Alright, so in TRS Badass Gay came up for discussion and it was agreed that there appears to big problem with the Badass X tropes in general, which needs to be sorted out until something can be ruled on for Badass Gay.
Here's a courtesy link: TRS page
. And Badass page with its subtropes. You can also visit the sandbox page here.
Noted Problems include:
- Tropes are just listings of characters people thing are badass who happen to have a certain trait. (The Badass + Trait Problem)
- Badass X as a naming scheme is actually very vague and doesn't give a lot of insight into what the character trope actually is, assuming it is a trope.
- Badass X as a naming scheme proliferates the use of Badass + Trait 'tropes'.
Suggested things to do include:
- Make it a requirement that a badass character trope means a character is "badass because of a trait", or "badass in spite of a trait".
- Renaming away from the Badass X naming scheme as much as possible.
- Cut, redefine or re-purpose things that are just Badass + trait.
There are also a lot of tropes that seem to be valid character-types, but have the naming scheme 'Badass X', when there's more to the trope than that. There are also a lot of prop or event or whatever tropes that need to be gone through as well.
Edited by Berrenta on May 15th 2020 at 7:39:14 AM
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
You mean Power Copying.
I see the Awesomeness.
Bah, whatever.
Fight smart, not fair.
Just make everything a YMMV trope
That doesn't really have anything at all to do with the issue. When Badass Blink or Badass Furry's threads are closed, shall we move something else into the TRS?
A big one is Badass Angster.
"If you aren't him, then you apparently got your brain from the same discount retailer, so..." - Fighteer
Hammer of the Pervs
The Badass Furry thread is locked, the new page is up and good to go. Badass Angster next?
"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
Certainly. Would you like to take care of that one or shall I?
Hammer of the Pervs
I'm about to go to bed, so if you don't mind.
"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
Okay. Here it is. Please check it out if you have the opportunity.
This is going to be so much fun.
So what has been discussed prior to this for Badass tropes? I'm still surprised some tropes still existing even though they should have been part of the culling.
I see the Awesomeness.
We've done a general sweep of the Badass tropes and are deciding what to do before we do it. Results so far are up on Sandbox.Badass Tropes.
I made a comment about the latest batch of tropes here and I'm waiting for discussion before making some moves.
I guess we could start pulling "not badass tropes" from the Badass index now.
edited 11th Apr '12 10:42:37 PM by Deboss
Fight smart, not fair.
This is going to be so much fun.
Ah, since I'm wondering why Badass Driver, Badass Long Hair and Badass Spaniard are still alive.
I see the Awesomeness.
I'm positive Badass Spaniard was in TRS, specifically for A) broadening to include all hispanics B) restricting to be about a stereotypical type of badass (to parallel things like Mother Russia Makes You Strong). I know Badass Long Hair has an IP, and I think it has a TRS specifically discussing how it is a contrast trope or some such.
We're TR Sing the TRS list slowly, as TRS moves slowly. Most of the sorting doesn't require actual action though.
Fight smart, not fair.
Cure Candy
TRS on Bad Ass Long Hair is looking at making it male only and splitting it between several types. Just put up an outline of how I think it should be split..... Go toss some inputs!
Sparkling and glittering! Jan-Ken-Pon!
Hammer of the Pervs
Took a look at the Badass Angster TRS - I think we can do something with it, but it probably needs a rename. I posted about it over there. Badass Longhair and Badass Spaniard are both still in progress at TRS.
"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
Badass Blink looks like it'll be getting a rename. At the moment it's sort of halfheartedly discussing a split as well.
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
I've been directed to this thread after asking whether there's any distinction between a Badass Princess and a non-crossdressing female Warrior Prince, as I've seen character sheet profiles where the character has both Badass Princess and Warrior Princess in their trope list. Any thoughts?
edited 13th Apr '12 3:36:18 PM by MarqFJA
Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
That's a good question. I think the distinction would be that a princess is expected to be pampered and weak, thus it comes as a contrast when they are surprisingly competent in a fight. On the other hand, while a prince isn't exactly required to be a great fighter, one who is is a bit of a stock character. I think in that case the Warrior Princess listings are misuse, which is why it is not a redirect.
edited 13th Apr '12 3:54:23 PM by Arha
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
But isn't Badass defined as "Rule of Cool personified"? How does a Badass Princess (and many other "Badass X" tropes, for that matter) fit that definition?
Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
We're going to be changing that. Badass has become a trope that just means good at fighting. The three categories for valid subtrope are enhances, contrasts and stock characters. Enhancing factors is something that makes it even more badass or otherwise changes how it works and contrast is badass in spite of something that would normally be a detriment, such as being small and cute. Stock characters are stock characters.
Thus, the distinction between Badass Princess and Warrior Prince is that Badass Princess is a contrast trope while Warrior Prince is a stock character trope that is basically exclusively male as I understand it. In the future that probably won't be the case, but for now, yeah.
I see the Awesomeness.
Well, we've also got a few other things in the works, but they're not really character types.
Fight smart, not fair.
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
Well, for what's it worth, the dictionary definitions of "badass" are along the lines of being "tough", "aggressive", "extreme to the point of admirability", "awesome", and/or "cool".
And I don't think the trope has to involve being good at fighting. I mean, Badass Pacifist is defined as an Actual Pacifist who succeeds in winning confrontations with violent troublemakers without resorting to violence him-/herself, right? No "good at fighting" at all.
edited 14th Apr '12 6:04:12 AM by MarqFJA
Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
I see the Awesomeness.
We're trying to be more restrictive. Cool is subjective, combat prowess isn't.
Fight smart, not fair.
I'm of the opinion that while a pacifist can be awesome, they can't be badass as we define it. But we just had a tangent on that within the last couple pages. Suffice to say that it's in the debated pile.
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
How about substituting "combat prowess" with "winning confrontations", or something similar?
Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.