History Headscratchers / Clannad

** If Google results [[http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Japanese+culture+water+on+sidewalk are credible,]] it's to cool down the cement due to the summer heat.

**** No, I meant having mostly Nagisa-focused scenes, don't misunderstand me... Sorry if I made it sound like they were making up stuff. And just to make myself clear, I don't dislike [=KyoAni=] (Hey, my favorite anime is ''{{Kanon}} 2006'') nor Clannad, case I was misunderstood. Just that, from my [=PoV=], they went kind of overboard on how much Nagisa appeared, even taking into account she's the main heroine with a longer plot and all that. It's not the plot's fault, is they way they played it out.

* How come we never see Nagisa and Tomoya doing the deed. I know it's it's at the G rating, [[BleachedUnderpants but this is Key we are talking about]], the other Seasonverse games have H-scenes, so why not Clannad? They even had both a clean and unclean version of both VisualNovel/{{Air}} and VisualNovel/{{Kanon}}. I know this is a stupid question and the obvious anwsers are either "[[GettingCrapPastTheRadar They can't get away with sex]]" and "[[{{Rule34}} Let the fans draw it then]]", but it must be said.

* This is probably a pretty silly thing to be bugged by, but - in Finland at least, if you want to work on utility poles, you need to be a certified electrician with some three odd years of vocational school under your belt. Yet Tomoya gets the job on the spot with only his (poor) high school diploma, and the manager dude is apparently perfectly happy with having to train his new employee from scratch. Is this just some cultural difference, or did anyone else find themselves wondering if they maybe missed something?

** I don't quite remember how it ran in the anime, but in the game, Tomoya and Nagisa's parents do realize instantly that this is an extremely bad idea, and much of the plot for a while is focused on getting Nagisa to change her mind. However, she's really adamant about it, and thus there's really nothing they can do about it.
*** That makes A LOT more sense, thank you! And yeah, on the anime, they all go "That's a great idea!" instantly, so boo to KyoAni.
**** Actually in episode 16, they did ultimately decide to have the baby at the hospital, but the birth came early and they were snowed in.
**** Yeah, I mentioned that, but still, they just said it in middle of a conversation, even though it's more important than that.
**** Ah, ok then. Only real answer is bad pacing.
***** Well, it was pretty realistic. They didn't want to dwell on what could go wrong. In general, IRL, home birth is actually a good idea - it relaxes the mother, helps form parent child bonds, and so on. It's just Nagisa's illness that makes the decision more difficult.
****** Really? (Hey, I'm a guy) That makes it more of a logical choice then... except for Nagisa, as said. And yes, it makes it realistic, so that's alright, I guess. One silly issue down!
*** In the game, Sanae even goes as far as to suggest abortion.
**** The family considers it in the anime too, but Nagisa completely rejects it.
** I'm surprised no one considers a cesarean section, which would be much easier on Nagisa's frail body. Granted, the early birth would have rendered this idea moot, but it should have come up at some point.

* And on the topic of mentioning important stuff by passing: The Theater Club closing. So they focus ''the entire first season'' on restoring the thing, and then they forget about it on After Story until they get to halfway the season, where they just give a quick mention it didn't have enough members to continue existing. Ends making the first season look a bit like a ShaggyDogStory in retrospect, if you ask me. Also, two of the three members were Tomoyo and Yukine, who should have enough influence to try to get new members in. Sooo...
** The first ''season'' was split between the Theater club and Fuko's sister's wedding. The main point of both was to get the people closer and essentially establish Tomoya's and Nagisa's [[TrueCompanions closest friends]], and Nagisa always knew it would be temporary. Also, this is Clannad, which prides itself on being a ShaggyDogStory [[CrapsackWorld in its]] [[TearJerker happiest endings]].

