Neon Genesis Evangelion

It's almost like Anno is trying to get people to dislike her.

...was he seriously getting angry that people formed their own opinions about the characters?

"Yup. That tasted purple."

You talking about Anno?

Yes.

"Yup. That tasted purple."

As far as I know (at least Australian wise), both DVD/BD have the exact same features, and the DVD's about $5 cheaper than the Blu-Ray. All up to you man.

I'm on Youtube Reviewing Things Cause I can.

I think so. In a "passive-aggressive" way, perhaps.

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.

I guess that happened when he felt people missed the entire point of the character.

Instead of focusing on relatives that divide us, maybe we should try to find the absolutes that tie us.

On a different note, the First Ancestral Race.

Since they're the progenitors of both regular humanity and the Angels, and implicitly possess both the Fruit of Knowledge (implied to be full-fledged sapience and/or scientific ingenuity) and the Fruit of Life (which manifests as the quasi-supernatural power exhibited by Adam and his children, as well as the exotic, sometimes seemingly-science-defying biological forms many of them take), I've been wondering... would that make them liable to being cases of Bizarre Alien Biology?

Also, are they an inversion of Human Subspecies, i.e. it's humankind that are a "subspecies" of the aliens, not the other way around?

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.

We know next to nothing about the FAR. Hell, there are some fans who take the stance that since they're never mentioned in the show (only in writer's notes or videogames), that they aren't even canon.

Assuming that they are canon, though, all that's known is that they created the White and Black Moons, hinting at tremendous scientific advancement, probably at a Sufficiently Advanced level. Beyond that everything is a blank.

edited 28th Jan '16 12:11:47 PM by DarkHunter

Actually, we do know more than that: That both good ol' humanity and the Angels are species variants of the FAR (the Angels are also described as "humans who discarded the human form"). That implies that the FAR, in their natural state, are some sort of amalgamation of both humankind and Angel.

More of the scant information we have on the race here and here. (Granted, it seems someone forgot to add references/citations to support the information, but a considerable portion of it draws from available translations of the CI info.)

edited 28th Jan '16 1:29:02 PM by MarqFJA

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.

Classified information information?...

I couldn't conceive a dream so wet; your bongos make me congo.

One would imagine the FAR are at least as powerful as Angels and at least as intelligent as humans. It may be that the Adam-Lilith hybrid in EoE is a reasonable approximation to the power of a single FAR being.

Given that, I've often wondered what kind of calamity could've really made the FAR give up their physical forms in favor of spreading their souls across the universe with the seven Seeds. It's hard to imagine any natural disaster (even on a planetary scale) really threatening them.

Author of The Second Coming (NGE) and The Coin (Haruhi).

Classified Information is the name of a set of files found in an Eva video game that was never released outside of Japan. It's basically where most information of supplementary canon comes from.

That's not what I was pointing out there. :P

I couldn't conceive a dream so wet; your bongos make me congo.

I think Yui deserves more love. Such an awesome character.

@ Dark Hunter

They were implied in the show, per Fuyutsuki claiming an intelligence other than mankind created the Geofront IIRC.

Well, what do you want me to call it, then?

I thought it was Gendou who said that to Fuyutsuki.

edited 29th Jan '16 5:37:21 AM by MarqFJA

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.

So I just got through reading the entire manga (had been putting it off since like forever), and I have to say, the new ending was extremely unsatisfying. So the reconstructed world has seasons and stuff, but Shinji & Asuka don't recognize each other. How is that happy? And where are all the others, like Misato and whatnot? And if Shinji remembers all that happened to him before the reconstructed world happened, then why the hell does he not recognize Asuka?! I know Eva is very mind screwy, but that just makes no logical sense at all.

edited 30th Jan '16 5:35:06 AM by YasminPerry

It's Sadamoto, he probably lost track of his own work after delaying it for so long that he might as well say that he wanted to finish it at all costs, quality be damned.

Instead of focusing on relatives that divide us, maybe we should try to find the absolutes that tie us.

I found a copy of End of Evangelion online a few days ago for eight bucks. I didn't have my wallet because I lost it at a friend's place, so I couldn't buy it.

Just looked it up again, and it's gone. God fucking damnit. All I want is End of Eva to add to my DVD collection, it helped to define me when I needed it most. I'm calm about it, I was more upset when I first saw it on sale because I knew this would happen, but I am still upset.

I'll be buying the 3.33 Bluray soon, though. Hopefully that will fill the hole in my heart. If anyone's seen it, how's the dub quality? Is it as good as 2.22?

edited 16th Feb '16 3:42:16 AM by MrMallard

Come sail your ships around me, and burn your bridges down.

