[002]
Darkaros
Current Version
Changed line(s) 1 from:
n
Nuked a bunch of {{Expy}} examples per [[https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13983140170A37263400&page=1#5 the official clean-up]] (Note: the discussion pages are broken as hell, so this link might be \
to:
Nuked a bunch of {{Expy}} examples per [[https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13983140170A37263400&page=1#5 the official clean-up]] (Note: the discussion pages are broken as hell, so this link might be \\\"broken\\\"; you can search the clean up thread or go to History -> find my working link of the cleanup thread when I deleted these examples).
There might be good content here still, even if it doesn\\\'t fit this trope; it might fit another trope or it might be good to put on the general Trivia tab for Trivia/FatePrototype as a non-troped bit of info.
For now, I retained Sky Silver Expy examples since they\\\'re arguably post-FSN in concept, but they might need to be expanded with context added to fit the {{Expy}} requirement list linked in the cleanup thread.
All these older characters who are literally prototypes for newer ones that got published can\\\'t be Expies:
----
This example is also a problem because Expies are supposed to have only one influence. I doubt \\\'\\\'any\\\'\\\' of this example is salvageable, it basically just says \\\"there were ideas and they were used elsewhere in the final product\\\". Also, the last bullet point is probably just a coincidence as it admits.
!!!Ayaka Sajyou
* {{Expy}}: Ayaka basically serves as the basis for the three main Masters of FSN: Shirou, Rin, and Sakura. To wit;
** Much like Shirou, she\\\'s the Master of Saber, one of the strongest Servants in the Holy Grail War, who also happened to serve a relative of theirs in the past war. Arthur is also hampered by the fact that Ayaka is one of the weakest Masters, same way how Artoria is hampered by Shirou\\\'s own ineptitude as a Master. Outside of their story roles, she\\\'s also a specialist type of magus whose talent lies in a field of magecraft that is considered basics for most magi [[note]]Projection for Shirou, Formalcraft for Ayaka[[/note]] and both only really discover said talent through someone spurring them on. [[note]]EMIYA and Arthur respectively[[/note]]
** In regards to Rin, she\\\'s the daughter of a magus family that was torn apart thanks to the past Holy Grail War, ending up an orphan as a result and living in BigFancyHouse by herself all the while being acquainted with a Catholic Priest who later turns on her. Physically, she and Rin even look similar to each other. The latter even wears glasses at times, increasing said resemblance. Both also use \\\"magic bullet\\\" like attacks [[note]]Gandr shots for Rin, Black Feathers for Ayaka[[/note]] and live a dual life of being a struggling magus and a student. It\\\'s even stated in material that Ayaka\\\'s initial relationship with Saber resembles the one Rin would have with Archer. It\\\'s also worth noting that both girls are {{Tsundere}} towards their respective love interests, especially when Ayaka\\\'s glasses are off.
** As for Sakura, Ayaka happens to be the second daughter of her family much like her and has low self-esteem thanks to her much more talented older sister. Ayaka also gets sick at one point, much like how Sakura gets sick during \\\'\\\'Heaven\\\'s Feel\\\'\\\'.
** It may be coincidential but appearance-wise Ayaka is similar to [[LightNovel/KaraNoKyoukai Shiki Ryougi]] minus the Mystic Eyes. This beomes more noticeable [[TheGlassesComeOff once she stops wearing glasses]].
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Misaya Reiroukan
* {{Expy}}: While Ayaka is the actual character prototype of Rin Tohsaka, Misaya is the prototype of the \\\'\\\'role\\\'\\\' Rin would later hold - which makes it amusing that Rin was saved by her canon\\\'s Lancer. At the same time, her [[spoiler: YourDaysAreNumbered status is seemingly carried over to the eventual fate of Illyasviel von Einzbern (homunculus with a limited lifespan)]].
** She even shares Rin\\\'s background as revealed in \\\'\\\'Fragments\\\'\\\': she\\\'s a haughty young lady with immense talent whose father was killed and betrayed by someone he trusted, and her mother dies sometime after the previous Grail War before Misaya participated in the next one.
----
The last sentence part basically invalidates this entire example... All it would be good for is Trivia as they have the same role but nothing else in common.
!!!Sancraid Phahn
* {{Expy}}: He would eventually evolve into the character of Kirei Kotomine, although \\\"the priest\\\" underwent the heaviest revisions of almost anyone out of the Proto cast on the way to \\\'\\\'F/SN\\\'\\\'; Kirei shares very few character elements with Sancraid.
