RWBY General Discussion

Keep in mind, 8 decades ago things were still in a Midevil Phase for most of the world sans Mantle.

Things are really about to get Fun around here

So, what do you think the Volume 8 trailer will contain?

He/His/Him. No matter who you are, always Be Yourself.

"At the start of the show the world is in a state of piece, Ozpin has people in Leadership positions on parts of each nations Governant. And the world is largely United. And even Salems minions are mostly made up of Societal Outcasts.

Salem has virtually everything working against her, and Oz has been able to Foil her schemes for a long time. "

Piece? sure, stability?....no, vacou is still argely lawless, Atlas and Mantle are clearly in this sate of unequalty even long before Ironwood show up, the white fang was become more and more extremist in their view, Lionheart was a traitor and nobody know exactly what is with theodore.

remenber, even if what you said is truth she still turn the table against him in vytal, that show you how little she need to wreck stuff.

"The only things Cinder made up was the idea Ironwood and Ozpin were in a power struggle with one another and that Mistral was gunning for war."

She didnt even said that, she point out the huge fleet there and leave the implication in the air, in part because Ironwood kinda try to undermind ozpin because he though ozpin didnt do enough.

So yeah, Salem is not so worry, is clearly she wait her time spying the kindoms and how they move in order to act her plan, that allow ther mystique to fester.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"

"remenber, even if what you said is truth she still turn the table against him in vytal, that show you how little she need to wreck stuff."

The situation with Vytal absolutely dosent show little she needs to wreck stuff, as I've said before, Salem needed to formulate a long and complex plan of Wich she needed a whole crap ton of things to go her way, With Cinder having to improvise at times, in order in order to accomplish what she did.

And even then it all would have been Undone if James had gotten Vacuos help afterward.

"She didnt even said that, she point out the huge fleet there and leave the implication in the air, in part because Ironwood kinda try to undermind ozpin because he though ozpin didnt do enough."

N...no? What she does is have Penny get ripped to Shreds and then talk about this was the sign of a big struggle between Ozpin and James and how the kingdoms were on the Brink of war.

Edited by Kylotrope on Jul 8th 2020 at 9:43:50 AM

Things are really about to get Fun around here

No really? we dont know how much she have to think and even if she did is not bad a sign because sh have being able to counter nearly everything so far, her only defeat coming by the indulgence of her subordinate like cinder and adam(well adam wasnt one but you get it), also Roman manage steal all the dust and put the breach plan and the activated it, that is a huge problem since they manage to sneak inside Ozpin nose, vytal was a blow to everyone with Salem losing very little in return.

And you seen fixied on that as it a call would solve everything like Salem plan is made of cristal or something, is clear Salem fear is the union of nations and people, but so far that take more effort than to tear down.

Penny death as a catalysm but is clear she would chose another one to do it, Cinder does state that you dont need a weapon dress as little girl, with the implication that it is a weapon, I think that is why Ironwood try to tell ozpin he can explain it because is REAAAALLY hard to see in any other way, them Cinder made allution on how ozpin failed to stop the breach and the fleet, she leave the implication out there because is easier to the public to come up with their own explanation.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"

We also see that mild disappointment with a mission objective (Volume 2) can attract a pack of Grimm.

'd but the "state of peace" is just The Masquerade that Ozpin has created. We see as early as Volume 3's opening, or even Volume 2's chats between Ozpin and Ironwood that it's a a fragile peace at best.

• Oz has only foiled her grand goal of claiming the relics. Grimm probably still wipe out human populations on the regular.
• The things that were working against her (vaults, huntsmen, academies) have been repeatedly shown to be corrupt or a temporary problem that she's slowly getting ahead of.
  • Just a few of her agents were able to wipe out all of the other huntsmen in Mistral.
  • Grimm were able to take Beacon without Salem being present.
  • She can't seem to crack the Vaults. That's the only thing Oz really has over her.

