troperville

tools

toys


main index

Narrative

Genre

Media

Topical Tropes

Other Categories

TV Tropes Org
random
This is a "Wild Mass Guess" entry, where we pull out all the sanity stops on theorizing. The regular entry on this topic is elsewhere. Please see this programme note.
Homestuck Trolls
The Sufferer's Righteous Leggings are Fedora Freak's Tall Pants
Somehow, due to the nature of Paradox Space, Fedora Freak's Tall Pants made its way into the troll's universe.

Kanaya's Vampiric Transformation was intended to restore the Troll race.

There is a reason why Kanaya was groomed to be a Rainbow Drinker, and why she has been drinking the various bloods of friend and foe alike. That reason? She's a failsafe in case something happened to the Matriorb. She's collecting the fluids in a similar way the Mother Grub collects them - to mix together and recreate new trolls from the slurry. How she does so is still anyone's guess, but there must be a reason to her methods.
  • Has she ever drank Feferi's blood? Maybe if a Rainbow Drinker drinks royal blood, they become a Mother Grub. So she can survive against the Condense, they may have a shot.
    • Yes, in fact, Feferi was the first person Kanaya drank from.

Gamzee will end up killing Bec Noir.
This is the reason why Gamzee was labled as the most important character in the comic. The Miracles video Dave linked to him broke the Juggalo's mind severely to the point of possibly self-mutilation, a similar psychotic break happening to a devote Christian being shown Jesus doing something incredibly blasphemous according to Christianity. Plus the fact that Gamzee's been almost entirely ignored by EVERYONE'S plotting and scheming due to his normally laid back nature would make him managing to defeat Bec Noir all the more mind blowing plot twist if only for the sheer unexpected nature of such an occurence.

That, or Andrew called Gamzee that to mess with us.
  • How will Gamzee manage it? A MoThErFuCkIn MiRaClE.
  • If the theory that Gamzee is Lord English is true, he would be far more powerful than Bec Noir.
    • This theory is Jossed, but he is pretty unkillable, at least.
  • What's the only card that can beat the Ace? A Joker.
    • It was a joke. Bec Noir can blow up planets at will, Gamzee can kill individuals very well. It's like a gun versus a bomb. One's great at killing but the other is just simply exponentially more powerful
    • Who's saying Gamzee can't blow up planets either? He merely hasn't just yet.
      • Um Gamzee's attack nearly wiped out their Eldritch Abomination of an endboss...which was the SIZE of a planet...
  • Let's not forget who else was watching when Hussie mentioned the "most important character"...
  • The problem that I see with this theory is that Bec Noir isn't a primary antagonist anymore, God Tier kids can tag-team him easily, as John has shown, and that's even without Jade's intervention and not counting PM. Gamzee/Cal are proving to be key to the main plot - rise and fall of Lord English, there's no need for additional complication here.

Aradia's dreamself had been awake since her death, but glitched because she hadn't entered the medium yet.
Dreamselves awaken in case of death, but because she hadn't entered the Medium, her soul couldn't travel to her dream-body. Her soul became trapped to wander Alternia until Sgrub happened, while her dreamself apparently attained maximum power and became trapped in the core of Derse.
  • Plausible at least, simply because nobody else in canon has been shown to be a ghost in the real world

Gamzee has been manipulating Vriska to make his cult's prophecy come true.
When Dave introduced him to Insane Clown Posse, Gamzee called it blasphemy, and remembered his true nature, before the Faygo and Slime Pies addled his mind. As each troll has their own power related to their game title, whatever his is allowed him to control Vriska, and make her actions to create Bec Noir her own when he is acting through her to achieve his goals. Included in this manipulation was for Jadesprite to exist, which plays a big part in his plans for Trolls and Kids to take his cult seriously, and create the mythical paradise planet his cult believes, compared to before; and on a side note, despite everyone believing he is an export of Juggalos, he is actually a believer of something completely different and far worse, like possibly Lord English and the Green Sun. Further proof of this includes how his miracle modus, and his clubs, contain colors of the rainbow, and a variant of one of the demon clowns in his posters will turn out to be Lord English's form. Heck, let's say looking at the colors are actually Lord English downloading commands into his mind to trigger later, initiating the end of the Trolls' and Kids' universes.
  • Well, not Guardian-level inauspicious, but if you comb back through the descriptions of different troll castes, read about the subJUGGulators. Or just check out the Highblood.
    • Gamzee's too insane to plan something like this.
    • This troper thinks not. He's very methodical, when one stops to think about it for a moment.
    • Again, insanity does not equal stupidity.
      • Gamzee has never demonstrated this, though he does seem to be loosely working with Doc and is fond of Cal.
  • Well, we know that Gamzee's cult has been about Lord English all along, and he has psychic powers to alter people's subconscious, so... so this is still pretty unlikely because it invalidates a lot of fun about Vriska's character, which is one of the most developed and dynamic ones in the comic.

Eridan destroyed the Matriorb to live out his old fantasies of genocide
He is pretty much slaughtering everyone for the hell of it at this point, and destroying the Matriorb was just a dick move. Eridan's decided that now that he actually can wipe out all the land-dwellers with his SCIENCE power... he will.
  • This troper believes that it had more to do with his role as the Prince of Hope, rather than this. Especally when the orb 'Hopesplodes' when he destroyed it.
  • Or, considering the influence that titles can have on the individual before the game begins, it's always possible that Eridan had all those aspirations of mass genocide BECAUSE of his status as the 'destroyer of hope'. Eridan took the opportunity, and since it does relate to his title, it was 'hopesploded' anyway. So in essence, both of these could be right.
    • It's at least implied his whole genocide complex wasn't entirely wholehearted, since he knew long before the game started exactly how to wipe out the land dwellers, and his only real reason for hating said land dwellers in the first place was because they pollute the oceans. He's also shown in [S]Kanaya: Return To The Core that he's actually friends with her, and that he wants to have a part in whatever is hopeful (actually wanting to be there when she hatched the new Mother Grub). It's more likely he was reacting from Unstoppable Rage (think of all the shit people do when they're flipping out). That's not to say he's in any way justified for doing what he did, but I doubt it was just done For the Evulz.

Rainbow Drinker Kanaya is still in total control of her rational facilities, and will not be going on a murderous rampage.
The only reason she sucked Feferi's blood was because the high-quality-ness of it is irresistable to rainbow drinkers. Other than that, she's just like she was before, except with a gaping hole in her uterus and, presumably, much harder to kill.
  • Since Kanaya had just come back as a rainbow drinker, it's logical that she'd be really thirsty for blood. Plus, Feferi was already dead, so...
  • Actually makes a decent amount of sense. While she has attacked Gamzee, Vriska, and Eridan, they kind of had it coming - Gamzee has gone comepletely Ax-Crazy and murderous; Eridan not only went on a murderius rampage and "killed" Kanaya, he also doomed the entire troll race by destroying the Matriorb; and Vriska is a BLUH BLUH HUGE BITCH.
  • Also, she only killed Eridan, and dealt with the other two in a nonlethal manner.
    • Still up in the air. She's going to kill Gamzee as of latest developments with her.
  • Officially confirmed in Act 6, I guess. She continues to be the sanest troll in the bunch and a Team Mom, and it seems the rainbow drinker thing is normal for her blood caste. And wanting to kill Gamzee is the sing of her sanity, not the opposite!

Gamzee's WTF attack against the Black King
Was The Bunny. He has access to every weapon due to Jokerkind, including the Warhammer of Zillyhoo, one of The Bunny's weapons. Naturally, he'd have use of The Bunny itself as well, since John has Bunnykind in his Strife Deck.
  • The Bunny is a unique weapon that has basically no way outside of Jack to reach the Troll's session and Gamzee couldn't repair it if he found it anyways.
  • The Warhammer of Zillyhoo is also a universally unique weapon and yet Gamzee weilds it.
    • It is a past version of the Warhammer, which The Bunny recieves just as it recieves Ahab's Crosshairs- the Warhammer gets transferred to the kids or otherwise makes it into the hands of Jade's grandson, who gives it to teh Bunny, and John takes it off the Bunny.
      • In fact, it was explained that all those weapons were given to Jake from the cherub session, presumably by UU; since she and uu lived in the very same meteor where the trolls ended up being after their session was destroyed, it's very likely she just picked all those weapons up from their eventual abandonment.

The Matriorb Will Be Restored
Kanaya will instruct Karkat, the only one of the group with the necessary experience, to appearify a copy of the Matriorb. Because it is destined to be destroyed, it will instead produce a ghost image. After a few more attempts, the appearifier will have enough genetic material to create one or more new Matriorbs.
  • For that matter... it looks like she used its code to alchemize a chainsaw. Considering Trollian's transtemporal viewscreen, that code may be recoverable. And we've already seen that there are Alchemiters and probably totem lathes in this asteroid.
    • She does have the code still. The grist cost is huge though.
  • Looks like it will happen in another manner than predicted. Whether Roxy has or has not manifested a "working" Matriorb, it's clear she's capable of it.

When Kanaya became a Rainbow Drinker, she wandered around in a trance for a while before regaining consciousness
Here, Kanaya sees bite marks appear on Terezi's neck to her apparent surprise. Shortly after, she disappears from the Dream Bubble. The fact that Kanaya is still in the Dream Bubble at this point indicates that she's still unconscious. At this time her body was moving entirely on instinct, seeking out blood so she had enough strength to fully revive. The blood from Terezi put her over the top, so she awoke, whereupon her first action was to bandage Terezi's neck.

Since Karkat was closest to the new universe before the scratch, his ideas had the most influence on it
All humans have red blood, for instance. One troll (I forget which, I think Vriska when she is talking to John) says that Karkat would have been better off as a human- maybe because he created the human's psychology to resemble his own.
  • That also explains why humans only have one type of romance, Karkat always was a fan of romcoms after all.
  • "AG: He likes to pretend he's all vicious and 8loodthirsty, 8ut I know he 8n't got that in him. I have a sense for these things. AG: He'd 8e so pissed if he heard me say this, 8ut I think he'd cut it 8etter as a human than as a troll."

His Honorable Tyranny is still alive
Just because Mindfang managed to leave doesn't mean he died. He could have decided to let her leave after a brief sparring. Or after she caused massive damage.
  • Irrelevant, given that everyone but the Empress and the Handmaid died from the Vast Glub anyway.