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Manaka Sajyou
* {{Expy}}:
** She was split into Ilya [[note]]older than she looks, pale and cute but still dangerous and with a warped sense of affection[[/note]] and [[spoiler: Dark Sakura]] [[note]](connection to [[spoiler: the Grail]])[[/note]], and some parts of her backstory were incorporated into Kotomine[[note]](being revived [[spoiler: by the Grail]])[[/note]], [[LightNovel/KaraNoKyoukai Ryougi Shiki]] and [[VisualNovel/TsukiHime Aoko Aozaki]] [[note]](innate connection to the Root and having few but super efficient circuits, respectively)[[/note]].
** In a sense, she\\\'s also one for Altrouge Brunestud. Both have a \\\"sister\\\" they have a bad relationship with, and both act as the master [[spoiler:of a Beast]].
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Saber (King Arthur)
* {{Expy}}: He\\\'s more like Shirou than his female counterpart - he notably \\\'\\\'smiles\\\'\\\' at Ayaka when he\\\'s first summoned, and says he\\\'s there to protect her.[[note]]Compare the female Saber, who stoically asks Shirou if he is her Master. Significantly, [[AngstWhatAngst he also doesn\\\'t seem to have any lingering regrets about his rule of Britain]] unlike the \\\'\\\'VisualNovel/FateStayNight\\\'\\\' Saber, which harkens a lot more from Shirou in the \\\'\\\'Unlimited Blade Works\\\'\\\' route--[[TheAntiNihilist he may be less-naive about the world and heroism, but he holds on to his ideals anyway]]. [[/note]] He also has some traits in common with Archer and his relationship with Ayaka is even described as being similar to that of Rin and Archer - at least at first.
** He also holds shades of Kiritsugu Emiya [[spoiler:as it was his meeting with the young child who would become the next Grail War\\\'s \\\"Master of Saber\\\" that saved his heart.]]
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Archer (Gilgamesh)
* {{Expy}}:
** He\\\'s essentially a composite of \\\'\\\'two\\\'\\\' Archers from the final work: while he eventually mutated into the Gilgamesh we all know and love, he also has elements of the primary Archer, being a dual-wielder who makes an epic stand against Berserker.
** He also has a bit in common with [[VisualNovel/FateStayNight FSN-Lancer]], being a combat-lover and all.
----
This example also violates being an in-appearance-only Shinji even if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Rider (Perseus)
* {{Expy}}: Rider is a somewhat more complicated example than the other characters listed here, as it is unclear how much of his role in \\\'\\\'Old Fate\\\'\\\'[[note]]The original draft for both \\\'\\\'Stay Night\\\'\\\' and \\\'\\\'Prototype\\\'\\\' where his identity was originally Theseus.[[/note]]was preserved in \\\'\\\'Prototype\\\'\\\' and how much of it was taken from FSN-Rider due to his changed identity. What is apparent, however, is that he bares something of a resemblance to Shinji, notably his wavy hair, and how he\\\'s apparently someone that Ayaka is personally acquainted with but later ends up fighting during the Holy Grail War. In VisualNovel/FateHollowAtaraxia, Rider calls Perseus a successful version of Shinji, though its unclear how much of that is based on truth, and how much of it is Rider holding a grudge for him killing her, as unlike Shinji, Perseus is a genuine NiceGuy.
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!The Beast of Revelation
* {{Expy}}:
** Naturally, this is the character that eventually became Avenger Angra Mainyu. The biggest difference is that the Beast is the intentional product of the Grail, while Avenger corrupting the Grail was wholly unintentional.
** Furthermore, the concept of a \\\"Beast\\\" class which embodied a sin of humanity would lurk in the background of \\\'\\\'Fate\\\'\\\' works for a decade (and is even somewhat there in \\\'\\\'stay night\\\'\\\' and \\\'\\\'Hollow Ataraxia\\\'\\\'), before the concept returned in full in \\\'\\\'Fate/Grand Order\\\'\\\', to the point that Proto-Arthur\\\'s introduction to that game seems to be hinting at this Beast making an appearance there as well.
** Extra materials for Prototype reveal he\\\'s also the prototype for the being known as the Beast IV [[spoiler:Primate Murder and that both rule over primates]]. The biggest differences being that their appearances are not confirmed to be anything alike and that he two represent different sins. Later on however, both FGO and the final volume of Fragments later retcons it into being Beast VI.
----
This example would also be a Administrivia/ZeroContextExample. Appearances only don\\\'t fit an Expy, and looking \\\"a bit\\\" like someone else... isn\\\'t saying much anyway.
!!!Nigel Sayward (Master of Lancer)
* {{Expy}}: Appearance wise, he looks bit like [[LightNovel/KaraNoKyoukai Araya Souren]].
