The Amazing Digital Cleanup

As a Web Animation that gained a 100 million views in the span of a month, The Amazing Digital Circus is a piece of work that's got plenty of tropers. Unfortunately, that rapid size of fans also meant a ton of misuse.

First case, is I'm gonna bump this question from Twiddler on the TADC YMMV discussion page.

Edited by AudioSpeaks2 on Nov 18th 2023 at 6:54:19 PM

In the last two weeks, I saw in the page histories that this example regarding Kinger had been bouncing around between tropes and even pages (namely, the Characters and YMMV pages):

• He [Kinger], the arguably least mentally sound character in the cast, suspects that Kaufmo has gone insane, and accuses Pomni of starting to go insane too after he heard both of them talking about an exit. Turns out, his fears were not unfounded, as Kaufmo had abstracted, and Pomni seems to be on her way to lose her sanity as well by the end of the Pilot.

To wit, it was first added on November 7th by Rom Watt under Kinger's folder in the Characters page, as an example of Hypocritical Humor. Three days later, on November 10th, Junebug 25 changed it to a Hypocrite Has a Point entry.

Another three days (November 13th), and commentspaee removes the entry from the folder and adds it to the YMMV page as an example of Strawman Has a Point. Their edit reason (in their edit on the Characters page, at least; the YMMV page edit only has the first three words) was "Audience agreement only, move to YMMV as Strawman Has a Point. No one In-Universe realizes Kinger was right, which is what those tropes necessitate." Two days after that (November 15th), Twiddler removed the entry entirely from the YMMV page because, according to their edit reason, it's "misuse of Strawman Has a Point. Kinger is not a strawman in this scenario."

Lastly, recently today (on November 18th), commentspaee re-added the entry back to Kinger's folder, under Hypocrite Has a Point once again, with their reason simply saying "Restoring, this actually counts."

So, I think the trope that the entry is closest to is Hypocrite Has a Point, because I don't find any humor in Kinger's claims about Kaufmo and Pomni, and there doesn't appear to be any outright Audience Reaction about them being good arguments that the creator(s) didn't intend in the first place (I think it's one of the few Foreshadowing hints to the reveal of what happened to Kaufmo); but does the trope really fit? The trope's page outright says that at least one of the characters must acknowledge the fallacy that the "hypocrite" is pointing out; in the pilot itself, nobody really brings up Kinger's claim after discovering Kaufmo had abstracted, and never remarks about Pomni's implied Sanity Slippage by the end of the episode (be it with or without mentioning Kinger).

It's also worth mentioning the fact that there's currently a similarly-worded entry for The Cuckoolander Was Right using just about the same context in Kinger's folder:

• The Cuckoolander Was Right: He refuses to go see Kaufmo because he believes he's going insane after claiming to see an exit, and thinks Pomni's going insane for the same reasons. As Kaufmo's "Abstraction" and Pomni's later Sanity Slippage after going through the fake exit door show, Kinger wasn't far off in his assessment.

Edited by Inky100 on Nov 18th 2023 at 12:22:42 PM

Note that I moved this issue from the "Are these Character Tropes?" thread because I initially wanted to discuss it there, but I didn't receive any reply in the last few days, so I followed AudioSpeaks2's past recommendation of putting it here.

Also, carrying over from this ATT query and this comment on the "Are these Character Tropes?" thread, the Wingding Eyes example in the series' main page (the current writing of which is shown below; it had two sub-bullets and some different wording at the time of the event, but the context was otherwise the same) specified two different instances of the trope applying to the same character (Pomni), with no cases from other characters cited whatsoever.

• Wingding Eyes: Pomni's eyes occasionally become scribbles when she's extremely distressed, or spinning spirals when she vomits from disorientation.

I initially added the entry on Pomni's folder in the show's Characters page, since it specifically referred to her (as well as the fact that there was a similar Eye Trope, Wide Eyes and Shrunken Irises, listed in her folder), only for Twiddler to remove my addition because "it should only be listed on one [page]" (just to note, I've never heard about this rule before, not even from other mods editing pages).

So, I'd like to ask, do both the Wingding Eyes and Wide Eyes and Shrunken Irises examples fit better in Pomni's character folder, or in the show's main page? I think they fit better as tropes specific to Pomni, since they happen to her quite constantly over the course of the series' only episode so far, but I need clarification.

Edited by Inky100 on Nov 22nd 2023 at 10:33:14 AM

As somebody who watched the first episode, not a lot of characters have Wingding Eyes. Caine has rather realistic eyes and so does Kinger, Bubble has black eyes that don't change much, Ragatha's eyes don't alter too much, Gangle's eyes don't change beyond warping black circles, Jax's eyes don't have their textures changing too much and Zooble rarely emotes much with their eyes and don't change much.

Edited by Diamondeye218 on Nov 22nd 2023 at 12:11:35 PM

On November 21st (the day before this writing), Li98vieira changed tropes for an entry in Caine's folder about his role in the series, from Big Good to Big Bad, alongside some rewording.

This is how the entry looked before the edit:

• Big Good: The all-powerful ringleader of the Digital Circus who provides activities to keep the performers from going mad with boredom, and consequently abstracting. Unfortunately, his lack of understanding humans and general obliviousness leaves his effectiveness in this role a lot to be desired.

This is how it looks now (notice how Li98vieira notably added "keeping the performers from escaping" among the purposes of the activities provided by Caine):

• Big Bad: The all-powerful ringleader of the Digital Circus who provides activities to keep the performers from going mad with boredom, consequently abstracting, and (presumably) escaping. Unfortunately, his lack of understanding humans and general obliviousness leaves his effectiveness in this role a lot to be desired.