The Rainbow Drinker subculture is a haven of monosexuality.
That's how Kanaya is a lesbian. It kind of makes sense, if you don't think about it too hard.
  • Given that Porrim—another rainbow drinker—has been said to have slept with nearly all of her friends, presumably including the male ones, this is likely Jossed.

Karkat is an empath.
Lower blood colors are shown to have stronger psychic abilities; Karkat's mutation doesn't exempt him, it simply masks which class he would be, which is exactly the class his astrological order implies. This is why he's good at reading people, hearing their problems and telling them what the need to hear. This is also why he's so foul-tempered; trolls aren't very pleasant to be around even when you can't feel their emotions. In "[S] Kanaya: Return to the core" when Equius offers to brotherly hug with his sweaty body, and Karkat recoils with a: "Don't touch me." This is how Karkat feels in his mind, all the time.
  • He would have known that Terezi knew his blood color then.
    • Empathic isn't the same as telepathic. He could have deduced she knows anyway, but as long as he doesn't know that, he isn't going to bring up something he's so self-conscious about. He's touchier about it than anything else, so he probably doesn't like dwelling on it himself.
    • If he can feel emotions constantly, he could have read Terezi like a book presumably because there's no way someone wouldn't have been at least surprised about his blood. I dunno, the main flaw with this is that if Karkat had this power, it would've already been apparent like with all the others. Also, if he had powers like this he wouldn't have needed Vriska to nudge Jack's mind for him.
    • Perhaps his powers are weak naturally (like John had little wind control) but would become incredibly strong if he reached God Tier?
    • Perhaps his abilities are entirely passive; he can feel what others are feeling, but can't do anything to change those feelings except talk.
  • This... actually makes sense. When Karkat isn't utterly pissed off at someone and wants them to be on his side, he's able to say what he knows they want to hear. This is also how he calmed Gamzee from his murderous rampage. Going back even further, this could be how The Sufferer gained such a following, but everyone pretty much hates pre-scratch Kankri... so... Not exactly jossed because the scratch could have altered red blood troll powers?
    • Pre-scratch Kankri could be an example of someone who couldn't figure out the right way to use his powers. As Seer of Blood, being empathic should have meant that he could tell how the emotional reactions people had to the way they were treated by others would help or hinder the group, but instead of finding ways of helping people cooperate or understand how they make others feel, his emphatic knowledge that lots of people were feeling resentment at the behaivior and attitudes to people of other castes simply caused him to try and get people to stop saying these things rather than get at the root problem. This annoyed others, but because he was already used to everyone feeling resentment, he didn't notice, or alternatively ignored that because he was determined that this would be the best way to lower harmful disunity within the team.

The Mother Grub creates some type of chemical or psychic signal or something similar that compells trolls born from it to remain loyal to the Empress and caste system.
But since the trolls and their ancestors were created by ectobiology instead they're free of that compulsion, which is why most of the ancestors we've learned of so far have been traitors or criminals and why most of the trolls, though too young to do much in the way of rebelling yet, mostly don't seem to care at all about the hemospectrum and why many of them have decidedly untrollish personalities. Of course, they're also free to buy completely into the status quo, so some of them do.
  • Problem with the above, The Summoner and The Sufferer were able to lead rebellions with normal trolls. Unless some of the trolls are able to copy the signals, there's no way it could work.
    • There is, if the trolls who followed them were able to overcome their base instincts. Trolls are not exactly disposed toward doing this, if the violent nature of their world is any indication, but that's why the majority of trolls follow the Empire in the first place.

The Mother Grub is not a natural part of the Troll lifecycle
Trolls used to reproduce in a manner not that dissimilar to Homo sapiens, their human-like sexual dimorphism is a relic of this period and the Mother Grub is a biotechnological intervention. The filial pail is part of this technological innovation as this form of reproduction required considerable alterations to the Troll's own biology in order to work. Due to these modifications, they are almost certainly sterile without the aid of the mother grub by this point. The Lususii are a part of this program of biological alteration and augmentation as well; allowing the trolls to outsource child-rearing as well as childbearing. Most likely, the Imperial Drones are a component as well.

There are several possible reasons for this change. Amongst others: freeing female trolls from having to bear their young or raise them, increased reproductive efficiency so that the vast hosts needed to conquer and hold their massive interstellar empire could be bred; or purely for reasons of ideology.

Whatever the reason for this, it was done well outside of living memory; likely even before the time of the ancestors.

No matter what advantage this lent the Alternian Empire, it has certainly doomed what remains of it as the trolls are effectively extinct; as of current events/timeline at least.

Every single dead troll/person will somehow get revived, be it the Scratch, The Windy Thing, shenanigans, offshoot timelines, whatever.
Because god dammit I'm going to cry.
  • the bodycount has decreased by at least one for now. Two if it wasn't a just killing. God damn you Scratch, messing with everyone
    • this troper is kinda lost on what just happened but that it will not matter much in the end because she predicts Vriska, Terezi and Karkat will all die.
    • Confirmed... All events that happened will always happen, regardless of whether or not the timeline is a doomed one. However death means very little in this series.
    • Exept Scratch also goes out of his way to mention that Jack, as an extension of the game, sees his fight against the hero of light as round 1 and round 2 of the same fight. Say the game expected a hero of space to die in all timelines, it may not care if the Witch of Space Jade dies or if the Sylph of Space Kanaya dies Jade died in the original doomed timeline and her dreamself died in the alpha timeline so she is probably safe, and Kanaya DID in fact die so she is also probably safe.
    • That pattern may go for titles in addition to attributes. Two Knights remain and two Seers remain, Karkat and Terezi are supposed to be doomed still but Rose and Dave are in the middle of a suicide mission. Can someone else taking a bullet instead of you be considered plot armor?
    • No idea what this means for Aradia.
  • Hussie's lips are strong enough to revive any character. (But he probably won't)
  • What other narrative purpose could there possibly be for Jane's powers? Hussie hasn't shown himself to be a huge fan of Forgotten Phlebotinum so far, so yeah, it seems pretty likely that the new session, when the whole Mind Control thing is sorted out, will have all 8 kids and all 24 trolls. And possibly a cherub, depending on how resurrection will work on Calliope.

Kanaya will try to revive Vriska as a rainbow drinker.
Can rainbow drinkers do that? Who knows, real world vampire fiction isn't exactly consistent on the rules for how vampires can make more vampires.
  • Unlikely as of what we know
  • No visible chance of that now that Vriska's body was deposited into a sprite that later blew up, but "shenanigans" could explain away pretty much anything in this series. On the other hand, the whole rainbow drinker thing seems to be unique to Kanaya's blood caste, so she probably can't make other castes that?...

The DEAD Trolls won't come back
Let's face facts, there are currently 6 dead trolls and of them only Vriska is anywhere close to being a main character. Gamzee will probably end up dying as well. And if we look at the other people, they're all relatively flat characters. Based on Tavros and Dave, they'll enjoy being dead because it seems to be pretty nice actually. However at some point they'll help out the still living players in some fashion, perhaps with the final boss. And they won't really be gone ever because the remaining players will dream in dreambubbles for the rest of their lives presumably.
  • This is MSPA. Has anyone ever actually stayed dead in MSPA? Jailbreak only ended because Hussie didn't feel like writing it anymore.
    • This isn't PS either, this actually has a story. The problem is from a narrative viewpoint, there's no real need for them to come back (again all being relatively flat and minor characters) and it works a lot better for the story (ie, no Ass Pull resurrection) if they stay dead.

Gamzee manipulated Terezi's vision of Vriska's fight with Noir.
This is the only way any theory involving Gamzee killing Karkat would work... but it's kind of spooky how well it does.

Here, Hussie raises the possibility of Gamzee manipulating Terezi into pinning his crimes on Vriska in order to get her to kill Vriska, but why would he stop there? It's all but stated that Terezi would not have been able to bring herself to kill Vriska without the knowledge of her vision; it's a bit too convenient that the future where Vriska runs off to confront Noir is one Terezi considers enough of a Bad Future to overcome that reticence. Gamzee's manipulation could have been as simple as forcing Terezi's vision to remain focused on Vriska, blinding her to the fact that Noir would have only discovered the already-dead bodies of Karkat and Terezi, rather than killing them himself.

Karkat is the second coming of Jegus, and will sacrifice himself to save Earth.

  • His death will purge the earth of the cancer (sin) and his death will allow the kids to win the game and go to paradise - their new universe that they will create.

Doc Scratch never accounted for the Sufferer

  • Introducing strange concepts such as equality, compassion and "love that transcends the grid" (note that Doc Scratch seems a little befuddled by the concept), into an otherwise barbaric and bloodthirsty society just might throw a wrench in his and Lord English's plans in the end. While modern trolls have forgotten the Sufferer, it is stated that his teachings have persisted, even if as 'superstition' and largely ignored or not known.

Regarding Gamzee's WTF attack on the Black King
Gamzee can use any weapon through use of the Jokerkind strife specibus. He copies the Black King's motif meaning he is somehow copying BK's weapon. The trolls (or at least Karkat) don't understand exactly what he did so he didn't sprout tentacles or a second mouth or anything like that. Instead he copied BK's ability to cause a Vast Glub. Gamzee executed a Vast Glub that targeted only one being. He did it with honks. Enjoy the nightmares.

Karkat will die at the hands of Sollux, John, or himself.
It's the only way to break the curse.

Jadebloods become Rainbow Drinkers through sun exposure.
This is why the Dolorosa was forbidden to leave the caverns.
  • That actually works pretty well.

Gamzee's 'honks' are produced vocally.
The noise is a vocalization that sounds something like the calls of geese. It's an ability that may have been useful in the troll's ancient ancestry (such as a warning cry or a means of long-distance communication,) but has mostly died out of the modern generations from lack of use. Few remaining trolls can make this noise, but those who can usually choose not to, since it's annoying and doesn't have any practical applications outside of making people uncomfortable with you. (Like humans who can wiggle their ears.) Gamzee, being the resident Cloud Cuckoolander, continued honking anyway because he thought it was funny, and got into the habit of doing it in place of laughter. So the ungodly honking that the others hear during his rampage is an audible, vocal noise; possibly the insane laughter of a highblood on his killing spree.

