taking his skates off when he realized the ice was thin helped disperse his weight across a larger area and therefore avoid putting more pressure than needed on the ice. He probably figured that he could warm his feet up again after he saved his sister. Anyone looking to rescue someone will do things that are temporarily uncomfortable (like standing on ice) because the overall aim is more important than being comfortable.

[[folder: Everyone's Undead?]]
* If Jack Frost [[spoiler: became Jack Frost after drowning in a frozen lake]], does that mean other Guardians and Pitch came around similarly?
** Not according to the books. As I recall, North was the only Guardian besides Jack to start as a human, and he was [[spoiler: a wizard who chose to take up the role]]. Pitch [[spoiler: was a human who was possessed by an EldritchAbomination.]]
** IIRC, the Tooth Fairy stated outright that they were all once human(Or possibly rabbit) until they were chosen to become guardians.
** She said they'd all had lives and families. That doesn't preclude some of them having possibly been something other than human.

[[folder: Did Pitch Use to be Good?]]
* Quote from Pitch's character page: "He was once a Well-Intentioned Extremist who used fear to protect children from danger." How, exactly, did he do that? The movie didn't have anything about that and I'm not currently able to read the books.
** In the sense of using fear as a warning. For instance, say a child comes across a dog that's twice their size, barking wildly at them. They'd instantly be terrified and run away. Pitch once used fear as means to veer them away from danger, not outright protect them from it. And the books and movie seem rocky on Pitch's plot, constantly zig-zagging his story and morals. The movie takes place far long after the books, so it's likely Pitch has become a permanent no-good-doer.
** The character page is referencing how children's scary stories like the Boogeyman originally served a purpose, namely keeping kids safe from genuine threats by presenting the danger as something their imaginations could engage with. For instance, if Jack's little sister had been told that a ferocious monster awoke in the frozen pond each winter and lurked under the ice, waiting for careless little girls to walk onto a thin patch so it could break through and gobble them up, she'd have been pretty scared, but she'd have stayed off the ice and ''wouldn't'' have needed her big brother to drown saving her life.
[[/folder]]
[[folder: Why Did Jack Bring Sophie Home?]]

[[folder: What Does Tooth Protect?]]
* Each of the Guardians is supposed to protect a certain aspect of childhood - North is wonder, the Easter Bunny is hope, Sandy is dreams, and [[spoiler: Jack is fun]]. But what is Tooth supposed to protect? Is she just a guardian of children's memories like she says, or is there some aspect similar to those of the others that is contained ''within'' the memories?
** I think a bit of both. She and her fairies protect the memories, which is important in its own right, and specifically, of the memories of what's important- which probably means the decisions that made the children what they are, the times they had fun, even their regrets.
** Yes, but...but what is Tooth's ''center'' supposed to be? Is it just...memories, or...?
*** The way I gathered, though I might be wrong, it is simply "memories". Just as North's is just "wonder", Jack's is "fun", Bunny"s is "hope" and Sandy's is "dreams"- however, they each may be defined in different ways, as in dreams meaning not just dreams at night, but daydreams and dreams for the future as well.
** In the very beginning, Santa calls on the guardians to gather at the pole. He says they "bring wonder, hope, and dreams" (also foreshadowing their centers?). However, he mentions nothing that fits Tooth, except the watch over and protects part, which fits all of them.
*** She protects the innocence of children through their memories and Sandy protects their creativity.

[[folder: Where's the Age Limit?]]
* Concerning the above, for how long do Tooth, Sandy, and probably Jack affect certain people? I mean true we stop losing "baby teeth" after a while but Tooth says she and her fairies remind "them of what's important." Does that apply to adults too? And adults most certainly don't stop dreaming, OR having fun at times (despite all appearances.)
** I think it can be agreed upon that with the way adults (most adults) live, a lot of them don't have time for things like really, truly indulging in wonder or fun, but that the select few times that they do may be a result of the Guardians' influences on them, perhaps so that they never ''truly'' forget what it means to be a kid. The fact that Jack was able to reclaim the memories of the day he died when he was still beyond the age of losing his baby teeth pretty much speaks for itself and, as you said, everyone has dreams at one point or another, no matter what age they are. But the Guardians' main focus is children since, if you don't ''show'' them what it's like to experience wonder, hope, or having fun, then they wouldn't have those virtues to look back on when they're older and they might need them. (Take, for example, children who grow up in really troubled homes - a lot of them have trouble adjusting, fitting in, and such as they get older because they never got to live life as a normal kid should.)
*** Actually, lots of adults enjoy themselves. But I agree with the rest of it.
*** Adults enjoy themselves, yes, but often in a much more restrained way. Not the sheer gleeful exuberance that a child does. Adults may still have fun, but it's not that same level of pure joy that children have.
*** That's not strictly true. Drunken parties anyone?
[[/folder]]

* Here's what I think to be a pretty good question - Jack refuses Pitch's offer to work together so that both of them would be believed in (and feared). This is before he finds out that Pitch still has Baby Tooth, so he's got no reason to hold back, but instead he turns around and starts walking away. Why didn't he try taking him down right then and there? Was he going to let him get away?
** I have 3 theories. 1, HeroicBSOD: Jack had been effectively expelled from the Guardians by that point; Pitch tried to tell him earlier, "This isn't your fight, Jack," and, now it wasn't -- once his initial rage wears off, despair sets in and he has no more will to fight the guy. 2, ShutUpHannibal: Pitch was in full-blown BreakingSpeech Mode, Jack remembered what happened last time he listened to the ManipulativeBastard talk, and decided it was safest to get away from him as quickly as possible instead of sticking around to fight and listen. 3: Although Pitch's speech didn't convince Jack to join him, it did make Jack feel sorry for him -- Jack believed him enough to no longer want to hurt him when the guy wasn't attacking him.