*** That covers the "Why didn't they help" part fine. Thank you. The other one is just KyoAni focusing too much on Nagisa [[SpotlightStealingSquad as usual]], I figure.
*** Again, this is just more stuff directly lifted from the games, so it's not entirely {{KyoAni}}'s fault.
**** No, I meant having mostly Nagisa-focused scenes, don't misunderstand me... Sorry if I made it sound like they were making up stuff. And just to make myself clear, I don't dislike KyoAni (Hey, my favorite anime is ''{{Kanon}} 2006'') nor Clannad, case I was misunderstood. Just that, from my [=PoV=], they went kind of overboard on how much Nagisa appeared, even taking into account she's the main heroine with a longer plot and all that. It's not the plot's fault, is they way they played it out.
***** Well, neither Tomoyo nor Yukine were members. Yukine was just someone they talked to from time to time, and Tomoyo was student council president. And besides, this troper liked the extra focus on Nagisa, and the highlight of how she and Tomoya need each other. I could write a corresponding JustBugsMe about how Yuuichi seemed to deal with the Kanon girls like an assembly line process and forget them instantly after he's done, even when they are briefly apparently the most important people in his life. Made the whole freak out over Ayu unconvincing, since he seemed pretty darn able to move on to the next girl before. It's better for the plotline and characterisation to just pretend some arcs didn't exist - they had to rush in places anyways.

* And speaking of Tomoyo, first episode of After Story: Tomoyo bats and gets a home-run. She then [[IdiotBall randomly decides to do a more femenine batting]] and gets nothing. Sunohara tries a home-run... run and fails (Not sure of the proper term, not a baseball fan, sorry), so he gets berated by Kyou... and Tomoyo. Who blame him as the cause for their current tie. Even though if Tomoyo had made a home run when she had the chance, they would be winning by one point. Huh... what? I know Sunohara is a ButtMonkey, but this is ridiculous.

* Also about Nagisa getting a blind eye at her: Episode... 19 I think of After Story. Tomoya meets with Kyou again after a lot of time and they chat. Kyou says Ushio is good at making friends "unlike a certain delinquent I know of" and he replies "Yes, she's like her mother". Huh... WHAT? [[InformedAbility Nagisa is good at making friends? The same Nagisa Tomoya met all alone and who in After Story did her warm-ups alone too? That Nagisa? Really?]] Did I miss something? And for that matter, Tomoya not good at making friends? He pretty much befriended ALL the TrueCompanions. They're friends because of ''him''. I don't get it.
** Sounds like Kyou was teasing Tomoya, as she rarely would complement him directly. I have no idea why the hell Tomoya would respond like that, maybe he was just out of it after Nagisa died.
*** There's no evidence that Nagisa had trouble making friends, except that in the scenes quoted she had been forced to repeat a year twice. Nagisa entered the third year for the first time (ep 23) with at least two friends, and got one more quickly. Tomoya only had one friend (Sunohara) for the first two years of school until he met Nagisa, and then changed his attitude. And even Sunohara was an arranged marriage. Tomoya attributes the entire TrueCompanions to Nagisa, because she broke her out of his introspection, and had him gather the theatre club for her sake. Tomoya was quite blunt in the introduction - that he didn't think he had friends before Nagisa.
*** Nagisa is shown to get along with people very well and to make them feel at ease. Reclusive Kotomi immediately takes a liking to her as soon as they meet--and Ryou was ''especially'' enthralled by her.

* On Nagisa and relationships: Her and Tomoya [[SleepingSingle sleeping on different futons]] after gettting married. Full stop. Saying that's weird is an understatement. For that matter, the nature of their relationship is incredibly strange, what with them never hugging nor kissing, always holding hands at best. I mean, there's a middle point inbetween "{{Eroge}}" and "a way-over-the-top chaste relationship". This might be partially ValuesDissonance or somesuch, possibly, but still, they couldn't have them hug and kiss at least ONCE? For example, {{Kanon}} 2006 had the winning couple kiss, and it's not alone or anything, so... Also, for those who have played the original game, do any of the other routes have hugging and kissing, or Nagisa's route isn't alone on this?

*** And also why they were given "alternate universes" episodes, then. Again, thank you, for that makes LOADS more sense than the utter and total lack of physical signs of appreciation from the anime. Seriously, what did get in KyoAni when doing this? At least two shows of them (Haruhi and Kanon) have kissing, dammit!