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Hiroki Sajyou
* {{Expy}}: He\\\'s the original concept of Kiritsugu Emiya, being the father of the main protagonist who died years before the story takes place. He also serves as one for [[LightNovel/FateZero Tokiomi Tohsaka]] as well since his relationship with his daughters somewhat resembles the one Tokiomi had with his.
There might be good content here still, even if it doesn\\\'t fit this trope; it might fit another trope or it might be good to put on the general Trivia tab for Trivia/FatePrototype as a non-troped bit of info.
For now, I retained Sky Silver Expy examples since they\\\'re arguably post-FSN in concept, but they might need to be expanded with context added to fit the {{Expy}} requirement list linked in the cleanup thread.
All these older characters who are literally prototypes for newer ones that got published can\\\'t be Expies:
----
This example is also a problem because Expies are supposed to have only one influence. I doubt \\\'\\\'any\\\'\\\' of this example is salvageable, it basically just says \\\"there were ideas and they were used elsewhere in the final product\\\". Also, the last bullet point is probably just a coincidence as it admits.
!!!Ayaka Sajyou
* {{Expy}}: Ayaka basically serves as the basis for the three main Masters of FSN: Shirou, Rin, and Sakura. To wit;
** Much like Shirou, she\\\'s the Master of Saber, one of the strongest Servants in the Holy Grail War, who also happened to serve a relative of theirs in the past war. Arthur is also hampered by the fact that Ayaka is one of the weakest Masters, same way how Artoria is hampered by Shirou\\\'s own ineptitude as a Master. Outside of their story roles, she\\\'s also a specialist type of magus whose talent lies in a field of magecraft that is considered basics for most magi [[note]]Projection for Shirou, Formalcraft for Ayaka[[/note]] and both only really discover said talent through someone spurring them on. [[note]]EMIYA and Arthur respectively[[/note]]
** In regards to Rin, she\\\'s the daughter of a magus family that was torn apart thanks to the past Holy Grail War, ending up an orphan as a result and living in BigFancyHouse by herself all the while being acquainted with a Catholic Priest who later turns on her. Physically, she and Rin even look similar to each other. The latter even wears glasses at times, increasing said resemblance. Both also use \\\"magic bullet\\\" like attacks [[note]]Gandr shots for Rin, Black Feathers for Ayaka[[/note]] and live a dual life of being a struggling magus and a student. It\\\'s even stated in material that Ayaka\\\'s initial relationship with Saber resembles the one Rin would have with Archer. It\\\'s also worth noting that both girls are {{Tsundere}} towards their respective love interests, especially when Ayaka\\\'s glasses are off.
** As for Sakura, Ayaka happens to be the second daughter of her family much like her and has low self-esteem thanks to her much more talented older sister. Ayaka also gets sick at one point, much like how Sakura gets sick during \\\'\\\'Heaven\\\'s Feel\\\'\\\'.
** It may be coincidential but appearance-wise Ayaka is similar to [[LightNovel/KaraNoKyoukai Shiki Ryougi]] minus the Mystic Eyes. This beomes more noticeable [[TheGlassesComeOff once she stops wearing glasses]].
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Misaya Reiroukan
* {{Expy}}: While Ayaka is the actual character prototype of Rin Tohsaka, Misaya is the prototype of the \\\'\\\'role\\\'\\\' Rin would later hold - which makes it amusing that Rin was saved by her canon\\\'s Lancer. At the same time, her [[spoiler: YourDaysAreNumbered status is seemingly carried over to the eventual fate of Illyasviel von Einzbern (homunculus with a limited lifespan)]].
** She even shares Rin\\\'s background as revealed in \\\'\\\'Fragments\\\'\\\': she\\\'s a haughty young lady with immense talent whose father was killed and betrayed by someone he trusted, and her mother dies sometime after the previous Grail War before Misaya participated in the next one.
----
The last sentence part basically invalidates this entire example... All it would be good for is Trivia as they have the same role but nothing else in common.
!!!Sancraid Phahn
* {{Expy}}: He would eventually evolve into the character of Kirei Kotomine, although \\\"the priest\\\" underwent the heaviest revisions of almost anyone out of the Proto cast on the way to \\\'\\\'F/SN\\\'\\\'; Kirei shares very few character elements with Sancraid.
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Manaka Sajyou
* {{Expy}}:
** She was split into Ilya [[note]]older than she looks, pale and cute but still dangerous and with a warped sense of affection[[/note]] and [[spoiler: Dark Sakura]] [[note]](connection to [[spoiler: the Grail]])[[/note]], and some parts of her backstory were incorporated into Kotomine[[note]](being revived [[spoiler: by the Grail]])[[/note]], [[LightNovel/KaraNoKyoukai Ryougi Shiki]] and [[VisualNovel/TsukiHime Aoko Aozaki]] [[note]](innate connection to the Root and having few but super efficient circuits, respectively)[[/note]].