It's good. Aside from Kaworu's inability to pronounce his name correctly and Asuka's nickname for Mari getting old fast, I didn't find any issues with it. YMMV, of course. Also, the audio as a whole doesn't know if it wants to be quiet or loud, so you might have to adjust the volume every now and then if there are other people around.

Sucks to hear about Eo E.

edited 16th Feb '16 12:26:32 PM by TheAirman

PSN ID: FateSeraph Congratulations! She/They

Looking on the bright side, I found a Blu-ray copy of 3.33 online last night for $34. That's $6 cheaper than most retailers I looked up.

...Except they delayed my order due to low stock, and my Bluray won't be here for maybe another 2 weeks.

edited 23rd Feb '16 11:21:47 AM by MrMallard

Come sail your ships around me, and burn your bridges down.

Evangelion 3.33 came in the mail today.

The BD case is pretty barebones, no illustration on the case or anything, but that is A-OK with me because it came with the dust cover with all the info on the back, just like the 2.22 DVD I have. It also came with an art book, which I skimmed slightly before putting it away to prevent spoilers.

I've been on complete media blackout regarding 3.33 for three years and nearly four months. I'll finally stop bringing that up every time I post in this thread. I'm going to watch 2.22 before watching 3.33, which will probably set me up for a fall if critical and fan opinion is anything to go by, but I'm not too fussed because I'm too excited.

I finally have a chance to watch 3.33 dubbed. Considering that they had a dub that they took on the road before reworking it for the better part of 2 years, that is entirely too long.

There goes Eva 2.22. One of the best localizations in the Eva franchise for sure, and one of the best dubs I've ever heard. Watching the Eva 2.22 dub is why I decided to wait out for 3.33's dub - the team at Funimation do a damn fine job and I wanted that first-time watching experience with the voices I'm accustomed to, with some of the best audio mastering and voice work I've ever heard.

I'm aware that this is all fanboy wank and that I'm overhyping the movie for myself, but it's been such a long wait and I'm very excited.

And there goes Eva 3.33. Three years in the making.

First, general reaction and non-spoilery stuff regarding the movie's quality. After finishing 3.33, I regretted watching 2.22 first because they're two entirely different movies. I was expecting action on par with Eva 2.22, and frankly I wasn't satisfied. But that's okay, because Eva 3.33 isn't that type of movie.

The music was... at the risk of sounding like an asshole, the music was barely there. I didn't notice much of the music, I think the most noteworthy piece of original soundtrack was the credits music. That might have been the BD though - I had the DVD of 2.22 on a pretty low setting on my TV, it played at 12 very nicely. The BD of Eva 3.33 was in between 18 and 20. It was very quiet, in both the music department and general sound department. that might just be BD though, this was the first Bluray movie I've ever purchased and played. That doesn't really excuse the music, but volume-wise maybe that was a factor.

The voicework was pretty solid. Misato sounded enough like herself, and the times her voice went into a different range it fit her character. Shinji was portrayed pretty well, there were a few times where I wasn't 100% sold but that was mostly in the first 20 minutes. Mari and Asuka were alright, but... well, whether you consider this a spoiler or not is up to you, but they have very little screentime and don't say much. Same with Ritsuko and Gendo.

Was it worth waiting three years and spending $36 for the BD and art booklet (which is fuckin' rad, by the way)? Not really. I would have been satisfied with the shitty first draft instead of waiting for this miraculous super-dub made with Studio Khara. For the amount of dialogue in the movie, for the time I've cut myself off from Evangelion blogs and spoilers, it was not at all worth the wait. The fact that they took three years to rework this minimalist-ass movie and release it with an English dub is shameful - I'm not sure if it was moreso due to Funimation or due to Studio Khara's interference, but I'm not 100% sure why it took so long when there was a complete dub in some sort of state back in like 2013, when they aired the whole thing at NYCC and took it on a road tour instead of RELEASING THE MOVIE.

Without knowing anything about that first version to compare to this one, I have a lot of questions and a lot of doubts. I enjoyed the movie to some degree, but it's not as entertaining as 2.22.

Now, for spoilers: This movie is bleak. Very bleak. And that's okay. I'm an EoE fanboy, I can do bleak. But I feel like there's not enough of anything else to balance it out with. Shinji's interactions with Kaworu are almost alien in how disjointed they are, with Kaworu seeming like he was brainwashing Shinji into Gendo's plan - it seemed so obvious, because I knew Gendo was already going to be a scheming prick. Nope, Kaworu was just as clueless and has Shinji start a destructive Fourth Impact. So now Shinji's taken part in 2 examples of supernatural genocide, one of which he was tricked into believing would make things better. God damnit, and after his friends and essentially family shunned him. Which was kinda justified due to the destruction he caused, but really shitty in that Misato egged him on, he honestly had no intention of hurting Asuka and had no idea how the world had changed. He was dumped into the world 14 years later, which he did screw up, but without a decent idea of just how he had screwed up and shunned by two people he had never meant to hurt.