Gamzee manipulated Eridan into defecting.
No idea if this will ever be brought up again (Though, knowing Hussie...), but will posit this anyway: like how he planted the clown doll into John's mind, and Lil' Cal into Dave's, Gamzee planted something into Eridan's head that somehow convinced him to defect. Thus, killing Feferi and Kanaya (And destroying the Matriorb) by proxy in his mission to kill everybody. Of course, Eridan could just be that much of a jerk.
  • It does fit his class. Earlier, he had used sopor to "allow rage to be destroyed"; now, he "invited destruction through [Eridan's] rage". And it can't be a coincidence that the Thief stole a life and the Prince slayed the damsels at the same time as the Bard sang his dirge.

Eridan knew Gamzee had snapped.
That's what he meant by "know when all hope is lost". He faced a choice of death by dog or death by clown. At least the dog had been known to keep underlings, in another universe.

We're giving Gamzee way too much credit
He's a stoner who lost his shit once he went into withdrawal, not some sort of supergenius with an elaborate plan to conquer the universe.

Karkat will go all God Head Pickle Inspector when he ascends to God-Tier
Just like Rose went all Demonhead Mobster Kingpin during Seer: Descend. Otherwise, his God-Tier form will simply be mind-boggingly impressive to justify all the mystery involving his powers.

Pre-Scratch!Sufferer was asleep when the scratch happened
He remembers his alternate timeline because his Dreamself "survived" the process and merged with his Post-Scratch!Alternia self. Since he was the leader, we could extrapolate that his companions put him to sleep (possibly against his will) hoping this would happen.
  • Jossed by Meenah's flashback and his title.

Karkat has "stigmata" marks from the Sufferer's torture
Which is why he wears long sleeves.

Some more trolls are going to reach the God Tier.
The end of act 5 has turned much of what we know about ascending on its head. Perhaps a player only needs one self to be alive and it doesn't matter which one. Additionally, the new hoodies in the store imply that at least one hero of Mind and Heart are going to ascend, and since there will be hoodies of all the different God Tiers eventually, perhaps one of each role will ascend. Four of them could belong to post-Scratch players, assuming the human session still has four players in the post-Scratch universe, but that still leaves four more God Tiers. Maybe Karkat, Terezi, Gamzee and Kanaya can still ascend.
  • The Rogue of Heart was Nepeta, who was already dead by the time the goods came out, and all of the Troll's quest "beds" have been destroyed with Prospit, Derse, and their individual planets. It's just merchandise.
    • Though maybe not, since we now have four new kids, one of whom is a hero of Heart: Dirk.
    • Still, this trooper believes that the only God Tier trolls we'll be seeing are ones in the Dream Bubbles. Plus, all of the Troll's dream selves have either died, or been used as an extra life.
      • One word: Gamzee.
      • There's no indication Gamzee isn't just wearing a costume that looks like a God Tier.
      • Indeed, that seems downright likely after the second flash of A 6 I 3 (see below).

Nepeta's coat is in fact what remains of the Sufferer's Righteous Leggings.
The Disciple absconded with them in a cave, where she lived for the rest of her days. Every night, she would cry herself to sleep and wipe the tears to the Leggings, gradually, over the decades, painting them green. Finally, long after her death, the cave was inhabited by another young troll, who turned the Leggings (perhaps with the help of the labour drones that constructed her hive) into a coat for her to wear.

Sollux is going to reach God Tier soon.
The main requirement for reaching God Tier seems to be facing your own death, and Sollux has died twice so far but is still around. His current "half-alive, half-dead" state seems like an unresolved one, and God Tier (being life after death) seems like a good resolution. Plus, Aradia being d00med was eventually resolved by her reaching God Tier, so it seems appropriate for Sollux to reach the same end.
  • So far as we know, Quest Beds are required to reach God Tier. There are no Quest Beds from the troll session left and none would be near the Green Sun anyway. On the other hand, Gamzee remains unexplained.
    • IIRC, it was hinted that there are other ways to reach god tier, but none have been mentioned yet...

Not every Troll will reach God Tier, but every Troll will reach some higher state
Along the lines of Kanaya becoming a Rainbow Drinker and Sollux being between life and death. The avenues to God Tier seem to be closed off to the remaining Trolls now, but they may have other destinies.

Aradia is going to die.
She's about to help slow Jack down for everybody trying to outrun him, and he is going to kill her. It will be considered 'heroic' because her death will help to buy her friends necessary time.

Gamzee took Sollux and Vriska's bodies because he wants to try and resurrect them somehow.
He certainly didn't seem to still be aggressive in the pages leading up to his getaway, and seemed fairly upset by Karkat's reaction to his honking. Perhaps he wants to try and bring back the only dead trolls who still have their heads to try and make up for the ones he killed. Whether he'll succeed is another matter entirely.

If this theory is correct, perhaps he will also be the one who finds a way to help WV.
  • WV is already ok due to Godtier Feferi.
  • Given a certain definition of 'resurrect', the April 18 update confirms this for Vriska...and Tavros.

Some of the pre-scratch Trolls survived, much like the pre-scratch human players have
And they are also, secretly, on their way to the post-scratch Human Session, having somehow figured out that its where they need to be. They will first appear in a Big Damn Heroes moment that may or may not fail miserably due to lack of combat prowess.
  • As a corollary, UU might be one of these Pre-Scratch Trolls.
  • The Summoner's odd "mutation" seems very suspicious considering the traits trolls acquire when they reach God Tier.
    • Did you mean the Signless/Sufferer's mutation? I don't think Tavros' ancestor was ever mentioned as having a mutation.
    • His wings. The Summoner has wings.
      • However, as the third walkabout in A 6 I 3 notes, it's just a mutation (no matter how much Meenah would like it to be otherwise).
  • They "survived" in a way, because Meenah killed them all so they'd become ghosts instead of going God Tier. Everything else is still up in the air.

Sollux and Aradia end up together by the end
Sollux has an association with the colours red and blue. Aradia had red blood, but now has blue blood.
  • Sort of confirmed.
  • They used to date too.
    • Sollux is half-dead and plans to move on.
    • Depending on your definition of "together" this may already be true; otherwise, we'll have to wait and see.
    • Well, they certainly die together... unless the off-screen nature of that suggests one or both survives somehow.

Kanaya's God Tier Design is that of Hussie's Design
Kanaya has told Jade that a Sylph is like a higher Witch. Earlier Troll Hussie was wearing Kanaya's symbol, AND (due to author status) would be the highest class in the game. There fore, Hussie could've been wearing the Sylph design; which would correspond with Kanaya's god tier design.
  • It's actually the Heir design. Compare it to John's. The hood is a bit shorter but it's otherwise the same.

Why Feferi couldn't revive but Jane could
Quite simple really, Feferi's Witch title is active, so she could utilize her powers to heal others, whereas Jane's Maid title is passive, so she utilizes her powers to heal herself.
  • I thought class mechanics worked the other way around- passive classes enhance the group with their powers while active classes benefit from their powers themselves.
    • I, personally, took a less literal definition for active/passive than what UU claimed them to be. From a linguistic persepective, Active and Passive voice have to do with whether the subject is acting or being acted on. So, Feferi's (Hypothetically) Active role needs her to be conscious/alive to be used. However, Jane's (Again, hypothetically) Passive role involves her being affected by her Aspect.
      • Then you need to redefine how almost all the classes apply to the trolls, because from what we know they reflect their actions in the game pretty well. You've effectively hidden an entire other WMG in this comparatively minor one.
  • I guess this is a typo and the intended text was "Feferi's Witch title is active, so she could only utilize her powers to benefit herself, whereas Jane's Maid title is passive, so she can utilize her powers to heal others". It both matches what the title of the WMG and makes sense from the description of active/passive classes.

Zillyhoo is the top Subjugglator
This one took a bit of thinking for me to figure out. The Warhammer of Zillyhoo is one of the end-game weapons, right? So why would both John and Gamzee both be able to wield it? Simple, really. Zillyhoo is an 8-letter name, similar to (most of) the rest of the trolls' ancestors. He was also the Grand Highblood (9 letters, does not fit with theme). So it would only make sense that both the standard wielder of hammerkind strife specibi (John) and his Descendant (Gamzee) would be able to equip it! ...Also the bunny, but it can use everything.
  • If you're using Hammerkind to explain John, then Jokerkind explains Gamzee.

Feferi will be back as more then just a dream ghost.
Given that her ancestor has become the acting Big Bad at the moment, it would just be a missed opportunity to not have them interact in some form.
  • By that reasoning, Vriska should come back to interact with Aranea. Although... considering...

Equius wasn't always quite as strong as he is.
He was already strong at birth, hence his lusus, but not quite as ludicrously so as he is when we are introduced to him. It's commonly theorized that the "Heir" class is a weak-start, high-growth class, at least as seen with John. However, unlike John, Equius has extensive combat experience already as a result of robot deathmatches. The reason Equius is already competent is because he's basically been powerleveling!

Gamzee was God Tier the whole time he was on the trolls' meteor.
He just wore his old mortal clothes and didn't exactly tell anyone he'd ascended for whatever reason. Hey, I have a perfectly good reason for guessing this one: How else could he have ascended when Jack destroyed LOTAM and Prospit (among every other planet)?
  • This could also explain why we both never saw Gamzee's dreamself die, and why his current god tier has very small, easily hidden wings.
  • It also easily explains why he still has scratch marks on his face from Nepeta's attack- it's the same body.
  • Might be another reason to why he almost looks completely unharmed after getting kicked off a cliff. Kanaya tried deal with him nonlethally when he fell off, so his death wasn't just.
  • This theory is really a thing that happened. There's a silhouette on that Quest Bed, which means Gamzee ascended and left the dead body behind, similar to the way John and Jade did when they reached the Godtiers. It also explains why Gamzee's attack against the Black King rivaled Vriska's attack when she was already the fully realized Thief of Light during that time.
    • Not in that panel it isn't! Trolls don't have Quest Beds, they have Quest Cocoons, which look very different. That's just the top of a tent.
  • What casts doubt on this is what killed another "someone ascended when nobody was looking" WMG: God Tier ascensions light up the entire incipisphere, which should have alerted all the players.
  • There's no indication Gamzee isn't just wearing a costume that looks like a God Tier. He has no wings for one thing, and Gamzee's hypothetical God Tier in one of Hussie's doodles (somewhere on his Tumblr for those interested) had very noticeable wings.
    • Though at one point UU suggested that God Tier wings can be hidden under clothing.
      • In [S] A6I3 ==> (2nd bubblr game), Meenah's interaction with Mituna confirms that wings can be hidden under clothing. But more importantly, Kurloz delivers the codpiece portion of the Bard outfit directly to Gamzee; when speaking about it with Meulin, he says "THE WICKED ENSEMBLE IS NOW COMPLETE", implying that they were piecing together the Bard of Rage outfit. Also, I just realized this: the very fact that Meenah is hunting for godtiers, trying to figure out who is one and who isn't, means that yes, it is possible to hide being a godtier! Porrim didn't even know for sure whether or not Meenah was godtier until the first bubblr game.

