Follow TV Tropes

Following

History YMMV / FantasticBeastsTheCrimesOfGrindelwald

Go To

OR

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* HarsherInHindsight: The reveal that Queenie cast a love spell on Jacob to force him to marry her, which is treated more sympathetically than Corvus Lestrange's similar use of the Imperius Curse in his backstory, becomes this given Rowling's increasingly transphobic posts, a number of which indicate a bigoted attitude towards men by stereotyping them as predators.

to:

* HarsherInHindsight: The reveal that Queenie cast a love spell on Jacob to force him to marry her, which her (which is treated more sympathetically than Corvus Lestrange's similar use of the Imperius Curse in his backstory, backstory) becomes this given Rowling's increasingly transphobic posts, a number of which indicate a bigoted attitude towards men by stereotyping them as predators.

Added: 367

Removed: 367

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* HarsherInHindsight: The reveal that Queenie cast a love spell on Jacob to force him to marry her, which is treated more sympathetically than Corvus Lestrange's similar use of the Imperius Curse in his backstory, becomes this given Rowling's increasingly transphobic posts, a number of which indicate a bigoted attitude towards men by stereotyping them as predators.



* HarsherInHindsight: The reveal that Queenie cast a love spell on Jacob to force him to marry her, which is treated more sympathetically than Corvus Lestrange's similar use of the Imperius Curse in his backstory, becomes this given Rowling's increasingly transphobic posts, a number of which indicate a bigoted attitude towards men by stereotyping them as predators.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* HarsherInHinsdight: The reveal that Queenie cast a love spell on Jacob to force him to marry her, which is treated more sympathetically than Corvus Lestrange's similar use of the Imperius Curse in his backstory, becomes this given Rowling's increasingly transphobic posts, a number of which indicate a bigoted attitude towards men by stereotyping them as predators.

to:

* HarsherInHinsdight: HarsherInHindsight: The reveal that Queenie cast a love spell on Jacob to force him to marry her, which is treated more sympathetically than Corvus Lestrange's similar use of the Imperius Curse in his backstory, becomes this given Rowling's increasingly transphobic posts, a number of which indicate a bigoted attitude towards men by stereotyping them as predators.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* HarsherInHinsdight: The reveal that Queenie cast a love spell on Jacob to force him to marry her, which is treated more sympathetically than Corvus Lestrange's similar use of the Imperius Curse in his backstory, becomes this given Rowling's increasingly transphobic posts, a number of which indicate a bigoted attitude towards men by stereotyping them as predators.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Has nothing to do with the trope.


* EveryoneIsSatanInHell: So many interpret Grindelwald's ultimate goal is to prevent W.W.II and the Holocaust given he shows his vision of the war, "if they do not act." But Grindelwald actually uses the vision of the War and the atrocities to emphasize how dangerous the Muggles are and makes a SlipperySlopeFallacy that the humans discovery of the Wizarding World is inevitable and they will commit the same levels of atrocities on them as they do on themselves. Grindelwald is making loads of presumptions that the later story of Harry Potter demonstrates he is wrong as the Wizarding World is still unknown 70 years later.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* TheWoobie: Poor Jacob has it hard in this movie. Just after getting his memories back, he ends up scuttling his relationship with Queenie because of his own fear that she would be persecuted for their relationship, not helping matters is that he spent most of the time under the influence of a love potion. [[spoiler:He also discovers from Grindelwald the possibility of another World War (mind you, he was a World War I veteran), and loses Queenie, who joins with Grindelwald.]] By the end of the movie, he looks absolutely broken.

to:

* TheWoobie: Poor Jacob has it hard in this movie. Just after getting his memories back, he ends up scuttling his relationship with Queenie because of his own fear that she would be persecuted for their relationship, not helping matters is that he spent most of the time under the influence of a love potion.enchantment. [[spoiler:He also discovers from Grindelwald the possibility of another World War (mind you, he was a World War I veteran), and loses Queenie, who joins with Grindelwald.]] By the end of the movie, he looks absolutely broken.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Misplaced, moving to the correct tab

Added DiffLines:

* IKnewIt:
** The reveal of Nagini being the Maledictus was a fan theory when the character was first revealed.
** On that note, Nagini being a [[ArtisticLicenseBiology venomous constrictor]] has generally been handwaved by fans as her not being a normal snake. This film confirms that Nagini is indeed ''not'' an ordinary snake.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
trope was cut/disambiguated due to cleanup


