Bah. Half the fun is in finding places to put incidental jokes for others to get fifty years down the line.
Fifty years? Honestly, they will be lucky if the rebuilding is done in fifty years. I think you are really underestimating how much of a project that will be. Originally it took 200 years to built it, and while we now have modern equipment which will help to do some of it faster, some things just can't be rushed.
Nope, not.
Cathedral tradition: overseers trying to catch (and remove) all the hilarity before moving on to the next section. Better fun: being found out 600 years later — when nobody is entirely sure they can understand the joke.
Edited by Euodiachloris on Apr 16th 2019 at 6:41:16 PM
I would hesitate to try to ascertain how long rebuilding efforts would take on Notre-Dame based on its original construction time. That has almost no predictive power—the techniques, amount of support and interest, amount of existing structure and plans to work from, chance of deciding some decades in to build this part in a whole different style... there's a lot of confounding effects going on.
Avatar SourceExperts have already said that rebuilding might take decades. A lot depends on the extend of the damage, though, and the question if the structure itself is still sound. The Church in Dresden for example needed nine years, and that one was smaller and was build from the ground up, so you didn't have to worry about preserving a previous structure (though they took care to use the stones of the ruin in the places where they previously were). And I am talking about the building itself. The interior wasn't done at this point.
Edited by Swanpride on Apr 16th 2019 at 11:40:27 AM
Yes, and?
What does that have to do with the original construction time of the cathedral? That's what you started with.
Avatar SourceThe point was that originally a lot of time (200 years) and craftsmanship went into this, you can't just redo this easily.
Medieval societies had very low surplus. It took a long time to build, but there also were not all that many people working on it at any given time because rich as the church was, they could not afford to hire stone masons in unlimited job lots. In modern France the limit is going to be "Not stepping on each others toes".
And it doesn't seem like this project will lack funding.
I hope the firemen get medals for their work yesterday. While it's obviously still horrible, their good work saved France an even greater irreparable cultural loss.
Macron is busy promising five years to "fully restore" it. Going by York Minster's various oopsies both directly after the '84 fire and for years afterwards, that's... optimistic.
Also, impossible.
I'd be more down with fifteen to twenty to shake the kinks out of a kinda-restore-but-with-better-fire-safety that large.
Edited by Euodiachloris on Apr 16th 2019 at 8:18:34 PM
I am mostly hoping that the one who got hurt will get the best of care and everything he needs for his (hopefully complete) recovery.
So various French billionaires, like the heads of the parent companies of Gucci, Louis-Vuitton, etc., are pledging hundreds of millions of euros to restoring Notre Dame.
Edited by Eschaton on Apr 16th 2019 at 1:25:28 AM
This is ridiculous: as things are now, donations are defiscalised enough and all this generosity from large companies is mostly free advertising. 90% tax reduction would mean that for every euro they give, other taxpayers would pay nine.
Edited by gropcbf on Apr 16th 2019 at 11:05:58 AM
Nearly 200 years on, that 19th century work is crumbling (though the medieval construction is mostly in better shape). One blazing hot day in early July, a staff member unlocked an old door off the choir and led TIME up a stone spiral staircase and out onto the roof, high above the crowds. Here, the site seemed not spiritually uplifting but distressing. Chunks of limestone lay on the ground, having fallen from the upper part of the chevet, or the eastern end of the Gothic church. One small piece had a clean slice down one side, showing how recently it had fallen. Two sections of a wall were missing, propped up with wood. And the features of Notre Dame’s famous gargoyles looked as worn away as the face of Voldemort. “They are like ice cream in the sun, melting,” says Michel Picaud, head of the nonprofit Friends of Notre Dame de Paris, looking up at them.
What is more, some fear the problem is getting worse. “The damage can only accelerate,” says Andrew Tallon, an associate professor of art at Vassar College in Poughkeepsie, N.Y., and an expert on Gothic architecture. Having carefully studied the damage, he says the restoration work is urgent. If the cathedral is left alone, its structural integrity could be at risk. “The flying buttresses, if they are not in place, the choir could come down,” he says. “The more you wait, the more you need to take down and replace.”