Gamzee is selling troll blood to Jane because...
...he knows she's the Maid of Life, and is hoping that if she does the Lifey Thing while she has the blood (or possibly after drinking some of it), it will revive the dead trolls. This is why he's so pushy about making sure she takes the 'potions'. He's only charging for them as a cover because if he didn't, she might start questioning his motives for forcing all these odd potions on her, and she might be more likely to talk to people about it, making it more likely word would get back to the other trolls, who might draw the wrong conclusions. But pushy salesmen aren't all that unusual in games, so if he charges for them, she might just dismiss him as a weird NPC.

Trolls don't have human style reproductive organs.
The reproduce through sweat. That sweat is collected into buckets and then taken to the Mother Grub. An example of this is seen in Equius who sweats whenever he's aroused.
  • All we know is that uu has no idea what a boner is.
    • And apparently finds things pornographic that we would consider incredibly tame.
    • All of which is irrelevant since uu & UU are a cherubs, not trolls.
  • Either way, it's pretty obvious that they're different, and it's equally obvious that Hussie will never explain exactly how they work.

Keeping with the Sburb/Sims theme, trolls reproduce the same way Sims in the original game did: by kissing a lot.
This would explain why uu found the incredibly tame things he asked Dirk to draw so pornographic.
  • See last entry: What bothers uu is irrelevant to trolls since he isn't one. (And it turns out that it's redrom he finds so perverted since his species only knows hate-based lust.)

Vriska and Tavros are going to somehow find a way to come back to life.
I CANNOT be the only one who thought this the moment Vriska said 'we're going to fuck shit up.' They're going to do it, I have no idea how but they will!
  • What's more likely is that they find a way to influence events while still ghosts. Aradia, Aranea, and Meenah suggest they could do quite a bit.
    • This seems to be confirmed. Vriska has no interest in joining a ghost army and the two of them are instead off "treasure hunting" for some sort of Game Breaker. They have no need to be alive to influence Lord English's defeat.

The Dead Libra troll, if one exists, will have rounded shades like Dave.
Bonus points if we learn that she used to wear glasses like Terezi's, but changed them when she received a gift from a friend.
  • Aranea is Vriska's Ancestor and has pointy glasses like Terezi, so Pre-scratch Redglare may have round glasses like Vriska.
  • Jossed, they are square.

The Unknown Dead Trolls were the "friends" Dream Jade made in the afterlife
I can totally see a shocking revelation like this happening. Especially since - if they are the pre-Scratch trolls - they would be more likely to be friendly. Emphasis on more likely.
  • If this is true, their identities will be exposited by Dog Tier Jade, since she's merged with Dream Jade.
    • Confirmed.
      • Not explicitly, yet. She confirms she met trolls in the afterlife but cannot confirm which ones. Although yeah, it's probably what will happen.
      • Given we know there are 3 groups of trolls, the mystery ones, the modern ones, and UU/uu, and the second were explicitly mentioned as not being the ones in question, and the third still have dreamselves, the only logical conclusion is that the mystery dead trolls are the ones Jade is referring to, though weird time shit could always enter into it for UU and uu at least. Unless Andrew's going to introduce assloads of fantrolls, that's pretty conclusive!
      • UU doesn't have a dreamself anymore (but then, that might still take weird time shit).

Other Pre-scratch troll names
In case any others show up (Pre-scratch Sufferer will likely), I've been looking for zodiac names that fit the 6-letter formula. Feel free to add more.
  • Aries: Neirra (Portuguese)
  • Tauros: Tyrenn (Norwegian)
    • Teseus (Greek Mythology)
  • Gemini: Besson (Catalan)
    • Thomas (Aramaic)
  • Cancer: Kreeft (Dutch)
  • Leo: Arysla (Meadow Mari)
    • Lolcat is a valid troll name!
      • Andrew isn't retarded.
    • Some variant of Freija (Norse Mythology)
  • Virgo: Sombla (Tatar)
  • Libra: Merleg (Hungarian)
  • Saggitarius: Skyten (Swedish)
  • Capricornus: Gadott (Waloon)
  • Aquarius: Verseu (French)
    • Drakma (after Skies of Arcadia's Drachma, who managed to forgive Rhaknam for killing his son Little Jack, unlike the guy he was based on. Since Eridan already draws some parallels with Captain Ahab, pre-Scratch Dualscar would draw some from someone inspired by him.)
    • Both Aranea and Meenah were previously suggested names (For Vriska and Feferi respectively, of course.) It's likely based on this that Hussie will continue to name the prescratch ancestors in this way- picking up long forgotten suggestions for the scratched session trolls.
  • Partially Jossed, we still don't know Nitram's or Zahhak's names. So far 0 for 10, though.
    • And now 0 for 12. This WMG would have had better luck going with the "reused suggestions" route.

Pre-Scratch Alternia was named "Mars"
This troper thinks it would be hilarious if the trolls turned out to be Martians all along.
  • Mars has two moons.
    • But Alternia has 3, 1 green and 2 pink. Moreover Mars doesn't really have proper moons, Deimos and Phobos being nothing at all like the moons of Alternia. Besides, why would Mars remotely make any sense? Pre-Scratch "Alternia" was a peaceful planet, and Mars was the god of war.
      • Actually the little pink one wouldn't count as a moon, the same way our moon doesn't count as a solar system planet.
      • Aranea says that the green moon was created after Doc Scratch started pulling strings, and not from her universe. Furthermore, the trolls aren't exactly aware of Earth's mythology, so it's not like they'd know he was a god of war. Troll Will Smith is also a philosopher, after all.
    • So you sayin' this's some John Carter of Mars sorta thing?
      • If it comes true, the movie will probably be referenced. Also the name "Princess of Mars" will come up.
  • Jossed. The planet was called Beforus.

Pre-Scratch Alternia was named "Earth"
As different option to the above.
  • Jossed. See above.

Explanations on Pre- and Post- Scratch Personalities
Aranea has already stated that in life, she wished she could be more adventurous, and exciting. That turned her into Vriska in the Post-Scratch session. All of the Post-Scratch trolls' personalities are due to the desires of the Pre-Scratch Trolls. My guesses so far, feel free to add your own!
  • Aradia: Not sure about this, how would Aradia's ancestor be if there were no Felt/Doc Scratch to enslave her? My guess was going to be that she wanted freedom.
  • Tavros: Remember how everyone thought Tavros would be a huge jerk when he was first shown? The pre-scratch Tavros had that personality, and just wanted to be nicer and incapable of hate.
  • Sollux:
  • Karkat:
  • Nepeta:
  • Kanaya:
  • Terezi:
  • Vriska: Already stated.
  • Equius:
  • Gamzee:
  • Eridan
  • Feferi: Wanted to be a kind and understanding ruler.

  • One problem with this: Aranea's Scratched and Idealized version isn't Vriska, but rather Mindfang. It isn't the Scratched Troll Kids who are idealized versions of the pre-scratched versions, but rather the Ancestors. For instance, I'd bet dollars to donuts that pre-scratch Sufferer was actually similar to Karkat but wished he could be nicer, creating the post-scratch messianic figure he was right up to the end.
    • Don't know about you, but I can certainly picture Meenah wishing she could be Her Imperious Condescension. From what we know some of the ancestors became, we can probably hazard a guess for others, though it could potentially be Jossed at any time.
      • The Handmaid: Likely desired to escape mortality and have a more visible effect on the world around her, ended up getting her wish in a less-than-desirable manner
      • The Summoner: ?
      • The Helmsman: ?
      • The Sufferer: May have been much like Karkat but wished that he could be nicer, which on the near-Utopian pre-Scratch world could help him fit in.
      • The sufferer has been adressed. He's basically a guy who likes to talk about social problems, and I mean talk and talk and talk. It's not unreasonable to assume he wished he had some real injustice to fight. Though it bears noting he is aware of his post-scratch counterpart's deeds, and disagrees with his methods.
      • The Disciple: ?
      • The Dolorosa: Perhaps she wanted to care for a child troll?
      • Neophyte Redglare: Desired to be a force for justice.
      • Marquise Spinneret Mindfang: Aranea admitted what she wanted to be.
      • E%ecutor Darkleer: Possibly wanted to be a merciful leader.
      • The Grand Highblood: Wanted a life of mirth, that would keep him laughing joyfully.
      • Orphaner Dualscar: Desired a powerful rival who would be a Worthy Opponent to him. There's some possibility that he had a caliginous crush on Aranea even before the Scratch, too...
      • Her Imperious Condescension: As previously stated, one can definitely see Meenah wanting to be a leader, and her troublesome, likely self-centered nature making her about the last person you'd want ruling you.
      • This is pretty much confirmed by her reaction to Aranea's tale, even though she didn't actually want to lead in life.

Meenah is the reason that the dead Prescratch ancestors are in the dreambubbles.
The plan she spoke of was in fact her last gambit to exist in some form. Aranea's description of her implies she's not evil at all, merely rough around the edges, comparing her to Vriska. (Who, recall, risked her life seeking revenge for Karkat and Terezi's deaths in an alternate timeline.) Meenah truly did care about her fellow players, and with the impending Scratch, in order to allow them to "live" on in the dream bubbles, she stole their lives as befitting her title so that they would not be erased forever in the Scratch.
  • The fact that Meenah's plan is why they still exist was pretty much confirmed by dialog that first brought it up. The rest (her not being evil, her caring about her teammates, and her "stealing" their lives), all still WMG fodder, though.
  • Judging by Meenah's interaction with her friends in the bubbles, she was an actual friend for most of them - for those of them who had friends at all, to be precise. She appears to know them pretty well, and judging by her interaction with Mituna, Horuss and Eridan's-loser-ancestor, she really cares. Kankri's intervention in all these cases served to contrast his uncaring and impersonal "right" with Meenah's outwardly jerkish but personal and caring attitude.

