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Um, there's no particular connection between those tropes at all, except that they often happen to be used together. An Apocalypse Maiden or something Sealed Inside a Person-Shaped Can makes a convenient Macguffin, but there's nothing inherently Macguffin-y about those tropes. In the case of The Chosen One, in particular, it's actually rare for one to be a Macguffin, but it's still a common type of Living Macguffin. Many LMs are TCO, but few TCOs are LMs.
edit to clarify: the point of MacGuffin is that it should be important to the characters. These other tropes are simply easy ways of making a living person be important to the other characters.
Edited by Xtifr Speaking words of fandom: let it squee, let it squee.
Ah I see what you're saying. (This is in response to where you edited your original post—it would have been clearer if you'd simply replied.) Yes, it can get fuzzy at times. But having character development does not actually stop a person from being a Living MacGuffin. It's not what a character is. It's a role they can play.
For example, in one episode of Bones, the protagonist gets kidnapped, and the rest of the cast spends the episode following clues to try to find her. Despite the fact that she's the protagonist, and a fully developed character, she became a living macguffin for that episode.
Edited by Xtifr Speaking words of fandom: let it squee, let it squee.
I see.
It's a bit odd because of the past laconic description (something about them being wanted despite doing nothing IDK) I always assumed that the trope only applied to characters who are only one tier above being living props, if that whereas there are way too many examples and wicks that equate being wanted to being thia trope regarless of the reason or its importance to the plot and I wanted to check that.
As for the 3rd example (along with the Bones one you provided) seems a bit like a stretch to consider them Macguffins since they do affect move around the plot and the Macguffin trope says that in order for something to be this, their special attributte is not just mundane, but also interchangeable with any other special object or character in the setting.
Dunno maybe I'm being too picky, but that sounds like any person with non-mundane special attributes (whether is supernatural, magical, prophecies etc.) that undoubtely affect or move the story for more reasons that their pursue itself would be disqualified of being a Living Macguffin at all.
But again that could be just me.
Some of the MacGuffin snowclones are more accurately described by the shared supertrope of Plot Device. A Plot Device does not have to be interchangeable with anything else. The Bones example is a MacGuffin (random bystander could be used in place of the character, with her being Trapped by Mountain Lions and unable to help).
Link to TRS threads in project mode here.
Oh, sorry I never watched Bones so I wasn't aware of the specifics, so in that case is there a trope for a character or object that is very, very important to the plot but the audience is not told why until very late into the story (chances are that it's part of The Reveal) but when it's done it ties in with the plot just fine, and they continue to be important afterwards?
For the rest, checking the Plot Device page they seem to support the idea that for an object or character to truly be a Macguffin (besides the ones already stated) they must be billed as important but never used or said importance to never accomplish anything within the plot right? Following that along with your statement that many Macguffin tropes are snowclones - I agree btw - Is there really such a need for so many of them? Especially when some of them are further divided in even more subtropes - some of them waaay too specific IMO - it feels like the trope really needs a cleanup.
If you want to build a more though understanding of Plot Device and its subtropes, I suggest starting a thread in Trope Talk.
Link to TRS threads in project mode here.
Maybe I could although dunno if it would be for the Living Macguffin or the Macguffin trope as a whole or its numerous subcategories.
Thank you.
When different pages give slightly different definitions of a term, it's often a sign that our definition(s) don't quite match those in the outside world. (Which happens—someone comes along and corrects—or "corrects"—the definition in one place, but not another, and we end up with a variety of definitions scattered across different places.)
So I went to The Other Wiki, and there seems to be some inherent ambiguity in the definition of the term
. So much so that they end up just listing three prominent filmmakers and their differing definitions, rather than saying "this is the one."
It does seem to be sort of a mess, and probably worth at least a trope talk thread, if not actual repair shop. Unfortunately, for such a widely used set of tropes, cleanup, if there is a problem, is likely to be a nightmare. *sigh*
Edited by Xtifr Speaking words of fandom: let it squee, let it squee.
I'm a little confused about this trope and how given that it's supposed to be a macguffin made into a person (which to my understanding seems like a person whose only purpose is to move the plot ...and not much of anything else), which means that there should be a difference between this trope and say... Apocalypse Maiden, The Chosen One, or Sealed Insidea Person Shaped Can
I understand how overlap is possible but when does a character go from being a mere Living Macguffin to any of these other tropes about a character relevant to the plot in one way or another? Or are ALL of those characters inherent macguffins? I mean since the trope itself is divided into more categories -some of which feel either really narrow or way too broad - and the main page description mentions the chosen one trope and at no point makes the distinction about the whole thing.
EDIT:
@Xtifr: Thank you for the answer, but now I see that I need to clarify a little more:
I know that in the most basic level Living Macguffin has little if any to do with the tropes I listed before, my confusion comes from the fact that in the Macguffin page we have this laconic description:
An object that, while not relevant to the main narrative, is frequently pursued throughout it.
Whereas the Living Macguffin has this one:
A plot object that is a person.
So, follwing these thread, my question basically boils down to this: In a narrative context, when or how does a character stop being a Living Macguffin? For example you said that this person's value is determined more by other characters and how much they pursue it rather than for the overall plot right? So this character could be a princess or a diplomat who at the end of the day doesn't not accomplish much but their purpose to the story is met for the simple fact that they are wanted people in the setting right? But a character with an established personality who happens to grab the Distress Ball is not right? Or a character who is The Heart of the team and is pursued for their importance to the main characters, or ( sorry I swear this is the last example) an established character (with personality, motives and connections to other characters) who is pursued by some unknown attribute that for a while is not specified to the audience so for a while they are indeed a Macguffin of sorts, their pursue fuels the plot at least half of the time, and at some point their importance in indeed a pivotal part of the Bad Guy's evil plot? Are they still a Living Macguffin?
Hope this is not too convoluted or something.
Edited by RoseBride