The church was not fully aware of the extent of the problem, say those at Notre Dame. Until a few years ago, the government effectively made the private areas off-limits. “There used to be about 200 old keys, so it was very, very difficult,” says André Finot, a spokesman for Notre Dame. Eventually, the government standardized the keys and allowed its tenants to climb the hidden stone staircases and access the upper levels. “We were shocked when we got up there,” Finot says.
Oh yeah, it's been in such a poor state recently that the BBC had managed to get multiple news pieces and travel episodes out of it. I think it was getting to the point that there were warnings it might collapse within the decade without urgent, massive repair work.
Avatar SourceGoddamit, France!
what’s interesting to me, is that until they went in and standardized the over 200 separate locks, a large part of the cathedral was nearly inaccessible, which is part of how the damage got to be so severe.
Edited by megaeliz on Apr 16th 2019 at 10:04:19 AM
Like I said before, glorified death trap.
Disgusted, but not surprisedThe publically accessible (well, easily publically accessible) parts are about as far from a death trap as you can get. Pretty simple layout.
Avatar SourceWell, the cathedral is owned by the state. The state sadly has a tendency to not care about problems which are out of sight.
There might some good coming out of the fire, but it won't make up for what was destroyed.
Part of an article from the New York Times, highlighting some of the reasons it went up so easily.
Some of those elements, like firewalls or a sprinkler system, were absent by choice — so as not to alter the landmark’s design or to introduce electrical wiring deemed a greater risk amid the timbers that supported Notre-Dame’s ornate lead roof.
“There had been a systematic refusal to install anything electrical” within “the forest” because of the risk, said Pierre Housieaux, president of the Paris Historical Association. “Everyone knew that the attic was the most fragile part.”
Inevitably, some of those decisions are being called into question in the aftermath of a calamity that scarred a jewel of Gothic architecture precious to all the world, and left a gaping wound in the heart of Paris.
“The fire-detection system existed, not the fire compartments,” said Jacques Chanut, president of the French Building Federation, referring to the structures commonly used elsewhere to contain blazes. “That’s the typical example of something we are going to have to think about tomorrow.”
However it began, the fire galloped unimpeded across the attic and roof, and up the wood structure inside the spire. The flaming spire stood out over the city like a Roman candle until it toppled over, crashing through the ceiling and into the cathedral.
As flaming pieces of the upper structure fell to the cathedral floor, some of the interior furnishings also caught fire.
Firefighters deployed a robot equipped with tank-type treads and a camera to pull hoses into the cathedral and aim water at the flames. Firefighters also used aerial drones to get a view, including thermal imaging, into the inferno.
But in the absence of fire-prevention measures at the cathedral, there was only so much the firefighters could do.
“The lack of fire security allowed the fire to spread quickly,” said Jean-Michel Leniaud, the former director of the École Nationale des Chartes, a French university institute that specializes in the sciences supporting historical work. “If there were sprinklers everywhere it might have been different, but there weren’t.”
Mr. Leniaud, who visited the interior of Notre-Dame on Tuesday, said the state, which owns and maintains the cathedral, had fire safety regulations for all buildings, but that “sometimes they can be hard to apply.”
Paradoxically, that can be especially so for some of its most cherished structures. “There’s always been a hesitation to disfigure the monument in question,” Mr. Leniaud said.
One reason the fire swept through the open space beneath the roof is that there were no barriers — sometimes called firewalls — to compartmentalize the blaze until firefighters could arrive, said Jim Lygate, a visiting professor of fire investigation at University of Edinburgh. For that reason, he said, such barriers are legally required in similar structures in Britain.
Experts say that restoration, which often involves combustible chemicals and electrical tools, always presents a fire danger, as does electrical wiring
But experts say the beams, many of them dating to the cathedral’s construction in the 12th and 13th centuries, became tinder-dry as they aged.
Sounds like it was something of a tinderbox, not helped by lack of modern fire precautions.
Edited by megaeliz on Apr 17th 2019 at 8:19:58 AM
Glorified. Death. Trap.
Disgusted, but not surprisedand yet it's houses sacred relics and priceless artworks
New theme music also a box
They will only be allowed to do something as close to what was there as possible anyway.