This is discussion archived from a time before the current discussion method was installed.
Essive: Erm, I've been in fandom for a good five years and it's generally accepted that "slash" only means same-sex pairings. There is some argument over whether it has to be overtly sexual or if it can be innocently romantic, but heterosexual stuff (such as, for example, Mulder/Scully) doesn't count.
Gus: Essive, the entry does not contradict your position. It talks about the meaning of "slash" having extended from the homoerotic toward a more general meaning. Fanfic fandom is deeply divided. There are entire communities of fan writers who do not have the time or interest to follow the usages outside of their focus/community.
Firefly 'ficcers, for example, will post "Jayne/Kaylee" as an advisement to the content. Ditto "Monk/Rene Sheppard" pieces out of the H:LOTS crowd.
Essive: The comment I added (after it dawned on me just a bit later) was "(I should say that it's generally accepted throughout the fandoms I've had contact with.)" That is, I've heard vaguely of the "any pairing" sense used in other fandoms. However, I don't consider a slash between characters names to be an example of the word "slash". Nearly every fandom I've seen uses the "(Character 1)/(Character 2)" designation — it's sort of the default. (I've seen "+" and "x" used, but they seem to be primarily limited to anime fandoms.)
Gus OK. I'm a language geek who is very interested in how words — particularly slang words — (or, in this case, slang puncuations) come to define and be defined by a community. What is your fanficdom? Mine are the Whedonverses, H:LOTS, and, recently, Lost. I haven't yet seen the "+" and "x" formulations in those groups. Maybe I have been hanging in the wrong places.
Xparrot: Not to jump in here, but... The "+" and "x" are anime/manga conventions adopted from Japanese fan doujinshi; the only time I've encountered them in Western fandom is when the fen involved are into animanga as well. They have a somewhat different connotation from the "/", in that they indicate not only the pairing but the sexual role. The first name is the "top"/"seme"/"masculine" position and the second the "bottom"/"uke"/"feminine". So in Weiss Kreuz, Aya x Yohji indicates Aya is topping, while Yohji x Aya means Yohji is. ("x" indicates actual sex or at least heavy petting; "+" is used for tamer relations or just UST without resolution)
Red Shoe: I first came across the term 'Slash' out in Blakes Seven fandom about a decade ago. At the time, in that fandom, it was strictly homosexual, strictly pornographic, and the ordering of names reflected the same kind of topping/bottoming relationship mentioned above. But there was a note in whatever it was I read about it in explaining that those particular facets were no longer considered "essential" except to purists.
Bluetooth The Pirate: If language is a memetic disease, then the Internet is like antibiotics. It forces language to evolve into a new and more virulent form. At least, that's what I derive from this discussion. (Warning: this comment contains tounge/cheek)
Fly: Xparrot, you're not entirely wrong, but it seems the demonstration of sexual role is accepted or not accepted depending on the fandom. For instance, in a Naruto fic or a Gundam Wing fic there's pretty big shipstorms (pardon the pun) over whether 1x2 or 2x1 or NarutoxSasuke or SasukexNaruto is better - but in Final Fantasy VII the x marker is still used but without topxbottom connotations. The people who happen to ship the spiky-haired hero with the silver-haired villain almost invariably call the pairing CloudxSephiroth, even though nine times out of ten Sephiroth usually tops (can you say Yaoi Height Rule?) But I have never, ever seen the word used to refer to het. I've heard of it being used for het, but never personally seen it. I've been in fandom for about five years now.
Ununnilium: So, here's a puzzler: is a fanfic about a homosexual Official Couple Slash Fic?
Tabby: And that's the question for the ages.
Steelhead Tsotha: I usually see the term "slash fiction" used only to describe distinctly non-canonical pairings.
Etrangere: Most often they still get called slash fiction (Queer as Folk or Brokeback Mountain fandom for exemple). Occasionnally people call them gay fanfics instead, I think. It's discussed regularly in places like live journal newsletter metafandom.
Ununnilium: Why did the Dinosaur Comics example get cut?
Later: Put it back in.
Marie: Sooo... All the 8 years I've been in fandoms as different as Sherlock Holmes, Pokemon, Harry Potter, and Stargate, the primary meaning of slash was 'gay fanfic'. The erotic aspect, which seems to be the primary definition in this entry, was always considered an optional extra. This entry is not only confusing, but has a very different definition of it's subject to pretty much everybody I ever met who writes the stuff.
Looney Toons: So... fix it. That's the Wiki Magic. You can make it better. You have the technology.
Fast Eddie: I don't know, there are opposing viewpoints right here in the discussion. Obviously, the OP thought the case stood as does. I suppose if Marie ever shows up again, she can make a case that accounts for these facts. Serious Business!
Etrangere: Yeah, I've already fixed it.
Fast Eddie: Yeah, your fix sought to deny the way the term is used in my ficcer fandom, so I fixed it a little further.
