Kingdom Hearts

Pfft as if he could change anything. He'a a moron given a task that would keep things on track. Even attempting to defy fate plays into Mo M hands as Maleficent and the Virus learn when their attempts were foiled the moment they tried.

I mean, he's the least moronic of the apprentices, the rest of them are straight up incompetent with their heads in the sand pretending nothing is wrong.

Ira does know something is wrong, but he doesn't know how to change that. Mo M even told him straight to his face you can't change fate.

Aceds letting his lust for power get to his head over everything, because he wants to be the leader and says whatever he thinks will make that happen. But him supposedly being not a moron when he just says what he thinks will get him what he wants is a lie, as all politicians are known to blatantly state things they don't believe to get what they desire.

And what he wanted was to be the leader, which again, was part of his role and he played it perfectly.

Ava was not the worst person there. Aced's plan wasn't any different than Xehanorts, and was super authoritarian to boot.

"Give me all the power, and I'll sweep aside your squabbling ineffectual Government Union Leaders and fight back the Enemy!"

Nope. Aced was clearly the worst.

Plus, Ava for all her faults wasn't the most ineffective leader (Ira), and wasn't doing a job predicated on spying on everyone (Invi and Gula). Plus, she succeeded.

She followed her heart. As Luxu said, she had a job to do and she did it.

Edited by AzurePaladin on Apr 15th 2019 at 7:01:42 AM

Yeah her job to form the Dandelions, but also her job to be the one who causes the Clock Tower to chime out and kickstart the war of child murder, which she of course immediately regrets upon realizing she started it, and then goes to the battle to kill children.

Ira straight up resists doing something about it because he's a brainwashed little toadie resigned to his own incompetence and still won't let go of his power.

Aced is supposed to be the straightforward and honest one, so belligerent as he is I don't doubt that he believed what he was doing was right and that it wasn't a power grab to stroke his own vanity. They are all puppets dancing on the strings of Master dick in a hood but his willingness to defy his teachings to try and salvage the situation earns him points for me.

I mean Ava's job was to do that and she outright resists doing things to try and stop the war because she believes the master would never let things happen because she's also a brainwashed little toadie. That said, that she refuses the Luxu's call in III leads me to believe that she'll at least see that she messed up in trusting him.

It doesn't matter if it was for vanity or not, Aced was not the right choice for leader. The Mo M even warned him that wanting to be leader wasn't good enough, but he ignored that.

Ava's indecisiveness was a factor in the war starting, but lets not pretend that she's the main culprit here. Out of all of them, she arguably had the least role in starting the war, and depending on how you interpret her intervention in Aced's two attempted assassinations, helped stop it breaking out early.

Edited by AzurePaladin on Apr 15th 2019 at 7:17:49 AM

Ava isn't around for the surprise reveal of what shes doing for daddy Mo M as the Fox piece is there amongst them. If she also doesn't have amnesia.

And Aced didn't care about defying the fate written if he thought it would let him rose to power, because his greed is what motivates him. That's why he was fine with the War because he saw it as his chance to take over and rule in the end.

The Master gave them roles they were unsuited for, and Aced trying to become the Leader at every opportunity was playing into the flaw that no he isn'f leader material but he wanfs to rule and he doesn't care how he gets it.

I mean his plan was sound so he seems right to me. I'm sure things would fall appart since You Can't Thwart Stage One but he is trying to do something instead of passively letting the foretellers drive the world into ruin.

Also, the war couldn't break out yet then because Kingdom Hearts could not be summoned without gathering enough Lux first.

Edited by lycropath on Apr 15th 2019 at 4:31:47 AM

You're right, it wouldn't start over Lux. It would start because the leadership was killing eachother. I don't know how the Unions would have taken it if one guy tried killing/exiling the other leaders and announcing himself sole ruler.

Okay, so the secret movie implies Riku will be seeking to find Sora. Thing is, at no point is it implied he will be successful. What if Riku winds up needing saving (whether by Kairi or someone else)?

Lux is needed to summon Kingdom Hearts, that's the point of gathering it. Without Kingdom Hearts the apocalyptic event of the Keyblade War can't start. Blood might be shed over the change of leadership but its not going to say drive the universe to the brink of extinction.

Edited by lycropath on Apr 15th 2019 at 4:29:28 AM

I still want to know why & how Sora manage to get transported to Shibuya. And why so many people are convince he's in the The World Ends with You. Not that it's all that hard to believe but surely Square has more than one game series that involves modern day Japan.