** In a sense, she\\\'s also one for Altrouge Brunestud. Both have a \\\"sister\\\" they have a bad relationship with, and both act as the master [[spoiler:of a Beast]].
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Saber (King Arthur)
* {{Expy}}: He\\\'s more like Shirou than his female counterpart - he notably \\\'\\\'smiles\\\'\\\' at Ayaka when he\\\'s first summoned, and says he\\\'s there to protect her.[[note]]Compare the female Saber, who stoically asks Shirou if he is her Master. Significantly, [[AngstWhatAngst he also doesn\\\'t seem to have any lingering regrets about his rule of Britain]] unlike the \\\'\\\'VisualNovel/FateStayNight\\\'\\\' Saber, which harkens a lot more from Shirou in the \\\'\\\'Unlimited Blade Works\\\'\\\' route--[[TheAntiNihilist he may be less-naive about the world and heroism, but he holds on to his ideals anyway]]. [[/note]] He also has some traits in common with Archer and his relationship with Ayaka is even described as being similar to that of Rin and Archer - at least at first.
** He also holds shades of Kiritsugu Emiya [[spoiler:as it was his meeting with the young child who would become the next Grail War\\\'s \\\"Master of Saber\\\" that saved his heart.]]
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Archer (Gilgamesh)
* {{Expy}}:
** He\\\'s essentially a composite of \\\'\\\'two\\\'\\\' Archers from the final work: while he eventually mutated into the Gilgamesh we all know and love, he also has elements of the primary Archer, being a dual-wielder who makes an epic stand against Berserker.
** He also has a bit in common with [[VisualNovel/FateStayNight FSN-Lancer]], being a combat-lover and all.
----
This example also violates being an in-appearance-only Shinji even if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Rider (Perseus)
* {{Expy}}: Rider is a somewhat more complicated example than the other characters listed here, as it is unclear how much of his role in \\\'\\\'Old Fate\\\'\\\'[[note]]The original draft for both \\\'\\\'Stay Night\\\'\\\' and \\\'\\\'Prototype\\\'\\\' where his identity was originally Theseus.[[/note]]was preserved in \\\'\\\'Prototype\\\'\\\' and how much of it was taken from FSN-Rider due to his changed identity. What is apparent, however, is that he bares something of a resemblance to Shinji, notably his wavy hair, and how he\\\'s apparently someone that Ayaka is personally acquainted with but later ends up fighting during the Holy Grail War. In VisualNovel/FateHollowAtaraxia, Rider calls Perseus a successful version of Shinji, though its unclear how much of that is based on truth, and how much of it is Rider holding a grudge for him killing her, as unlike Shinji, Perseus is a genuine NiceGuy.
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!The Beast of Revelation
* {{Expy}}:
** Naturally, this is the character that eventually became Avenger Angra Mainyu. The biggest difference is that the Beast is the intentional product of the Grail, while Avenger corrupting the Grail was wholly unintentional.
** Furthermore, the concept of a \\\"Beast\\\" class which embodied a sin of humanity would lurk in the background of \\\'\\\'Fate\\\'\\\' works for a decade (and is even somewhat there in \\\'\\\'stay night\\\'\\\' and \\\'\\\'Hollow Ataraxia\\\'\\\'), before the concept returned in full in \\\'\\\'Fate/Grand Order\\\'\\\', to the point that Proto-Arthur\\\'s introduction to that game seems to be hinting at this Beast making an appearance there as well.
** Extra materials for Prototype reveal he\\\'s also the prototype for the being known as the Beast IV [[spoiler:Primate Murder and that both rule over primates]]. The biggest differences being that their appearances are not confirmed to be anything alike and that he two represent different sins. Later on however, both FGO and the final volume of Fragments later retcons it into being Beast VI.
----
This example would also be a Administrivia/ZeroContextExample. Appearances only don\\\'t fit an Expy, and looking \\\"a bit\\\" like someone else... isn\\\'t saying much anyway.
!!!Nigel Sayward (Master of Lancer)
* {{Expy}}: Appearance wise, he looks bit like [[LightNovel/KaraNoKyoukai Araya Souren]].
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Hiroki Sajyou
* {{Expy}}: He\\\'s the original concept of Kiritsugu Emiya, being the father of the main protagonist who died years before the story takes place. He also serves as one for [[LightNovel/FateZero Tokiomi Tohsaka]] as well since his relationship with his daughters somewhat resembles the one Tokiomi had with his.
