The General Religion, Mythology, and Theology Thread

The whole, "Angels are wingéd humanoids," thing is, if memory serves, the fault of artists not drawing them right. (To be fair, statistically speaking, I'm sure that, if Angels are real and as Abrahamic lore describes, many of them have humanoid appendages. By that I don't mean appendages that wouldn't look too out of place on a human, though I'm sure they have those too, but appendages that are shaped like humans.) Similar to how the only reason apples are associated with original sin is because a bunch of morons thought they were so goddamned clever for that goddamned, "Malus," pun.

I'm either laughing or screaming; maybe both. Either way, this image will be in my nightmares for years to come.

Good job.

edited 23rd Mar '14 8:53:18 AM by Rem

The winged humanoid is pretty easily explained by that just being what 3D creatures see when they deign to dip their multi-dimensional toes into a slice of reality we can comprehend.

The other shapes are the same being from different angles.

edited 23rd Mar '14 8:55:08 AM by Elfive

TROGDOOOOOOOORRRRRR

I was reading the Book of Enoch and thought I'd share the list of Seven Archangels and Their Functions.

They amuse me.

My person favorite is Raguel, who's apparently the divine equivalent of the guy who gives you concrete shoes and introduces you to a deep lake.

<ost realistic Rendering of humanoid angels I've encountered is John Varley's Gaea Trilogy

I named my son after an archangel. Good times :)

Which archangel did you name him after?

So angels are like different species than humans? Or is that "Little Billy died because God needed another angel" thing just a Hand Wave to why God lets children die or kills them directly? You know, I spend way too much time thinking about dead children.

Whoops! Sorry about the double post.

edited 24th Mar '14 6:05:34 PM by DigaagWaRiz

Angels are not dead humans. I don't even know where that came from. Angels are supposed to be the servants of God, there are several very strange classes of angel, and the only angels described with wings are the Cherubim which just sound odd and the Seraphim with six wings. Oh, and all the angels are supposed to have been created before humanity.

The angels that appear to people aren't really described, aside from how they apparently terrified people (why do you think "Fear not" was always the first thing they said?), and also, they're never described as singing. They always say things.

There is one description of an angel from Daniel 10 though.

4 On the twenty-fourth day of the first month, as I was standing on the bank of the great river, the Tigris, 5 I looked up and there before me was a man dressed in linen, with a belt of fine gold from Uphaz around his waist. 6 His body was like topaz, his face like lightning, his eyes like flaming torches, his arms and legs like the gleam of burnished bronze, and his voice like the sound of a multitude.

Sounds kind of like a robot actually. Maybe this is where Atlus got their idea of the Metatron from?

edited 24th Mar '14 10:00:31 AM by Zendervai

I may be mistaken but I seem to recall that the idea of Fluffy Cloud Heaven where blessed souls wear halos and strum harps all day long is relatively recent.

edited 24th Mar '14 10:01:45 AM by Fighteer

Yeah, the few Biblical descriptions of Heaven make it sound like a giant cubical city.

The measurements given indicate that each side is the same length as the distance between Jerusalem and Rome.

Apparently God really likes the concept of the Arcology.

edited 24th Mar '14 10:07:10 AM by Zendervai

An afterlife presented as a reward is almost always drawn as what the person imagining it thinks would be the best possible way to spend time; to the Vikings, it was Valhalla — fighting all day then partying all night, then doing it again the next day, with no lasting damage and no hangovers. A fluffy cloud heaven of idleness and comfort would appeal to people who have to work hard all day, in all weather, whether they want to or not, with little time for hobbies or relaxation like laying around playing music.

@ Zendervai: Metatron is an archangel^note  Odd name though — sounds like an electronic product from The '80s.

I know that. Just whenever the Metatron shows up in the Shin Megami Tensei series, it looks like a robot.

I will forever picture him as Alan Rickman.

edited 24th Mar '14 11:01:21 AM by Elfive

To the Christians he is named Uriel, but the Semetic name is Azrael.

