Casantifa.
I like these, but the fact they have been from the 40s so far bugs me on a fundamental level. Like the illustration of the lack of modern ones, perhaps because film is such a high barrier medium (what was that Cocteau quote in that Beauty in The Beast video he did, I should look for the actual quote anyways "film will never be an art/until the sum of it's parts/are as cheap as ink and pen") I'm thinking of that, and apparently word vomitting. To clarify it doesn't bug me on Kyle Kalgren's part it bugs me on what films are getting made way. Granted there are only two ones so far, maybe their are modern ones I'm just not familiar with.
FWIW, he posted a list
on Twitter of potential films he could cover in this series
Oh it's chronological that makes sense.
Witness Kyle break from gnomes.
Kyle elaborates on the specific definition of fascism.
I am copying my comment since it been increasing on my mind as the political discourse has become more heated and seemingly more coarse: I enjoyed this video but a quick question: Based on the current video’s definition of fascism, where does developing a national identity come into play? Correct me if I'm wrong, but being a basic member of society, taking pride, to even a minor degree, in one's country is fairly standard. Rather you are German, American, Chinese, or Israeli, you are choosing one country over another. Would that be fascism? If the answer is only concerned with radicals, how does this video not come across as "Chicken Little the sky is falling" mentality?
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
I don't recall if Kyle specifically mentions national identity, and I don't know if fascism specifically needs a national identity so much as a singular identity for people to rally behind (which can be and often has been national identity), and is at least partially defined by the belief that everyone outside of that identity is bad and inferior. In terms of national identity, it's not simply being proud of your country or even preferring it to others - it's the view that your country is inherently superior to all others, and must be that way.
I think it's also worth noting who fits into that identity will often be excluded based on the needs of the movement (obvious example - the Nazis didn't consider Jews to be "real Germans").
In any case, yes, it's a radical position, but just because it's radical doesn't mean that people who hold that position are politically irrelevant - indeed, I personally spotted most, if not all, of the warning signs Kyle listed in the behavior of Donald Trump.
Oh God! Natural light!
insert commentary here
There was a good Saturday Morning Breakfast Cereal comic on the subject which I think delineates the problems with excess nationalism and how merely having a national identity is not that but I can't remember which one it was
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
insert commentary here
Yeah that was the one I was thinking of
Point no. 2 of Eco's Ur-Fascism tenets is probably the most interesting point to me as it's something I've never really thought about before with ideologies.
So how did the Nationalist’s house get built if it wasn’t by way of patriotism and what is the difference of Nationalism and Fascism?
Edited by snaver on Sep 2nd 2019 at 9:37:23 AM
Nationalism and patriotism are closely linked, but sometimes people use Nationalism to mean bad patriotism, the kind where your country is superior to others and people in your country who aren't patriotic should leave.
Well Fascism often is nationalistic it is not the only thing, someone could say include immigrants or refugees (to use current examples) and not want an autocracy, not believe in some greater past and be nationalistic, those elements tend to be their with fascism.
Video response:
I wish that progressives wouldn't use trigger as a mocking thing. But he makes good points about how fascists benefit from fascism's definition being fuzzy. Also good examples for what Ur-Fascism can look like or mean.
Indeed.
Nationalism and facsim are often comorbid, but are not necessarily so.
Despite my screen-name, ranting to you about One Piece is not my top priority.
Yes exactly.
Explain. How is the video not projecting a “Chicken Little” or “mountain out of a molehill” mentality? Is nationalism or fascism the natural or logical endpoint to patriotism?
If you honestly don't see it I can't help you.
I don't think you can have fascism without nationalism. It's kind of one of the core tenets. You can be nationalist without being fascist, but you can't be fascist without being nationalist.
I dunno, he inherited it? I mean, most nationalists did not themselves build the nations that they take pride in. For the purpose of the allegory, the fact that he has the house does not mean he put work into making it nice.
Edited by DrDougsh on Sep 2nd 2019 at 9:52:27 AM
I recall this same topic came up years ago on this very thread after Kyle's Yeelen review, since the video has him examining Mali's, Germany's, and America's founding myths about themselves.
Edited by Tuckerscreator on Sep 2nd 2019 at 12:41:03 PM
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
That is a good metaphor. The nation exists before the fascism or the fascists would have nothing to harken back to.
Inheritance implies family ties. As social creatures, would that increase the nationalistic tendencies?
I’m enjoying this discussion 
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
Well, one hallmark of fascism is the desire to return to a mythical, bygone era where everything was better, so I suppose “inheriting” a country would make it so that living memory of what things were actually like dies out over time.
Oh God! Natural light!
A byproduct of country’s identity is the development of the narrative of its origins. No narrative is perfect (Hi, America and England). If you are choosing one over another, would that be a form a fascism?
Also, I am happy to see Kyle admitting to not being more clear over which political side fascism is on was a failure on his part. That is really my issue with the video. Just how broad and simple his definition actually is.
Edited by snaver on Sep 2nd 2019 at 7:30:02 AM
No I'd say it's more like when you get into "Make America great again" to use a current example. Though there can be issues with some narratives and some narratives are more exploitable, like there is issues with "America is a melting pot" or "a nation of immigrants" which ignores some things, Colonialism for example, but isn't used in the same way.
Or wonderful progressive multiculturalism vs whatever the fascist one for Canada is, which I don't know, beyond it definitely exists. Think it might be explicit in it's Imperial apologism probably? I don't know I'd have to listen to Bernier or something and I'd rather not.
Kyle did a video about the Shakespeare Garden.
Judging by his and Jourdain’s twitter, his next Shakespeare video will be Gnomeo & Juliet.
Edited by Tuckerscreator on Jul 2nd 2019 at 11:12:00 AM