[[folder: The Motivations of the Man in the Moon]]

** Let's assume that he can't bring people back from the dead whenever he pleases (like, 300 years later), so he made Jack a spirit at the time he died because it was either then or never. It's also safe to assume he knew ''exactly'' what would happen in the future and when (most {{Big Good}}s with this much cosmic influence are omniscient) and the best way to move the pieces to win the game. Why couldn't he have just told Jack who he was, how he died, exactly how he would be needed in 300 years, what his job would be, make him a Guardian immediately, and give him all the information and power he would need for an easy victory? Because would Jack have become the type of person who ''could'' defeat this enemy under those circumstances? He would have spent years pining for the family he knew he had but couldn't speak to, he might not have embraced his power so eagerly, he probably wouldn't have spent so much time bonding (albeit, one-sided) and playing with kids if he had such a huge responsibility on his shoulders and a dangerous battle to look forward to, and he wouldn't have proven himself like we see him do both in battle and through the choices he makes. A person doesn't become a hero -- the type who's strong and smart enough to defeat evil -- by having everything handed to them; you have to learn things and prove yourself on your own. That's what TheHerosJourney is for. The [=MiM=] gave Jack his SupernaturalAid, but Jack had to undergo the journey himself, just like how a teacher gives students all the knowledge they need but can't take the test for them. (Maybe Jack thought he needed more information handed to him instead of wanting to find it himself, but given how he ended victoriously, he had exactly what he needed.)

[[folder: Sandy and Jack-Unequal Belief?]]
* I can understand the comparison between Jack and characters such as Tooth, Bunny, or North - they're all well-known holiday icons, so it's pretty easy and understandable for children to believe in them, whereas when most people refer to "Jack Frost", they tend to pass it off as just an expression in the film. But about ''Sandman''... Even when I was a kid, I don't remember ever hearing or learning about a character who sends people to sleep and keeps watch over their dreams... At least, not on the same level as Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy or Easter Bunny - it was probably on a similar level to the idea of Jack Frost. (In fact, I think the bogeyman was more of a universally recognized figure to children, so how is it that ''he's'' the one no one believes in?)
** I knew what the Sandman was in elementary school. He even made appearances in some of my favorite shows (''Series/AreYouAfraidOfTheDark'' and ''WesternAnimation/MuppetBabies''). Kids might not look forward to his visits like the Tooth fairy and Santa Claus, but chances are good they'll know who he is and what he does. As long as they don't scoff and think, "That's ridiculous -- there's no such thing as the Sandman," they believe.
** My question was why they would believe (even subconsciously) in Sandy, but not in Jack, when both of them would seem to be on a similar level of children-knowing-about-them-ness.
** In the folder regarding belief in children of different religions, it's suggested that the Guardians' powers derive from people partaking in their center specifically, as a separate matter than whether anyone believes in the Guardian as a folkloric figure, which dictates whether they can see them. Like Jack, Sandy has immense power because everyone has dreams, but the only characters who we know for a fact can see him are Jamie (who's a total nerd when it comes to holiday figures like the Sandman) and Jamie's friends, who were clued into his existence by Jamie. In the bigger picture, it's very possible the number of people who can see Sandy would prove not to be especially high because he's so obscure -- which might be why Jack shows such an affinity for him over the other Guardians.

[[folder: Why Didn't He Just Ask?]]

** Why would he think they'd have answers for that in the first place? He's surprised when the Toothfairy tells him the teeth contain memories, so he has no reason to believe before them they'd be of any help.
*** Well, you'd think that they'd at least have a better understanding of the situation, as they already have believers and used to be different people. They could have pointed him in the direction of the Tooth Fairy in regards to his memories, and helped him out with the rest.
*** Jack was surprised when Tooth told him all of the Guardians had past lives and families. For 300 years, he'd just wanted to know what his purpose was - he didn't even know there was anything else he could've been looking for.

*** There is a Rise of the Guardian app which states “Jack likes the beach - but only to have fun freezing waves.” This probably means he can go to warmer climates. And whilst he specializes in snow-based fun (y’know, considering he’s a Winter Spirit) we see in the flashback of Jack’s human life that he can entertain kids with other things, e.g. stories.

[[folder: You Look Different!]]
* Why are some of the Guardians so...unrecognizable, especially if their power is derived from the belief of all children? For what it's worth, North and Bunny are alright in terms of design (most notably since there aren't many ways in which you can make a little bunny seem very awesome or threatening while still being friendly toward children), but why make Tooth a sort of hummingbird-person and Jack Frost a teenager or a young adult, instead of the old man he's usually pictured as?
** Tooth is hummingbird-like because, most likely, a hummingbird is the most "fairy-like" creature the author of the books could think of: a delicate, sparkly, fascinating, and spirited little flying critter. As for Jack being a kid, it's a kid's ''movie'', and his CharacterArc is one of him growing up enough to embrace responsibility for others: qualities pretty much guaranteed to be a NoSell if he'd looked like a rickety old man.

[[folder: Seeing Characters You're Not Supposed To?]]
* Isn't it a little odd that believing in a Guardian goes hand in hand with being able to see them, considering the point of characters like Santa, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy is that you ''aren't'' supposed to see them while they're there?
** Maybe because if someone ''did'' believe in them, then on the off-chance they were caught, the person would simply think, "Oh, it's [insert guardian here]" and think nothing of it. However, if someone ''didn't'' believe in them, they'd probably think the guardian was an intruder or in Bunny's case a strange cryptid, which would get them in trouble. However, that still doesn't answer the question of why they don't just be invisible to everyone.

[[folder: Why Do They Keep Secret?]]
* Why do the Guardians keep themselves secret if they want everyone to believe in them?
** Because true faith is believing in something even with the notion that it may not exist. Also, the only people who can see the Guardians are children who already believe in them anyway.
** Also, they aren't keeping it secret. People still pass down stories of Santa and the Easter Bunny and tooth fairy, all of them...The Guardians rely on those stories (along with their respective holiday roles) to instill their importance in children. It's only up to the children whether they choose to believe.

[[folder: Indecision?]]
* If a child never outright denied the existence of a Guardian, but kept in mind that they ''might'' not exist, where would they fit into things?
** There's a difference between knowing something and believing in it. You can believe in Santa Clause even when armed with the knowledge that he ''maybe'' doesn't exist.

[[folder: Jack's memories]]
* If Tooth hadn't known that Jack couldn't remember his past, that hints at it being normal for a Guardian to be able to remember their life before they became a Guardian. So...that brings us back to this enigma - why can't Jack remember his? Unless the man in the moon took away his memories, and he would have no reason to, since it only delayed him stopping Pitch because of his indecision...
** According to WordOfGod, the Man on the Moon ''did'' take away Jack's memories. [[spoiler: Twice.]] It appears to have been out of some misguided but good-faith attempt to protect him from pain because you're right, there ''is'' something that makes Jack different: Jack's the only one amongst them who died before becoming their current self. [[spoiler: And before that, Jackson Overland was apparently--somehow--what remained of the person that had once been Nightlight after he gave up his powers, so, understandably, the Man on the Moon would be a bit protective of his friend, even if his idea of protection seems to have ended up ultimately doing more harm than good.]]