There are several legends around Azrael.

To some in the Jewish community, Azrael (known as Uriel) was the one who succeeded in getting the dirt for Adam. God sent Gabrael, Michael, Uriel, and another whom I forgot to get the dirt. The other three were distracted Alon their path according to their calling. Michael rescued a lamb from a lion for example.

But every time Azrael was tempted to stop, they refused to stop and instead prayed for god to intercede in the matter. As a result, they were the only one to bring back dirt. God rewarded Azrael by allowing them to be present when he breathed life into Adam. Azrael was also given the honor of being the only entity besides god who can touch the human soul.

In Jewish lore, Azrael sits forever at a book, writing and erasing the names of souls as they are born and die. They are called in to advocate for or against a soul sometimes. In Islamic lore, Azrael actually carries the soul before god to be judged.

I named his Azrael because I felt naming him for the one person able to touch a human soul would help him know just how much he means to me and what love I have for him. You can ask him and he will tell you he is Mommy's Archangel.

Three angels sent to earth to find dirt. Two fail.

I find this ridiculously funny for some reason.

God sent angels to get something for him. That implies that he couldn't reach it himself or just didn't feel like it, which also implies he is in a position in space away from Earth. Maybe he was uncomfortable trying to sculpt Adam all the way from his throne? I give up trying to rationalize these things.

Anyways, are angels supposed to have free will? I know in the Qur'an (which claims to correct perceived errors in the Bible and the Torah) angels have no free will and so obey God without fail. So instead of Satan being a fallen angel, he is instead a Jinn. Jinn have free will and are made out of fire. They are also invisible to humans. And they can possess us...Wow I got the short end of the stick. I want to shoot fire and take over people's bodies!

So there was this city in ancient Egypt called crocodilopolis , and apparently it was the center for the cult of Sobek http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crocodilopolis

God sent a lot of people to do something he should have done or could have done himself.

Angels were made to be servants of god so why not?

That's a wikipedia page about a cult in Ancient Egypt based around the worship of a crocodile deity...and it still manages to end on how it's important to Christians. I'm not trying to be a bigot but seriously, I want to know about the cool crocodile worship stuff not about Christians or Arab conquests.

I mean, why bother creating things to do things for you when you can just instantly do them yourself? Where the heck does God even get the motivation to do anything? Uh, never mind. That discussion would take up pages and not get anywhere. I realize that I'm still subconsciously trying to "win" on this thread...Maybe I need to take a break. It's just that having a civil dialogue on this thread about religious material eases my mind a bit after reading comments about how I have to accept Jesus or I'm going to hell on You Tube. I'm not trying to bring up Christian doctrine! I'm just saying...

edited 24th Mar '14 7:13:56 PM by DigaagWaRiz

Sometimes they have free will. Other times, they're basically God's appendages, considered individual entities only because humans are squishy and, for the most part, three dimensional, thus limiting our ability to fully understand what is really happening.

Part of having the power to do it yourself also includes the right and ability to delicate other tasks.

Look, I'm not a Christian, and I normally argue against Christianity more often than not, but in this case if the biggest issue you got with a deity is that they don't handle things firsthand,that's not really a problem in itself

Angels are tools.

Think about what they are: Creatures older than time itself who's aspect is so awesome that it is a cause for panic and terror- "Be Not Afraid" - things so powerful that they can lay waste to an army in an hour, destroy a nation in a day, stop the sun itself. They know Earth goes around the sun, but could care less- the laws of physics might as well be playground rules to them. They saw them installed and will watch them be outgrown.

And there are more of them than stars above.

These are things that could easily be worshipped as gods themselves- but they willingly submit themselves to another being- think of how much more powerful this king must be.

Powerful psychological tool for inspiring awe there. Yahweh was always good at shock and awe. Heh, what do you think the plagues were for? The flood?

edited 25th Mar '14 12:43:55 AM by Matues