Changed line(s) 1 from:
n
Nuked a bunch of {{Expy}} examples per [[https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13983140170A37263400&page=1#5 the official clean-up]] (Note: the discussion pages are broken as hell, so this link might be \
to:
Nuked a bunch of {{Expy}} examples per [[https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13983140170A37263400&page=1#5 the official clean-up]] (Note: the discussion pages are broken as hell, so this link might be \\\"broken\\\"; you can search the clean up thread or go to History -> find my working link of the cleanup thread when I deleted these examples).
There might be good content here still, even if it doesn\\\'t fit this trope; it might fit another trope or it might be good to put on the general Trivia tab for Trivia/FatePrototype as a non-troped bit of info.
For now, I retained Sky Silver Expy examples since they\\\'re arguably post-FSN in concept, but they might need to be expanded with context added to fit the {{Expy}} requirement list linked in the cleanup thread.
All these older characters who are literally prototypes for newer ones that got published can\\\'t be Expies:
----
This example is also a problem because Expies are supposed to have only one influence. I doubt \\\'\\\'any\\\'\\\' of this example is salvageable, it basically just says \\\"there were ideas and they were used elsewhere in the final product\\\". Also, the last bullet point is probably just a coincidence as it admits.
!!!Ayaka Sajyou
* {{Expy}}: Ayaka basically serves as the basis for the three main Masters of FSN: Shirou, Rin, and Sakura. To wit;
** Much like Shirou, she\\\'s the Master of Saber, one of the strongest Servants in the Holy Grail War, who also happened to serve a relative of theirs in the past war. Arthur is also hampered by the fact that Ayaka is one of the weakest Masters, same way how Artoria is hampered by Shirou\\\'s own ineptitude as a Master. Outside of their story roles, she\\\'s also a specialist type of magus whose talent lies in a field of magecraft that is considered basics for most magi [[note]]Projection for Shirou, Formalcraft for Ayaka[[/note]] and both only really discover said talent through someone spurring them on. [[note]]EMIYA and Arthur respectively[[/note]]
** In regards to Rin, she\\\'s the daughter of a magus family that was torn apart thanks to the past Holy Grail War, ending up an orphan as a result and living in BigFancyHouse by herself all the while being acquainted with a Catholic Priest who later turns on her. Physically, she and Rin even look similar to each other. The latter even wears glasses at times, increasing said resemblance. Both also use \\\"magic bullet\\\" like attacks [[note]]Gandr shots for Rin, Black Feathers for Ayaka[[/note]] and live a dual life of being a struggling magus and a student. It\\\'s even stated in material that Ayaka\\\'s initial relationship with Saber resembles the one Rin would have with Archer. It\\\'s also worth noting that both girls are {{Tsundere}} towards their respective love interests, especially when Ayaka\\\'s glasses are off.
** As for Sakura, Ayaka happens to be the second daughter of her family much like her and has low self-esteem thanks to her much more talented older sister. Ayaka also gets sick at one point, much like how Sakura gets sick during \\\'\\\'Heaven\\\'s Feel\\\'\\\'.
** It may be coincidential but appearance-wise Ayaka is similar to [[LightNovel/KaraNoKyoukai Shiki Ryougi]] minus the Mystic Eyes. This beomes more noticeable [[TheGlassesComeOff once she stops wearing glasses]].
----
This example would also be poorly formatted (ExampleIndentation) if it were legit since it\\\'s one big example that should be merged. She\\\'s an older character who gets turned into Rin anyway.
!!!Misaya Reiroukan
* {{Expy}}: While Ayaka is the actual character prototype of Rin Tohsaka, Misaya is the prototype of the \\\'\\\'role\\\'\\\' Rin would later hold - which makes it amusing that Rin was saved by her canon\\\'s Lancer. At the same time, her [[spoiler: YourDaysAreNumbered status is seemingly carried over to the eventual fate of Illyasviel von Einzbern (homunculus with a limited lifespan)]].
** She even shares Rin\\\'s background as revealed in \\\'\\\'Fragments\\\'\\\': she\\\'s a haughty young lady with immense talent whose father was killed and betrayed by someone he trusted, and her mother dies sometime after the previous Grail War before Misaya participated in the next one.
----
The last sentence part basically invalidates this entire example... All it would be good for is Trivia as they have the same role but nothing else in common.
!!!Sancraid Phahn
* {{Expy}}: He would eventually evolve into the character of Kirei Kotomine, although \\\"the priest\\\" underwent the heaviest revisions of almost anyone out of the Proto cast on the way to \\\'\\\'F/SN\\\'\\\'; Kirei shares very few character elements with Sancraid.