[[folder: What to do, what to do...]]
* While the Guardians are busy battling Pitch during the climax, we cut to Jamie looking at a stream of golden sand moving by. He gets excited, exclaims "I know what we have to do!", and tells his friends to follow him. I guess the implication is that they did something to bring the Sandman back, but what was it? The movie never shows us...All we see is Sandy reappearing amidst a cloud of sand, but there's no mention of whether the kids were involved or what they did to cause it. (Apart from them running around purifying nightmares, but they were already doing that before Jamie's eureka moment.)

[[folder: They can afford skates?]]

* So we can infer that [[spoiler: Jack's family was poor]] judging from the clothes and village, so how did they manage to buy ice skates?
** They probably just made them.
** They also don't seem that poor in comparison to the rest of the people in their village (if the one Jack visits during the prologue was his hometown). Everyone there appears to live in the same conditions, which makes sense for an American settlement in the early 1700s.

[[folder: Why hasn't he done that before?]]
* Jack bringing that bunny to life from the window frost seemed to come out of nowhere a little bit, and it seemed like seeing it was all it took for Jamie to believe in him. Which makes sense - a mystical frost-bunny leaping out of your windowpane and hopping around the room before bursting into a shower of snowflakes is a lot more mystical and awe-inspiring than, say, blizzards and snowball fights. But how did Jack know (or why did he think) he could do something like that, and why hasn't he ever tried it before?
** Perhaps the idea was that Jack was too free-spirited to ever consider slowing down and connecting with any child on such a deep, personal level. As much as he boasts about understanding kids more than the other Guardians do, the problem is that he only connections with them on a relatively surface level that doesn't leave a lasting impact.

[[folder: Jack's dissension]]
* One thing I've ''never'' understood about this movie is why Jack is so dead-set against being a Guardian. I can see how being "cooped up in a hideout thinking up new ways to bribe kids" (roughly paraphrased) would clash with his personality, but Sandy doesn't spend his time hidden away somewhere - he's out there every night just giving sweet dreams to children, not "bribing" them with money or presents or eggs. And Jack knows this. So why does he act like the roles North, Bunny, and Tooth have are all there is to being a Guardian?
** There are several reasons. 1) Jack Frost is the Guardian of Fun, not the Guardian of Responsibility. 2) He has had a conflict with Bunnymund in the past, and only seems to truly respect Sandman. 3) He is upset at the Man in the Moon on account of being ignored for 300 years. It was a "Get in the robot" moment.
*** Jack's been playing by his own rules for the last 300 years and naturally isn't fond of the idea of suddenly being bound up by rules and responsibilities. He also probably feels some misguided resentment towards the other Guardians since he knows they can communicate with the Man in the Moon who has steadfastly been ignoring Jack all this time. He seems to have lumped them all together as a "hero brigade" of sorts that he feels a level of condescension towards because he thinks of them as a bunch of stuffy goody-two-shoes.

[[folder: The Moon's Mission]]
* Why does the Moon, or the Man on the Moon, care about the Happiness and wellbeing of Human Children?
[[/folder]]

[[folder: Jack can't float?]]
* When Jack fell into the pond in the flashback, why didn't he just float to the top? Was he that dense when he was human?
** My best guess is that the Man in the Moon was able to keep him from floating to the surface, probably to spare his sister the trauma of seeing his frozen corpse lying there and to keep her and others from endangering themselves to try and recover the body.
[[/folder]]

[[folder: Is the Mouse a Guardian?]]
* So, a previous headscratcher established that the mouse is a nod to European mythology and that the confusion might have come from a European kid visiting North America... but another question about the mouse is... ''is it also a guardian''? Because it does the same job as Tooth, but Pitch doesn't seem to be going after it, and it doesn't attend meetings.
** The mouse is probably comparable to the yetis and the elves who work at the North Pole, as well as the smaller fairies that Tooth has done the collecting for her. Early in the movie, the four Guardians give a nod to other folkloric creatures that exist who ''aren't'' direct Guardians when the Man in the Moon is choosing a new one -- Sandy suggests it could be a leprechaun and Bunny mentions the existence of the groundhog tied to Groundhog's Day. "Guardian" is a bestowed title given to figures with centers that cater to a certain aspect of childhood, not a catch-all term for any mythical being.
** As for why the mouse hasn't been targeted by Pitch, we don't know that it hasn't. If we assume the mice do ultimately work for Tooth, the Nightmares could still be in the process of capturing them all, just like they'd be sent after any fairies who weren't at the Tooth Palace during the attack. Pitch doesn't need to incapacitate every last one of them, anyway; he just needs to capture enough of them that people stop believing in the Guardians, and then even the ones who remain free (like Baby Tooth, as an example) will still run out of power.
[[/folder]]

* So children who don't believe in Jack Frost pass right through him if contact is made, but in the middle of the film, he carries Sophia in his arms as he returns her home? Had he ever tried touching someone before? Would that work? I'm assuming that since Sophie is a very young child, the rules of belief in the Guardians don't apply to her, so if Jack was able to physically touch someone else, how would they react to it?

** If you want to get technical, outside of Australia, the only continent whose majority is located in the Southern Hemisphere in South America. Africa appears to have more land situated north of the equator than south of it, and Bunny only said there would be springtime ''on'' every continent; it's not like he said it'd be ''all over'' every continent. This still leaves open the question of Australia, of course, but maybe Bunny doesn't consider that a continent or, since it's his homeland, he regards it as existing within his sphere of influence, so to speak, which means it doesn't need to fall in line with the others... If that makes sense.

* Why do only children count? I mean, I'm sure the parents would notice that they weren't replacing any teeth with quarters (or ''[[NoKillLikeOverkill Christmas trees]]''), or that there were a lot of gifts they hadn't bought, etc., so they have every logical reason to believe that there's either some weirdo creep in every neighborhood in the world of the legends are all real.

