One Piece - Manga Spoiler Thread (Untagged Spoilers)

Edited by sgamer82 on Mar 24th 2022 at 8:07:08 AM

Which why should avoid doing certain series that are still running. There are a few matches that ran headfirst into that.

So Luffy has Toon Physics and Oda keep his powers as goofy as he wanted to.

Best chapter ever.

The Nika thing was even foreshadowed with the first depiction of him in the manga. Not only is he first mentioned by the guy who failed to prevent the Gum-Gum Fruit's theft, the depiction of Nika is a noodle-armed cartoonish figure.

Luffy says this is his peak.

Who wanna bet we get Gear 6th down the line?

Edited by WashTheLaundryHero on Mar 25th 2022 at 2:47:14 AM

Given that Gear 4th was nine years ago, I doubt it.

I'm also reminded of the bonfire scene in Skypeia, though I can't recall offhand if there was anything Nika-like in Luffy's appearance/silhouette at the time.

Actually, a possible bit of gag foreshadowing was Chopper's little freakout post-Fishman Island (the arc where we heard the words "Joy Boy" for the first time) that Blackbeard would come for his Fruit only to be told "no one wants the Human-Human Fruit."

Edited by sgamer82 on Mar 25th 2022 at 2:56:58 AM

There was, specifically the bonfire scene in the arcs epilogue.

Mid-point, actually (chapter 253). Or at least that was the bonfire I was thinking of. And it was quite Nika-like when I decided to take a look

Also:

Edited by sgamer82 on Mar 25th 2022 at 3:03:13 AM

[x4] So what, Luffy is never gonna do something new ever again for the rest of the story, not even for the big finale?

Gear 4th was nine years ago because that's when the last big battle arc climax happened. Time has nothing to do with it.

So if i understood this correctly the god Nika essentially looks like a normal human, but has rubbery properties, which is why the Zoan aspect isnt immediatly obvious since all 3 forms look 100% normal human. Furthermore the fruit essentially allows the user to perform any move they can imagine themself doing. (Plus perhaps Luffys ability to make allies/friends with close to anyone, but that is hopefully just Luffy himself)

Honestly i feel like the reveal is unnecessary. One Piece isnt the kind of story where a reasonable explanation is needed for cool moves. The other aspects of the fruit dont really change anything beyond making the fruit itself a prime target of the World Government, while Luffy himself should already be a prime target. This just makes Luffy fulfill some form of "destiny" by eating the fruit instead of because of his decisions.

It's not really 'destiny', it's a complete accident Luffy got that fruit. Not so much a 'chosen one' as a 'lucky one'.

Of course you can still argue that there's not that much difference in practice and Luffy's own achievements and agency are undermined by making him have the strongest power from the beginning, but that's a different discussion, and it's more in line with how Luffy was already framed, with his lineage and whatnot.

Edited by WashTheLaundryHero on Mar 25th 2022 at 4:08:59 AM

How much "chosen one" there is depends on how much actual will the Nika fruit has.

Also I'm not sure Nika is actually a god. I generally figured Nika was just another name for Joyboy (or vice versa)

You could also argue Luffy achieved everything he did despite not knowing what his own power was. Plus the multitude of times he'd have died, "strongest power" or no, if not for his own determination and outside factors.

Edited by sgamer82 on Mar 25th 2022 at 4:51:32 AM

I meant he fulfills/got the "Joyboy destiny" from eating the fruit. Luffy has multiple elements in his lineage, which could be interpreted as some form of chosen one, but the thing is he goes against those elements. He is neither a revolutionary, nor a marine, its his decisions that brought him to where he is. I feel like that has been a repeated element in One Piece (and specificly Wano) that it doesnt matter if it seems someone is destined for something, its their decisions that matter.

Luffy being a personification of "the Warrior of Liberation" opens up the possibility that his actions in saving his allies/friends werent his decisions, but him following a destiny. In practice there is no difference, but the mere (known) possibility takes away from the central theme of freedom in One Piece.

As you may have noticed i utterly loathe anything to do with destiny, fate, or similar. Its always either worthless or souldestroyingly depressing.