Meenah will leave her dream bubble
Ponder this text from UU.
UU: for instance, a hero of life and a hero of doom have aspects as different as can be.
UU: bUt if their classes are different enoUgh as well, that is, one active and the other passive, remarkably there is a chance they coUld end Up with very similar abilities!

Now, the only potential similarity between Sollux and Feferi's abilities is that Sollux can leave a dream bubble (by virtue of being half-dead), while Feferi is hinted to manipulate them in some way ("It is the past, brought back to life by a witch!"). But what if it's not Sollux and Feferi; what if it's Sollux and Meenah? Given that Meenah is a Thief of Life, it's conceivable that she could steal life to come back from the dead, at least for a little while. It's possible that this is why GCat set up Roxy's meeting with Meenah - so that Meenah will follow her Dream Self out of her dream bubble and into...wherever Roxy's Dream Self ends up.

There may be robot possession involved, followed by Meenah battling the Condesce. Because with so many duplicates around, it's surprising no-one has fought themselves yet.

Pre-Scratch Trolls' Titles
Aranea and Meenah both share aspects with their post-Scratch successors, but not their classes. Nor did the classes simply switch between the two of them (meaning Aranea wasn't the Witch of Light despite Meenah being the Thief of Life). Not a huge leap of reasoning to say this is probably a theme amongst all of the trolls. (Working off a WMG in the Unified Theories section for classes.)
  • The Handmaid: Rogue of Time
    • Personal guess, simply because the Handmaid was forced to serve Scratch/English and wasn't allowed to... well, go rogue.
      • Damara is the Witch of Time. Should've guessed that, really, since Aradia's name refers to a goddess of witchcraft if I recall.
  • The Summoner: Prince of Breath
    • Personal guess is not Knight, as it would just be an Active-Passive flip. Also, not the Bard IF the Grand Highblood was the Page, since it would just switch Gamzee and Tavros' classes.
    • OP here. Just realized that I kinda eliminated all of the other Prince options, so I guess the Summoner is.
      • Nitram can't be the Page, so he must be the Rogue of Breath (out of what's left). Assuming he doesn't end up a Lord.
  • The Ψiioniic: (Knight, Bard, or Page) of Doom
    • Not the Prince if Dualscar is the Mage, as it would just switch Sollux and Eridan's classes.
      • Mituna's the Heir of Doom, which in hindsight, seems like it would kind of suck.
  • The Sufferer: Heir of Blood
    • The Sufferer is basically Troll Jesus. John, the Heir of Breath, is a Messianic figure. If the Sufferer was also the leader of the pre-Scratch session, there's a precedent.
      • Kankri is the Seer of Blood, which only exacerbates his parody of Social Justice bloggers- he "sees" problems everywhere.
  • The Disciple: (Seer or Witch) of Heart
    • Not the Maid if the Handmaid is the Rogue, as it would just switch Nepeta and Aradia's classes.
      • Well I was on the right track, but Meulin is the Mage of Heart. Alas.
  • The Dolorosa: (Seer or Maid) of Space
    • Got this one right (ignoring the Seer bit...). Porrim, as a feminist, probably isn't happy with being called the Maid of Space.
  • Neophyte Redglare: (Maid or Witch) of Mind
    • Only two combinations if the Handmaid is the Rogue: If the Disciple is the Seer, then the Dolorosa is the Maid and Redglare is the Witch. OR, if Redglare is the Maid, then the Dolorosa is the Seer and the Disciple is the Witch.
      • Or they could defy all expectations and make Latula part of what was a presumably male class, the Knight of Mind.
  • Marquise Mindfang: Already confirmed to be the Sylph of Light.
  • E%ecutor Darkleer: (Bard or Page) of Void
    • No possible combinations for Prince combined with others' restrictions. Not the Knight if the Sufferer is the Heir.
      • Since Nitram can't be the Page (out of what's left), that makes Zahhak the Page of Void. Assuming he wasn't a Lord.
    • Although since the Knight in chess is a horse, it would make some sense.
  • The Grand Highblood: (Knight or Page) of Rage
    • Personal guess is not Prince, as it would just be an Active-Passive flip.
      • And just to completely discredit me, Kurloz was the one class I said he wasn't, the Prince of Rage.
  • Orphaner Dualscar: Mage of Hope
    • Eridan insists that magic isn't real. I cannot be the only one who the irony appeals to.
      • Cronus is the Bard of Hope. Ironic, considering nobody will listen to his music.
  • The Condesce: Already confirmed to be the Thief of Life.

So... Feferi's predecessor has Vriska's class Vriska' predecessor has Kanaya's class, hers has either Terezi's or Aradia's.
  • If she has Aradia's: Aradia's predecessor has Nepeta's class, hers has either Terezi's or Feferi's.
    • If Feferi's it completes a cycle with only 5 characters.
    • If Terezi's: Terezi's predecessor has either Feferi's or Aradia's class.
      • Aradia's is impossible since her class is already Kanaya's predecessor's.
      • If Feferi's it completes a cycle which encompasses all 6 females.
  • If she has Terezi's: Terezi's predecessor has either Feferi's or Aradia's class.
    • If Feferi's it completes a cycle with only 4 characters.
    • If she has Aradia's: Aradia's predecessor has Nepeta's class, hers has either Terezi's or Feferi's.
      • Terezi's is impossible since her class is already Kanaya's predecessor's.
      • If Feferi's it completes a cycle which encompasses all 6 females.

There are two possible routes, let's do the same with the male characters.

Karkat's predecessor has Equius' class, his has either Tavros' or Gamzee's.
  • If Tavros':Tavros' predecessor has Gamzee's or Eridan's.
    • If Gamzee's: he has either Karkat's or Tavros'.
      • If Karkat's, it creates a cycle with only 4 characters.
      • Tavros' is impossible since his class is already Equius' predecessor's.
    • If Eridan's: Eridan's predecessor has Sollux's and his predecessor has Karkat's, Gamzee's or Tavros'.
      • Tavros' is impossible since his class is already Equius' predecessor's.
      • If Karkat's, it creates a cycle with only 5 characters.
      • If Gamzee: Gamzee's has either Tavros' or Karkat's.
      • —> Tavros' is impossible since his class is already Equius' predecessor's.
      • —> If Karkat's it completes a cycle which encompasses all 6 males
  • If Gamzee's he has either Karkat's or Tavros'.
    • If Karkat's, it creates a cycle with only 3 characters.
    • If Tavros': Tavros' predecessor has Gamzee's or Eridan's.
      • Gamzee's is impossible since his class is already Equius' predecessor's.
      • If Eridan's: Eridan's predecessor has Sollux's and his predecessor has Karkat's, Gamzee's or Tavros'.
      • —> Tavros' is impossible since his class is already Gamzee's predecessor's.
      • —> Gamzee's is impossible since his class is already Equius' predecessor's.
      • —> If Karkat's it completes a cycle which encompasses all 6 males

Again there are two possible routes.
  • The Sufferer is an Heir
  • Dualscar in a Mage
  • Both have The Summoner as Prince
  • The Grand Highblood is either a Knight or a Page
  • The Psiioniic is either a Bard or a Knight
  • Darkleer is either a Page or a Bard
    • Pre-Scratch Dualscar is confirmed as the Bard of Hope
Meenah at one point had a fight with the A1 version of the Handmaid.
Likely as part of Meenah's plan to die. In that fight, if it was part of the plan, Meenah died and thus succeeded. Why do I say this? Circumstantial simultaneity. The fuchsia-blooded troll in a fight to the death against the rust-blooded troll, with one of them hoping to die in the fight as part of a plan that involves the destruction of a universe? From my pitifully limited understanding of the concept of circumstantial simultaneity, that certainly sounds like it could mirror the fight between the Condesce and the Handmaid. What's more, the fates of players in a post-Scratch session seem to mirror in some ways their pre-Scratch equivalentsnote , so why not for pre-Scratch players in their post-Scratch status as ancestors? Plus, this might be why we never saw Meenah or Aranea before the Scratch: until the Condesce killed the Handmaid, Meenah's fight with the pre-Scratch Handmaid hadn't happened yet, since it happened "at the same time as" the battle between their post-Scratch versions.
  • Confirmed. Meenah and Damara did indeed have a fight, but it ended differently than in the post-Scratch universe.

Meenah once had flushed feelings for Aranea.
We know at least one female troll has been flushed for Aranea. Meenah is the only other pre-scratch troll we know about so far, and we know she and Aranea got along, while the other pre-scratch trolls didn't like Aranea much. Perhaps Meenah liked Aranea a little too much.

Pre-scratch Sufferer and Dolorosa are moirails
Just based on the fact their post-scratch selves are extremely close, with the Sufferer being basically the only troll raised by another troll, and the Dolorosa being pretty much the only troll to raise another troll.
  • Jossed. Kankri and Porrim don't really like each other.
Gamzee is in some way connected to the Cherubim
Calliope's cosplay horns closely resemble his. Also, Gamzee has a connection to Doc Scratch and Cal, who have been shown to be connected to the Cherubim and Lord English.
  • Confirmed? Gamzee raised them.
Pre-Scratch Karkat was that universe's version of the Sufferer.
Aranea wears the sign of Cancer, which shouldn't make sense... unless the Pre-Scratch universe had a Sufferer, too. Since the trolls and their ancestors were switched after the Scratch, the same way the Kids and their Guardians were, it had to have been Karkat. One of the reasons why the troll race was so peaceful, aside from the lack of Doc Scratch's interference, is that Karkat's revolution was actually successful. It would make sense. The Pre-Scratch session was a failure; Post-Scratch, on the other hand, Karkat was able to unite the trolls and win their session, and the obstacles that prevented them from claiming their prize were at the time out of their control. Plus, the way things are now, he still stands a chance of helping fix the rest of the mess they're in. In other words, in both troll universes, the troll we know as the Sufferer was always doomed to fail, while the troll we know as Karkat Vantas was always the one to succeed.
  • Also, it brings a new meaning to what Vriska told John, that Karkat had ruined things by making them work together. If Pre-Scratch Karkat had been the Sufferer, and had brought an era of peace to the trolls, that might have contributed to the Pre-Scratch trolls' inability to win their session.
    • This is Jossed by the fact that the non-peaceful nature of the Trolls only exists as a result of Doc Scratch's influence, which only exists in the Post-Scratch universe. The Sufferer arose as he did because he was responding to the unjust nature of Alternia in contrast to his memories of the Pre-Scratch universe; a Pre-Scratch Sufferer cannot fill this role in deed or prerequisite. Aranea DOES, however, imply that she has a crush on the Pre-Scratch Signless, and even without that, she likes many of his ideas. Furthermore, the Pre-Scratch Trolls weren't created by Ectobiology at all as part of their Session Glitch, which means Karkat and company don't even have Pre-Scratch counterparts. Whatsoever.
      • Incorrect: The Trolls were duplicated like the Kids were, and Aranea's necklace shows that Karkat or the Pre-Scratch Sufferer did something. Doc Scratch's narration referring to the glitch still mentions the players came from the sky, a clear reference to meteors. Moreover, Aranea has stated her society had flaws too, and a Pre-Scratch Karkat could easily have protested that.
      • Karkat's ecto-breeding retro-actively created the Ancestors, but it is specifically stated that being born outside of the Session's timeloops is a calling card of Lord English. And while Alternia did have flaws, I don't see anything that'd require a messianic protestor given that the place was pacifistic to a fault.
    • Jossed: She confirms that she wears the pendant in honour of the post-scratch Sufferer. Also, she did not wear it before dying and scratching her universe, and coming to learn of the Sufferer's deeds by dreambubble shenanigans.