* That isn't very clear about the film, but what were Pitch's actual feelings about Jack? That's sure, they both are enemies, but according to the scene in Antarctica, Pitch seems to see him more as he offered Jack to join him. The question is: was Pitch's only goal in this scene was manipulating Jack as usual or was he truly sincere about the fact that he felt alone in not being believed in. It looks like that's one of few scenes where he was shown as sincere and showed some true empathy toward him, as he sounded very sad about not being believed in. And the fact that he had when Jack refused his offer showed he was genuinely sad about being rejected, so maybe he was truly sincere about the offer. But before this event, Pitch mocked Jack for not being believed in, spent all his time torturing him, and even tried to apart Jack from the other Guardians by giving him the teeth of his memories. So, where these actions were planned from the beginning to make Jack join his side, or was it something he did to break Jack down more than he already did?

** There's never any indication that the staff contains ice powers independent of Jack's, or that Pitch would be able to use them even if it did - at best, he may be able to use it as an extension of his power overshadow and fear, but that's pretty doubtful. If breaking it is what seems to weaken Jack even further, then why not?

* Each of the Guardians is supposed to protect a certain aspect of childhood - North is wonder, the Easter Bunny is hope, Sandy is dreams, and [[spoiler: Jack is fun]]. But what is Tooth supposed to protect? Is she just a guardian of children's memories like she says, or is there some aspect similar to those of the others that are contained ''within'' the memories?

* I can understand the comparison between Jack and characters such as Tooth, Bunny, or North - they're all well-known holiday icons, so it's pretty easy and understandable for children to believe in them, whereas when most people refer to "Jack Frost", they tend to pass it off as just an expression in the film. But about ''Sandman''... Even when I was a kid, I don't remember ever hearing or learning about a character who sends people to sleep and keeps watch over their dreams... At least, not on the same level, like Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy or Easter Bunny - it was probably on a similar level to the idea of Jack Frost. (In fact, I think the bogeyman was more of a universally recognized figure to children, so how is it that ''he's'' the one no one believes in?)

*** Who's to say he didn't? For all we know, he probably ''did'' spend those 300 years asking for help, only to be ignored the whole time. Heck, even Bunnymund didn't like Jack and only saw him for his snowstorms and that aforementioned blizzard.

* One thing I've ''never'' understood about this movie is why Jack is so dead-set against being a Guardian. I can see how being "cooped up in a hideout thinking up new ways to bribe kids" (roughly paraphrased) would clash with his personality, but Sandy doesn't spend his time hidden away somewhere - he's out there every night just giving sweet dreams to children, not "bribing" them with money or presents or eggs. And Jack knows this. So why does he act like the roles North, Bunny, and Tooth have are all there is to be a Guardian?

** Expanding on the third point mentioned above, because he's been ignored for 300 years, not just by the Man in the Moon, but ''every single spirit'' in the world, including the Big Four...honestly, can any of us blame him for saying no? Heck, I would've given the same answer if they did that to me. (I just would've given a ReasonYouSuckSpeech instead of the one Jack gave in the movie)

*** Who's to say he didn't? For all we know, he probably ''did'' spend those 300 years asking for help, only to be ignored the whole time. Heck, even Bunnymund didn't like Jack and only saw him for his snowstorms and that aforementioned blizzard.

*** Expanding on the third point mentioned above, because he's been ignored for 300 years, not just by the Man in the Moon, but ''every single spirit'' in the world, including the Big Four...honestly, can any of us blame him for saying no? Heck, I would've given the same answer if they did that to me. (I just would've given a ReasonYouSuckSpeech instead of the one Jack gave in the movie)

* So children who don't believe in Jack Frost pass right through him if contact his made, but in the middle of the film, he carries Sophia in his arms as he returns her home? Had he ever tried touching someone before? Would that work? I'm assuming that since Sophie is a very young child, the rules of belief in the Guardians don't really apply to her, so if Jack was able to physically touch someone else, how would they react to it?

[[folder:Jamie Being The Last Light]]

** Check the "Fridge Logic" page. It says this there. Twice, actually. They were really close together, only a room apart, so their lights were probably so close Pitch thought they were one (heck, on that globe an entire city is pretty much a dot). Or Sophie was just too young to actually even understand the concept of "belief". For example, Christmas is that day where toys appear under a tree decorated with glowy thingies.
** Indeed, note that Sophie displays absolutely zero surprise at seeing the Guardians, or any of the wacky stuff she encounters. She's just too little for her belief to be a matter of faith, it's all "Ooo, that thing I've seen before that I like!"

** [[spoiler: As the staff is what he'd used to save his sister, proving himself worthy of the Man in the Moon's favor, it had probably been a receptacle for his Guardian powers all along: he just didn't realize it, because he wasn't actually using them to ''protect'' kids (as opposed to showing them a good time), so was operating at a low ebb for all those years. That's why Jack himself was caught off-guard when his powers got so much stronger once he directed them against a genuine threat.]]

** He probably lost the cloak at some point in his history. He spends a lot of his time being tossed around in rough winter winds -- it's easy to imagine that the cloak was blown off during one of his flights. The origin of the hoodie is also easily explained, in that he probably swiped it from somewhere out of desire to wear something that would cling to him a bit more easily while in flight.

* There is a scene (just after Sandy's death) when Jack goes against Pitch all by himself, ''totally owns him'', and even guardians ask "how did you do that?" For some reason, it's never explained, why exactly he could do that. The closest thing to explanation I may find, is that element fun and laughter is natural counter to fear and nightmares; but it's merely blind guessing, which lacks proof.

** It's not that confusing: Jack is obviously incredibly powerful even with ''no'' believers. While the others start off powerful and revert to their "baseline" states as the movie progresses--states which are pretty much powerless--Jack is ''already'' at his baseline throughout the entire movie. Yet he is incredibly powerful and only becomes ''moreso'' after becoming a Guardian, according to WordOfGod. All in all, Sandy and Jack are by far the most powerful members of the group. [[spoiler:Further, it's actually quite fitting that Jack, when able to focus and not doubt himself, could be a combative match for Pitch. According to the book series--to which the movie is a sequel--Jack was the one to seal Pitch away in the first place back when Jack was Nightlight.]] And honestly, when you have no believers and you're still powerful enough to control the weather, the only lack of belief that can damage you is your lack of belief in yourself.

