Some actress pages.

I should add that I just looked at the Jessica Simpson page and it's very much an example of what not to do. I don't feel like tackling it at present but really the entire "trope" list needs cutting, as does much of the description. The image is kind of unflattering, too.

In which case I think we should get rid of all the real person pages. I don't think restricting tropes to 'Alice frequently plays a Dumb Blonde' is all that feasible since there are too many grey areas, especially with the likes of Simpson who have an offscreen persona closely associated with her usual onscreen one... and in that case we'll just go through another slash and burn session.

edited 2nd Jun '11 12:02:41 PM by RossN

That's not necessary; stop twisting our logic. Take Eddie Murphy for comparison. Aside from a few silly entries like What Could Have Been and a Real Life Mistaken for Gay, it's exactly what we want.

But that hasn't been what's been happening during the recent cuts.

How so?

See this post from Madrugada. If you want to recreate some of these cut pages according to the guidelines, go right ahead. Sandbox it and post in this thread when ready to move.

During the recent cuts tropes have been, well... cut, based on the tropers distaste leaving other tropes that equal apply to the person rather than the role - Deadpan Snarker for instance - behind.

That's probably a mistake, then, or at least an overly cautious interpretation of the guidelines. Cleaning up the nastiest stuff is our first priority; nobody would be offended to look at a page where they're being called a Deadpan Snarker.

But still it should go if the policy is 'only what they display in their works' right?

edited 2nd Jun '11 12:30:09 PM by RossN

Yes, it should.

I'm all for cutting these and why not cut actor pages?

They are not tropes, they are not stories with tropes are used to build. At least the professional wrestler pages are about tropes related to their wrestler characters, and those have been debated for the cut list and trope repair shop already.

If I click Eddie Murphy I'd like to be able to cross-reference the works he's appeared in. That's why.

Question: is this page OK to leave as is? https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HidetoMatsumoto

As far as I know, none of the stuff there is overly creepy (even the stuff that may appear creepy is relevant to his life and to what happened to him), and he died in 1998, so I'm assuming a more biographical tone is all right? I've removed autobiographical stuff from other musician articles I curate per thread consensus, but is leaving this one all right?

And asking it please not be edited (at least with cutting or history purge) until I've had time to edit out unwanted material and clean it up as per what would make it acceptable, if it is not. :)

I think the point is that we don't encourage applying tropes to Real Life people. We are more interested in what happens in their works, or in roles they are typecast in. That said, you're talking about an artist page — that is, a musician, and those are fully tropable in the context of their work. So it's a different fish.

The point is that the tropes should be about their work, not themselves as people.

edited 9th Jun '11 7:58:43 AM by Fighteer

Edit - answered, thank you :) Posted before I saw your edit.

edited 9th Jun '11 8:01:17 AM by AGroupie

I would add that the main thing to avoid is tabloid and paparazzi type material hyping the individual in one way or another, it's the main reason real life examples were cut from Nice Character, Mean Actor. Now if the individual spends a moment as themself (like in an interview) and tells a personal story that uses tropes or generally exudes a particular character trope, that's using a trope in an atypical setting and still something media related. Robin Williams is a Motor Mouth both on and off the camera.

My solution: Just cut all the trope examples and make them a short summary of the person's career and then a filmography.

I made the pages for Michael Ironside and Jeremy Irons some time ago, and I don't see those gathering much natter.

^ Then we're simply trying to duplicate imDb.

Its useful for us to have for cross referencing. IMDB has a lot of other information we don't need to catalog

I don't think they should be cut, but like people have been saying, more emphasis on common character types they play rather than creepy Male Gaze stuff. I think someone should also look at the newer Disney Channel actresses pages such as Debby Ryan, Chelsea Staub, Bridgit Mendler, etc. (a list can be found on the Disney Channel page near the bottom). They look like someone started them to be creepy, which is especially a problem since most of these actresses are 16 or younger, and then someone else tried to edit all the creepy tropes out, leaving nothing but one or two stuff associated with them.

edited 10th Jun '11 3:45:33 PM by wuggles

As someone who still uses this site for random browsing often, I find it invaluable to be able to go to an actor's page and see which works he or she has been involved with, and then go to the pages of those works without doing a search.

Hold on a second, why not just move the creepy versions of the pages to the Fetish Fuel wiki?

While it's not my call to make and this is in no way official policy (that I know of), IMO fetishizing real people is crossing a line better not crossed.

And we don't really want them. I know Your Kink Is Not My Kink And That's Okay, but it shouldn't be a place where everything icky gets dumped.