Pokémon General Thread

You have to the freedom to be be snippy, but I don’t really have a horse in this race. It just sticks out as a simple way to pass a legitimacy test, due to how egg outcomes were predetermined (from what I remember) in Gen 6 & 7. Plus not picking up on something that should have been an impossible combination is another question on how this works.

Honestly just highlights why some people aren’t bothered by genning.

I don’t think you’d even need to do that.

Edited by Cross on Jun 4th 2023 at 8:06:25 AM

‘My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.’

I feel like we got a bit off course...lets re-center back to the original topic with bonus context: How badly the Korean TTPC division messed up the tournaments to the point that people brought these mons in the first place

To add on what was mentioned a few pages ago, the tournaments to qualify were a buggy mess, people were only told it was a qualifier after the fact in a previous year, the accommodations were poor, and theres been backlash across multiple eastern regions and champions.

With this added context....Okay I see now why they went to go this route. Usually when public outcry isnt enough forcing a spotlight by doing some drastic tends to be a good alternative. the collusion was the whole point, because everything about how TPCK handled things was so awful it might as well have been left to chance. There was no intergrity to keep with the sport because everything prior to was tarnished already.

Edit: removed allusions to genning since at this point in time, no hacked pokemon were present.

Edited by CountofBleck on Jun 4th 2023 at 8:33:32 AM

Look, if people wanna spend hours of their life building teams for Pokemon, be my guest, I won't stop or judge you. Me personally? I got better things to do than spend hours grinding a team if I can get done in 30 minutes what would normally take hours to accomplish.

Work smarter, not harder. Ethics don't really matter in a competition, just whoever is the winner.

Edited by BlackYakuzu94 on Jun 4th 2023 at 8:11:18 AM

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.

It is a bit of an issue with the Paradoxes, as those frolicking around Area Zero have random I Vs, and finding a shiny one with 6 perfect I Vs and optimal nature is basically unbeatable luck. Breedable Pokemon can be easily bred into optimal I Vs and Natures, and legendaries come with a few perfect I Vs ever since gen VI. But Paradoxes have no way of getting warranted I Vs, beyond the Earth titan having 30 across the board, and the rare raid Paradox Donphans that lasted all of 2 hours before the event got cancelled. A shiny with plenty of bottle caps and mints having been used on it is far more realistic. Even if both are perfectly possible 'mons.

And, again, personally I think that bottle caps should change the actual IV, and mints should change the actual nature, not override the modifier.

That's why you gen 999 vitamins, bottlecaps, mints and TMs instead.

Secret Signature

But you need to hack a Switch for that, rather than merely trading with a bot.

Update: Apparently the hacked pokemon thing was a rumor to begin with??? 1 person was disqualified with no reason given, and the remaining players were all disqualified due to a weird vague ruling. Basically they didnt even get to play, they just got booted for just turning in their battle teams.

Not a rumor, as those teams get uploaded as rentals, and, heh, data was so-so.

But if they were disqualified for bringing hacked pokemon, they would just say it outright. Why use a ruling such as "act of causing harm to the opponent or giving an offensive image"?

Other VGC users have also rallied behind the protesters, like previous world champion Sejun Park (the pachirisu guy) or Nails, as well as Wolfey himself as shown above. The more I look onto it the less likely it seems foul play was agoot from the players...aside for colluding to troll top 4.

Edited by CountofBleck on Jun 4th 2023 at 8:59:04 AM

It seems like their Pokemon were genned, but it's besides the point. It seems like there are people who think the whole thing was about hacked Pokemon, when that wasn't the reason the players were disqualified, nor are those players complaining about and trying to get sympathy for being disqualified.

They were disqualified under vague rules because TPC saw their teams before the matches, and said teams all had nothing but Metronome because the players colluded to turn the Korean finals into a farce as a way to protest TPC mishandling the Korean tournaments. One player got disqualified first with no reason given, probably because he turned his team in before the others, but his replacement also agreed to the idea, so then later all the remaining 4 got disqualified. Which in end means their protest half-worked, since they effectively got the Korean finals cancelled.

One of the players then made English posts explaining what happened so that more people would know why the Korean finals were cancelled and about the issues players were having that made them protest.

It doesn't matter if it's tedious, cheating is still cheating and people who say shit like "Ethics don't really matter in a competition, just whoever is the winner" shouldn't be playing competitive.

It’s more like a person deciding to drive a car to an event rather then walking.

This entire thing just sounds like a shit show.

