This is discussion archived from a time before the current discussion method was installed.
Working Title: Informed Attractiveness: From YKTTW
Goat Boy: Look, let's just face the ugly truth here. There is NO WAY IN HELL that ANYBODY, that's me, you, or anyone else, can be objective, unless it's a comedy, where someone obviously meant to be ugly is seen as attractive. Otherwise, this trope is just a more socially acceptable form of fan-hating, and therefore, does not belong here.
Carltheshivan: Most of the examples in this article are heavily subjective, and this troper, as well as many others, would disagree with many of the claims that such and such an actor is not attractive. This article seems like an excuse for people to remark about how they don't find a particular actor attractive, even if the rest of the world does. I suggest we classify this article as a subjective trope.
Semiapies: I blame Hollywood Homely. Someone who'd get "Wow, look at that hottie who just walked in"-type reactions in person is somehow "plain" on screen if he or she's not dressed to the nines or not showing enough skin. I mean, just look at some of the female examples cited as plain, which include (at the time of writing) Alyson Hannigan and Carrie Fisher.
Idle Dandy: There's a lot to go through to cull examples from the YKTTW discussion. I'm not sure how to handle the ones where the character is played by a famously attractive actor, such as Brad Pitt on Friends or Rebecca Romijn on Ugly Betty.
Antheia: ...or John Barrowman on Doctor Who. I'm trying to write an example mentioning him (anyway), but I can't seem to find a good way to write it. Help please?
Vampire Buddha: Cute this, because Daphne really is good looking, and the vast majority of viewers find her more attractive than Velma:
- * Daphne from Scooby Doo
Clerval: Taking out this, because Yuna's looks and Lulu's are never compared, there's no scripted insistence that Yuna is the most beautiful person around and, you know, it's not as if falling in love is simply a matter of identifying the hottest person in the room anyway.
- Yuna from the same game. I mean, Lulu even gives you the option of which girl you're most attracted to, but it doesn't matter, Hero Boy's gonna wind up with Yuna
Fly: Seymour Guado from Final Fantasy X - He gets The Bishie Sparkle
Um, what? Removed.
Austin: I must disagree strongly with Cordelia. I don't see what hair color has to do with it anyway.
Grimace: I threw caution to the wind and took it out. There's a lot of entries here that seem to be Tropers just not personally finding an actress attractive (fair enough), and so instantly assuming their looks are non-existent.
- That's the problem with a trope like this. If the writers say that she's best looking girl in the show, then she's probably not going to be ugly or completely bland from an objective standpoint, and someone is bound to agree with them, even if others don't. There's no other way to look at it than from your personal standpoint. I personally happen to disagree with the trope's opening quote. Jolene Blalock is better looking than Linda Park.
KJMackley: Wording is everything, and this trope is somewhat subjective but when people outright say that a certain actress is unattractive it becomes a bashing spree, but to say they aren't as drop dead gorgeous as the extras (who are probably former models) it becomes a comment, not a rant. I know plenty of people who prefered Maggie as Rachel from The Dark Knight then Katie Holmes. Maggie isn't a typically gorgeous actress but she is attractive enough to be believeable in the Love Interest role. Same thing with Cameron from House.
Anonymous Mc Cartneyfan: Cameron from House is a relative example. Yes, the actress who plays her is attractive. But when the standard for male attractiveness was Chase (he's just "pretty" in-universe, so those who prefer House may rest easy), then why was Cameron the female standard early on? And why would House hire her for her looks when she is relatively deficient in feminine assets he seems to value elsewhere (specifically, in Cuddy)?
Muninn: Taking out the following example:
- Inverted with L from Death Note. He was designed to be unattractive, and looks it, with pale skin, a dead looking stare, bags under his eyes and sloppy hair. But according to the fangirls, he's just dreamy.
KJMackley:I took out a few things: first the page quote because it wasn't a real demonstration of this trope. It was just being picky and not only that, T'Pol in the show was not constantly lauded over for being attractive. The trope was still used in that show but it wasn't a straight usage but Playing with a Trope, so I rewrote it in the Live Action TV section.
And then for the following two examples, in "Ten Things" Kate was considered anti-social, not unattractive. Bianca was considered attractive but mostly unattainable, which made her a sort of "prize." It doesn't help that the attress is Larisa Oleynik, not Larisa Meredith. And the Bond Girls is a non-example, it doesn't give anything specific.
- The much sought after Bianca in Ten Things I Hate About You. I would hate to be picky, but the actress in question, Larisa Meredith, isn't anywhere near as attractive as most of her female co-stars.