Personally I feel it's irrelevant. Either fate/destiny/etc exists and it doesn't matter what you do because you're following your fated path like it or not, or it doesn't and nothing you do matters in the sense that there isn't any fated path or follow.

Either way, whether what you do doesn't matter or it doesn't matter what you do, there's no reason not to just do what you want.

I could easily see that being an outlook Luffy could have were he introspective enough to consider such a thing.

Edited by sgamer82 on Mar 25th 2022 at 5:00:41 AM

I'm assuming Naruto burned you on that :V

Because I'm seeing most of the dissent towards this plot point coming from disgruntled Naruto fans who despise how that series "ruined" its themes.

Personally, this doesn't really change much. All of Luffy's decisions up to this point were his own; nobody set him on his current path, he himself chose this. Its not the power that matters, but what one chooses to do with it.

Honestly, I really do think Shonen fans are a little too obsessed with the idea of an underdog protagonist, to the point where any sort of "destiny" or "fate" is immediately scrutinized, and that's pretty unreasonable if you ask me.

Remember how Luffy opened a snake's eyelid from within its eye?

How he powers up by eating meat?

The whole "Water-Luffy" debacle?

He was always a toon. This just makes it official.

I do like that it's apparently framed not as the Strongest Power, but as the Most Ridiculous.

I wouldn't be surprised if it gets framed as Luffy 'stealing' someone else's destiny by randomly eating that fruit.

I've seen theories that Shanks wanted to give Ace the fruit.

That still would be fit the themes and Luffy's character, right? A guy that's so free he can even choose to become the Chosen One of his own free will.

Edited by WashTheLaundryHero on Mar 25th 2022 at 5:21:49 AM

From seeing flirty Kaidio to Luffy hulk smashing him, this has been one of the funniest main battle of One Piece.

Okay was right to allow Luffy Power to be this goofy from the start.

I think the reveal of Luffy's true fruit is just bad. It creates several plot holes and confirms what would be my greatest concern about Luffy's story, that the theme of freedom get mishandled.

Luffy is all about being the freest person in the world. Yet, he can't even choose his own fate, which makes him the least free person in the world. He was literally destined by a prophecy to bring forth a new era, and it was stated a few times like with Mihawk in Marineford that fate was on his side. It begs the question of how many of his actions were truly his own and not willed by destiny? And apparently Luffy doesn't even have his own will, but only the will of D, Joyboy, and now it seems Nika. Luffy never had his own free will, he was always destined to succeed and bring forth a new era, hence why Hawkin's cards couldn't see him fail. Luffy can't choose anything, his journey is predetermined by fate for him to succeed. And just because it is in his favor, doesn't make him any less free. And it's rather bad imo that Oda portrays fate favoring Luffy as a good thing.

You've got it backwards. It's not that Luffy lacks freedom because he's fated to do these things - rather, he's fated to do these things specifically because he's free, because they're the things he wants to do, fate or not. It's for these traits that the fruit drew itself to him in the first place.

If you're looking for a slave to fate, look no further than Luffy's antithesis, Blackbeard.

And how do you want to know it's that way? How do you want to know that Luffy wants to do these things because of his own accord and not because it was put on him by fate, by the will of D, Joyboy or Nika? Can you really say that this is Luffy's own will and not that of someone else?

Can you even say that Luffy could go against his destiny? Again, just because he is destined for greatness, doesn't make him any less a slave of fate.

Edited by bandersnitch on Mar 25th 2022 at 5:49:51 AM

Fate is what Blackbeard, the probable Big Bad of the story, always rags on about. He claims everyone is a slave to fate. Given that, and the underlying themes of freedom the entire story possesses, it would not be very appropriate for the main character to be similarly chained.

Just wait and see. It'll be fine.

Which is why I am rather critical of this moment being treated as completely triumphant. Oda is also not the most consistent with his themes and adopts too much of a "trying to have his cake and eat it too"-approach. And honestly, Wano has given me not much optimism, in general.

Just two weeks ago, people said "Just wait and see, Oda won't retcon Luffy's fruit into a zoan." Not to mention, must long runner end on a rather bad note, and One Piece's cracks are getting bigger.

Edited by bandersnitch on Mar 25th 2022 at 6:07:56 AM