The Military Thread

Well I hope they figure that out soon, sorta seems like something you'd wanna keep making.

How long until the reserves run out?

Giving the Chally the 55 would give it possibly higher velocity then the Abrams. It would incidentally make it compatible with nearly all US ammo stocks as well as other stocks made to work in the L/44 guns.

edited 31st Aug '14 3:10:46 PM by TuefelHundenIV

It's not as simple as dropping a new gun into the existing turret; regunning the tank requires completely redesigning the turret.

Rheinmetall 120mm gun...so that's the name of Abrams' gun.

Deadbeat: its not an entirely new gun just a longer one.

Alright, I think The Alleged Car page could use a few military examples, anything Detroit or Lelyand can screw up the DOD can screw up for thousands more...

• The Gamma Goat "While the Gama Goat had exceptional off-road ability, its quirky steering made it hard to handle on pavement, and its tendency to flounder in amphibious operations required drivers to have special training in order to operate it. This meant it could not be the "general purpose" vehicle the Army had hoped for, and production was halted after the original contract expired. This is somewhat ironic, as some[who?] claim the problems were largely due to cost-cutting modifications made at the request of the US Army."

• Most versions of the iconic jeep were fine off road. On road, speed freaks trying to drift a jeep could get into a rollover due to most being topheavy. The Willys MB did find itself on the surplus market, but the latter M151 MUTT did not. It couldn't meet US highway standards and was rollover prone.

• The HMMWV burst on the scene after The Gulf War. In The War On Terror, it's soft skin was vulnerable. First there was the "hillbilly armor", ad-hoc armor that was breaking drive trains and causing rollovers. Then the "up-armored" variant arrived with built in armor. It too was rollover prone, however the engines struggled under the strain of all that armor. Hence the MRAP program and the Joint Light Tactical Vehicle program to replace the HMMWV.

edited 31st Aug '14 7:37:54 PM by TairaMai

Yes, but the recoil mechanism and the like will need to be redesigned all the same. Supposedly the US isn't in on the project so far because the extra length created some unexpected interactions with petal separation for sabots, which in turn meant shots going wild. (Maybe the new -E4 version of the Silver Bullet overcomes that?)

Didn't the jeep kill Patton afterall?

No, he was in a staff car a 1938 Cadillac Model 75. His car was hit by a Deuce and a Half.

Interestingly enough, his protege Walton Walker was killed in a darkly similar accident (collision with a truck) while riding a Willys in Korea. Needless to say, Walker's death allowed Ridgeway to assume command of the U.S Eighth Army, then in disarray from the Chinese intervention, and get it back into competent shape for the rest of the war.

See? Another example of the Willys Jeep helping out in the war!

(Okay, I'm joking, but all signs indicated that Walker was out of his depth dealing with Korea, while Ridgway performed one of the greatest feats of personal leadership in US Army history in turning the UN forces around.)

@ Taira: Detroit or Leyland were often the contractors...

It's not the gun that's the problem. The turret's ammo storage is designed for the two-part ammunition that the L30 uses.

I just read in the Rheinmetall 120mm's page that the L55 has undergone testing with two modified Challenger 2's...six years ago. I'm guessing it's possible but the Mo D can't be arsed to do anything about it.

The Humvee was fine, and had armor protection on par with any other vehicle in its class (which is to say: none at all). You might as well call the Abrams a flop because of its limited passenger space.

The MRA Ps are nightmares when it comes to turnovers, incidentally. The V-hull and heavy armor which they are based around means they are very high off the ground and very top heavy. Can't say I'd ever heard of the Humvee having a problem with turnovers, due to their very wide, squat stance.

Pavlov's House.◊

Okay, this came up in the Ukraine thread, and I have to ask:
How do modern tanks stack up against each other?

We just had a big thingy on this a little while ago.

We concluded that if we can actually start deploying Iron Curtain in good numbers on the Abrams and other NATO tanks then everyone would be in a dead heat with everyone. Unless it's a T-72 or older.

We also concluded that tanks are tubby and tank eyes look neat.

The majority of MBT's in modern militaries have never really faced each other in their country of origins best kit. Nearly all encounters have either been between a home model vs a export or export vs export. Export models are usually not a as tough as their home counter part and have a few things changed or tweaked usually to make them a bit weaker or not quite as capable as the best model. They also frequently tend to have country specified modifications made to them to suit the recipient countries needs.

(catching up from while I was away at Dragoncon)

Regarding so-called "peacekeeping" forces and their perception as being inadequate at best, when given ROEs that are basically "no self defense for any reason" it's kind of difficult to get anything useful done, which is why stuff like Filipino forces breaking out of a siege by Syrian rebels is considered newsworthy.

It also doesn't help support the notion of peacekeeping forces being useful when they're not only not keeping the peace but making things less peaceful, like in Africa where PK forces have abused the people they're supposed to be protecting.

(This isn't the thread for it, so I won't get into my other issues with peacekeepers, especially of the UN variety. )

edited 1st Sep '14 1:51:31 PM by Nohbody

Strange thing I've learned from the local news broadcasts on the subject:
The majority of the troops in the Golan Heights are usually based in various outposts, observing the area.
The Irish, however, are used as a QRF, heading out to flashpoints. That's kinda interesting.

Been meaning to ask, Republic of Irish or the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Irish?

Republic of Ireland Irish. They have a long history of participation in UN operations, most notably at the Siege of Jadotville in 1961, during which they radioed UN headquarters with the immortal words: "We will hold out until our last bullet is spent. Could do with some whiskey."

edited 1st Sep '14 3:55:54 PM by Achaemenid

John Walker, Jr, head of the Walker spy ring, dies in prison 9 months before his scheduled release.

As someone who might have had to face one of those Walker-enhanced Soviet subs had I stayed in, the best I can say about his death (and that of his brother, also involved in the ring, earlier this year) is "took long enough".

edited 1st Sep '14 4:46:33 PM by Nohbody

Filipino Force Defied UN Commander in Golan Crisis.