I'll teach you a lesson about just how cruel the world can be. That's my job, as an adult.

This is why I don't play competitive. Besides, there are more important things to consider here, like which Metal Coat trade evo I should pick for my next run of SoulSilver.

FC: SW-1445-0294-1719/PSN: TekkenGirl4Lyfe/Currently playing: Fire Emblem: The Blazing Blade

All I'm getting from this is that it very much seems like trying to make Pokemon competitive was a mistake.

I wouldn't necessarily say that. Pokemon Showdown's always an option if you want zero grind.

Edited by badtothebaritone on Jun 4th 2023 at 11:13:22 AM

With Genned Pokemon, I'd argue it is cheating, because the difficulty of capturing, breeding, and training Pokemon is intended to be part of the challenge in my opinion.

Having said that, I'd argue that the Pokemon games are designed in such a way to make such cheating effectively necessary. It being so difficult to get a viable team, in my opinion, is a major part of what causes this.

So, personally, I'd rework game mechanics to make it so that Pokemon you catch out in the open tend to be tournament-viable.

"Any campaign world where an orc samurai can leap off a landcruiser to fight a herd of Bulbasaurs will always have my vote of confidence"

thats a strange takeaway considering nothing about these issues is inherent to pokemon being competitive. Its all just mismanagement or poor design decisions from game freak/tpc(i).

Edited by Draghinazzo on Jun 5th 2023 at 7:57:17 AM

It’s more like a person deciding to drive a car to an event rather then walking.

It's more like using steroids if there were no physical downsides or health risks.

They didn't give a shit, until players made a loud enough outcry, causing them to actually implemented a ball legality rule afterwards.

This 1000% absolutely depends on context.

"Work smarter not harder" is often illustrated using a guy reshaping a block into a ball so he can push it more easily compared to others who are pushing a block. But.....that doesn't work if he's working for someone asking for a block, not a ball. He'll just gets fired if he brought a ball when a block is what's required. Basically, "work smarter" is only good if the result still qualifies for what's being asked. If what's being asked is "Pokemon that looks legal", then a "clearly hacked Pokemon" does not qualify, regardless of how long it takes to make.

And ethics does matter in say, World Cup or Olympics. Those are competition too, and no one cheating in those will get off free if found, because everyone in the world are watching.

Because TPC's hack check is so inadequate that they couldn't see any of the signs of the Pokemon being hacked. All they see is everyone intentionally messing with Metronome.

It's been decades, and TPC somehow still insist on using their hack check that's far worse than Pkhex. Even though nothing stop them from just using Pkhex from behind the scene to check all competing players' Pokemon.

Speaking of which, isn't it funny that Pkhex creators ask others to not use Pkhex for "cheating" in making competitive team? When they're the ones who enabled it in the first place by making and updating Pkhex. You want people to stop hacking? Then stop giving public the updates for the hack program in the first place!!! People won't hack if there's no means to do so.

Edited by ShiningStardust on Jun 5th 2023 at 8:40:47 PM

If there was no possibility to gen Pokemon all that would really happen is competitive would become less popular (well, on cartridge and "official" tournaments, anyway) because of the significant cost of time investment. The only people who'd be able to compete are those with a lot of time or money to pay for people to do it for them.

Edited by Draghinazzo on Jun 5th 2023 at 9:16:53 AM

I think the idea is similar to the wine blocks sold during prohibition. Legally there was supposedly nothing objectionable about selling bricks of grape concentrate and yeast, and hey, if you say not to do these exact steps that will get the customer the product they actually want, you're legally covered, right? Of course, the violation of the spirit of the law wasn't fooling anyone.

SoundCloud

Let people mod, and don't be the dumbfuck who goes to an official tournament with the cheat engine on.

What I find funny is how competitive gamers don't really have any honor nowadays. Half of the time we wade through scandals in any circuit, or top level players being hypocrites...

Yeah no.

Good old Not Invented Here syndrome. Apparently it's even more prevelant in Japan than over here, and is why good netcode is so hard to find in games like Tekken and Splatoon.

In any case, genning is implicitly allowed in tournaments because they don't enforce the rule against it. The Korean finalists were thrown out for collusion and trolling (presumably; the reason actually given was very vague), which they did in protest of the horrendous mismanagement of the tournament circuit.

Edited by Anura on Jun 5th 2023 at 2:20:45 PM

A society grows great when old men plant trees whose shade they know they will never sit in.

Yeah, I think we should stop dancing around the elephant in the room: Most players in high-level tournaments do it.

SoundCloud