I mean maybe this is nitpicking but I'd say Oz has been "stalling Salem" not "winning against Salem."

And now she's more or less blitzed the world's largest military and got its leader cornered.

Edited by FOFD on Jul 8th 2020 at 11:45:43 AM

Akira Toriyama (April 5 1955 - March 1, 2024).

"The things that were working against her (vaults, huntsmen, academies) have been repeatedly shown to be corrupt or a temporary problem that she's slowly getting ahead of.

Just a few of her agents were able to wipe out all of the other huntsmen in Mistral.

Grimm were able to take Beacon without Salem being present. She can't seem to crack the Vaults. That's the only thing Oz really has over her."

You seem to he ignoring the "how" she did that with those.

Salem accomplishes the Mistral thing again, praying on the idea she's invincible to exploit fear. Its what happened with Leonardo and he sold out the Hunstman in Mistral for her agents to kill.

And the Grimm only took Beacon after an incredibly long and complex plan requiring lots of stuff to go her way was executed.

"No really? we dont know how much she have to think and even if she did is not bad a sign because sh have being able to counter nearly everything so far, her only defeat coming by the indulgence of her subordinate like cinder and adam(well adam wasnt one but you get it), also Roman manage steal all the dust and put the breach plan and the activated it, that is a huge problem since they manage to sneak inside Ozpin nose, vytal was a blow to everyone with Salem losing very little in return."

It is a bad sign, a sign of how much of a disadvantage she was at that she had to initiate this gigantic event with tons of planning and....oh for the love of god just read what I wrote previously.

"And you seen fixied on that as it a call would solve everything like Salem plan is made of cristal or something, is clear Salem fear is the union of nations and people, but so far that take more effort than to tear down."

What are you saying exactly? That even if James went to Vacuo for help there would have been some challenge before teaming up with them? And that's not even true with how the show portrays things.

Edited by Kylotrope on Jul 8th 2020 at 9:23:11 AM

Things are really about to get Fun around here

"Just a few of her agents were able to wipe out all of the other huntsmen in Mistral. "

And she did because Lionheart who is suposed to be one of the ozpin inner circle betray him, that enough should tell you how fragile ozpin mesure are or the fact he have to really in trickery and lying to their own forces to carry out his will.

"It is a bad sign, a sign of how much of a disadvantage she was at that she had to initiate this gigantic event with tons of planning and....oh for the love of god just read what I wrote previously.

"

I read it is just...dosent make sense? you seen to implied ozpin did such a good job that salem have to create super plans...except those plans invold exploting the flaws and cracks on the system that is fragile because it realies in goodwill and trickery.

Also every time they try to stop her plan they got carry away: they stop roman? he got the dust anyway, stop the breach? it matter not and the falure from stoping from happing become part of cinder narrative, they bring fleet? they turn against them, james and RWBY manage to stop tyrian and watts? bring the seer grimm and chess piece and salem is on their way because they were bait, they fail in mistral because Cinder got bitchy and Adam got incely again.

if a carefull system can be dismantle in a few atack, is not a stable system.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"

"Also every time they try to stop her plan they got carry away: they stop roman? he got the dust anyway, stop the breach? it matter not and the falure from stoping from happing become part of cinder narrative"

The last 2 things are either the Result of some Xanatos Speed Chess on Cinders part to undo something going wrong or Salem using the exact tactic I described of relying on fear of her to make moves(James coming in with his fleet)

And none of that goes against what her plan actually Entailed and required, AKA her only being able to sneak in Cinder and Co thanks to Leonardos fear of her so they could sneak in to begin with. And needing Cinder to both set up a ton of False narratives and Frame a Kingdom and get into the CCT to ensure communications would be down afterwards.

" she did because Lionheart who is suposed to be one of the ozpin inner circle betray him, that enough should tell you how fragile ozpin mesure are or the fact he have to really in trickery and lying to their own forces to carry out his will"

No it shows how much she can do when she relies on Fear, its been indicated Lionheart was a completely different person beforehand.