Whether he's supposed to be the series' Big Good or Big Bad is rather ambiguous in itself (to the point that we could otherwise just remove the entry entirely if it's a major issue), but I don't think any of Caine's functions in running the Circus were made clear (other than the adventures, if that counts). Besides, he created the secret exit door specifically because he was kept being asked for it by various performers (mostly past ones aside from Pomni, if I'm not wrong), and the exit's fakeness was mainly because he doesn't really understand what an "escape way" is (not to mention that he also stated he doesn't know anything about the virtual world outside the Circus and whatever other places he creates). What should we do with this entry?

Edited by Inky100 on Nov 22nd 2023 at 5:59:04 PM

Given Caine's Ambiguous Nature, I feel like neither Big Good nor Big Bad should apply to him until more episodes flesh him out.

Let's just comment it out and then later reinstate it when and if the time comes.

I've commented the entry out for now, citing this thread. Should I do something else in regards with it (e.g. send a PM to Li98vieira), or is it fine for now?

Edited by Inky100 on Nov 23rd 2023 at 5:15:11 PM

Users are confusing. I don't think most things on this site make sense because everyone is too busy ignoring or skimming through the pages before actually adding an example. All of that happened because I hadn't a clue what anything actually meant since the masses of people are twisting what everything means in here, especially "has a point" and "playing with". Everyone needs a guide on how to actually use TV Tropes.

... Not to say people don't know how to use the site, that is. It's the examples themselves and the failure to read definitions before adding something that's the issue.

Edited by commentspaee on Nov 23rd 2023 at 7:33:34 PM

I think this needs to be cleared up because it keeps getting added and deleted

But is TADC an adult show or not?

Recently there was a What Do You Mean, It's Not for Kids? entry to the show's YMMV page

I promptly deleted it it's meant to be a family friendly show in spite of the horror. Like Courage

I just wanna ask, when has Goose ever said that this is an adult show? From all the signs and the fact that she didn't even put a "Not for kids" warning, this is very clearly not for adults only, it's for the whole family. Kids watching this is appropriate.

I'll ping

~SnowyZoe97 and SuperL here as they have argued in favor of calling it not for kids. Just for their thoughts.

Honestly, I don't think TADC is necessarily aimed at a family demographic. It's not necessarily an adult-rated show, sure, but the premise alone makes it quite clear for me that it isn't meant for children and families; the amounts of viewers from such demographic is probably because of its bright, kid-friendly-looking aesthetic (for the most part, at least) that was deliberately done to go along with the premise. It kind of reminds me of the YMMV item's example for 9, a film that didn't necessarily have an adult rating, but was watched by plenty of families with their children due to CGI movies at the time of its release being generally made with a certain enjoyability from kids and families in mind (it had a considerably grim aesthetic to go with it premise, though, so there wasn't much of an excuse as TADC).

If anything, I think that former What Do You Mean, It's Not for Kids? example could work with some re-writing.

Edited by Inky100 on Apr 6th 2024 at 1:37:58 PM

Personally, I regard this series as the kind of show where it is technically kid-friendly, yet it's also something you wouldn't want a young child to watch due to certain elements to the show. In this case, it's the possibility of the show taking a depressing route and showing stuff like sad backstories, character death, the exploration of the existential horror, and an overall somber mood as the episodes go on, not something I would want a young child to watch. So yeah, I think the example could work with rewriting, just that it cannot phrase TADC as an adult show like Hazbin Hotel and Helluva Boss.

It keeps getting added repeatedly now, though by other users. I inserted a commented out note in an effort stop this.

It... kinda is? It says here according to the official Glitch Productions website that it is for 13–24-year-olds.

~AudioSpeaks2: And a ping to make sure.

I think this should fall under the New Hope effect (I made this term up but it goes like this)

Essentially, George Lucas intended A New Hope to be a children's movie. But besides Lucas and maybe a few producers, basically nobody calls it a "children's Science Fantasy" film, just "A Science Fantasy film"

I think whatever target audience Glitch and Goose wished to market the show to objectively doesn't come across in the show itself because nothing about it is explicitly or even implicitly targeting adults only or including anything inappropriate for kids. Again, just because its horror doesn't make it adult either because Coraline and Courage are also horror but aimed at kids.

I see... Let's just wait for more episodes and see if there's anything not so appropriate.

Edited by moxeden on Apr 16th 2024 at 7:48:30 PM

I guess you're right with that and fair enough reasoning with that

Here's Goose's comments about the demographic on Tumblr:

[1] She's iffy on having 8-year-olds watch it because she will "push things kinda far later down the line".

[2] She thinks a 12-year-old could "probably" watch the show (possibly as in "handle watching it").

[3] She cautions that watching her "weird cartoon" might damage little kids' development.

[4] She recommends older viewers screen each episode and decide for themselves whether it's appropriate for younger kids.

Edited by immblueversion on Apr 29th 2024 at 6:40:07 AM

I'm thinking the lead quote should be changed or removed. The opening dialogue is a pre-Subverted Kids' Show mislead that doesn't represent what the show is really about: a group of traumatized people and how they deal with being trapped forever in a world they hate.

Maybe Pomni and Ragatha's conversation will do the job better:

I'd like to split the Fridge Brilliance, Fridge Horror and Fridge Sadness sections of the Fridge page into several "In General" and "By episode" folders for each header. I did make the intiial folderizing myself, but the headers were removed by Phoenixprominence not long after. Would it come off as an Edit War if I re-add themn?

Also, Gummigoo's folder might need to have its spoilers unmarked considering the sheer amount of spoiler tags and an example of Walking Spoiler present in it.

Edited by Inky100 on May 4th 2024 at 10:31:03 AM