Marvel Comics General

That's really well-said. It also explains why the Black Panther books are becoming increasingly cluttered with a bunch of flat, boring, IP-bait OCs that I can't foresee any future writer using, even ones who like bringing back obscure characters. When I can't envision Peter David - the man who used obscurities like Damian Tryp and Isolationist as the villains of one of his most acclaimed stories - using the characters Coates or Ridley or Eve Ewing made, whose names I can barely even remember, you know it's bad.

If no-one wants Black Panther, maybe they should have shoved him back in Avengers after Priest instead of dragging him down into mediocrity.

That was what they did with him after the Priest run; he went right back to being a member of the Avengers instead of a solo hero. It was the Hudlin run that arguably began the current loop the series is trapped in, though ironically, that run mostly suffered from the opposite of a lot of later runs' problems, like making T'Challa into a borderline God-Mode Sue instead of shitting on him.

Hudlin did at least introduce Shuri and a handful of other stuff that’s had lasting impact

It doesn't help that BP's now become big enough that he always has an ongoing now so just keep him an Avengers character isn't an option anymore.

In Shuri's case it is kind of annoying how they keep grafting T'Challa's intelligence onto Shuri. I've seen people saying its to make Shuri T'Challa's Q but like does he really need a Q? Does every character constantly need the same stuff like the guy in the computer?

Its another instance of how the character is being torn apart to prop up others. I remember hearing how in the Shuri book there was a scene where they stated that Shuri got passed over for being Black Panther for her gender despite that never being a problem before. She only got passed over because she's the younger sibling, not because she's a girl.

Edited by slimcoder on Mar 20th 2024 at 7:15:02 AM

Given how crazy she was at the start, she gets another reason for why T'Challa was the best option for the role.

Yeah, that shit is part of why I don't like Shuri. She's literally just all of T'Challa's scientific smarts ripped out of him and clumsily retconned into a sister that inexplicably never got mentioned before until she was introduced.

I’ll offer this praise to Coates, he has the right idea of giving Shuri her own thing to do by making her Griot giving her a mystical focus.

Otherwise Shuri’s being T’Challa’s tech head is annoying because it amounts to “T’Challa has a problem so he goes to Shuri who instantly whips out a gadget or information on hand to immediately solve the solution”.

The characters intelligence is trivialized to make Shuri come across as more important which is the worst thing to do to make a supporting character useful.

It’s funny how that wasn’t Hudlin’s idea, that was a chang the MCU made that was since grafted onto the comics for synergy. So now Shuri is suddenly an uber-genius despite that never really being her thing before.

Edited by slimcoder on Mar 20th 2024 at 8:55:54 AM

Which wasn't the case in Hudlin's run, to be fair. It was the MCU that made her a super scientist and that eventually carried back to the comics.

Edited by Cortez on Mar 20th 2024 at 12:42:20 PM

What happened to Shuri was probably the most blatant and obnoxious bit of MCU synergy ever. For all that people complain about synergy, it usually just means a costume change or a villain getting some focus. Relatively minor things. But Shuri got completely, totally, 100% reinvented to match her movie version, with virtually none of her previous characterization being retained.

I wonder if the best approach to a Black Panther solo right now might be to just to a superhero comic. Forget Wakandan politics for a bit, forget what it means to be Black Panther, forget all of that. Just have him get caught up in a weird adventure.

I dunno, the struggle to balance being a hero and being a ruler is a fundamental part of Black Panther’s story.

Given how things have been going for him lately, a book focused on his heroics would be good. Of course, any writer needs to know what they are supposed to focus on.

But he's not really a ruler anymore. And at this point the nonstop self-angsting has gotten unbearable with the character.

He really does need a back to basics superhero approach. Have him on fun adventures, fight actual supervillains instead of nefarious figures of Wakanda's past.

Have him do some global sight-seeing international treks, take him out of Wakanda.

The guy needs an Immortal Thor-esque revamp. Just get rid of all the incessant maudlin-angst about himself and just refresh the man's confidence in himself. No more whining about how he "needs to find himself and prove himself to his people." Just have him as a capable confident hero.

Edited by slimcoder on Mar 20th 2024 at 10:06:06 AM

"I dunno, the struggle to balance being a hero and being a ruler is a fundamental part of Black Panther’s story." Sure. But taking a character out of their usual story can be a refreshing change of pace.They can't just do the same thing all the time, it starts to get tiring, so throwing them into a completely different situation than they're usually seen in can give readers a chance to see another side of the character. Then, when the character is put back in their usual type of story, it feels fresher to the readers, too.

Funny how Immortal Thor was brought up. A big part of Thor’s character is an even trickier balancing act: hero, king, and god. With a dash of fate and meta narrative.

Edited by M84 on Mar 21st 2024 at 1:33:31 AM

And a lot of daddy issues. Can't forget those.

T’Challa of course avoids that since his father is already dead. Instead he has to deal with the rest of his family.

I mean its not really that hard. Just don't dial up the wangst.

Its very simple, but some writers just want their heroes masochistically tortured. It has nothing to do with them being hard to write.

Just look at the current Batman ongoing vs the World's Finest title. Incessant misery vs Batman actually being able to crack a smile and do some jokes.

Edited by slimcoder on Mar 20th 2024 at 10:53:51 AM

Yeah but that is two different titles. So BP would need two different writers.

Which I guess is kind of what is happening since BP is on the current Avengers run.

He needs good writing, like whats happening on Thor right now.

All that stuff about Thor regaining his determination, sticking by the decisions he makes, able to come up with clever solutions to problems, and standing like a badass to whoever goes against him are all things T'Challa needs.

Hell IT even has a moment where Storm actually admits she's wrong. Imagine that, a story where Storm makes a wrong decision and admits it. If only T'Challa could be allowed to be right for once.

Edited by slimcoder on Mar 20th 2024 at 11:06:04 AM

I'm tickled at the essay in the first issue of Immortal Thor where Ewing talked about how his favorite Thor moment is Thor just standing outside in the turbo storm on Battleworld, having the time of his life.

And you can see that inspiration in Immortal Thor so much.

Ewing is one of the few writers that really leans into the implications of Thor being a storm god, with stuff like him making a blizzard the Frost Giants summoned go away by sternly telling it off like it's a puppy that messed in the house, or tanking literally everything Storm throws at him because while she might be able to influence weather, he IS weather.

OG Shuri is a witch not a scientist.

But yes, I see her having no problem being his Q because T'Challa being a scientist doesn't mean he needs to spend it all.

T’Challa is a jack of all trades, master of some

Shuri can be better at science because T’Challa is better at other stuff. And although T’Challa is a bit of a scientist himself he’s seldom presented as one of The scientist characters

Does current Shuri also deal in sorcery?