And the worst part is that when he is confronted with his consequences, he runs away and shifts blame. Which is a constant in the series, but in 2.22 he was clearly ready to take a step forward and fix a mess that needed his help by the end. Even knowing what other people had said about the movie, I was disappointed in how powerless Shinji was in this movie, and how far he as a character had backpedaled to the point of delusion by the final fight. He didn't listen to Kaworu's warnings, presumably because he just wanted to make things right that badly, but I didn't buy it. Kaworu's long silence and Shinji fucking up with the lances was a low point of the movie for me, because it didn't feel right. It felt contrived.

And again, I can buy Shinji running away and giving into grief. But never on this level. I think it's because of the lack of a relatable authority figure - every adult in the movie hates Shinji or wants to use him for something, to the point that even Kaworu is dancing to Gendo's strings without realizing how badly he's fucking up. So this was the lowest point of Shinji Ikari for me. I mean, considering how he's come down from a triumphant high in 2015 by saving Rei and jumped forward 14 years to a world that his actions doomed, I guess I can't make a judgement call on how Shinji would react. I mean, the other time he was responsible for a total genocide of the human race, it was unstoppable and had somewhat of a happy ending (except for him and Asuka, I guess) - we never got to see him come to such a sudden realization of what's happened. I guess? I dunno, as a certified EoE fanboy I feel like said movie was a more moving and comprehensive event than 3.33.

Which brings me to an interesting point - 3.33 wasn't an ending. There's one more movie to go. And I think 3.33 has more potential merit than it has now if the last movie can justify 3.33's direction and come back around to what Eva's all about. For me, that's hope. The series ended with a personal breakthrough for Shinji and hope for the future, End of Evangelion ended with the hope that humanity can rebuild itself and that those who choose to live will have a chance to be happy, even Rebuild 1 and 2 were about hope. 3.33, on its own, is mostly about despair. If the last movie can bring it back around to hope, I'll be happy.

A few more assorted tidbits: Rei Q has potential as a character, but I feel like throwing Rei 2 away after her positive character development was a waste. Though I'm kind of hoping that she's in Shinji's heart or something corny like that. The new characters were kinda pointlessly over-designed for their function in the movie, and I kinda didn't like most of them. Especially Pink Hair. I'm pretty impressed that they were ballsy enough to go with the setting that they went with, where Shinji irrevocably fucked the world and he has to deal with that revelation - seeing the ball (which was kinda dumb, but very recognizable) and the crosses was pretty messed up. This movie was the first time I even remotely agreed with Asuka, specifically that he's a brat - because in this movie specifically, he's regressed to the naive shell of a person he never was before this movie. I wish there was actual answers as to why Asuka and Mari - Mari especially - still look so young. All we got was "curse of the Eva", and that was lame. I hope Pen Pen's okay.

Now, onto the big shipping dilemma about Rei. The movie stated it outright that Rei is a direct copy of Yui. I can respect that, and not ship Rebuild!Rei and Shinji. I say it like that because I've been shipping this pairing since I was 12, and have a dormant fanfic about her and Shinji in a blatantly fanfic-ified world where nothing is awful. Letting go of the ship isn't something I can easily do. I'm basically shipping outside of the context of Rebuild or 3.33 in particular - I don't deny that doing that is a cheap move, but I'm staying positive about something that I've found positive for a significant amount of time. I'll just be a bit more quiet about it.

Now, theories: Toji is alive. I know that Shinji gets Toji's school shirt, implying very heavily that he was a victim of Third Impact, but I feel like with Sakura's demeanor towards him and the possibility that Kaji's still alive, that it's very possible that wherever Shinji goes in the last movie to help him out (as stated in the post-credits slideshow), he'll run into Kaji and possibly Toji. The uniform could have been kept with NERV, given that their school was run by NERV, and circulated among both Shinji and Kaworu. Tied to this theory is that Kaji's alive, given what the old guy on Misato's ship says ("Kaji did say that she was a crazy broad", or something along those lines).