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Manaka Sajyou
* {{Expy}}:
** She was split into Ilya [[note]]older than she looks, pale and cute but still dangerous and with a warped sense of affection[[/note]] and [[spoiler: Dark Sakura]] [[note]](connection to [[spoiler: the Grail]])[[/note]], and some parts of her backstory were incorporated into Kotomine[[note]](being revived [[spoiler: by the Grail]])[[/note]], [[LightNovel/KaraNoKyoukai Ryougi Shiki]] and [[VisualNovel/TsukiHime Aoko Aozaki]] [[note]](innate connection to the Root and having few but super efficient circuits, respectively)[[/note]].
** In a sense, she\\\'s also one for Altrouge Brunestud. Both have a \\\"sister\\\" they have a bad relationship with, and both act as the master [[spoiler:of a Beast]].
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Saber (King Arthur)
* {{Expy}}: He\\\'s more like Shirou than his female counterpart - he notably \\\'\\\'smiles\\\'\\\' at Ayaka when he\\\'s first summoned, and says he\\\'s there to protect her.[[note]]Compare the female Saber, who stoically asks Shirou if he is her Master. Significantly, [[AngstWhatAngst he also doesn\\\'t seem to have any lingering regrets about his rule of Britain]] unlike the \\\'\\\'VisualNovel/FateStayNight\\\'\\\' Saber, which harkens a lot more from Shirou in the \\\'\\\'Unlimited Blade Works\\\'\\\' route--[[TheAntiNihilist he may be less-naive about the world and heroism, but he holds on to his ideals anyway]]. [[/note]] He also has some traits in common with Archer and his relationship with Ayaka is even described as being similar to that of Rin and Archer - at least at first.
** He also holds shades of Kiritsugu Emiya [[spoiler:as it was his meeting with the young child who would become the next Grail War\\\'s \\\"Master of Saber\\\" that saved his heart.]]
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Archer (Gilgamesh)
* {{Expy}}:
** He\\\'s essentially a composite of \\\'\\\'two\\\'\\\' Archers from the final work: while he eventually mutated into the Gilgamesh we all know and love, he also has elements of the primary Archer, being a dual-wielder who makes an epic stand against Berserker.
** He also has a bit in common with [[VisualNovel/FateStayNight FSN-Lancer]], being a combat-lover and all.
----
This example also violates being an in-appearance-only Shinji even if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Rider (Perseus)
* {{Expy}}: Rider is a somewhat more complicated example than the other characters listed here, as it is unclear how much of his role in \\\'\\\'Old Fate\\\'\\\'[[note]]The original draft for both \\\'\\\'Stay Night\\\'\\\' and \\\'\\\'Prototype\\\'\\\' where his identity was originally Theseus.[[/note]]was preserved in \\\'\\\'Prototype\\\'\\\' and how much of it was taken from FSN-Rider due to his changed identity. What is apparent, however, is that he bares something of a resemblance to Shinji, notably his wavy hair, and how he\\\'s apparently someone that Ayaka is personally acquainted with but later ends up fighting during the Holy Grail War. In VisualNovel/FateHollowAtaraxia, Rider calls Perseus a successful version of Shinji, though its unclear how much of that is based on truth, and how much of it is Rider holding a grudge for him killing her, as unlike Shinji, Perseus is a genuine NiceGuy.
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!The Beast of Revelation
* {{Expy}}:
** Naturally, this is the character that eventually became Avenger Angra Mainyu. The biggest difference is that the Beast is the intentional product of the Grail, while Avenger corrupting the Grail was wholly unintentional.
** Furthermore, the concept of a \\\"Beast\\\" class which embodied a sin of humanity would lurk in the background of \\\'\\\'Fate\\\'\\\' works for a decade (and is even somewhat there in \\\'\\\'stay night\\\'\\\' and \\\'\\\'Hollow Ataraxia\\\'\\\'), before the concept returned in full in \\\'\\\'Fate/Grand Order\\\'\\\', to the point that Proto-Arthur\\\'s introduction to that game seems to be hinting at this Beast making an appearance there as well.
** Extra materials for Prototype reveal he\\\'s also the prototype for the being known as the Beast IV [[spoiler:Primate Murder and that both rule over primates]]. The biggest differences being that their appearances are not confirmed to be anything alike and that he two represent different sins. Later on however, both FGO and the final volume of Fragments later retcons it into being Beast VI.
----
This example would also be a Administrivia/ZeroContextExample. Appearances only don\\\'t fit an Expy, and looking \\\"a bit\\\" like someone else... isn\\\'t saying much anyway.
!!!Nigel Sayward (Master of Lancer)
* {{Expy}}: Appearance wise, he looks bit like [[LightNovel/KaraNoKyoukai Araya Souren]].
----
This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Hiroki Sajyou
* {{Expy}}: He\\\'s the original concept of Kiritsugu Emiya, being the father of the main protagonist who died years before the story takes place. He also serves as one for [[LightNovel/FateZero Tokiomi Tohsaka]] as well since his relationship with his daughters somewhat resembles the one Tokiomi had with his.