*** Um, excuse me, just to pull you up on this, but Bunnymund is clearly modeled off a kangaroo. And it's not just an accent, he uses boomerangs as weapons. And he drops so many cliche Australian slang words that I feel like I'm choking on my own culture. He's definitely Australian, and it bugged me as well that they put Easter in springtime, when here it's smack in autumn.

*** Nope, the names are switched too. "Winter" is always the cold season, whether that's January or July. That is, in fact, why there are so many Australians complaining about Bunny's unthinking association between Easter and Spring.
*** I see...I kind of figured that, to be honest. In that case, though, I think Bunny's center might be even more applicable to the Southern Hemisphere. He says that Easter is about new beginnings and hope, which to me would be more important during autumn, when everything tends to be withering and dying out - a celebration of hope reminds you that things will be better once the cold season is over. Whereas celebrating it when I do up here means that there's very little "hope" involved, since all that new life we're "hoping" for is already kind of here. (The "springtime" line is still a little insensitive even by this logic, but remember that "springtime" isn't what his center is. What he's really concerned with protecting is hope.)
** If you want to get technical, outside of Australia, the only continent whose majority is located in the Southern Hemisphere is South America. Africa appears to have more land situated north of the equator than south of it, and Bunny only said there would be springtime ''on'' every continent; it's not like he said it'd be ''all over'' every continent. This still leaves open the question of Australia, of course, but maybe Bunny doesn't consider that a continent or, since it's his homeland, he regards it as existing within his sphere of influence, so to speak, which means it doesn't need to fall in line with the others... If that makes sense.

* North's accent and costumes make sense, Santa is modelled on St Nick, who was originally a Scandinavian and Northern European folklore, so him wearing Russian (?) style hats and so on makes sense. So why is Bunnymund so obviously Australian when rabbits are major destructive introduced pests in that country? Surely the Easter Bunny has been around longer than the 150 years or so rabbits have been in Australia?

** And as for the question mark after "Russian"... St. Nicholas of Myra, on whom North and Santa are based on, is actually the patron saint of Russia.

* This is something made somewhat unclear in the movie. if enough people believe in a specific guardian, does that mean that everyone can automatically see him or her? Or is it only people who believe in a specific guardian that can see that specific guardian.

** Speaking from experience, that's actually pretty natural for the area where Jamie lives. (Pennsylvania, going by the location of his light on the globe.) In locales like that, snowfall is rare enough and day temperatures high enough for schools, even small-town colleges, to declare snow days where a good deal of the stuff will be melted away by late morning. It's all about how dangerous travelling is at the time that school starts.

** Yetis, elves and Santa himself are constantly moving around in the workshop, Bunny didn't want to take the chance that someone was in the area the hole opened to and would fall in, and even if he knew for a fact no one was there, if one wasn't paying attention where they were walking, they could fall in before he jumped out and closed the hole, and hurt him or themselves.

** Possibly, Bunny wanted to verify with a view from the outside that the aurora being emitted were actually a signal for the Guardians to assemble and not just a particularly flashy but otherwise natural northern lights show. He's mentioned to be in a rush at the moment trying to prepare for Easter, so he wouldn't want to tunnel directly in if it's not actually worth his time.

* What was with the mouse? Did he work for the tooth fairy or something? And if so, and if she still had people out there working for her, why were so many kids still losing faith so fast if they were apparently outsourcing their work?

* Why do only children count? I mean, I'm sure the parents would notice that they weren't replacing any teeth with quarters (or ''[[NoKillLikeOverkill Christmas trees]]''), or that there were a lot of gifts they hadn't bought, etc., so they have every logical reason to believe that there's either some weirdo creep in every neighbourhood in the world or the legends are all real.

** The Tooth Fairy and Sandman are wholly secular. And while Santa and the Easter Bunny are associated with Christian/Catholic holidays, they're really just big jolly figures that even other kids probably enjoy the sight and thought of. Anyway, the Guardians protect all children, including the ones that don't believe in them, so it's not like it matters in the big scheme of things.

* That isn't very clear about the film, but what were Pitch's actual feelings about Jack? That's sure, they both are enemies, but according to the scene in Antarctica, Pitch seems to see him more as he offered Jack to join him. The question is: was Pitch's only goal in this scene was manipulating Jack as usual, or was he truly sincere about the fact that he felt alone of not being believed in. It looks like that's one of few scenes where he was shown as sincere and actually showed some true empathy toward him, as he sounded very sad to not being believed in. And the face that he had when Jack refused his offer showed he was genuinely sad about being rejected, so maybe he was truly sincere about the offer. But before this event, Pitch definitely mocked Jack for not being believed in, spent all his time to torture him and even tried to apart Jack from the others Guardians by giving him the teeth of his memories. So, were these actions were planned from the beginning to make Jack joining his side, or was it something he did to break Jack down more than he already did?

** Why not both? He could have genuinely wanted Jack to join him, but saw manipulating him against the other guardians to be more important. He may have just seen it as a way to do both. Also, he clearly believed he was in complete control and was going to win regardless. So he had no real reason to manipulate Jack other than to join his side.
** I see so was that a twisted way to gain friendship, wasn't it? However, another point about this Antartica scene: why did he want Jack to join his side? Apparently, the first reason why he was interested in Jack was his powers wasn't he? However, if he only wanted his powers and being unstoppable if Jack joined his side, why did he just take the staff in exchange of Baby Tooth then just broke it right afterward? The staff is apparently an extension of Jack's powers, so he could have just kept it for himself. Or did he do it because Jack's rejection?
** There's never any indication that the staff contains ice powers independent of Jack's, or that Pitch would be able to use them even if it did - at best, he may be able to use it as an extension of his own power over shadow and fear, but that's pretty doubtful. If breaking it is what seems to weaken Jack even further, then why not?

* Okay, if Jack's powers affected the world, couldn't he have, for example, used his ice and such to write his name and animate ice sculptures to bring attention to it? I don't accept him being, if he was, illiterate as excuse. He had enough time to learn and his wind can carry books, if he himself couldn't have done that.
** Maybe he didn't want to, and was mostly interested in having fun. Or he tried it a few times early on, it didn't work, and he gave up. Or he never thought of it before. Or RuleOfDrama.
** True belief in something involves having faith in it even when it may not be there. That's not nearly the same as being shown or told firsthand that something's real and just accepting it like that. Jack pretty much says so at the end of the film. Note how Jamie doesn't see Jack until Jack creates a frost bunny that causes it to start snowing in his room, by exposing his center in the shadow of Jamie's fear and despair.

