Needs Help: Gorn

First and foremost, I'm not trying to bring back this trope as it was (Violence as Titillation), I'm just saying that it could be reworked into something non-sexual, rather than the locked example-less page it is now. I'm aware that that the locking and example sectionectomy was done per Fast Eddie a few weeks after The Second Google Incident, with the lock reason on the locked pages category being "Creepy Examples". I could be wrong on this, but I'm thinking the page was mostly cut because it listed a lot of Pages Cut Under the Policy Change as examples, and because it could be construed as a Porn Trope. I'm dabbling into unsafe waters here, but bear with me.

To be honest, I think the trope's problem was that it was ambiguously defined. While its laconic is "Gratuitous, over-the-top graphic violence.", its name implied brutal, violent pornography (Guro), and thus was misconstrued as a Porn Trope, even though it's listed on It's Not Porn, It's an Index. IIRC, the page was used to list and link to NSFW "Guro" hentai and the like, which has since been obliterated from this site for the better. The page was also used properly, however, to list over-the-top graphic violence in works as a trope. While we have a Violence Tropes index, Gorn isn't listed there. There are, however, more specific tropes related to Gorn. (Bloodier and Gorier describes non-violent works turned violent, Bloody Hilarious describes gratuitous blood used for comic effect, Ludicrous Gibs describes unrealistic mutilation, etc.)

In the content policy, it is mentioned that works that simply receive an M/R rating that aren't explicitly porn won't be cut, which is what a lot of this page's examples consisted of before the cut. While our content policy at the moment apparently (not using the word ironically) exists to combat porn, sexual gushing, pedopandering, and fetish fuel, there's no rule against non-sexual violence.

While I'm aware this was a decision by moderators that probably isn't up for discussion, I'm going to at least propose that the page should be renamed and reworked to be non-sexual (It's still listed as a trope on many pages, BTW). Perhaps there could be a disclaimer stating to abide by No Lewdness No Prudishness and our current content policy. Most importantly, the new page should focus on "Gratuitous, over-the-top graphic violence." Think Gears Of War and Evil Dead, not Mai Chans Daily Life.

I think this would be a better solution than the locked, example-less definition page we have right now. Of course, the page would probably have to be cut of Image Links and Real Life examples, but it could work. It's not like graphic violence isn't described on the pages that list this as a trope right now, as well as on pages like Cruel and Unusual Death and Torture Porn. Still though, if this is a Fast Eddie cut that he feels should be permanent for this site's safety against the wrath of Google (or else otherwise due to NSFW external links and hyperbole/natter like the real life section of Nightmare Fuel), I understand and respect his opinion perfectly on the matter.

Just a proposal, TRS.

edited 19th Sep '12 3:30:05 PM by AmateurPolymath

Gorn has nothing to do with porn or anything, and we've been over this several times. It just uses "porn" as a synonym for something extremely detailed and lovingly described. I suspect someone who didn't know that cut the examples here.

Nope, Fast Eddie cut the page... probably for a good reason, too. (I suspect due to links/vivid descriptions to works that violated the content policy). Even though the page qualifies as It's Not Porn, It's an Index, there's the potential for new users to mistake the title for brutal graphic pornography and thus link to and list as examples brutal graphic pornography. My proposal is to start the page anew and renamed without any sexual connotation.

edited 19th Sep '12 3:39:35 PM by AmateurPolymath

Someone will need to read this history to understand what was going on. It doesn't look nice, I'd say.

Actually, reading those examples, it doesn't look very safe for Google when you have a page devoted to vivid descriptions of graphic violence. Should've realized this...

"Our program policies don't allow Google ads to be placed on content that contains graphic or gory images such as bloodshed, fight scenes, and gruesome or freak accidents."

I can perfectly see why Fast Eddie cut the page now. Even looking at the image for Bloody Hilarious makes me kind of uneasy that someone could easily cause a THIRD Google incident.

edited 19th Sep '12 5:10:24 PM by AmateurPolymath

Well, we do need to make an actual page for Guro. It's just confusing having it as a redirect to gorn. It would be a locked stub, obviously.

edited 19th Sep '12 5:59:04 PM by Discar

For Gorn, I think we can do with a locked page and a cleaned example list - I'll write one shortly.

I'll leave guro to someone more familiar with the issue. It makes sense to turn that into a def page like Ryona and similar.

Sorry if I bumped this thread by 5 days, but I like that idea. Clean up the example list, lock the page, and remove this trope's sexual connotations. Guro, instead of redirecting to Gorn, can now link to a locked stub.

I guess it all depends on Fast Eddie. I'm guessing he cutlocked it as a safe measure after The Second Google Incident. Who knows, he might not be too open to the idea. (And probably justifiably so). If this was a unanimous decision on a mod subforum like the Real Life pages of Nightmare Fuel, I can totally understand why he doesn't want this page to return.

edited 25th Sep '12 2:06:56 PM by AmateurPolymath

Thing is, Eddie deletes and locks pages then doesn't respond to P Ms. Is it me, or does Google have too much sway over T Vtropes?