Five-Man Band cleanup

And Drowtales isn't that long for a webcomic. It's about average length for a long runner. It hasn't even hit the 2k mark yet. There are a number in the 5k and 10k range. Most of those being daily updates.

actually if you count the Daydream Archive, Sidestory Archive, the Relic Hunters Archive, and the Path to Power Archive, then Drowtales has over 6,000 pages. And thats not counting the pages in the main archive that have been deleted due to rewrites.

Also, the update to my first post in this thread is complete.

Re: Secret Six example- Pull it, Ragdoll is not a woman and therefore cannot be the chick and Catman does not really fit the smart guy role either.

@Dalkon Cledwin: First of all, thank you for bringing the examples here for discussion. I appreciate the fact that you followed the note^* which is what you're supposed to do, granted, but most people choose to ignore them.

That said, on to the proposals themselves:

• Chrys'tel's band: Due to the gender restrictions on the trope, this is not a Five-Man Band. However, it does sound like it would fit the supertrope (currently in YKTTW under the working title Pair Of Foils And A Mediator); if you can write up a good example in the format from this post, we'll move it on to the sandbox page where we're collecting examples.
• Ariel Val'Sarghress' first band: I don't think this fits either Five-Man Band or the supertrope; there seems to be too many characters.
• Ariel Val'Sarghress' second band: Once again, not a Five-Man Band because there are too many females. Depending whether The Mentor is actually part of the team, this may fit under the supertrope. Also, I have reservations as to whether the character you placed as The Leader actually counts as part of the team in the story, given that he is out-of-commission and thus presumably not working with the group for most(?) of the story.

EDIT: Mixing hottip and note formatting doesn't work very well. XD

edited 7th Dec '12 8:12:52 PM by Nocturna

just out of curiosity, why does a five-man band have to be gender locked?

Because the original form is gender locked. You'd better ask Fast Eddie though.

I don't see why it needs to be gender locked when five-man bands exist in various media in non-gender locked forms. I mean for example, the original group from Sailor Moon would qualify as a five-man band in the most technical definition of the phrase. Gender Locking it based on the fact that it is based on the Super Senshi series does a disservice to various other media.

edited 8th Dec '12 7:22:06 AM by DalkonCledwin

We have already said it many times, even in the OP. if you want to change the gender rules, take it up with Fast Eddie. You are not talking to the right people here and we'd prefer this thread to stay open and visible.

how do I get in touch with Fast Eddie?

Fast Eddie. On the blue bar on the top of the page, there is a message icon.

edited 8th Dec '12 7:46:10 AM by SeptimusHeap

okay I sent off a message to him.

I'm kind of new to this forum, so please don't get offended.

I saw this Five-Man Band example on the Family Guy page and I do believe it fits.

• Five-Man Band: The Griffin family
  • The Hero: Peter
  • The Lancer: Lois
  • The Smart Guy: Stewie
  • The Big Guy: Chris
  • The Chick: Meg
  • Team Pet: Brian

Here are a few examples from Sonic X that I think, fits.

• Five-Man Band
  • The Hero: Sonic
  • The Lancer: Knuckles
  • The Smart Guy: Tails
  • The Chick: Amy Rose
  • Tagalong Kid: Cream
  • Sixth Ranger: Chris

edited 8th Dec '12 8:11:31 PM by MsCC93

First of all, The Hero is no longer part of the Five man band so that's one mark against Family Guy.

The problem with Sonic X is Sonic isn't much of a leader. A hero but no leader.

Sonic X is missing the Big Guy.

The Family Guy: Megs is certainly not The Chick. Never mind that they aren't really a team in a Five-Man Band sense. They spend more time fighting each other than working together.

Also, all of these are Zero Context Examples.

I agree with Shima. I haven't seen a lot of Family Guy, but pretty much every episode I've seen has had them working against each other rather than as a team.

Family Guy: not a team, Peter is more The Big Guy than Chris (though they both play the role), Meg is not The Chick (Brian actually comes closer, though he's not a fit), Brian and Lois often play The Smart Guy, Brian is close to being The Lancer as Lois at times. This seems to me like a clear case of shoehorning.

Added without discussion:

My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic

I'm honestly not sure where to start with what's wrong with this one. Twilight would be both The Leader and The Smart Guy (and Rarity is most definitely not even a secondary one, unless there's been shifts in the later seasons), there is no single Lancer (as all the other five are designed to contrast with Twilight), Pinkie Pie is really not The Chick... All in all, this is a fine example of shoehorning.

That and they're the Mane Six. They by definition cannot be a Five-Man Band.

The crowner originally allowed for groups of six as well (with two on one of the types). Have we changed that?

This is doubling up on four of the roles, though, which I think is a little beyond the pale. Not to mention, smacks of shoehorning.

Also, as is too often the case, we have The Chick abuse.

(I also wonder about genders, but I don't know enough about the show to comment on that aspect. But I had the vague impression that they were all female.)

edited 13th Dec '12 12:48:05 PM by Xtifr

Oh, I wasn't arguing that the My Little Pony example should stay—it's definitely shoehorning, and yes, they are all female—I was just confused by shima's comment because my understanding was that we were still allowing six characters to count, under Tropes Are Flexible. While I wouldn't object to limiting it to precisely five, as far as I know that decision was never made.

The crowner is here.

That said, I agree on axing the My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic example. Obvious shoehorning, and Septimus Heap would make a better (read: one character less, but still shoehorning) example.

Also agreed. Six ponies plus Spike means too many. Whoever added Pinkie Pie as the chick clearly does not understand the trope's definition.

There's a difference between Tropes Are Flexible and you can shove anything in a trope. Five-Man Band can include a Sixth Ranger if they really are a true Sixth Ranger, but otherwise it should be five people. This is one of the more strictly defined tropes. Shoving in all the associated types is how it decayed in the first place. That's why we're making a team supertrope for groups that don't fit the trope.