* How could Jack's baby teeth contain memories up until the moment he died? When he died he was in his latter teens at least, long after he was done having baby teeth.

** He took them off to avoid breaking the ice. Ice skates are, effectively, a boot with a blade on the bottom. The blade means the full weight of the wearer is on two thin strips of ice, whilst taking his skates off when he realised the ice was thin helped disperse his weight across a larger area and therefore avoid putting more pressure than needed on the ice. He probably figured that he could warm his feet up again after he saved his sister. Anyone looking to rescue someone will do things that are temporarily uncomfortable (like standing on ice) because the overall aim is more important than being comfortable.

* If Jack Frost [[spoiler: became Jack Frost after drowning in a frozen lake]], does that mean other Guardians and Pitch came around in a similar manner?
** Not according to the books. As I recall, North was the only Guardian besides Jack to start off as a human, and he was [[spoiler: a wizard who chose to take up the role]]. Pitch [[spoiler: was a human who was possessed by an EldritchAbomination.]]

** In the sense of using fear as warning. For instance, say a child comes across a dog that's twice their size, barking wildly at them. They'd instantly be terrified and run away. Pitch once used fear as means to veer them away from danger, not outright protect them from it. And the books and movie seem rocky on Pitch's plot, constantly zig-zagging his story and morals. The movie takes place far long after the books, so it's likely Pitch has become a permanent no-good-doer.
** The character page is referencing how children's scare-stories like the Boogeyman originally served a purpose, namely keeping kids safe from genuine threats by presenting the danger as something their imaginations could engage with. For instance, if Jack's little sister had been told that a ferocious monster awoke in the frozen pond each winter and lurked under the ice, waiting for careless little girls to walk onto a thin patch so it could break through and gobble them up, she'd have been pretty scared, but she'd have stayed off the ice and ''wouldn't'' have needed her big brother to drown saving her life.

** Bunny sure was needed at that moment, being the leader of the ordeal. Perhaps Jack simply got excited? He liked being in Burgess and he was probably thrilled to find out that he could actually hold Sophie, as opposed to passing through her.

* Each of the Guardians is supposed to protect a certain aspect of childhood - North is wonder, the Easter Bunny is hope, Sandy is dreams, and [[spoiler: Jack is fun]]. But what is Tooth supposed to protect? Is she just a guardian of children's memories like she says, or is there some aspect similar to those of the others that is contained ''within'' the memories?

*** The way I gathered, though I might be wrong, it is simply "memories". Just as North's is just "wonder", Jack's is "fun", Bunny"s is "hope" and Sandy's is "dreams"- however they each may be defined in different ways, as in dreams meaning not just dreams at night, but daydreams and dreams for the future as well.
** In the very beginning, Santa calls on the guardians to gather at the pole. He says they "bring wonder, hope and dreams" (also foreshadowing their centers?). However, he mentions nothing that fits Tooth, except the watch over and protect part, which fits all of them.

* In relation to the above, for how long do Tooth, Sandy and probably Jack have an effect on certain people? I mean true we stop losing "baby teeth" after a while but Tooth says she and her fairies remind "them of what's important." Does that apply to adults too? And adults most certainly don't stop dreaming, OR having fun at times (despite all appearances.)
** I think it can be agreed upon that with the way adults (most adults) live, a lot of them don't really have time for things like really, truly indulging in wonder or fun, but that the select few times that they do may be a result of the Guardians' influences on them, perhaps so that they never ''truly'' forget what it means to be a kid. The fact that Jack was able to reclaim the memories of the day he died when he was still beyond the age of losing his baby teeth pretty much speaks for itself and, as you said, everyone has dreams at one point or another, no matter what age they are. But the Guardians' main focus is children since, if you don't ''show'' them what it's like to experience wonder, hope, or having fun, then they wouldn't have those virtues to look back on when they're older and they might really need them. (Take, for example, children who grow up in really troubled homes - a lot of them have trouble adjusting, fitting in, and such as they get older because they never got to live life as a normal kid should.)

* Here's what I think to be a pretty good question - Jack refuses Pitch's offer to work together so that both of them would be believed in (and feared). This is before he finds out that Pitch still has Baby Tooth, so he's got no reason to hold back, but instead he turns around and starts walking away. Why didn't he try taking him down right then and there? Was he really going to let him get away?
** I have 3 theories. 1, HeroicBSOD: Jack had been effectively expelled from the Guardians by that point; Pitch tried to tell him earlier, "This isn't your fight, Jack," and, now it really wasn't -- once his initial rage wears off, despair sets in and he has no more will to fight the guy. 2, ShutUpHannibal: Pitch was in full-blown BreakingSpeech Mode, Jack remembered what happened last time he listened to the ManipulativeBastard talk, and decided it was safest to get away from him as quickly as possible instead of sticking around to fight and listen. 3: Although Pitch's speech didn't convince Jack to join him, it did make Jack feel sorry for him -- Jack believed him enough to no longer want to hurt him when the guy wasn't attacking him.

** Let's assume that he can't bring people back from the dead whenever he pleases (like, 300 years later), so he made Jack a spirit at the time he died because it was either then or never. It's also safe to assume he knew ''exactly'' what would happen in the future and when (most {{Big Good}}s with this much cosmic influence are omniscient) and the best way to move the pieces to win the game. Why couldn't he have just told Jack who he was, how he died, exactly how he would be needed in 300 years, what his job would be, make him a Guardian immediately, and give him all the information and power he would need for an easy victory? Because, would Jack have become the type of person who ''could'' defeat this enemy under those circumstances? He would have spent years pining for the family he knew he had but couldn't speak to, he might not have embraced his power so eagerly, he probably wouldn't have spent so much time bonding (albeit, one-sided) and playing with kids if he had such a huge responsibility on his shoulders and a dangerous battle to look forward to, and he wouldn't have proven himself like we see him do both in battle and through the choices he makes. A person doesn't become a hero -- the type who's strong and smart enough to defeat evil -- by having everything handed to them; you have to learn things and prove yourself on your own. That's what TheHerosJourney is for. The [=MiM=] gave Jack his SupernaturalAid, but Jack had to undergo the journey himself, just like how a teacher gives students all the knowledge they need but can't take the test for them. (Maybe Jack thought he needed more information handed to him instead of wanting to find it himself, but given how he ended victorious, he really had exactly what he needed.)