* EvilIsSexy: Vinda Rosier looks like a fashion model and no matter how evil her actions as Grindelwald's most prominent supporter, it doesn't take away from her appearance.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* MemeticMutation: Many reviews said the biggest crime was the movie itself.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* MisBlamed: Upon release, the film was considered poorly written and most people blamed Creator/JKRowling for it being confusing and hard to follow. However with the release of the extended cut, the main criticism of the theatrical cut was that it is poorly edited and to a lesser extent poorly directed. Most people who’ve seen the extended cut will blame Creator/WarnerBrothers and then CEO Kevin Tsujihara for forcing a mandated runtime at the last minute and tying everyone involved’s hands rather than the creatives themselves.

to:

* MisBlamed: Upon release, the film was considered poorly written and most people blamed Creator/JKRowling for it being confusing and hard to follow. However with the release of the extended cut, the main criticism of the theatrical cut was that it is view has changed to the film being poorly edited and to the victim of ExecutiveMeddling more than anything. Since the extended cut is mostly cut exposition that gives more context, the consensus is now that the foundation of the story is fine but that said foundation was cut out from under it by a lesser extent poorly directed. massacre in the editing room. Most people who’ve seen the extended cut will blame believe that ultimately Creator/WarnerBrothers and then CEO Kevin Tsujihara are the real ones to blame for forcing mandating a mandated runtime film be chopped up at the last minute to meet an arbitrary runtime limit against the creatives’ vision. Tsujihara famously and tying everyone involved’s hands rather than similarly forced ''Film/BatmanVSupermanDawnOfJustice'' to have a whole half hour cut after it was already done because he believed that long movies made less money because they could play less often. He was ultimately fired from WB shortly after this film came out after he was found to have been promising roles and auditions to the creatives themselves.woman he was having an extramarital affair with.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* ImprovedByTheReCut: The film was heavily criticized on release for its confusing and crowded plotting. The extended cut available on the Blu-Ray has several expository scenes that add some vital context and help out with the pacing, especially in the second act.

to:

* ImprovedByTheReCut: The film was heavily criticized on release for its confusing and crowded plotting. The extended cut available version of the film included on the Blu-Ray has several expository scenes is widely considered to be a huge step up from the theatrical version. The extended version of the film contains about fourteen minutes of cut content that add some vital context goes a long way to make the story more comprehensible and help easier to follow. The cut content is almost exclusively exposition that helps to explain certain character who were victims of the condensed runtimes’ choices. The Credence and Nagini subplot in particular stands out with as much more understandable than in the theatrical cut, although Queenie’s subplot is also markedly improved. What is widely considered to be the most baffling cut scene is the extended version of Newt and Dumbledore’s conversation early on about why Grindelwald was looking for an obscurial since it directly explains why he’d sent Newt to New York in the first movie. What’s even more baffling is that it only clocks in at 40 seconds. The longer runtime also helps to smooth out the pacing, especially in the second act.act, by giving the film some room to breathe. The extended cut is by no means considered a masterpiece but the sum of the parts do come together to form a whole, cohesive story rather than the theatrical cut being a series of scenes strung together that starts and finishes strong but suffers from a chaotic middle that drags down the entire product.



* MisBlamed: When the film first came out, Creator/JKRowling bore a brunt of the criticism for its failures. However, with the release of the extended cut, more of that criticism has shifted onto director Creator/DavidYates and editor Mark Day for making choices to cut short but vital scenes that add more emotional weight and much-needed exposition that make it more coherent. There was also an edict from WB mandating the film be under 2hrs 15 minutes, tying Rowling, Yates, and Day's hands about the final product.

to:

* MisBlamed: When Upon release, the film first came out, was considered poorly written and most people blamed Creator/JKRowling bore a brunt of the criticism for its failures. However, it being confusing and hard to follow. However with the release of the extended cut, more of that the main criticism has shifted onto director Creator/DavidYates and editor Mark Day for making choices to of the theatrical cut short but vital scenes was that add more emotional weight it is poorly edited and much-needed exposition that make it more coherent. There was also an edict from WB mandating to a lesser extent poorly directed. Most people who’ve seen the film be under 2hrs 15 minutes, extended cut will blame Creator/WarnerBrothers and then CEO Kevin Tsujihara for forcing a mandated runtime at the last minute and tying Rowling, Yates, and Day's everyone involved’s hands about rather than the final product.creatives themselves.