"james and RWBY manage to stop tyrian and watts? bring the seer grimm and chess piece"

The chess piece was basically Salem getting lucky(I know there's speculation otherwise, but so far it's just that) and the issue with Using the stuff in Volume 7 as a refutation is that the entire point of there actions in Atlas was how easily the plan could get foiled if James came to his senses Wich is why they had to go there Asap.

Edited by Kylotrope on Jul 7th 2020 at 10:31:15 PM

Things are really about to get Fun around here

Is more than fear, Salem can disisguise exactly what she have to her service, James was right in that Ozpin was to lax in his security and Cinder manage ot pass, she also have a hacker who could turn his fleet against him(and someone who can sneak into his fleet into first place).

Salem forces hability to re alter their plan for their advantage kinda give them and edge over the group, specially because for most part they dont know ho they are dealing with.

The refutation come not that jame didnt come to is sense but rathet than the entire fight in mantle was a sort of a bait because the plan was letting Salem to come unhindred so she can use her massive for as levarage, probably the idea was that mantle to be destroy until Salme show up and bruce force her way into the staff, which it kinda sorta was carried.

You are reaaaaally understimated salem hability

Edited by unknowing on Jul 8th 2020 at 5:04:27 AM

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"

The funny thing despite James claiming that, it was his guards that cinder managed to beat up and sneak pass

Cinder didn't get passed because of a lack of firm security, and his extra security didn't reveal them, there was nothing really skeptical about her team for awhile, they got passed thanks To Leo's fear causing him to work with them.

With Atlas, Tyrian and Watts would never have been able to even start the attack on Mantle to set up the 'Bait' if James had done certain things earlier on.

And my point is that you can't use that to refute the point about Salems plans revolving around others Fear of her and that she is actually very stoppable, when the entire reason Salem goes to Atlas to start with is because of how easily her plans would be foiled if James came to his senses.

Edited by Kylotrope on Jul 7th 2020 at 11:26:31 PM

Things are really about to get Fun around here

In a cursed note unrelated to anything going on in this thread, allow me to share: last night I had a RWBY-themed dream, in which someone managing to sleep with all three of their team members was referred to as "getting a BINGO."

Thank you for sharing this cursed moment with me.

This right here.

I think Salem actually runs on a lot of being able to claim anything that happens was "according to plan". Part of this is the mythology she's built up around herself as a Goddess, and also that her followers are people that are so good at improvising.

When she's facing off against someone like Ironwood, who is an inherently paranoid person that overthinks all the possible scenarios, it's proven especially effective.

...........and now we have to stare at Team STRQ for a moment. Tai, did you bang all your teammates?

Edited by harostar on Jul 8th 2020 at 8:30:42 AM

x2, Relevant.◊

Edited by jouXIII on Jul 8th 2020 at 3:40:22 PM

I assure you, I'm a completely trustworthy person.

I saw a theory that the king of Vale isn't supposed to be King Arthur, rather, he's going to allude to Mickey Mouse.

@Haro

Thankyou pal.

Edited by Kylotrope on Jul 8th 2020 at 2:50:32 AM

Things are really about to get Fun around here

Let's be real, of any relationship reveal that could possibly happen in RWBY, the idea that Tai and Qrow had a fling would be the least surprising by far,

x2 ...So Sword of Destruction is a Keyblade?

Edited by jouXIII on Jul 8th 2020 at 3:53:17 PM

I assure you, I'm a completely trustworthy person.

"Inappropriate stories", huh Uncle Qrow?

Harriet has come to Amity Arena, and it seems not even her own kingdom has good things to say about her personality.

Vegeta: I'm back bitches!

Wouldn't Ruby also fall in that category?

They implied her Semblance isn't just speed when Harriet commented on it in RWBY V7 E3 "Ace Operatives".