Sopor Slime is made from the blood (or other parts) of limeblooded trolls

The other WMG for Pre-Scratch Troll Classes was getting cluttered. My guesses:
  • The Handmaid: Seer of Time
    • Notice how she had her music boxes at the end of the game, before Meenah exploded them all. She must've known what was going to happen, so she brought them with her.
      • Jossed; she's the Witch of Time.
  • The Summoner: Knight of Breath
    • He protected low-bloods and animals in A2. I could see him being confident and an Alpha Male, protecting his friends in A1, which is why Tavros idolizes Dave. I could also see him as Prince.
      • Jossed; he has to be the Rogue of Breath.
  • The Ψiioniic: Page of Doom
    • He was the figurehead of the Condesce's ship in A2, he was the herald of Doom, bringing it everywhere.
      • Jossed; he's the Heir of Doom.
  • The Signless: Heir of Blood
    • Heir = default protagonist class? It just seems to fit, like The Summoner's.
      • Jossed; he's the Seer of Blood.
  • The Disciple: Witch of Heart
    • Her romance with the Signless transcended the quadrants. Jade has been shown to alter her environment around her; altering external space. Maybe as Witch of Heart she altered the traditional romance standards for them in A1?
      • Jossed; she is the Mage of Heart.
  • The Dolorosa: Maid of Space
    • She was the maid/slave for Mindfang in A2, so why not?
    • Confirmed as Maid of Space
  • Redglare: Rogue of Mind
    • Same as Signless/Summoner, just a hunch/guess.
      • Jossed; she's the Knight of Mind.
  • Aranea: Already revealed as Sylph of Light.
  • The Expatri8: Mage of Void
    • Random guess. Could also be Bard.
      • Jossed; he has to be the Page of Void.
  • The Grand Highblood: Prince of Rage
    • He destroyed through his rage/insanity in A2, just a guess at this point.
      • Confirmed as Prince of Rage.
  • Dualscar: Bard of Hope
    • Random guesses, could also be Mage. Mage would be funny because of the whole magic thing.
      • Confirmed as Bard of Hope.
  • Meenah: Already revealed as Thief of Life.

Meenah has a red crush on Mituna because his name has "tuna" in it.
Just calling it before the next update probably makes it obvious. We already know from the A 6 I 3 update that she has been waiting for an opening for his red quadrant even though Latula has had it filled all this time so the only remaining question would be why?

Gamzee redacted large amounts of information from Rose's Chronicle to prevent Caliborn, not Calliope, from gaining information on Lord English (the former's future self).
Think about it. If Caliborn knew about the information hidden in the tome, he would be able to use it to his advantage. Gamzee recognized that he ultimately served as a pawn for his "Mirthful Messiahs" when Doc Scratch told him that the players all fell into his trap, even after renouncing his religion. Since he knew he had some role in setting the trap up to begin with, he decided to sabotage events in the future in order to buy everyone else that much more time to put a stop to the Demon's plots.
  • His encounter(s) with Kurloz, who's embraced his religion's nature, makes this much less likely, though it could still be true pending other WMGs below. I think it's just as likely that the information was redacted by Lord English himself.
  • Keep in mind that in the encounter with Kurloz that we saw, the only thing he said was something along the lines of "shut the fuck up and give me the codpiece".

The King In Red(an unfinished Karkat's Theme remix) was gonna be used for him going God Tier...
...But since it was never finished, they cut God Tier Karkat from happening, only allowing him to appear in a dream bubble from a doomed timeline.
  • Jossed by Andrew's previous statements. Music team knows nothing of canonical spoilers, not even Radiation. The only people who get spoilers are the art team, and they are always extremely narrow apparently. For example in Cascade, the artist who designed Jade's god tier spoke back and forth with Andrew but wasn't privy to details about other parts of the flash. This is why each section has a slight Art Shift.

Gamzee's gonna fight Nepeta in a dream bubble...
...And she will be PISSED OFF. She'll probably lose(whether or not she really fought Gamzee the first time is unknown, since she only scratched him indirectly), but Gamzee will freak out.

Pre-Scratch Summoner's typing quirk substitutes i's with '1'.
...Like Tavros' 't1CK' code.
  • Confirmed.

Meulin's Class will be the Mage class.
I think it's the only class that could possibly be unisex because all female classes have been taken and Page,Bard,Prince,and Heir are all male classes. Knight has already been assigned to Latula which made what seemed like a male exclusive class become unisex. Seer has also been revealed to be unisex because of Kankri. Mages outside of homestuck are usually female, but in the Homestuck universe Sollux is currently the only known Mage. Meulin couldn't be a Rogue becuase Nepeta is already the Mars Rogue of Heart.
  • Confirmed.
  • Side note: Mage is typically associated with male practitioners of magic outside of Homestuck. But that's all irrelevant to what's already been confirmed.

Gamzee is going to betray Kurloz
His moirallegiance with Karkat stopped his murderous rampage before. When push comes to shove, he'll sabotage Kurloz's efforts for Karkat's sake, which will prove instrumental in Caliborn's defeat.

Tavros's ancestor will be an Internet Tough Guy, only not on the internet
It'd make a hilarious contrast to Tavros, who barely has a spine, and Kankri, who's overly and annoyingly sensitive. He'd be cursing all over the place, hyping himself up against people who disagree with him, and just be a humongous douche who can't back up all the grandiose gloating he does. Yet, somehow, Cronus would still be a bigger tool than him.
  • Borderline jossed.

Kurloz is the source of Mituna's problems.
He was the only witness to the event that burned out Mituna's psionics and left him brain-damaged, and Mituna is said to be lucid around Kurloz. Chances are, pre-accident Mituna was onto whatever plan Kurloz had, and had to be dealt with.
  • So,Mituna's the heir of doom, and heir are speculated to mean 'protected by X'. Therefore, Mituna was protected by doom.
Kurloz proved he has the power of mind control, and that he wasn't above controlling those he's close to (Meulin). He also belongs to the same dark cult as Gamzee. Now, how powerful would he and, in turn, his cult become if he had control of a powerful psionic. Now think. If Kurloz tried to control Mituna, isn't it possible that he fried his brain with his psionics to make sure he wasn't worth having? It would have been protecting his friends and, in a way, his free will. How's that for being protected by your doom?
  • This theory's pretty popular, there's even a fanfic based on it!

Kurloz has split personalities.

But they are closer in nature to Mituna's than Gamzee's: while Gamzee's personalities are both evil, Mituna switches between raving asshole and Extreme Doormat. Kurloz was most likely a genuinely decent person (aside from the whole cult thing) before his vision of Lord English, which along with the guilt from deafening Meulin made him go deeper into his religion and triggered his evil manipulative cultist personality. Good!Kurloz is most likely unaware of his other side's existence, considering his friendly interactions with Meulin before the codpiece is presented to him.

The 'Mirthful Messiah' that Gamzee and Kurloz are conspiring with isn't who you think it is.

It's actually Calliope. The 'Vast Honk' that Kurloz heard was a desperate scream from what remained of her within Caliborn, transcending both space and time (incidentally, both Calli and Caliborn's powers in the game) so that somebody, somewhere, would hear it and try to set her free. It should also be noted that between Lord English's dual personalities, Calliope was definitely the more 'mirthful' between them. The word 'Calliope' is also related to the circus, similar to the clown-like Gamzee and Kurloz (the first of which has a song dedicated to him called "Midnight Calliope".)

With that said, Gamzee and Kurloz are actually conspiring not to help Lord English, but to get close enough to him to set Calliope free, as it was alluded to earlier in the story that the only way to disable Lord English was to say her name in his presence. That's why they are keeping their movements a secret from everybody whilst maintaining the guise of being psychopathic clowns - they're making sure nobody, especially not Lord English, is aware of this.
  • My god. This is BRILLIANT. The likelihood of this WMG being confirmed is low, but god do I want to believe. What a twist!
  • Might be linked to the loss of Kurloz' voice; an intentional gambit on the part of LE's crew to prevent him uttering Calliope's name aloud.

Kurloz sabotaged his own session
Which is why it was Unwinnable and they needed a Scratch in the first place. After all, if they won, his Messiah would never be reborn through incubation by Doc Scratch. He used psychic influence to contribute to and exacerbate the psychological cluster*** that was his Session, and may have even conspired with his Jack Noir behind everybody's backs.

Damara is a Troper
The pre-scratch Trolls appear to be parodies of every internet user that annoys Andrew. People who edit his posts, rabid fangirls, people who think Eridan is not that bad, etc. I got the idea from his formspring that he doesn't particularly like our site. He described it as "The holy scripture for anime nerds", and judging by the leaked sprites, Damara is wearing a Japanese schoolgirl outfit or something similar. Also, she used the Quills of Echidna. Trope-tan fights with a quill.