* The way Kyou and Fuuko's names are written on the OP. The former uses a romanization style, the latter uses an older one, causing her to get referred as "Fuko" by subs, fans, and just about everyone else. Which [[BerserkButton makes me angry]]. [[TheHulk You don't want to see me angry]]. Er, seriously anyway, can't they be consistent? I wouldn't mind it TOO much if it was "Kyo" and "Fuko", even though I'd prefer "Kyou" and "Fuuko", but man... mixing two styles just doesn't looks right.

*** Hmm, that must make me think that the anime at least takes place in 2008, or so, when it was made by KyoAni. Nagisa is about 18-19, and she was five when Akio prayed for her, making them set up a bakery so they could look after her, so the tapes would stop around 1994. Though the game still takes place in 2003, at least the school life part, because of Sunohara's calendar.

** Not everyone can afford a cellphone. Not everyone can afford service. Not everyone can afford a computer. Not everyone can afford interent. Also they are in a remote town, which may not have great phone service anyway. Sure, 2008 might make it harder to accept but 2003 it would be reasonable for few people to have cellphones. And in anime and manga, the technology matches the source material.

** ButtMonkey,'Nuff said.
** His hair is also the most obviously bright one. Blue is practically used as a lighter shade of black in cartoons, and even the green hair was pretty dark. Also ButtMonkey
** Blond is also typically the "bad boy/girl" hair color in Japan, since with their hair, it's usually only achieved by heavy bleaching. (Some kind of a rebel thing-- either way, it's still the bad boy image.) It may have made customers feel uncomfortable, so it had to go.
** Sunohara actually has blond hair. The rest have variant shades of black hair, but as in ''{{YouGottaHaveBlueHair}}'' hair colors can be used for personality or just to set them apart. Usually wild hair colors are just shorthand to tell characters apart.

* During Misae's route, there is a scene where Yoshino is seen as a senior in high school. Since it's a flashback, you also see Kouko-sensei, while she was still an art teacher. It's only after the scene is over that you remember [[HotForStudent the two of them got married.]]

** His detachment isn't as obvious in the English dub, but in the original Japanese, one of the things that outrages Tomoya so much is that his father refers to him as ''Tomoya-kun'' instead of simply Tomoya. In a culture where people are addressed by their first name or family name, with suffixes, based on how familiar they are with eachother, a father referring to his son with the suffix of -kun is very over-formal and distant. It would be like your father referring to you as 'Mister' instead of 'Son'.

* How did Nagisa know the illusionary world? She used the story in her play but unless she actually read that in a book(highly unlikely) she shouldn't know anything about the illusionary world at that time.

** If Google results[[http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Japanese+culture+water+on+sidewalk]] are credible, it's too cool down the cement due to the summer heat.

** I hope no one minds if I join in on this topic. I actually just finished the series, and initially, that particular Hill scene in the finale was the single most confusing part to me since in particular, I didn't understand how Nagisa could have any knowledge of all of the time she and Tomoya spent together. However, when I saw the RecapEpisode, it slightly cleared things up: Tomoya explained to himself (and to the audience) that he could recall initially going through losing both Nagisa and Ushio, and then almost miraculously, being taken back right to the point that Nagisa gave birth, except that this time, she had survived of course. This pretty much confirms that Tomoya didn't actually re-live his initial meeting with Nagisa in reality, nor did he re-live everything else leading up to Ushio's birth, but was brought right back to the point where things went differently for the better as a sort of karmic reward. However, despite understanding that part of it, I still have absolutely no idea what that Hill scene was supposed to be exactly, especially since everyone seems to have a different theory. However, is it possible that there'a an official answer to this? It not, I understand, since it ''is'' hard to know for certain. Nonetheless, can anyone help with that?

**** Yeah, I guess. As I said, I [[MST3KMantra shouldn't think this THAT much]], but hey, that's what this section is for, right? But yeah, I consider this question closed. Oh, and thanks for taking your time to answer to my silly questions.

*** Still, the manager's blitheness kind of [[WillingSuspensionOfDisbelief strains credibility]]. "Hey boss, this kid here has previously shown zero interest or aptitude in public electricity services and has absolutely no experience in the field, but he helped me and my wife get married so could you maybe give him a job or something?" "SureWhyNot!"

* One minor thing I never understood is why Akio, and Tomoya when he worked at the bakery, was always throwing water on the sidewalk. They had plants in front of the bakery, but they were just tossing water on the sidewalk. Is this some weird Japanese thing?

