Misused: Invisible President

There is a mismatch between how the trope Invisible President is defined and how it is used. The trope is defined as having Real Life presidents (or other political leaders or public figures) show up in your work with their face obscured and their identity obscured so a real person who might object isn't technically featured. An example given is Johnny English, in which we see Queen Elizabeth II's hand and hear her voice but her face is never shown.

But there are a great many examples citing fictional leaders who are presented as The Faceless or The Ghost. One of this second type of example as listed is Veep, in which the President is The Ghost, never shown onscreen, but is definitely fictional (he's eventually named "Stuart Hughes").

TLDR, a whole bunch of examples don't fit the definition as given, so it would seem our options are 1) delete all the bad examples or 2) revise trope definition to include fictional leaders who are portrayed as The Faceless or The Ghost.

I always thought that all these discussion threads with only one post hadn't been opened, and I never looked at them.

Now it turns out that some of them have been opened. Seems like it's time to look at all fifty-plus one-post threads on the page.

Topic: ...and this thread is mine! Anyhoo, seeking guidance on whether to change the definition to fit the usage, or to do a massive pruning of examples in accordance with definition.

I think this is another Trope Transplant case with this becoming the supertrope and the current definition becoming a subtrope of it. There is very much a trope of the president being heard but not seen that doesn't just extend to real presidents.

So change the definition to fit the misuse, then?

Not quite. It's Missing Supertrope Syndrome and the current name works well for making this the supertrope and getting a more specific name for the subtrope this is currently defined as.

Isn't the supertrope just The Faceless or The Ghost, as appropriate? I mean, we don't need a more specific variant of those tropes just for presidents, right? The Faceless is already commonly used for leaders anyway. I'm not convinced we shouldn't just move the bad examples to the existing supertropes and call it a day.

I would certainly support getting rid of the "exceptions" though. This isn't a trope where aversions are notable.

edited 28th Jul '15 7:57:47 PM by troacctid

In other words, move all examples of fictional leaders to The Faceless or The Ghost? I can get behind that.

This sounds like a specific subtrope of He Who Must Not Be Seen. Leaders who are either The Faceless, The Ghost, or The Voice due to real world implications (either serious or as a joke).

Fictional leaders being vague seem like they should just be on one of the variant tropes.

A better name might be in order though, and a description that makes a real world requirement clear.

edited 7th Aug '15 11:06:19 PM by Jokubas

Question: if a world leader is not named, and their face/voice are never shown, how can you be sure whether they're supposed to be the Real Life leader or a fictional one?

Well, with Bush he tended to get a pair of cowboy boots, or the silohuette of a man in a cowboy hat. Obama tends to get a fleeting glimpse of an African American man. Other presidents get other bits of tells. Depends on the film, but it's a bit like caricature. You know who it's supposed to be even if they don't out and tell you.

Or the character remains conspicuously unnamed as well as unseen.

It also helps if the creator has a standing policy of "Always assume the in-universe President of the US is the current incumbent", like Marvel Comics and DC Comics (until Lex Luthor ascended to the office for some time; since then it's always a fictional character as the US President in the DC Universe).

Assuming the president is the sitting one when the work is made unless directly stated is a good rule.

There are so many works that do this, even some that drop subtle hints without directly saying any name.

That's basically just Like Reality, Unless Noted.

Bumping so this can stay open.

Bump.

Locking per New Year Purge.