And finally, a quick summary of how I felt. Movie was too bleak IMO but can be redeemed by the fourth and last movie, there was too much 3D CGI, Shinji and Kaworu's supposed rapport was slow and plodding with Kaworu talking like an alien very noticably. The collar thing was dumb, Shinji taking the spears against Kaworu's wishes was dumb and done for dramatic effect, and by the end of the movie - while I agree with Asuka being fed up with Shinji - I felt like Shinji got a godawful rap and was well-justified in having that slack jaw and inability to function on his own - a dude's head fuckin' exploded right next to him, Jesus. Movie was a straight-up "Shaggy Dog" Story, and it wasn't worth the wait - though I don't regret watching the movie like I did, and there's hope that the series as well as this movie alone will be redeemed. As far as art goes, I'd give it a 6 - it's not bad, but 2.22 was more interesting and had more of a flair. Plot-wise, this movie is a 4 - Gendo's an old asshole and I hope he has a heart attack, Misato is justified in hating Shinji for his role in Third Impact as is the rest of the human race, but she actually condoned his actions at the time and is kind of a hypocrite, the story was mostly a lot of new stuff that came out of nowhere, which would have worked well with more set-up, and the characters were very underwhelming. Musically the movie was a 5 for me, mostly because I didn't feel that the music did much for me. I didn't hate this movie, but it could have had more flair in my opinion and doesn't stand well without a more solid and cohesive conclusion. This movie is the antithesis to 2.22, and as a guy who liked that movie very much 3.33 was a hard pill to swallow.

And if you think that was a lot of writing, I have more opinions that I might drop more casually over time. I'll also answer questions if anyone wants to know anything else.

edited 11th Mar '16 9:53:05 AM by MrMallard

Come sail your ships around me, and burn your bridges down.

Yeah, 3.33 may not be the worst anime film I've ever seen, but it is one of the most disappointing. It almost feels like Anno had nothing but contempt for those who enjoyed the previous film, and wanted to slap them across the face for doing so with this film. The fact that it is so unrelentingly bleak with nothing else to lighten the tone makes it hard to get attached to the events of the story, or care about Shinji, since he's doomed no matter what. The whole thing just feels incredibly mean spirited and one-sided. Heck, the fact that Anno fell into another depression after finishing the film also makes me wonder if he himself is having second thoughts about taking the story in this direction.

Not to mention that it prioritizes themes and messages over telling the story. Rather than continue from where the last film left off, we're instead jumped 14 years into the future. No doubt this is to make us feel the same way as Shinji, but I think this is a cheap ploy to try and make us sympathize with his plight. Throughout the whole film, you're constantly beaten over the head with themes and messages about Shinji's situation and how one needs to let go of the past and whatnot. Again, all done in such a one-sided and downright contemptuous manner. They have basically taken precedence over the story and characters, sacrificing relationship building and interaction in favor of preaching themes that I assume Anno desperately feels the audience must live by. I know I keep on bringing up The Matrix Reloaded to the annoyance of some of you, but that's exactly what the film feels like to me in terms of how it delivers its themes.

Now all this wouldn't be a problem since it is leading right into the next film, but unfortunately, it's been the better part of a decade, and we still haven't gotten the last movie. Anno instead has postponed it while he works on other projects, which almost feels like he deliberately is trying to hold off working on it. It's quite frustration, even if those other projects turn out good.

As for Shinji and Rei though, I'm not quite sure the ship has completely sunk yet. The former seemed more bothered with the fact that the latter was not saved than the reveal that she's a copy of his mother after all. Plus, that relationship is one of the core focuses of the entire Rebuild saga. To just drop it would be a huge waste imo, especially if it's all for some theme of "Shinji can't mature if he's with her", ignoring his he did start to mature in 2.22 through his interactions with her. Even if it ends in a bittersweet manner aka Simon and Nia, I'll be content with that.

What say you Mallard?

edited 11th Mar '16 12:58:53 PM by LDragon2

I at least think that Hideaki Anno working on Gojira 2016 is good for him, and that working on other projects is a good way to cleanse his palate. I can live with no Evangelion 4.44 until like 2020 if it means he's getting into the groove of it. I'm no stranger to waiting.

I agree that Shinji seemed more disturbed that he hadn't saved Rei, but learning she was a replica of his mother was about as disorienting as the revelation that he hadn't saved her imo. I mean, he learns that his mother's last name was Ayanami, that Rei was a clone and then he's confronted by a wall of severed heads. I'm curious about the SDAT player, for a while there I thought it was broken because I thought it had her soul inside of it or something.

Having slept on it, I kind of enjoyed Eva 3.33's minimalism. even if Shinji is crapped on, built back up by Kaworu and crapped on even harder, the minimalism of the movie was interesting. I can appreciate the movie on that basis. At the same time though, It's in a very different ballpark to pretty much any other piece of Eva media, and because of that this might currently be my least favorite Eva film. Not that I hate it or think that it was a burlap sack full of faeces, It's around average for me, but I think I've enjoyed almost every other piece of Evangelion media that I've seen more than 3.33.

Come sail your ships around me, and burn your bridges down.