Split or Expand: : Cargo Cult

The description and examples for Cargo Cult are really messed up. The description says that cargo cults are NOT an example of the Cargo Cult trope, despite being the source of the trope name, which is confusing as heck. Instead, the trope is supposed to be about characters encountering a society that mistakes them for gods. Despite the description, the examples include actual cargo cults as well as characters being mistaken for gods.

Two possible solutions:

1. Expand the definition of Cargo Cult to include actual cargo cults.

2. Keep the actual examples of cargo cults under Cargo Cult, and create a new trope page for the examples in which characters get mistaken for gods. Mistaken for Gods currently already exists as a redirect to Cargo Cult, so we could make that into a separate page.

Expanding is easier, and the two types of situation are similar - they both arise from characters encountering a new society, which then interprets their arrival according to their mystical beliefs. On the other hand, they're not the same thing - real life cargo cultists generally didn't believe their visitors were gods.

Splitting has the advantage of being more descriptive. There's a real distinction, and it's pretty easy to explain the difference between the two types of situation. On the other hand, are the two sufficiently similar that we'll end up with examples continually being added to the wrong pages?

Any thoughts on what the best course of action would be?

edited 26th Sep '10 8:29:16 PM by StarshipTroper

Split it. Cargo Cult is a well established outside-the-wiki term with a clearly defined meaning. We shouldn't use it for something else, especially if we then add a statement proving that we know we're using it wrong.

Outsiders mistaken for Gods is something else again entirely, and only rarely does it even overlap with a cargo cult. It's also been around as a trope since long before cargo cults — The Man Who Would Be King by Rudyard Kipling immediately springs to mind. It was written 60 years before the first cargo cult sprang up.

OK, that makes sense. This is the first time I've proposed something like this - do I now need to create a page action crowner to vote on this, or does that only apply when there are people arguing about what to do? If not, I'll go ahead with the changes.

We need to see whether there are more then two people who care, I've made a Page Action Crowner and hooked it to this thread... Now we wait and see if anyone else cares.

\*sigh* this trope is really confusing. If you have a look on the Other Wiki page on cargo cult (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cargo_cult) you'll see that neither of the proposed explanations is right. Cargo cult is when a tribe uses it's usual magic practices to get the "wealth" of the advanced culture. Like if they want a car, and they pray for the gods to provide it.
What we have on the Cargo Cult page are basicaly these three types of examples:

1. group A believes that group B are gods
2. group A believes that object C was made by gods
3. heroes encounter group A and the group thinks the heroes are gods

I guess we could consider 1 and 2 as the same trope, and make a new one for 3 (the redirect, Mistaken for Gods, is probably the best title).
As for the "original" trope, Cargo Cult is misleading to anyone who knows the usual meaning. And it doesn't describe the trope anyway... wouldn't something like False Gods work better?

Got a link to the crowner? I also vote for splitting it.

I've just looked through the examples. The vast majority of them fall under "Outsiders Mistaken For Gods". Aside from those, I count 7 examples of actual cargo cults (or ones that sound like they might possibly be examples - I've extended large amounts of benefit-of-the-doubt to some of them).

There are also:

• 6 examples that are like Lost Technology, except that the society considers the ancient technology sacred rather than just something their ancestors helpfully left lying around. They may be able to operate the technology, but they will do it by ritual rather by understanding. Should we lump these under Lost Technology?
• 5 examples of worshipping artefacts from another civilisation.
• 3 examples of the writings of an ordinary person being mistaken for holy scripture. This sounds like it should be a trope of its own - anyone know if we've got a page for it?
• 2 examples of worshipping a small annoying alien creature/thing. These might arguably also count as "Outsiders Mistaken For Gods".
• 2 examples that are just religions from cultures that have limited understanding of the wider world.

Do any of those sound like they should fit under another, existing trope?

Additionally, there were:

• 3 examples that were other tropes entirely (which I've just removed).
• 4 examples with too little description for me even to guess how to categorise them.

edited 3rd Oct '10 8:27:47 PM by StarshipTroper

Hi Anna The Crow,

Your types 1 and 3 sound very similar, differing only in whether it's the hero or someone else in the story being mistaken for a god. Have I understood? I think they're alike enough to stay on the same page, if so.

Thanks for the link to the article on the Other Wiki. According to that, a few Real Life cargo cults also worship real individuals from the outsider culture. The article says that some cults worship "certain Americans ... as the spiritual entity who will provide the cargo to them in the future". It also calls the Prince Philip Movement a cargo cult, as it has a clear connection with the John Frum cults, but the worship of Prince Philip would fit the "Outsiders Mistaken For Gods" category. If we split the pages, we should probably note briefly somewhere that a few cults are examples of both.

There's no mention of any cargo cults that worshipped the high-tech items themselves (as in your type 2). Not sure what to do with the fictional examples of this - your suggestion of putting them with the type 1 examples is a possibility (maybe giving them their own subsection of the page?). Your "False Gods" idea also sounds promising for this. "Inanimate Object God"? "False Idol"?

You're right that, however you look at it, the current page description is indeed FUBAR.

Not sure how coherent this post is; I am very sleepy.

P.S. batgirl 1: Did you find the crowner? Madrugada attached it to the bottom of the thread.

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