Terezi wouldn't show her face to Karkat because she's dead, perhaps having been Driven to Suicide.
All ghosts in Homestuck are shown to have milky white eyes. If Terezi had died, it stands to reason that her eyes would be white as well. It's possible that something unseen happened to her, possibly between her and Dave, and that Terezi wound up killing herself as a result—if this were the case, it makes sense that she'd be reluctant to let her possible former matesprit, Karkat, find out. It would also give a bigger reason for her moping around in the dreambubbles—she felt guilty about her suicide.
  • But her eyes won't show behind her red glasses anyway...
  • Jossed.

Eridan was actually Asexual and overcompensating.
His behaviour comes across less as actual desire and more as trying to shove himself into a relationship for the sake of being normal (and, pre-S Grub, not being culled). With Alternian culture the way it is, he never had an opportunity to find out what asexuality is. He pursued Feferi because she was there, couldn't grasp why she would prefer Sollux over him since he's never experienced love/pity, and assumed she was trying to get him killed or shame him as opposed to simply not being interested, hence why he got so angry. Explored in more detail in these fics.
  • There's another fan theory that Cronus is pansexual non-romantic. Tying this in to the theory elsewhere on the page that the Scratch gives the players warped versions of the lives they thought they wanted, it's possible that Cronus is so and Dualscar wasn't. Dualscar's romantic feelings only served to make things worse for him.

Karkat Vantas...
Has tourettes syndrome. Think about it. He cusses randomly out of nowhere, and he seems to be screaming, but that might just be his typing style.

  • Karkat doesn't cuss and scream randomly out of nowhere. He cusses and screams because he is very, very angry about everything, all the time. That ain't Tourette's.

The entire purpose of Meenah's obsession with money and fascination with her other life as Betty Crocker...
...is to set up the mother of all "Because I knead the dough" jokes.

The Tavros we've been seeing from the 10/11/12 update onward...
...is actually Andrew Hussie in disguise.
  • Jossed.

Tavros and Vriska will accidentally help Lord English
The two of them met thanks to the bizarre actions of Gamzee, who is working for Lord English. This suggests that whatever they are doing (hunting for a Game Breaker treasure) is something he wants done. After all, their quest is motivated by Vriska's belief that what they really need to beat Lord English is a quick fix cheat of some sort, and we all know how well that's worked out for her in the past.
  • Tavros' inner monologue used Gamzee's typing quirk in a recent update.
    • That's just him being really bad at whispering...

Mituna actually did make it to God Tier
He's probably wearing a pressure vest, and nobody ever told him how to take it off for his own benefit. Meenah is not aware of this, since she hasn't been in the dreambubble as long. Mituna probably doesn't remember/lost his powers with the incident/thought his power as heir of doom kind of sucks/ doesn't really care, anyway.
  • Seeing as how going God Tier is shown to heal people's past wounds (note Vriska's arm and eye), and Mituna's just as mentally damaged as before (and it's mentioned that he "overexerted" his powers, implying that there was some sort of physical brain damage), this seems unlikely.
  • However, a few altrenate timeline God Tier Mitnas show during the Ministrife with the helmet. Saying it is for recognition purposes doesn't work, as he was shown in the same flash without his helmet. It's still a possibility.

Gamzee is not God Tier, but he and Kurloz think he is.
Kurloz seems to put a lot of importance on putting together what is probably Gamzee's God Tier outfit, perhaps out of the belief that the outfit is what gives the powers. They will be proved wrong in the most hilariously Problem Sleuth-esque way possible. "Of course you aren't God Tier just because you happen to be wearing the outfit. You're not sure why you ever would have thought otherwise."
  • What about the wings?
    • Part of the outfit.
      • Take another look. He doesn't have wings.
      • This part of the theory is confirmed when one of his wings falls off as Caliborn shoots him. You can clearly see the strap. However, it remains to be seen as to whether he's survived the attack.
      • He survived, but not for god tier reasons.
The Pre-Scratch trolls actually are fantrolls.
One day someone created a bunch of bad fantrolls and wished on a star that they could become real. So the Author Fairy came down (in a dress) and waved his magic wand, thus making them canon.

Here's what I think happened with Mituna and Kurloz in the mysterious incident.
Mituna told the trolls about his visions, but none of them believed him, right? Well, that's only if you believe Aranea is completely correct about everything, and from opening the chests in the meenahquest games, you can see that sometimes the prescratch lot have no idea what's actually going on. So, I think that Kurloz did believe Mituna about the visions, but because of his sewn mouth, had difficulty explaining this to the others. Either that, or there wasn't time because the danger was imminent. Hence why Aranea thinks nobody believed Mituna. So, Kurloz and Mituna go out to face this danger, and it is a psychic as well as physical danger. They get as far away fron the others as possible hoping it will attack them rather than the others, hence why they were alone, and Mituna uses his powers to form a sort of force field around himself and the others while Kurloz uses his chucklevoodoos to stop the psychic threat. However, I think that being so close to Kurloz while they both used such a large amount of power damaged Mituna's mind, as he was hit both by the strain of holding such a powerful shield, and the edge of the strongerst chucklevoodoos Kurloz could pull off, as well as being affected by whatever psychic powers the thing they defeated had.

Tavros isn't trying to propose to Vriska. At least, not in the sense we might be thinking of.
He's encountered the idea of human matrimony twice before. Once was during his feeble attempt to troll Dave, when Dave mentioned it before he verbally tore him to shreds and sent him packing. The second was with Hussie stalking/proposing to Vriska, to which she reacted with revulsion and repeated attempts to avoid him. Taking into account his passive-aggressiveness, such as when he dumped the maps on the ground rather than giving them to her, he doesn't want to marry her. He wants to make her go away.

Gamzee is a juju.
Think about it. Here is what we know about jujus so far;
  • They exist only to make their universe's inhabitants as miserable as possible by making their lives a living hell. Gamzee has the ability to alter reality and create nightmares in someone's mind. He's the entire reason Cal exists.
  • There can only ever be one of them. For example, this is why every Lil' Cal but one has fallen some kind of horrid fate that results in its destruction. If Gamzee were a juju, this would explain why no other version of him has been seen; they've all been destroyed or otherwise erased from existence.
Gamzee being a juju would explain a lot about him.

Meenah will enact her role as Thief of Life by literally stealing another character's life for herself.
... Bonus points if this unlucky individual is upon their quest bed at the time. I'm hoping for Terezi or Karkat.
  • Nonono, you got it all wrong. It is clearly Gamzee who she'll kill.
    • Given that Caliborn has now shot Gamzee and that his godhood has been called into question, it's unlikely (at the VERY least) that she'll kill him.
      • Then again, the dream bubbles may give him a way to continue to exist(which may result in a hilarious Call Back in which Lord English does the exact same thing).
      • Actually, he's still alive... somehow.

The wings really ARE part of the outfit, and thus Gamzee isn't dead.
He survived being kicked off a cliff by Kanaya and launched by a massive explosion. I think Gamzee is gonna take more than that to kill.
  • Partially confirmed, though the reasoning for his survival is still ambiguous. Either it's because he's a clown, or he's God Tier.

That's not what the Bard God Tier outfit usually looks like.
The other God Tier outfits are at least marginally more dignified. Gamzee either threw something together himself if he's not God Tier or modified the provided outfit magically if he is, just to make everyone assume he's stupid and harmless again.
  • Jossed, as it's the same outfit that God Tier Cronus wears, of the same colors as God Tier Kurloz.

Gamzee is FTM.
There actually isn't anything external behind that codpiece, he just got it to distract the eye now he's old enough to grow unwanted boobs.

Kurloz will be the one to call Calliope's name.
His oral mutilations are likely to be relevant to the plot in some way. Calliope is one half of the Messiahs as well, so he technically could be influenced by her as well as Caliborn. Thus, it's possible Caliborn/LE intentionally influenced him into destroying his own voice to prevent him calling Calliope back, and he'll get it back in the nick of time.

Sburb is set up to intentionally turn Post-Scratch players' lives into warped versions of their desires.
Either because the game itself is malevolent or it was designed by evil forces, this is possible. Aranea claimed they got to "live out their wildest fantasies", but observe;
  • Kankri wanted to battle injustice; he ended up horribly killed and it became a capital crime to speak his name.
  • Meulin, as a shipper, may have wanted true love, or may have wanted to spread the word of what she believed in; her love was killed in front of her and she was exiled from society, never to speak to another living troll again and only to be known through her cave-paintings.
  • Horuss wanted to be more than just a cog in the machine; he stepped out of his assigned place when he freed the Disciple, and was exiled for his pains.
  • Rufioh wanted to be a hero; his rebellion made things worse, he killed his own matesprit, and he presumably died horribly.
  • Mituna wanted to help his friends and maybe get access to cool technology into the bargain; he got stuck in the engine.
  • Aranea wanted to be a swashbuckling hero and to have a cool story to tell; she became a sexually abusive narcissist who got killed by her own matesprit.
  • Porrim wanted to take care of Kankri; she saw him die horribly, and ended up a slave.
    • Porrim wanted a place outside the system; she ended up outside its protection.
  • Cronus wanted a worthy rival and a cool story of his own; he ruined his kismesissitude, and ended up being murdered by a clown.
  • Damara wanted revenge; she got stuck serving Doc Scratch.
  • Latula wanted to bring justice and protect the innocent; she got lynched by the very people she was trying to protect.
  • Kurloz and Meenah wanted power; he got to be head of his beloved church and she got to run the whole Empire, and in the process they (assuming Aranea was right and Kurloz wasn't always a psychopath) ruined or ended the lives of everyone their Pre-Scratch selves ever cared about.
    • To support this theory, the Beta Kids suffered from this too:
      • John wanted to be a famous comedian/magician/movie star; Poppop!John ended up achieving this after a life of being raised by Betty Crocker, a figure he despises.
      • Jade wanted to live among animals; Grandma!Jade ended up living among giant murderous alien creatures after being essentially exiled with only her adoptive grandson for company.
      • Dave wanted to step out of Bro's shadow and be an individual all his own; Bro!Dave grew up without an older brother and accomplished many things, but had very few friends as a result.
      • Rose wanted to write stories about super powerful wizards and killer Eldritch Abominations; Mom!Rose twisted those stories into propaganda against The Batterwitch and almost got into a lot of trouble for it (and later died).

Kurloz's catastrophic nightmare...
... involved him seeing what his post-Scratch self did to everyone he'd known on Beforus. It wasn't pretty.