Okay, my bad. I hold, however, that she was not the most culpable in that mess. Aced drove most of the conflict that lead Gula to try summoning Kingdom Hearts. Gula and Invi caused much of the suspicion by spying, and Ira was an incompetent leader that made all of the above issues worse.

Who knows if he's even there yet? Remember, the first game had Roxas battling Riku at Memories Skyscraper, and Riku had yet to even go through Castle Oblivion yet.

Edited by AzurePaladin on Apr 15th 2019 at 7:38:05 AM

I don't think Ava is the most responsible either. I mean she's a toadie but she's just a kid too.

Damn. So not fans of the Foretellers huh?

You guys are brutal.

You're not wrong, but you're brutal.

There isn't a lot likable about them

yeah that could be endgame stuff for the next main game with them trying to find and/or stop Mo M. it could be 5 minutes into the next game sora just kinda fades in and luxords card disappears from his hand

the foretellers are a bunch of dumb furries following onto every word of a troll with no original thoughts for the most part

Edited by Deadpoolrocks on Apr 15th 2019 at 5:01:26 AM

I actually found them all compelling! They were well written (except for Aced's sudden shift from "you all betrayed us" to "I'm a wanna be dictator now"), in the sense that they were distinct characters whose flaws brought upon the apocalypse when they went unchecked.

Having said that, no, none of them are exactly paragons of light. Even Ava fought in the Keyblade War alongside her personal army, and she was the least inclined to do so. They were a mixture of incompetent, indecisive, inexperienced, and ill-suited to the jobs which they had been given.

So, I'm a fan in the sense of "I want to see more of them" rather than "I think this character is one I actually like".

Edited by AzurePaladin on Apr 15th 2019 at 8:09:21 AM

I think the question of "Which Foreteller is really the bad guy responsible for the Keyblade War?" is missing an important point.

They all are. And more poignantly, none of them are. Because the real bad guy responsible for the Keyblade War is the Master of Masters, a man who literally wrote the book on how the world will end, then assigned them all tasks meant to ensure it comes about.

Everything that happens from the moment he gives them their Roles, all of that is just the tumbling of the dominoes he carefully set up.

Ira is a weak and ineffectual leader. This is because Ira is a person ill-suited to leadership, and the Master made him the leader anyway to ensure a challenge to the throne.

Aced challenges the throne. This is because the Master literally told him, it is his Role within the grand plan, that if Ira sucks as a leader, Aced is to dethrone him and seize control of the group.

Invi, Gula, Ava, Luxu, they're all just doing their part. Performing their Role. Trying to unmake the Keyblade War while unknowingly performing the actions that bring it about, as the Master of Masters foresaw. None of them is "the person responsible for dooming the world", because that person is the guy that saw the doom of the world, wrote an extensive volume of the events that lead to it, and then only gave parts of it to his people to ensure it comes about.

The Foretellers, each and every one, were played for suckers because they trusted the Master of Masters. And for all their failings, it should not be forgotten that they screwed up and doomed the world because they were each fulfilling their designated role. And their roles are terrible.

Which is why I'm not really inclined to weigh in on the question, "Which poor sap fulfilling their shitty role, fulfilled their shitty role the shittiest?" Everyone in the Age of Faerie Tales is a victim of the Master's machinations, so far as I'm concerned. Foretellers included.

The reason I think Aced is a Heel–Face Turn risk is because out of everyone who get flipped over and f*cked sideways by trusting the Master, he's the one who seems the angriest about it, at least in KHIII's ending. The one most likely to want to shove a brick down the Master's throat. And since shoving a brick down the Master's throat is a good thing, I think he might turn.

That's just typical Aced rather than anything meaningful. Getting angry over something.

I'm down for the new saga being the Foretellers vs the Master of Masters.

Foretellers in an all out war against each other

just like last time!

I totally expect all the Foretellers to be like I Did What I Had to Do and Sora to be there going, "Yeah, but did you, though? Have to, I mean?"

He'll only understand about 10% of anything that actually happened but it'll be an Armor-Piercing Question all the same.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Apr 16th 2019 at 8:24:08 AM

Sora trying to stop the fighting e

"You guys can't just start killing each other!"

"Why not?"

"Because I said so!"