It's not the first time it's been demonstrated that Ruby's Semblance isn't pure speed, it's just Ruby never truly understood her own Semblance. She even admits as such to Oscar that she never really bothered thinking about it after practicing turning into three Rose Clusters. Hell, they've been demonstrating her Semblance isn't generic Super-Speed as far back as Volume 2, which I go into detail here. Ruby's Semblance if anything is in a similar category as Neo's, since she's able to generate a canopy of rose petals that encase her physical form in a similar manner to how Neo alters her appearance with her illusions. Hell, something Vine said to Jaune actually furthers the idea her semblance is making something tangible around her. Much like how Vine's Semblance gives him glowing stretch armstrong limbs, Ruby's Semblance is likely generating a cone of Rose Petals, if not turning her body into Rose Petals, and her "speed" comes from propelling herself forward rapidly.

Edited by RebelFalcon on Jul 13th 2020 at 4:54:47 AM

Vegeta: I'm back bitches!

"The funny thing despite James claiming that, it was his guards that cinder managed to beat up and sneak pass "

Meh I give him a pass because he put guards, ozpin put...nothing, Cinder pretty much sneak complete under the school, under the city and manage to create a breach and them broke festival.

"With Atlas, Tyrian and Watts would never have been able to even start the attack on Mantle to set up the 'Bait' if James had done certain things earlier on. "

Cinder taking about the timeline show they would atack Atlas, they probably modify some stuff here and there but it was clear the set was already there by time RWBY got ther.

"And my point is that you can't use that to refute the point about Salems plans revolving around others Fear of her and that she is actually very stoppable, when the entire reason Salem goes to Atlas to start with is because of how easily her plans would be foiled if James came to his senses. "

Except so far salem have goten what it want to, not only because of fear but because manipulating the fragile system that was there, you argument since to based on the idea she have to work harder to crack ozpin while she went easy on ironwood, which is.....absurd?, salem is beatable, but very? not much.

"When she's facing off against someone like Ironwood, who is an inherently paranoid person that overthinks all the possible scenarios, it's proven especially effective. "

I mean she manage to beat ozpin in beacon, what chance their subordinate with not even a tenth of her experience can do against her?

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"

"Except so far salem have goten what it want to, not only because of fear but because manipulating the fragile system that was there, you argument since to based on the idea she have to work harder to crack ozpin while she went easy on ironwood, which is.....absurd?, salem is beatable, but very? not much."

Exploiting existing flaws is part of it yes, but Fear is her main instrument, particularly against those actually in the Secret War. Cinder getting to the CCT Tower? Cinder and her gang studying all the students to learn more about them? Cinder and Co being able to use that information so she could cause a big ruckus and make the headmasters look bad to launch the attack on Vale? And being able to shut down global communications? All of it was made possible do to Salems grip on Leo

And your still not arguing against the big point here Salems plans were relying on James fear keeping him from going to Vacuo for help.

"mean she manage to beat ozpin in beacon, what chance their subordinate with not even a tenth of her experience can do against her?"

I'm gonna sound like a Broken Record at this point, but Salem only beat Ozpin thanks to An extremely complex plan and James not coming to his senses was the only resson James hadn't thwarted Salems plans.

Things are really about to get Fun around here

There was clearly Xanatos Speed Chess happening at Beacon, and Salem's plans were amended once again following Haven, so I imagine if James had reacted differently "the plan" would have adapted with it.


Regarding Vaccuo, the implication that Theodore is involved in a conspiracy with the Crown seems to suggest that there wouldn't have been any help from there; that Salem's still worried about that suggests the Crown and Theodore are acting independently of both her and Ozpin and neither of them know about it.

Edited by CaptainCapsase on Jul 9th 2020 at 10:53:10 AM

So, I have a question: since the server crash, do you think some of the edits to the trope pages were lost and if so, should they be restored?

He/His/Him. No matter who you are, always Be Yourself.