All Patron Trolls are destined to fall in love with their respective kids
Vriska loves John, Terezi loves Dave, Kanaya loves Rose, and Karkat has ship teases with Jade. Hmmm...

Dream Gamzee is still alive
Gamzee never dies because of his clown immortality, and that extends to his Dream Self. Dream Gamzee is still flying around the troll's session, doing who-knows-what. He may be gathering up the leftovers from Jack's rampage for something. (Maybe he's collecting the remnants of their worlds and the moons, to try and piece their quest beds back together?)

Terezi is spying on Gamzee and is not really on his side. Also there's something about the eyes thing here.
We know Terezi's ancestor Redglare was secretly a follower of the Signless, a fact that hasn't ever come up again. She also worked for Gamzee's ancestor the Grand Highblood, so it would make sense if Terezi was secretly spying on him. Terezi is hiding her eyes for some reason, and there was for a time a theory that she was dead, but now we know she's not. In addition, Meulin doesn't have the flashy-color-eyes thing all the time, so it's probably not hiding mind control. This is actually because she's taken Aranea's offer at some point and is no longer blind, breaking the 'hear no evil, speak no evil, see no evil' pattern that would be apparent if she was not a spy, following the line of Kurloz and Meulin.

The most telling piece of evidence, though, comes from a pun on her name: Spyrope. Dragon pun, right there.
  • She did take Aranea's offer, but she probably isn't spying on Gamzee. If anything, she's tormented by her feelings for him.
Sollux is naturally attracted to scary people.
He liked Aradia (who is fascinated by death), his most recent girlfriend was Feferi (who is kind of crazy, likes and was raised by Eldritch Abominations) and has a red and black thing for Gamzee (self explanatory).

The mass genocide of the limebloods was actually instigated by Lord English/Scratch.
Simply because Calliope had similarily colored blood. Limebloods being a threat to the authorities was only a cover-up, or something.

The Sufferer wasn't a troll version of Jesus...
He was a troll version of Vladimir Lenin.
  • Both men were known to be charismatic leaders and great orators.
  • Both men were revolutionaries interested in overthrowing a class-based society.
  • Both men supported the lower and working classes.
  • Both men were despised by the local authorities.
  • The Sufferer had candy-red blood; Communism is associated with the colour red.
  • Karkat's weapon is a sickle, one of the symbols of the Soviet Union.
  • On a more tongue-in-cheek note, this would make him Russian.
Any Jesus parallels that can't apply to any revolutionary leader? Chalk it up to in-universe Historical Hero Upgrade (note that Lenin was also subject to a great degree of hero worship in the Soviet Union).

Kanaya will go Mama Bear on Jane for stabbing Karkat.
Just like the Dolorosa on John, only with more blood. HISS!
  • Jossed...for now.

Meenah and her Ghost Army will be used to defeat The Condesce
Meenah has shown in the past that she has more morals than her post-scratch counterpart, if only regarding specific individuals that she cares about and The Condesce does not, is inevitably going to become involved, and has stated that she cannot control herself regarding seething hatred of any other Royal Trolls - potentially including her alternate self.

This is how Tavros survived growing up as The Woobie on a death world, and why Jake was so terrified when they tried to express affection to him.

Kurloz' nightmare was the result of Lord English's time powers.
Highblooded trolls must be naturally psychologically set up to cope with multiple millenia of life, avoiding the problems that humans living that long would suffer. As a Lord of Time, LE can manipulate time. Kurloz' nightmare was simply how his life would be if he experienced time the way a human would. No wonder it sent him insane.

Gamzee has the power that John has - and both are "unstuck" in canon.
Think about it - he has a tendency to show up and watch (or even interfere with) events in many situations, and then completely disappear. It's been established that there are no instances of a dead Gamzee in any timeline, and that Gamzee can even leave one session to enter another dimension (as he did with raising Calliope/Caliborn). What if Gamzee has been manipulating the fabric of Paradox Space itself?

Gamzee's actions to ensure Lord English's rise follow the same logic that led Vriska to ensure that the players would have to deal with Bec Noir
Since Lord English has clearly been influencing events already, trying to subvert his existence would simply create a doomed timeline, which would probably just be useless. So he figures he may as well make sure what needs to happen happens and may or may not be planning to turn on him later. Basically, how can you prevent English's existence WHEN HE IS ALREADY HERE!?

What any of this has to do with screwing with Terezi and donning fake God Tier garb I have no idea.

Kankri was castrated.
Beforus' Crapsaccharine World status is exactly the kind of place where well-meaning eugenics could thrive, and even if it wasn't so extreme Kankri's vow of celibacy may be related to social pressure not to make more mutants. In darker interpretations, the idea that he may have had some surgical "help" isn't impossible; he tells everyone he's celibate because he doesn't want them to know. In the dreambubbles, his body healed and he has his reproductive organs back, and is not dealing with it terribly well, as we see in his interaction with Latula.

Kanaya will take up Jade's sword.
Kanaya will fall asleep and wake up in a dreambubble where she'll meet Jade's ghost. Jade will tell her where her quest bed on LOFAF is and instruct Kanaya to die on it. Kanaya will do as instructed and ascend as a fully realized Sylph of Space. And I for one seriously hope she kills Aranea afterward.

Aranea will in the end give the resurrection ring to Jade
There's two ways this can go. Willingly, where she gives it as penance after she realizes that she's going overboard, or unwillingly, where it gets taken from her and given to ghost-Jade somehow (possibly involving an appearifier).

Aranea manipulated Terezi by using Gamzee
Un-blinding Terezi was always a part of her plan. When Terezi refused, Aranea decided to mind-control Gamzee into making Terezi insecure enough to come back to Aranea and get her eyes fixed. Honestly, this wouldn't be too out-of-character given what we know about her now.
  • Terezi's speech to Gamzee strongly implies that this may be the case.

Gamzee was created for the sole purpose of unleashing or aiding in the unleashing of Lord English.
If you think about it, it makes sense. He has never died in ANY of the timelines. Why is that? Because Lord English created him, and he is basically made to be a durable tool. The only reason he didn't start sooner is because he was stoned on soper slime (and even then it seems he may have underlying loyalty to his masters. Mirthful Messiahs anyone?), and while he did use the term "lowblood", he never specifies that the blood COLOR makes them low. His default purpose was activated, and he went on a killing spree. Karkat is able to become his moirail and keep him pacified and realize that he ultimately did care for his friends. But through one way or another (maybe he went to "factory default") he slowly sunk back to his purpose. More evidence to this fact is after he left, we have seen very little emotion from him aside from complete dogged loyalty to CALIBORN, who is the spawn of Lord English, and a refusal to accept rejection.

Terezi will blind Gamzee.
Poetic justice at work.

Gamzee will kill Aranea.
A man can dream...

Gamzee has been overtaken by Rage.
No, not the emotion, the Aspect itself. Hear me out. John's aspect seems to give him control of The Breeze. It looks as though, according to Jack Noir, the Breeze is protecting him in some way, having a sort of will of its own. Why can't Rage be the same way??? Except worse? What I think is, when Gamzee channeled his Rage in his attacks, the more he channeled, the more it took hold of him. He was consumed to the point of wanting to end the universe, by joining Caliborn, and now it seems like their is very little of him left (and the mind control didn't help) based on his brief moment of clarity (or was it?) with Terezi. If it was an act, it's likely he is Pure Rage at this point.

Gamzee has no motive, and is just doing what he does for shits and giggles.
And it will be in a big moment, someone asking "Why are you doing this", and Gamzee just says "Because why not" or something of the sort.

Tavros was emotionally capable of saving Vriska from bleeding to death, but he chose not to.
  • It's not that big a leap. He wasn't quite spiteful enough (or brave enough) to actively attack her when she was at normal strength, but her injuries gave him an opportunity to get revenge. On at least a subconscious level, he wanted Vriska to feel pain like he had when she broke his legs.

Eridan Ampora is actually Netherlands from Axis Powers Hetalia
He looks suspiciously similar to Neth. Also, the scarf, coat and hair. he looks exactly like a troll version of him if you take off his glasses!
  • I... cannot unsee this.

Tavros will come back to life and arrive on LOFAF
When Tavros decided he'd had enough of Vriska and actually showed a massive amount of spine, he did the one thing that none of the pre-scratch trolls did despite being in the Dream Bubbles for countless sweeps, he developed as a person. Coupled with the fact that he then flew off unaided which he could never do before he could possibly be on his way back to the waking world.

Vriska will come back to life and help everyone
Sooner or later, Aranea will either go to sleep or be knocked unconscious. At this moment Vriska and Meenah will tag-team her in a dreambubble, working together as Thieves (come on, they have a common Title, this has to be relevant somehow), and Vriska will take the ring (because Meenah explicitly doesn't want to). She will take control of Gamzee, subdue him somehow, then find Roxy and give her the ring, willingly surrendering her narrative importance and going back to Meenah and pissed-off Aranea. Roxy will go to sleep, find Calliope, give her the ring, and then there will be rainbows, puppies and party baloons because why the hell not.

Well, it will probably be more complicated than that, seeing how this plan ignores Her Imperious Condescension who's likely to have her own plans for all involved, but the core points are: Vriska&Meenah steal the ring from Aranea when she's next in the dreambubble, Vriska takes it and comes back to life, and then after some events willingly gives the ring away because that's what she planned to do from the start.

Damara is actually fluent in English/West Beforan.
She chooses to speak Japanese/East Beforan instead, to mess with people, but she's actually completely bilingual, and was faking poor English to mess with the kids. It's also poasible that the reason she refuses to speak English stems at least partly from her former association with Rufioh. Think about it—she's said to have settled with the Lost Weeaboos after leaving East Beforus, so it's quite possible that she learned English from him, and that speaking it brings back memories she'd rather suppress.

Eridan will somehow come back to life and kill Gamzee.
Mindfang killed Redglare, Terezi kills Vriska. The Summoner killed Mindfang, Vriska kills Tavros. Orphaner Dualscar killed The Dolorosa, Kanaya kills Eridan. Who killed Orphaner Dualscar? The GHB did. So Eridan will kill Gamzee.
> Go Back
> Return to main page
Homestuck AlphaWMG/HomestuckHomestuck Jossed Trolls

random
TV Tropes by TV Tropes Foundation, LLC is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike 3.0 Unported License.
Permissions beyond the scope of this license may be available from thestaff@tvtropes.org.
Privacy Policy
119512
25