Batman General Discussion

Welcome to comics, son.

I've been in comics. The hypothetical in question was what would be done with the Joker in the real world, and in the real world, he would have been shanked to death in a prison a long time ago.

I think you underestimate the impact of a personality like Joker's. He's a mad dog. He doesn't care who he hurts, as long as he thinks it's funny. He's ruthless and smart and unpredictable.

The point is kinda moot, since a real world prison would never put a Joker in direct contact with the general prisoners.

Doesn't change the fact that, in-universe, he tends to be an alpha male whenever you put amongst other prisoners or inmates. I figure his reputation has a lot to do with it. And physically, he's been able to overpower men like twice his size, and even do things like holding his own against platoons of Ra's al Ghul's guards.

If you can even trade two punches against Batman before going down, you should be a physical beast in real world terms. Even a guy like Penguin, who can beat the Spoiler in one to one combat, would probably eat alive almost anyone from the real world in a street fight.

Steph and Ozzie had one-on-one combat? o.O

It was right before Steph started her Robin career. They were pretty even during most of the fight, but eventually Ozzie overpowered her and gave her a warning before getting away in a helicopter. Technically, he could have just shot her through the skull right there, since he had her at his feet and groggy, but I guess he just didn't want to face Batman's anger afterwards.

Okay, because I know about the Steph and Cass vs. Penguin comic, while she was Robin. I hadn't heard of that one, tho.

I expect, in reality, the Joker in the general population of a prison is going to be something akin to Rorschach (from Watchmen) in prison, albeit with more maniacal laughter. They'd probably stick him in isolation pretty quick, if not for his own protection then for the protection of others.

Well, the key thing to remember about Comic Books as written as Marvel Comics and DC Comics is that they are very much like those TV Soap Operas. You have a story that has been told since the 1930s, and it never really ends. Because of that, a number of characters must live on, and if they die, they'll come back. Of course, it really tests your Willing Suspension of Disbelief, but maybe both companies count on people having short-term memories. Too bad they never counted on websites like TV Tropes....

Oh, yeah, and at the risk of sounding like a Johnny-come-lately, the Commissioner's Sociopathic son James Gordon Jr. has returned. I wondered if he would. There are some readers who say the Junior is terrifying because he's apparently a more realistic portrayal of a sociopath. Those are probably the same ones who think that Depending on the Writer is going to work against the character, because it looks like a different writer is going to interpret him as a crazy knife-wielding thug. That doesn't sound like a more realistic portrayal of a sociopath, does it? <Raises eyebrow>

Its almost offensive. I have never raised a knife against anyone in my life, and thug implies less than full mental capacities. Which would imply that the writers think all sociopaths are violent serial killers with damaged mental faculties.

I might just complain to the new writer about this portrayal - with a knife. I am kidding, you know.

Though, I do admit, there is something I am confused about. His plan the last time seemed to be built likewise on the premise that all sociopaths are serial killers. Realistically, his plan would result in a generation of babies growing up to be lawyers and used car salesmen.

edited 13th Dec '12 6:44:24 PM by NickTheSwing

Well, in Gotham, lawyers and serial killers seem to have a symbiotic comfortable relationship.

Think about it. Compare the times you have seen Joker killing one of his henchmen compared to the times you have seen him killing one of his defense lawyers.

In response to the whole; Joker would've gotten shanked in prison...Joker is committed to Arkham, not Blackgate. The asylum setting has much more control of its inmates, comparitively speaking, than prison does. Even if the insane people in Arkham cared or was sane enough to realize that the Joker is a mass-murderer...The asylum staff would quickly be on the scene and stop it. And the more sane criminals in Arkham, like Mr. Freeze, would be too afraid of Joker to try and kill him.

Well, Freeze needs to be in isolation all the time due to his special condition, so he can't hang with the other inmates anyway.

Well, what about Ra's al Ghul, who is pretty sane, sort of, but he's just extreme in his views. Sort of like zealous envrionmentlaists.

Ra's al Ghul doesn't strike me as the type to be afraid of anyone. Honestly, I have a hard time thinking of any rogue of Batman's that would be outright intimidated by the Joker. "He's too crazy to work with," perhaps, but not "Oh no, it's the Joker, please don't kill me!"

I suppose Lawyers and Serial Killers in Gotham seem symbiotic, but it seems like a rather large logical leap to make in a supposed realistic take on what a sociopath would be like. I mean, James Jr. seemed well educated about his condition, so why make such an error?

edited 14th Dec '12 5:15:06 PM by NickTheSwing

Well, minor leagues guys like Twedledee and Twedledum, Kite-Man or Cluemaster? Yeah, I can see them being terrified by being near Joker.

I'd imagine the Penquin and the Riddler would be too.

Hey, check these out.

http://batx15.deviantart.com/art/Falcone-Crime-Family-328477124?q=gallery%3Abatx15&qo=3

http://batx15.deviantart.com/art/Maroni-Crime-Family-342388916?q=gallery%3Abatx15&qo=2

http://batx15.deviantart.com/art/Vitti-Crime-Family-342389359?q=gallery%3Abatx15&qo=1

http://batx15.deviantart.com/art/The-Riley-Gang-342389689?q=gallery%3Abatx15&qo=0

Pretty cool, huh?

X

One of Joker's main weapons is his charisma. If anyone was that charismatic in real life, even a maximum security prison wouldn't be able to hold them. Joker is just going to corrupt the first person he can talk to.

Thank you so much for providing those pictures! I've heard about crime families in Gotham, not to mention seeing or hearing about a number of characters, but I never really had a big picture to look at!

It's interesting that a number of the costumed villains that Batman fights against are in those pictures. It just goes to show that taking down a crime family can be quite difficult.

I guess The Joker doesn't belong in any of these crime families. No, he strikes me as either an independent or the type to start up his own crime family...with him at the head, of course!

I have three batman related questions for this forum thread.

1. Wass Bruce wayne's uncle Phillip Wayne still in canon on new earth before the flash-point reboot?

2. Is there any info about Bruce Wayne's grandparents?

3. Would what if Bruce Wayne was shot with his parents make a good elseworlds story? I'm thinking either bruce dies and becomes the spectre or he survives but ends up as a cripple i'm working on a fanfic.

Thanks for everybody's time

1. I don't believe so. Philip Wayne was the one who raised Bruce before Frank Miller's Batman: Year One retconned things so that Bruce had no living relatives and was raised by Alfred.

2. Again, I don't believe much has ever been said about either Bruce Wayne's paternal or maternal grandparents (though Martha's maiden name was Kane, and she was heir to the Kane Chemical fortune; I don't know if she's supposed to be any relation to Batwoman in the New 52. I'm pretty sure both sets are supposed to be deceased at the time of his orphaning, though.

3. Could be. Go for it.

Thanks for the answers and would it be a better story if bruce was crippled or would it be a better story if he died and became the spectre and I can't decide which particular story idea to go with right now?

Opinion question for this thread. Do you think that Batman joining the Justice League diminshes his crimefighting effectiveness? Pre-Justice League, Batman was viewed as the bat-like demon from the pits of hell that was secret and deadly. No one ever saw or knew about very well. However, joining the Justice League causes Batman to be seen in publicity photos and it seems that most Justice League villains know Batman has no powers. So, what do you guys think?