* Kotomi's story arc bothers me a lot. For nearly a decade, she's been driven by guilt over destroying her parents' research. She finds out that the research wasn't in that envelope anyway, and that's cool. But then we learn that her parents had it with them and could have protected it (by putting it in that suitcase) but didn't. Sure, they didn't know the suitcase would reach home safely, but it was the best they could have done. No-one is in the least bothered by this thought. Also, were it not that everyone in this world is crazy, her guardian was a complete jerk for presenting the suitcase the way he did, getting up her (and the audience's) hopes that the research was saved when he knew it wasn't.

** Japan takes a [[ValuesDissonance very different view]] toward bullying than the West does. It involves a fair bit of what we might call "victim blaming". The assumption is that if you are bullied, you must have done something to attract attention to yourself. They even have an idiom about this: "The nail that sticks up gets pounded down." There's a big societal emphasis on conformity and respecting your elders (which in this case would mean the older members of the club). And speaking up about it (like Sunohara did) is also frowned upon, because then you're bothering other people with your problems, which is a big no-no in Japanese society. Note that when Sunohara made a scene about it, the rest of the school, ''including the faculty'', labelled him a delinquent troublemaker for it.

* The soccer club in episode 4 of After Story. If the club has a reputation for hazing and bullying, then why didn't the school go about trying to either shut down the club or get rid of the major members involved if their reputation's well known among the student body?

* The soccer club in episode 4 of After Story. If the club has a reputation for hazing and bullying, then why didn't the school go about trying to either shut down the club or get rid of the major members involved in the kind of reputation it had?

* How is Tomoya's father paying the bills? Unless I missed something, there was no mention of him working aside from in the flashback scenes to Tomoya's early childhood; whilst Tomoya's in high school and in the years after that, he doesn't seem in any fit state to be working...and yet he's still got a roof over his head, and neither of them are starving or anything.

** In the visual novel, the baseball game was a completely unrelated and hidden route much like the laser tag hunt. As such, it's likely that Tomoya didn't get a job in the power company after the baseball game route.

*** In the game, Sanae even goes as far as to suggest '''''abortion'''''. Woah.

* While Yoshino was at the Akio's baseball game, he must have noticed Tomoya's shoulder problem at one point. How did he not remember that when Tomoya started working with him?

* On a related note: if someone who can't see Fuuko touches her or comes into contact with the space she's occupying, what would everyone see?

** Just read this part in the VN, and Yoshino specifically says that his job doesn't even check for a high school education. I'm guessing the writers simply DidNotDoTheResearch.

<<|ItJustBugsMe|>>

** The first ''season'' was split between the Theater club and Fuko's sister's wedding. The main point of both was to get the people closer and essentially establish Tomoya's and Nagisa's [[{{Nakama}} closest friends]], and Nagisa always knew it would be temporary. Also, this is Clannad, which prides itself on being a ShaggyDogStory [[CrapsackWorld in its]] [[TearJerker happiest endings]].

* Also about Nagisa getting a blind eye at her: Episode... 19 I think of After Story. Tomoya meets with Kyou again after a lot of time and they chat. Kyou says Ushio is good at making friends "unlike a certain delinquent I know of" and he replies "Yes, she's like her mother". Huh... WHAT? [[InformedAbility Nagisa is good at making friends? The same Nagisa Tomoya met all alone and who in After Story did her warm-ups alone too? That Nagisa? Really?]] Did I miss something? And for that matter, Tomoya not good at making friends? He pretty much befriended ALL the {{Nakama}}. They're friends because of ''him''. I don't get it.

*** There's no evidence that Nagisa had trouble making friends, except that in the scenes quoted she had been forced to repeat a year twice. Nagisa entered the third year for the first time (ep 23) with at least two friends, and got one more quickly. Tomoya only had one friend (Sunohara) for the first two years of school until he met Nagisa, and then changed his attitude. And even Sunohara was an arranged marriage. Tomoya attributes the entire {{Nakama}} to Nagisa, because she broke her out of his introspection, and had him gather the theatre club for her sake. Tomoya was quite blunt in the introduction - that he didn't think he had friends before Nagisa.