The Place for Purging Porn and Pedo-Pandering (AKA P5 flag evaluations)

Are we willing giving votes of no-confidence already? Seems premature.

@Tomu: It's not a subject being voted on :)

I agree with the people saying that trying to access and at least glance at the works in question is a good idea, especially if they are readily available to anyone with an internet connection.

(lotte derail: The she's a succubus part ends up mostly she has a tail and pointy ears, and Bizarre Alien Biology

Just giving info on the show.

edited 29th Apr '12 8:14:43 PM by animeg3282

On Lotte, let's wait for Catalogue to cast their vote (I assume Eddie was voting in that thread, not overriding; if he was, of course, then that can be clarified) before we perform our complaining rituals. Please.

I just want to say that when the premise is 10 year olds giving bj's then there's a good reason that it's alienating.

You forgot the fact that she's also a succubus, which makes it more alienating.

edited 29th Apr '12 9:36:27 PM by Psyga315

Oh right. Don't succubuses pretty much exist to have sex?

... Clearly, you people lack imagination. The reason why we're even arguing about Lotte is because the Audience-Alienating Premise is misleading. No matter how ridiculous the premise, it can be made into something heartwarming and tasteful.

@Kaiser: ...Uh, that's not actually accurate... Lotte, the ten year old succubus in question, doesn't actually give any blow jobs in the series, nor does she ever do anything explicit...

I don't see what imagination has to do with anything.

Yes, but as far as this work is concerned, no sexual hijinks occurred with the preteen succubus.

Y'know, you folks who are trying to appeal Lotte need to take a different tack. Instead of focusing on how "heartwarming" and whatever it is, you should be focusing on what it doesn't contain. I.e., what traits of pedoshit does the panel look for (underage sex, underage fanservice, underage blowjobs, people hitting on/being hit on by children, children masturbating, etc.), and whether or not this show/manga contains those elements.

Quality or heartwarmingness is just irrelevant, and if that's all you talk about it will look like you're just saying "But it's good pedoshit."

edited 29th Apr '12 9:47:41 PM by ArcadesSabboth

What Lotte doesn't contain is anything explicit, or anything to imply that Lotte does anything sexual at all.

Then how about the fact that Lotte does not like men, to the point of staffing her entire mansion with female charges so she won't be near them. Even when the male lead is told about his "job" with Lotte he too doesn't want to have any of it, and instead the two develop into a father-daughter relationship.

edited 29th Apr '12 9:52:56 PM by Spirit

Fine, let's see.

1. Male protagonist is a father with a ten year-old daughter, so he treats the the ten-year-old succubus like his daughter.

2. Ten year-old succubus doesn't like men because she was scarred when her mother had sex with a man in front of her. (Yes, she's a terrible parent.) The reason why the human is able to get close to her is because he treats her like a daughter instead of a lover.

3. Some comedic fan service here or there, but it involves the older characters instead of the ten year olds.

edited 29th Apr '12 9:53:26 PM by encrypted12345

...but the premise of Lotte is about sexualizing a 10 year old girl. Of course's it's pedoshit.

People keep saying, "It's really about a father and daughter bonding" or "it's about a daughter forced to grow up quickly" and stuff, but the thing is, all those premises can be done without making the girl a succubus. There are innumerable ways to write a scenario in which you can keep every other element people keep mentioning — young girl, told she has to grow up fast, protective dad, girl hates boys, etc. — without bringing in the succubus part. The only thing choosing the succubus route does is sexualize the girl. It doesn't matter if the manga or anime refrains from technically showing the girl having sex in order to evade the censors; the premise of the show goes to great pains and makes specific decisions to emphasize that 'THIS TEN YEAR OLD GIRL IS A SEX OBJECT.'

It's pedoshit, it violates the 'implied underage sex' rule on the wiki (the character is a succubus, sex is implied by her very existence), and shouldn't be on the wiki. I support Fast Eddie's decision to boot it.

...You're again relying too much on the Audience-Alienating Premise. -_-

Just because the character doesn't have to be a succubus to work doesn't mean making the character a succubus won't make the story more interesting, and, as has been stated, not only is there nothing explicit, Lotte is never even implied to have sex during the series' run. :/

Her being a succubus implies that she will have sex at some point, not that she will have sex while she is underaged. Why can't she abstain from having sex until she's, say, 18?

Is Darkstalkers purged/going to be purged because of Lilith?

Well, that doesn't count, as it's main-stream available in the US after all.

... Except no, it doesn't. There's no implied sex, she's pointed out to be too young to have sex, the first time she's been near a man he becomes her surrogate father figure and nothing sexual occurs.

The premise is off, but the premise shouldn't make you ignore the content.

For example, A Game of Thrones has the premise of "dark fantasy with interweaving plots and schemes and such". Yet the content includes a lot of things I find very, very disturbing and unsavory.

No, I'm not trying to say we should cut A Game of Thrones since it's exempt, but it's an example of the premise not always dictating the content.

Glider Guy. If it was unambiguously pedoshit and Lotte no Omocha was executed the way the Audience-Alienating Premise implied, we wouldn't be having this argument. -_-. Two of the P5 support it, so at least give some concrete evidence before you call their judgement wrong.

It should also be noted that Lotte no Omocha can be viewed, legally, through Crunchyroll.

edited 29th Apr '12 10:48:58 PM by Spirit

Doesn't that mean it automatically falls under the exemption clause?

Crunchyroll doesn't give ratings, so I don't know.

I was under the impression that Crunchyroll has a policy against showing hentai at all, though. Could just be my faulty memory.

Also, I want to know if lying about the content of a work constitutes trolling.

edited 30th Apr '12 12:01:40 AM by Ramidel

It probably would be considered trolling, yes. If under the pretense of being factual at least.

(EDIT: If you're trying to imply that everybody defending Lotte No Omocha is trolling, then I suggest you find out for yourself. And hey, if you're right then you might just get to kick two members of P5 from their seats for abusing the position.)

edited 30th Apr '12 12:16:25 AM by Sabbo