Black Lagoon

OT3

So hell yes.

Shenua, Rotten and Sawyer deserve their own Sitcom.

Hmm. It'd be interesting if they were made a tag-team playable character by default.

I'm not all that bothered by Rock being mindfucked,its just that I hope that at the end of the day he isn't shown to be completely wrong for believing that people can be genuinely decent. In many ways I see the show as being more existentialist than nihilistic; the moral of the Tokyo Arc to me seemed to be that in the end no matter what the circumstances are, we are ultimately responsible for every action we do, and therefore we must live with some dignity in our choices for being our own, for better or worse. This a very Family-Unfriendly Aesop, but it doesn't inherently prove that human kindness is impossible.

I think once Rock realizes (completely) that there is no universal justice but wishes to do good regardless out of an irrational want, he'll be better off for it.

edited 14th May '11 1:17:23 AM by Scherzo09

I agree. I've always interpreted Fabiola's shut up Haniibal speech to Revy during the El Baile De La Muerte arc as existential.

I thought that he figured that out already. Wasn't that the point of his speech to Balalaika in episode 23?

Well,since I'm waiting for the dub of the OVA so I haven't seen Roberta's Bloody Trail yet, but from what I've hear Fabiola's position is kinda... torn apart. That being said, I feel Revy herself is more existentialist than nihilist, though she wouldn't bother to classify herself either way. I was pleasantly surprised that she doesn't go out of her way to shove her philosophy down peoples' throats; it seems to me its more of a reaction to others trying to preach to her how the world is, which seems to be a pet peeve of hers. Her philosophy ain't exactly upbeat, but she does have a reason for doing what she does. That said, I do think her interactions with Rock show that she is less secure than she lets on.

As for Rock, it seems to me that he understands the lack of justice but still hasn't fully come to terms with that or reconciled that with his worldview. Eventually he will have to come to accept he really doesn't have any 'moral superiority' over the murderers and gangsters of Roanapur. That doesn't make his way of doing things any less legitimate than say Revy's or Balalaika's, but it means he'll have to have the irrational volition and the means to carry it out.

Also, am I the only one who doesn't think Revy's morality system is nihilistic? Not every system that lacks a universal inherent value in human beings is nihilism.

"Nihilism" is one of those words that doesn't really mean anything, but which people apply to ideologies radically different from the mainstream and which some people have successfully appropriated to distinguish themselves.

Eh, Nihilism to mean strikes as a philosophy based around bitterness at the fact that traditional morality and ethic are dead and inability to get beyond that, while Nietzschean Ethics and Existentialism are about building an irrational, subjective meaning for your existence. I'd say Revy falls into that camp.

On the other hand,it seems to me that base monetary acquisition is not actually her driving concern, as she barely seems to own much of anything besides her guns, but the thrill of acquiring money and valuables through illicit means. And even then, the other members of Lagoon company matter to her more than she'd like to admit. And as my friend put it, there's sort of a female bromance between Revy and Eda.

That's interesting to hear, because I always felt that Fabiola came out the strongest from that argument. As to whether Revy is existential or not, it's been awhile since I've seen the anime, so I'll watch it again and also brush up on some of my books and then I'll present an argument either against that or adding further support to your argument, depending on what I see.

Fabiola's position isn't torn apart, she tears apart Revy's. And is ignored.

Any word on a new chapter?

I don't think Revy's philosophy is inherently wrong, but I think she still wants to deny that she places a lot of value in other human beings, Rock being the most apparent but also the other members of Lagoon and even other denizens of Roanapur. Its a nice juxtaposition I think, Revy is coming to terms with her humanity while Rock is coming to terms with the darkness within his soul.

edited 25th May '11 12:02:44 PM by Scherzo09

I didn't say she was wrong, I said Fabiola tore her position apart. Revy kept going on about how the world is terrible and it's not black and white until finally Fabiola got pissed off and said that she knows perfectly that there's mostly gray in the world and that Revy is the one looking for 'white.' Someone who really acknowledges the world as gray or black wouldn't be arguing like she did.

Well I'm still steeling myself for the Dub release so I'm not the best to talk about these things. But I like to think that beneath her Complete Monster facade she likes to put on from time to time there is still a genuine Woobie down in there.

Uh huh, that's what I said. Indirectly. Fabiola was making the point that deep down Revy doesn't believe the world is as bad she claims.

I still don't think Revy is as transgressive as she's normally made out to be, but it seems that telling her how the world works, whether it be accurate or not, is a Berserk Button for her. In this case though she doesn't want to admit how attached she's become to others, because she's scared on some level of being betrayed. Sorry if it seems like I'm parroting you, but just trying to clarify that Fabiola is hitting her soft spot she doesn't like to admit to.

Also, do you think they'll get the dub actors from the first two seasons for the OV As?

I'd hope so, but considering they only got JYB to return as Vash for the trigun movie, I don't have high hopes honestly. It would be awesome though.

Well, wasn't Trigun done like a decade ago? BL was only dubbed 4 years ago.

I don't see what the age of the show has to do with it. As far as I know, with the exception of Lia Sargent, who I'm not sure about, all the original voices for the main 4 characters are still in the business.

Honestly I'm more concerned about how BL has a new NA distributor, Funimation instead of Geneon. Think they'd want to get back the original cast? BL just had such a superlative dub.

So has anyone heard any update on the status of the manga? Last time I heard, the hiatus was to last until this summer, which is now.