Etrangere: Hey! Sorry, I didn't seek to deny it, I'd never encountered used as such so I thought it'd meant the "uncanonical pairing" one, it is a rare definition. (What fandom is it? I'm just curious).
Fast Eddie: Het The Wire, H:LOTS, Bt VS, and Firefly — the emphasis being on "het", with a focus on Original Flavor, so "Slash' indicates either a non-canonical paring or that the piece is focusing on a canonical pairing. Pretty boring for folks who are into homosexual-izing things. That's one of those "divides" referred to above. There are folks who just don't see the point of the way the others do it.
Etrangere: Okay, that makes sense given that I'd seen it to mean "uncanonical pairing" in the Buffy fandom. Is the current version okay for you? This definition is mentionned but I think it's fair to present slash as most commonly used for samesex pairing (it's the most frequent definition in omnifandom places like metafandom for ex, and because we need a word to mean that trope), but we aknowledge the other definitions. Heh, I think most people like the pairings they like regardless of whether they're slash or het - at least I know I do.
Fast Eddie: :-D ... You used "slash" just then as a synonym for "homoerotic". The entry seems fine now. As long as we have room to acknowledge that some communities use it differently, it seems fair. // afterthought: In the ficcer fandom I hang out in, there are canon homoerotic pairings (B Tv S and The Wire for lesbian pairs, H:LOTS for gay male) so the slash may indicate those pairs, just by accident, on the way to indicating that the story will be focused on that pair. So, you will see things like "Willow/Tara: <Title>" ...
Etrangere: It's a handy word to mean that! But I can see the necessity of a word to mean the opposite of "gen" as well. Maybe we need to make up that word ^^ Well, yeah. You always end up needing the pairing anyway, so apart from discussion I hate when people categorize their fics by het, slash, femslash, gen.
Etrangere: Now it's you who's erased one of the definition :p the uncanonical pairing one exists, even if it's rare.
Fast Eddie: Hmm. I thought if it meant both uncanonical and canonical pairing that the word pairing was enough, there being nothing left to modify.
Etrangere: I'm afraid I'm not following you. Picture me confused.
Fast Eddie: I put it in a little different form. Maybe it will be more clear.
Etrangere: lol, I was going to do that. Okay, here's what I meant above, the different definitions are :
1. Gay fanfic, may or may not be erotic (most frequent meaning)
2. Gay and must be erotic (original meaning)
3. Gay but only if uncanonical
4. all fics gay or not that is about the pairing (your definition as I understood it)
5. fics about uncanonical pairings, whether they are gay or not.
That fifth definition is the one you erased previously and which I wanted to put back.
Fast Eddie: How is 4 different from 5? "All fics" would include canonical and otherwise, no?
Etrangere: 4 includes fics that are canonical. 5 says canonical pairings are not Slash.
Fast Eddie: Ah. So, to make it more clear, 5 would be "...indicates that the pairing is not canonical...". There would be some additional text about how, plainly, not all of the definitions are compatible, much less in agreement.
Etrangere: Is the current definition breakdown okay with you?
Janitor: I think Fast Eddie has been having too many of those beers he enjoys. Whn I "speak" on IM to many of the same people he 'fics with, they have no issue with "slash" at all. Slash is something that happens elsewhere for them. "Let slashers have their words," is one quote. Gus had the same issue as Eddie. Maybe it is a crusty old ficcer issue. Pedants, to a man. ^v^
Fast Eddie: Pedant?! <grumbles, grouses> Okay. Okay! This is apparently my own personal Single-Issue Wonk issue. Let Slash Fic equal gay-fic. I retire in dishonour. However, I reserve the right to enter text into the entry that notes the controversy. These are my terms. ;~)
Etrangere: Works for me ^_^
Sci Vo: Pulled this since it no longer fits well:
- Parodied/referenced/thought was awesome in this strip
of Dinosaur Comics.
Slashfic = Gayfic? launched as Slash Fic Discussion: From YKTTW
- Subverted:[[Torchwood]] fics have slash that is actually canon.
No! No no no no no. Go read Subverted Trope. Again and again and again. @-@
Anyway, this brings back my question above: Does fic about canonical gay relationships "count" as slash?
Fly: Moving the Kingdom Hearts example to Most Fanfic Writers Are Girls.
Midna: Oooookay, I don't think the recently-added page image is Safe For Work (yeah, the internet wasn't fabricated to be work-safe, but still). I mean, look at it - it's human-on-furry sex. It may illustrate the definition of Slash Fic, but it sticks out like a sore thumb.
High Five: I'll go out on a limb and say I LOVE the new page image. It illustrates the dissonance between fanon characterizations and canon perfectly - I couldn't believe it when I hovered over the image and saw "South Park".
Goat Boy: I think feminism, and society in general, took a huge leap forward the first time some woman was sitting on the subway, and saw two guys making out, and suddenly realized her panties were getting a little moist...