- Whoops, sorry about that! Must've mixed up her name with her Alex Mack co-stars. Could never tell those two girls apart.
- Many Bond girls have this problem.
Wookie: I would recommend naming this trope after Cleopatra, as her beauty was supposedly the envy of the entire world, whereas most depictions of her from the time period show a rather plain-looking woman. Also, I really don't think it's subjective; in some of these cases the people are quite attractive. It's the fact that it's *assumed* that the person is ridiculously, over-the-top attractive that makes the trope.
Masami Phoenix: Okay, I don't get why the Firefly example is even here. It seems to be comparing the attractiveness of all the leads, but that never really comes up in the actual show. Kaylee is the only one who really compares herself (or anybody else) to Inara and that's more about her being "glamorous" rather than more physically attractive. All four women are openly stated to be attractive.
Not sure about the QAF example. The cast gives Brian Kinney credit for his impossible confidence, charisma and apparent ability to seduce *anyone*, not his extra special, extraordinary good looks.
- Brian Kinney in Queer As Folk was written as if he were impossibly handsome, but the actor, Gale Harold, was about on par with the rest of the cast.
Vilui: I removed some excessive praise of Kate Winslet. You can keep the example, since I know many people find her attractive (God knows why) but the wording went too far, even for a subjective page like this one.
I removed this:
- In Theres Something About Mary, Mary is quite attractive, after all she is Cameron Diaz. Still, the way everyone thinks she is the ultimate woman is somewhat overboard.
- To be fair, it's not just her appearance that has every guy in love with her, but in this case her personality justifies the attention. Her charisma, sense of humor, love of sports and beer, are all part of what makes her irresistible to guys. Some people just have a magnetism to them.
because the response is right. Mary's personality is specifically written to make her "the perfect woman." After all, the film is called "There's Something About Mary," not "Mary is Really Beautiful."
KJMackley: I removed several examples for the following reasons: James Bond girls- still not an example, just a generic statement. Firefly- doesn't explain anything, it's just saying that everyone is hot (As well, being a companion Inara certainly carries herself much differently than the other girls). Star Trek- Just because there are other attractive women around doesn't dimish that Rand was attractive, it's like having the option of several pretty girls to ask out and you go for the one who isn't being harassed by your buddies. Just because you would choose differently doesn't mean informed attractiveness. The Dark Knight- Someone took this out once (not me), and it was put back in. I would have just let it be, but upon a recent watch of the movie I noticed that the Joker didn't pick her out at random at the party, he targeted her because she talked back at him. Otherwise, there is no point in the movie where people are gushing over how pretty she is, she simply has two guys who are in love with her.
- Girls from James Bond movies will often fall victim to this, likely the result of the concept of the Bond Girl having reached memetic levels of hotness.
- Firefly. Inara has the makeup and costumes (and of course Morena Baccarin is beautiful to begin with), but Kaylee has the sweet and pretty, River rocks the waif look, and Zoe has the unadulterated hotness. Cue obligatory bunk reference.
- How about Janice Rand. She and Kirk had UST. She was the victim of Attempted Rape by an evil clone of Kirk. Charlie, the Raised by Wolves teenager with godlike powers from the episode Charlie X lusted over her. Really, though, compared to Nurse Chapel and Uhura (who's played by Dorothy Dandridge lookalike Nichelle Nichols), and several Green Skinned Space Babes, Janice Rand might as well be called Janet Rando.
- Maggie Gyllenhaal's character in The Dark Knight is supposed to be beautiful, but the general consensus is that she's rather plain.
Loser Takes All: Removed, because Rashida Jones
◊ is hardly unattractive, the show - like The Office, its spiritual predecessor - tries to make its cast look more like "real people" than Hollywood beauties, you'd be hard pressed to find someone who doesn't consider her more appealing than the other regular female cast (remember, Aubrey Plaza's character is supposed to be too young to be a valid option), and the show really doesn't mention her attractiveness often (she has two men after her, but they both clearly like her for more than her looks; she gets hit on when she makes presentations, but the clear intention is to show how creepy the people who come to parks department presentations are). Even the incident mentioned is clearly more about Amy Poehler's character's deluded worldview than a reflection of the reality of Jones's character's life.
- Amy Poehler's character in Parks And Recreation remarks to Rashida Jones' character that because she is so pretty, she is likely not used to being rejected. Admittedly, in the context of the episode she's being rejected as a hunting partner, but this and other comments throughout the series are meant to make us see Jones as exceptionally pretty.