There might be good content here still, even if it doesn\\\'t fit this trope; it might fit another trope or it might be good to put on the general Trivia tab for Trivia/FatePrototype as a non-troped bit of info.
For now, I retained Sky Silver Expy examples since they\\\'re arguably post-FSN in concept, but they might need to be expanded with context added to fit the {{Expy}} requirement list linked in the cleanup thread.
All these older characters who are literally prototypes for newer ones that got published can\\\'t be Expies:
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This example is also a problem because Expies are supposed to have only one influence. I doubt \\\'\\\'any\\\'\\\' of this example is salvageable, it basically just says \\\"there were ideas and they were used elsewhere in the final product\\\". Also, the last bullet point is probably just a coincidence as it admits.
!!!Ayaka Sajyou
* {{Expy}}: Ayaka basically serves as the basis for the three main Masters of FSN: Shirou, Rin, and Sakura. To wit;
** Much like Shirou, she\\\'s the Master of Saber, one of the strongest Servants in the Holy Grail War, who also happened to serve a relative of theirs in the past war. Arthur is also hampered by the fact that Ayaka is one of the weakest Masters, same way how Artoria is hampered by Shirou\\\'s own ineptitude as a Master. Outside of their story roles, she\\\'s also a specialist type of magus whose talent lies in a field of magecraft that is considered basics for most magi [[note]]Projection for Shirou, Formalcraft for Ayaka[[/note]] and both only really discover said talent through someone spurring them on. [[note]]EMIYA and Arthur respectively[[/note]]
** In regards to Rin, she\\\'s the daughter of a magus family that was torn apart thanks to the past Holy Grail War, ending up an orphan as a result and living in BigFancyHouse by herself all the while being acquainted with a Catholic Priest who later turns on her. Physically, she and Rin even look similar to each other. The latter even wears glasses at times, increasing said resemblance. Both also use \\\"magic bullet\\\" like attacks [[note]]Gandr shots for Rin, Black Feathers for Ayaka[[/note]] and live a dual life of being a struggling magus and a student. It\\\'s even stated in material that Ayaka\\\'s initial relationship with Saber resembles the one Rin would have with Archer. It\\\'s also worth noting that both girls are {{Tsundere}} towards their respective love interests, especially when Ayaka\\\'s glasses are off.
** As for Sakura, Ayaka happens to be the second daughter of her family much like her and has low self-esteem thanks to her much more talented older sister. Ayaka also gets sick at one point, much like how Sakura gets sick during \\\'\\\'Heaven\\\'s Feel\\\'\\\'.
** It may be coincidential but appearance-wise Ayaka is similar to [[LightNovel/KaraNoKyoukai Shiki Ryougi]] minus the Mystic Eyes. This beomes more noticeable [[TheGlassesComeOff once she stops wearing glasses]].
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This example would also be poorly formatted (ExampleIndentation) if it were legit since it\\\'s one big example that should be merged. She\\\'s an older character who gets turned into Rin anyway.
!!!Misaya Reiroukan
* {{Expy}}: While Ayaka is the actual character prototype of Rin Tohsaka, Misaya is the prototype of the \\\'\\\'role\\\'\\\' Rin would later hold - which makes it amusing that Rin was saved by her canon\\\'s Lancer. At the same time, her [[spoiler: YourDaysAreNumbered status is seemingly carried over to the eventual fate of Illyasviel von Einzbern (homunculus with a limited lifespan)]].
** She even shares Rin\\\'s background as revealed in \\\'\\\'Fragments\\\'\\\': she\\\'s a haughty young lady with immense talent whose father was killed and betrayed by someone he trusted, and her mother dies sometime after the previous Grail War before Misaya participated in the next one.
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The last sentence part basically invalidates this entire example... All it would be good for is Trivia as they have the same role but nothing else in common.
!!!Sancraid Phahn
* {{Expy}}: He would eventually evolve into the character of Kirei Kotomine, although \\\"the priest\\\" underwent the heaviest revisions of almost anyone out of the Proto cast on the way to \\\'\\\'F/SN\\\'\\\'; Kirei shares very few character elements with Sancraid.
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This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Manaka Sajyou
* {{Expy}}:
** She was split into Ilya [[note]]older than she looks, pale and cute but still dangerous and with a warped sense of affection[[/note]] and [[spoiler: Dark Sakura]] [[note]](connection to [[spoiler: the Grail]])[[/note]], and some parts of her backstory were incorporated into Kotomine[[note]](being revived [[spoiler: by the Grail]])[[/note]], [[LightNovel/KaraNoKyoukai Ryougi Shiki]] and [[VisualNovel/TsukiHime Aoko Aozaki]] [[note]](innate connection to the Root and having few but super efficient circuits, respectively)[[/note]].
