Discussion HeartWarming / KamenRiderDrive

Frankly, the issue is that there is a slavish devotion by the community that regards O-T's translations as the be-all and end-all of translations. For the record, I watch Raws, and I was only aware that the new translation originated from O-T because it was brought to my attention by another party, and frankly, it fit the profile of how they consistently translate material. That said, I have no horse in the subbing race so the assertion that I prefer TV-N over O-T is one founded on misguided playground tribalism.

On the matter of which translation is preferable, the former is putting in additional contexts that simply do not exist. Chase asserts that protecting humans IS his instinct. No additional context, no auxillary implications, and though there is a modifier to indicate uncertainty, the simple fact of the matter is that Chase associates the protection of humans with who he is as an individual being. And at this point in his development, it makes perfect sense for him to do so because it's a moment in his life where he is neither influenced by Krim's programming nor the Roidmudes' brainwashing.

One could make the implication that when Chase says 本能, he is making a nod to his mechanical nature, thus making it conceivable that something like the instinct to protect could be hard-wired into him. That is to say, the instinct to protect originates from a source external to his state of being. The problem with this assertion is that the use of 本能 in this context is clearly used to assert a sense of humanity and individuality in him. Prior to this, the word プログラム (program) has been used to describe his instincts, and the fact that 本能 is used instead demonstrates a clear shift in context, one that O-T has not acknowledged.

To be fair, one is fully capable of interpreting Chase’s statement as either referring to his decision as an individual or as a machine. I can see both sides being right. And it’s for that reason, leaning to one interpretation over another simply isn’t practical. One could just as easily translate the statement as, “Protecting humans is an instinct of my own choice.” to accommodate the former interpretation, but it would hold as much validity as O-T’s translation because there simply is no evidence from the actual quote to assert one interpretation over another. A neutral, direct translation might be less colourful but it at least matches the ambiguity of the statement.

But now here’s the real issue. Ask yourself if the direct translation, which was edited in before the O-T subs came out, could be in any way described by an individual of appreciable fluency in both English and Japanese as misrepresenting the source quote. Does it in any way completely fail to provide an accurate understanding of what the characters are saying? Really, how many people would actually compare those translations and the quote and say, “Wow, how did they ever come up with THAT conclusion”? Yeah, forgive me for blowing my own horn, but that was a perfectly serviceable translation. And yet somebody still found the need to replace it with another translation. Not because the first translation was glaringly incomprehensible, but because an organisation not in anyway directly representing Toei said that that was what these characters said, so by golly, that MUST be what they are saying!

Last I checked, neither the TV Tropes community, nor the Toku community was obliged to owe total and complete allegiance to O-T. TV Tropes is a catalog describing memetic patterns in works, and therefore our primary concern should be to discuss the work through the lens of its official incarnations rather than through the lens of fan-interpretation (and ALL fan-subs are fan interpretations). We are allowed to comment on these interpretations, and hell, if they have an identity uniquely distinct enough from the source material, we can even treat them as their own works as we do Team Four Star’s Dragon Ball Z Abridged. But to construe a fan-interpretation as a direct representation of the source material is simply out of the question, and that has been precisely what this community has been doing in regards to O-T. Guess what? O-T’s translators are not the only people who can translate Japanese into English, and regardless of what you think about their accuracy, their being a group does not make their translations any more valid than other possible translations.

Look, if someone wants to change the first translation because they felt that there was a more serviceable translation, I’d be fine with that. I probably would still try to argue for the first translation but I’d appreciate that the other party is acting based on a genuine appreciation of a work we both enjoy, and I know we can safely have a discussion knowing we are both addressing the exact same thing, albeit with different interpretations. But, if someone wants to change the translation because “Subbing Group A” said so, then that’s where I draw the line because they’re not fans of Toei’s Kamen Rider Drive. They’re fans of “Subbing Group A’s” version of Kamen Rider Drive. To them, the latter holds priority over the former, because they don’t give a crap what the former puts out. Their only concern is what the latter says the former is putting out.

Let me get the record straight, I do not blame O-T for this entire fiasco. I’ve only been aware of a few of their subbing choices through friends and contacts and while I do not agree with their subbing philosophy, they are perfectly free to interpret a show however they wish and to share it with the community, and each and every member of the community is free to either accept or reject O-T based on their own whims. But we as a community should also be aware of the distinction between official material and fan-interpretation, and realise that the sub-page in TV Tropes deals with the former, not the latter. Slavishly accepting everything O-T puts out as word of god only demonstrates a critical lack of judgement, and makes the intellectually arrogant assumption that everyone on this community appreciates that we’re turning this page into a mouthpiece for O-T. If the situation ever does become one where O-T is the only available source for translations, then we should by all means use it. But where alternatives are available, let’s not kid ourselves into thinking that O-T has the final say in English translations.

I'd say it doesn't matter too much what translation is used, as long as it demonstrates the trope and doesn't totally misrepresent the original story. So people shouldn't be editing the translations, either way, unless they're demonstrably wrong- even if someone else edited it first.