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KuroFox Forum lurking fox from under a rock Since: Jun, 2010
Forum lurking fox
#51: Oct 7th 2010 at 8:30:01 PM

I have to say even the most blatant excuse plot is a lot better than the Pac Man Fever games started from. So yes, it has evolved. There has been ups and downs and some epics and not so epics.

Think of Final Fantasy, starting off with no more than "save princess, seek sages, retrieve Plot Coupons and defeat evil as four Hello, [Insert Name Here] heroes" to a spikey haired, clinically insane protagonist (he gets better though) and then to a more complex and elaborate world ultimately run by a fake religion.

Jsut an example of the development of writing for games. Of course we still get some poorly made up excuse to have a mindless slaughterfest for fun. Like Team Fortress 2. And still people love it cos they do it right, with Rule of Funny.

edited 7th Oct '10 8:31:42 PM by KuroFox

Sonic hates SOPA
Desertopa Not Actually Indie Since: Jan, 2001
Not Actually Indie
#52: Oct 7th 2010 at 9:23:34 PM

Think of Final Fantasy, starting off with no more than "save princess, seek sages, retrieve Plot Coupons and defeat evil as four Hello Insert Name Here heroes" to a spikey haired, clinically insane protagonist (he gets better though) and then to a more complex and elaborate world ultimately run by a fake religion.

I don't think of the last of those was really a step forward. Manipulative false religions had been done before Final Fantasy VII, let alone X, and I wouldn't call X's world more complex or elaborate, it just had a more distant backstory. X did have a bit of novel stuff with regards to characterization, but I don't think the gap from VII to X represents a real development in storytelling.

You know what I liked in VII, which I thought added appreciably to the experience of the game, and pretty much died out after a brief stint in VIII? The minigames. Not the optional sidequest stuff, but the brief tasks you're required to do every once in a while that deviate from normal gameplay. Some of them were a bit contrived, particularly when they shoehorned in prizes for performance, but it had two useful functions. First, it enhances the sense that you're not just controlling a guy who walks around, talks to people and kills stuff; the journey has variety, and you are a participant in it. Second, it allows them to throw curveballs at the player. When Cloud reaches Aeris in the City of Ancients, for instance, and you start struggling for control of your character, you have the sense that this is another task you're being confronted with as a player, not just another piece of story you're watching, and you're screwing up. It helps set up the sense of confusion and futility for the coming scene. Shortly after, in the town before the glacier, Elena says she's going to hit you, you get instructions on how to dodge it, and Cloud does nothing, and it's clear that it's because he thinks he deserves it.

Stuff like this is a major component of video game writing. The creators need to be keenly aware of what kind of medium they're working with, and how to best convey the story they're making in terms of that medium.

edited 7th Oct '10 9:25:38 PM by Desertopa

...eventually, we will reach a maximum entropy state where nobody has their own socks or underwear, or knows who to ask to get them back.
WORLDTree Since: Dec, 1969
#53: Oct 8th 2010 at 1:49:50 PM

I never really got the analogy of moving "set pieces", for some games yes but that could be applied to any game that has you move to any distanced destination form the beginning, weather or not they insert dialogue or cut-scenes at certain points they have to put progression in somewhere, having a structured storyline isn't that bad as it allows the author to build the story carefully and avoid plot holes or errors while having more freedom to insert details you're not going to miss.

Cidolfas Since: Jan, 2001
#54: Oct 11th 2010 at 6:47:13 AM

Frankly, I can't say I'm ever bothered by "mashups". Maybe it's because I never studied the various time periods enough to care, but none of the things you complain about in FF 12 / FF Tactics bothered me in the least. Probably because it's a made up world and they can damn well write what they please as long as it sounds good - and it did, certainly better than the silliness that often passes for dialogue in JRPG's. There's actual metaphor and idiom in there that makes you use your brain slightly.

Nikkolas from Texas Since: Dec, 2009 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#55: Oct 11th 2010 at 8:17:40 AM

I may not be a video game guru or anything but one of my favorite series generally seems to be regarded as having some of the best writing in gaming history.

I also agree with the mention of the first Xenosaga game. I liked 3's story but something seemed off in its overall presentation. Episode 1 on the other hand, was flawless IMO. Well in terms of storytelling.

edited 11th Oct '10 8:20:13 AM by Nikkolas

Desertopa Not Actually Indie Since: Jan, 2001
Not Actually Indie
#56: Oct 11th 2010 at 4:54:13 PM

Maybe it's because I never studied the various time periods enough to care, but none of the things you complain about in FF 12 / FF Tactics bothered me in the least. Probably because it's a made up world and they can damn well write what they please as long as it sounds good - and it did, certainly better than the silliness that often passes for dialogue in JRPG's. There's actual metaphor and idiom in there that makes you use your brain slightly.

For a made up world, I generally find Translation Convention most tasteful. Throwing in real world accents willy nilly without consideration to whether they fit thematically makes them sound pretentious and affected. There was metaphor and idiom in the dialogue, but I thought it lacked verisimilitude.

...eventually, we will reach a maximum entropy state where nobody has their own socks or underwear, or knows who to ask to get them back.
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