** In a sense, she\\\'s also one for Altrouge Brunestud. Both have a \\\"sister\\\" they have a bad relationship with, and both act as the master [[spoiler:of a Beast]].
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This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Saber (King Arthur)
* {{Expy}}: He\\\'s more like Shirou than his female counterpart - he notably \\\'\\\'smiles\\\'\\\' at Ayaka when he\\\'s first summoned, and says he\\\'s there to protect her.[[note]]Compare the female Saber, who stoically asks Shirou if he is her Master. Significantly, [[AngstWhatAngst he also doesn\\\'t seem to have any lingering regrets about his rule of Britain]] unlike the \\\'\\\'VisualNovel/FateStayNight\\\'\\\' Saber, which harkens a lot more from Shirou in the \\\'\\\'Unlimited Blade Works\\\'\\\' route--[[TheAntiNihilist he may be less-naive about the world and heroism, but he holds on to his ideals anyway]]. [[/note]] He also has some traits in common with Archer and his relationship with Ayaka is even described as being similar to that of Rin and Archer - at least at first.
** He also holds shades of Kiritsugu Emiya [[spoiler:as it was his meeting with the young child who would become the next Grail War\\\'s \\\"Master of Saber\\\" that saved his heart.]]
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This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Archer (Gilgamesh)
* {{Expy}}:
** He\\\'s essentially a composite of \\\'\\\'two\\\'\\\' Archers from the final work: while he eventually mutated into the Gilgamesh we all know and love, he also has elements of the primary Archer, being a dual-wielder who makes an epic stand against Berserker.
** He also has a bit in common with [[VisualNovel/FateStayNight FSN-Lancer]], being a combat-lover and all.
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This example also violates being an in-appearance-only Shinji even if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Rider (Perseus)
* {{Expy}}: Rider is a somewhat more complicated example than the other characters listed here, as it is unclear how much of his role in \\\'\\\'Old Fate\\\'\\\'[[note]]The original draft for both \\\'\\\'Stay Night\\\'\\\' and \\\'\\\'Prototype\\\'\\\' where his identity was originally Theseus.[[/note]]was preserved in \\\'\\\'Prototype\\\'\\\' and how much of it was taken from FSN-Rider due to his changed identity. What is apparent, however, is that he bares something of a resemblance to Shinji, notably his wavy hair, and how he\\\'s apparently someone that Ayaka is personally acquainted with but later ends up fighting during the Holy Grail War. In VisualNovel/FateHollowAtaraxia, Rider calls Perseus a successful version of Shinji, though its unclear how much of that is based on truth, and how much of it is Rider holding a grudge for him killing her, as unlike Shinji, Perseus is a genuine NiceGuy.
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This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!The Beast of Revelation
* {{Expy}}:
** Naturally, this is the character that eventually became Avenger Angra Mainyu. The biggest difference is that the Beast is the intentional product of the Grail, while Avenger corrupting the Grail was wholly unintentional.
** Furthermore, the concept of a \\\"Beast\\\" class which embodied a sin of humanity would lurk in the background of \\\'\\\'Fate\\\'\\\' works for a decade (and is even somewhat there in \\\'\\\'stay night\\\'\\\' and \\\'\\\'Hollow Ataraxia\\\'\\\'), before the concept returned in full in \\\'\\\'Fate/Grand Order\\\'\\\', to the point that Proto-Arthur\\\'s introduction to that game seems to be hinting at this Beast making an appearance there as well.
** Extra materials for Prototype reveal he\\\'s also the prototype for the being known as the Beast IV [[spoiler:Primate Murder and that both rule over primates]]. The biggest differences being that their appearances are not confirmed to be anything alike and that he two represent different sins. Later on however, both FGO and the final volume of Fragments later retcons it into being Beast VI.
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This example would also be a Administrivia/ZeroContextExample. Appearances only don\\\'t fit an Expy, and looking \\\"a bit\\\" like someone else... isn\\\'t saying much anyway.
!!!Nigel Sayward (Master of Lancer)
* {{Expy}}: Appearance wise, he looks bit like [[LightNovel/KaraNoKyoukai Araya Souren]].
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This example also violates multiple influences if it were even a newer character copying an older one.
!!!Hiroki Sajyou
* {{Expy}}: He\\\'s the original concept of Kiritsugu Emiya, being the father of the main protagonist who died years before the story takes place. He also serves as one for [[LightNovel/FateZero Tokiomi Tohsaka]] as well since his relationship with his daughters somewhat resembles the one Tokiomi had with his.