* I can understand the comparison between Jack and characters such as Tooth, Bunny, or North - they're all well-known holiday icons, so it's pretty easy and understandable for children believe in them, whereas when most people refer to "Jack Frost", they tend to pass it off as just an expression in the film. But about ''Sandman''... Even when I was a kid, I don't remember ever hearing or learning about a character who sends people to sleep and keeps watch over their dreams... At least, not on the same level, as Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy or Easter Bunny - it was actually probably on a similar level to the idea of Jack Frost. (In fact, I think the bogeyman was more of a universally recognized figure to children, so how is it that ''he's'' the one no one believes in?)

* I know Jack and the Guardians had a mutual dislike in the beginning of the movie, but how come Jack didn't approach any of these guys about his memories and purpose when he learned of their existence?

*** Well, you'd think that they'd at least have a better understanding of the situation, as they already have believers and used to be different people. They could have pointed him in the direction of the Tooth Fairy in regards to his memories, and help him out with the rest.

*** There is a Rise of the Guardian app which states “Jack likes the beach - but only to have fun freezing waves.” This probably means he can go to warmer climates. And whilst he specialises in snow based fun (y’know, considering he’s a Winter Spirit) we see in the flashback of Jack’s human life that he can entertain kids with other things, e.g. stories.

* Why are some of the Guardians so...unrecognizable, especially if their power is derived by the belief of all children? For what it's worth, North and Bunny are alright in terms of design (most notably since there aren't many ways in which you cam make a little bunny seem very awesome or threatening while still being friendly toward children), but why make Tooth a sort of hummingbird-person and Jack Frost a teenager or a young adult, instead of the old man he's usually pictured as?
** Tooth is hummingbird-like because, most likely, a hummingbird is the most "fairy-like" creature the author of the books could think of: a delicate, sparkly, fascinating, and spirited little flying critter. As for Jack being a kid, it's a kid's ''movie'', and his character-arc is one of him growing up enough to embrace responsibility for others: qualities pretty much guaranteed to be a NoSell if he'd looked like a rickety old man.

** Also, they aren't really keeping it secret. People still pass down stories of Santa and the Easter Bunny and tooth fairy, all of them...The Guardians rely on those stories (along with their respective holiday roles) to instill their importance in children. It's only up to the children whether they choose to believe.

* If Tooth hadn't known that Jack couldn't remember his past, that definitely hints at it being normal for a Guardian to be able to remember their life before they became a Guardian. Sooo...that brings us back to this enigma - why can't Jack remember his? Unless the man in the moon took away his memories, and he would have no reason to, since it only delayed him stopping Pitch because of his indecision...
** According to WordOfGod, the Man on the Moon ''did'' take away Jack's memories. [[spoiler:Twice.]] It appears to have been out of some misguided but good-faith attempt to protect him from pain, because you're right, there ''is'' something that makes Jack different: Jack's the only one amongst them who died before becoming their current self. [[spoiler:And before that, Jackson Overland was apparently--somehow--what remained of the person that had once been Nightlight after he gave up his powers, so it's understandable that the Man on the Moon would be a bit protective of his friend, even if his idea of protection seems to have ended up ultimately doing more harm than good.]]

** They also don't seem that poor in comparison to the rest of the people in their village (if the one Jack visits during the prologue was his hometown). Everyone there appears to living in the same conditions, which makes sense for an American settlement in the early 1700s.

* One thing I've ''never'' understood about this movie is why Jack is so dead-set against being a Guardian. I can see how being "cooped up in a hideout thinking up new ways to bribe kids" (roughly paraphrased) would clash with his personality, but Sandy plainly doesn't spend his time hidden away somewhere - he's out there every night just giving sweet dreams to children, not "bribing" them with money or presents or eggs. And Jack knows this. So why does he act like the roles North, Bunny and Tooth have are all there is to being a Guardian?
** There are several reasons, actually. 1) Jack Frost is the Guardian of Fun, not the Guardian of Responsibility. 2) He has had conflict with Bunnymund in the past, and only seems to truly respect Sandman. 3) He is upset at the Man in the Moon on account of being ignored for 300 years. It was basically a "Get in the robot" moment.
*** Jack's been playing by his own rules for the last 300 years and naturally isn't fond of the idea of suddenly being bound up by rules and responsibilities. He also probably feels some misguided resentment towards the other Guardians since he knows they are able to communicate with the Man in the Moon who has steadfastly been ignoring Jack all this time. He seems to have basically lumped them all together as a "hero brigade" of sorts that he feels a level of condescension towards because he thinks of them as a bunch of stuffy goody-two-shoes.

* When Jack fell into the pond in the flashback, why didn't he just float to the top? Was he really that dense when he was human?
** My best guess is that the Man in the Moon was able to keep him from floating to the surface, probably to spare his sister the trauma of seeing his frozen corpse lying there, and to keep her and others from endangering themselves to try and recover the body.

[[folder:Is the Mouse a Guardian?]]
* So, a previous headscratcher established that the mouse is a nod to European mythology, and that the confusion might have come from a European kid visiting North America... but another question about the mouse is... ''is it also a guardian''? Because it does the same job as Tooth, but Pitch doesn't seem to be going after it, and it doesn't attend meetings.
** The mouse is probably comparable to the yetis and the elves who work at the North Pole, as well as the smaller fairies that Tooth has doing the collecting for her. Early in the movie, the four Guardians give a nod to other folkloric creatures that exist who ''aren't'' direct Guardians when the Man in the Moon is choosing a new one -- Sandy suggests it could be a leprechaun and Bunny mentions the existence of the groundhog tied to Groundhog's Day. "Guardian" is a bestowed title given to figures with centers that cater to a certain aspect of childhood, not a catch-all term for any mythical being.

** However, if you know Santa Claus is real, you'd probably be more inclined to believe in Easter Bunny, etc. So it helps,

*** Pitch was indeed a good person before becoming the Boogeyman. He used live during the Golden Age as a man named Kozmotis Pitchiner. He was the general of the army that fought creatures called Dream Pirates and Fearlings. When the Fearlings were captured, they were locked in a prison that had to be guarded constantly. Kozmotis was the one to guard it. Background: Kozmotis had a daughter called Emily-Jane and whilst guarding the prison, he kept a locket of her to stop him from falling for the Fearlings bribery and threats. The Fearlings managed to see the image one day and somehow managed to mimic Emily-Jane’s voice. Kozmotis had been in the prison for a long time so it was easy to trick him. The Fearlings pretended to be Emily calling out for her father to get her out of the prison. To convince him, the Fearlings made a shadow which looked like a little girl. Kozmotis opened the prison, expecting to find his daughter but was possessed by the Fearlings who turned him into Pitch Black.

* A question that has bugged fans ever since the movie came out: How did Jack get his hoodie and what became of his cloak if we are to assume he is still wearing his white shirt and vest underneath the sweatshirt?
** Not sure about the cloak, but maybe the moon gave him the hoodie. After all, the moon does have a lot of influence on his life.

[[folder: The Moon Can't Talk in Real Life...Right?]]
* Can someone ''please'' explain that last line of dialogue at the end of the film?! "When the moon tells you something, believe it." What was even the POINT of that? Was it meant to be some loose moral they tried adding onto the end, or was just because Dreamworks picked up the IdiotBall for a moment? Seriously, what were they thinking putting that in?
** I haven't seen this film that many times, so I don't entirely recall the words or the context in which they were spoken...Maybe Jack...meant it as something like, "If the world seems to be telling you you're fated and meant for something great, don't waste time fretting and worrying over whether or not you'll be good enough." Jack spends a lot of the movie seeing himself as inferior when the moon and the other Guardians try to convince him that he's meant to be one of them, and a lot of the problems in the movie may have been avoided if he'd just listened to them.
** It's not meant to be a "moral" at all. Not everything in a movie is meant to be a life lesson. It's just a silly callback to earlier in the film, no need to creator bash about it.
** My translation: "When you feel something inside you telling you this is what you're meant to do, go with it." Either that or: "When God tells you something, believe it."
** ^ What about people who don't believe in God? A message like that would seem weird in a movie that's not overtly religious.
** A better line would be "and all you have to do is...believe."
[[/folder]]

[[folder: The Hoodie]]
* Where did Jack get his blue hoodie from and why? His dialogue hints at one point that he doesn't have any body warmth to maintain - he's just naturally cold, so wearing it should be the same as wearing his original clothes. Maybe he wanted to update his look a bit over the years (though I don't know why he hadn't changed his pants, in that case), but did he steal it? Or did he find it somewhere and decided to start wearing it?
** Maybe the Man in the Moon gave him the hoodie, but I don't know why, though.
[[/folder]]

[[folder: Why, Oh Why, Did They Not Fly?]]

** If the town was part of a school district, instead of having a school system exclusively for that particular town, it's possible that there was heavy snow in another area and this town only got a little. This troper has had a ''lot'' of snow days with no snow at all, because of the weather in another part of the district.
** Some towns do not close down school for any amount of snow at all, but others cancel school for just a sprinkle of snow on the ground. it's possible Jamie's town falls in the latter.
** Jack ices up the streets pretty good in creating the snow day, which was probably one of the major justifications for it.
** The snow doesn't have to be all that deep, so long as it's enough to, say, bring down a tree on the power lines ''to the school itself''.
** Where this troper lives, and possibly elsewhere, I'm not sure, the rule is if a bus slides off the road, then they have to call off school. There's also wind chill that could be cause for a day off - since most snow days have to be called by 6 or 7 or 8 in the morning, Jack would have had plenty of time to clear it up and allow for the kids to have some fun outside. Or maybe he just buried the school in ten feet of snow, as a joke. I think we all could imagine Jack doing that, couldn't we?
** I've seen news reports of cities that normally get no snow, so when the littlest bit falls, everything shuts down. If Jamie's hometown is somewhere south where it rarely snows...
** Of course, this all still does beg the question why, if Jack is the one who made the snow day, why he didn't make more of it. Realistically, who goes outside to play in the snow when there's hardly any snow on the ground?
** If I recall correctly, Jamie says at one point that Michigan is "super-close" to wherever he lives.[[note]] According to his light on the globe, he lives somewhere in Pennsylvania.[[/note]] As someone who grew up in Michigan but goes to school in south-central Ohio (which would probably qualify as "super-close!"), I can safely say that the circumstances necessary to declare a snow day vary significantly between these two locales. I've had "snow days" here in Ohio, in college, no less, where there was just enough to cover the ground, and most of it had already melted by late morning. As for why Jack couldn't make more of it, it was close to Easter, and probably not cold enough for that much snow to keep from melting.

** Yetis, elves and santa himself are constantly moving around in the workshop, Bunny didn't want to take the chance that someone was in the area the hole opened to and would fall in, and even if he knew for a fact no one was there, if one wasn't paying attention where they were walking, they could fall in before he jumped out and closed the hole, and hurt him or themselves.
** Or it could be that Santa's workshop had some kind of spells preventing magical entry. That's very common in fantastic fiction.
*** That doesn't seem to be the case, since Pitch is able to appear inside the North Pole and Bunny later opens a tunnel to his warren directly from Santa's workshop. Still, it would be good manners not to directly transport yourself into someone else's home. It's like knocking before coming inside for non-magical guests.
*** Bunny also presumably goes straight back to Santa's after the Yeti's nap Jack, through his tunnel. It's possible he didn't the first time out of politeness mixed with RuleOfFunny
*** Maybe to get back at North for forcing him to go on the sled earlier on?

** Early in the movie, the four Guardians give a nod to other folkloric creatures that exists who ''aren't'' Guardians when the Man in the Moon is choosing a new one -- Sandy suggests it could be a leprechaun and Bunny mentions the existence of the groundhog tied to Groundhog's Day. The fact that Jack tried to refuse the mantle of Guardian shows that it's more of a title rather than a catch-all term for mythical beings. The mouse may be collecting teeth in the same manner that the Tooth Fairy does, but we don't know that he uses them to store and recall children's memories, which is what makes Tooth a Guardian. And if we assume that's the case, it explains why Pitch isn't going after him, because he doesn't protect any part of childhood to combat the fear that Pitch wants to spread.