** Creator/JohnnyDepp's involvement in the franchise became this due to the allegations made by ex-wife Creator/AmberHeard of abuse. While his appearance in the first film was relegated to a surprise cameo, the expansion of his role (and replacement of Creator/ColinFarrell) in the second film initially generated a significant amount of negative press from audiences, critics, and media alike, although his role was mostly praised once the film was released. However, in early November 2020, Depp lost a libel against ''[[UsefulNotes/BritishNewspapers The Sun]]'' for calling him a "wife beater." The judge ruled that while she was abusive to him, she also proved that he abused her in 12 of 14 instances, meaning "wife beater" was not libellous. He ended up leaving the role of Grindelwald altogether after this, at Creator/WarnerBros' request.

to:

** Creator/JohnnyDepp's involvement in the franchise became this due to the allegations made by ex-wife Creator/AmberHeard of abuse. While his appearance in the first film was relegated to a surprise cameo, the expansion of his role (and replacement of Creator/ColinFarrell) in the second film initially generated a significant amount of negative press from audiences, critics, and media alike, although his role was mostly praised once the film was released. However, in early November 2020, Depp lost a libel against ''[[UsefulNotes/BritishNewspapers The Sun]]'' for calling him a "wife beater." The judge ruled that while she was abusive to him, she also proved that he abused her in 12 of 14 instances, meaning "wife beater" was not libellous. He ended up leaving the role of Grindelwald altogether after this, at Creator/WarnerBros' request.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* TookTheBadFilmSeriously: WebVideo/JennyNicholson felt that Creator/JudeLaw was the saving grace of the film; absolutely nailing Creator/MichaelGambon's mannerisms and being very believable as a young Dumbledore.

to:

* TookTheBadFilmSeriously: WebVideo/JennyNicholson felt that Creator/JudeLaw was the saving grace of the film; film, absolutely nailing Creator/MichaelGambon's mannerisms and being very believable as a young Dumbledore.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* EveryoneIsSatanInHell: So many interpret Grindelwald's ultimate goal is to prevent W.W.II and the Holocaust given he shows his vision of the war, "if they do not act." But Grindelwald actually uses the vision of the War and the atrocities to emphasize how dangerous the Muggles are and makes a SlipperySlopeFallacy that the humans discovery of the Wizarding World is inevitable and they will commit the same levels of atrocities on them as they do on themselves. Grindelwald is making loads of presumptions that the later story of Harry Potter demonstrates he is wrong as the Wizarding World is still unknown 70 years later.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* ImprovedByTheReCut: The film was heavily criticized on release for its confusing and crowded plotting. The extended cut available on the Blu-Ray has deleted scenes that add some much-needed pacing and context.
* MisaimedFandom: [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMP4sR3zgRY This video]] offers the idea that various scenes were meant to contrast Grindelwald as a {{foil}} to Voldemort, such as being unable to kill a baby himself when the latter did (tried to, anyway) with no hesitation, but flew over peoples' heads (likely because they watched the original movies so long ago they had forgotten the details).

to:

* ImprovedByTheReCut: The film was heavily criticized on release for its confusing and crowded plotting. The extended cut available on the Blu-Ray has deleted several expository scenes that add some much-needed pacing vital context and context.
help out with the pacing, especially in the second act.
* MisaimedFandom: [[https://www.MisaimedFandom:[[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMP4sR3zgRY This video]] offers the idea that various scenes were meant to contrast Grindelwald as a {{foil}} to Voldemort, such as being unable to kill a baby himself when the latter did (tried to, anyway) with no hesitation, but flew over peoples' heads (likely because they watched the original movies so long ago they had forgotten the details).
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Names The Same is no longer a trope


** The reveal of Claudia Kim's character's name: Nagini. No, it's not NamesTheSame. She's ''that'' one.

to:

** The reveal of Claudia Kim's character's name: Nagini. No, it's not NamesTheSame.a coincidence. She's ''that'' one.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Moved to Trivia


* AuthorsSavingThrow: In the original books, [[ChildByRape Voldemort's origins]] endured some flak from certain readers, as they seemed to insinuate that being conceived through a loveless union would automatically make someone a sociopath with no understanding of love or empathy. While it may not have been intentional, the issue is rectified in this film by establishing Leta Lestrange to be a morally-upright, albeit flawed individual, who displays great love and devotion toward Newt and his brother [[spoiler:and even sacrifices herself to save them from Grindelwald]], despite being born and raised under circumstances eerily similar to those of Tom Riddle himself.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** Leta Lestrange, for some people. It seemed to be that they were setting her up to be both a romantic rival to Tina and, if not an antagonist, then a morally ambiguous WildCard whose story arc and internal conflict would span most—if not all—of the pentalogy. But in this film, there doesn't seem to be much trace of the person Queenie describes. She's unambiguously TheAtoner and the DarkSecret is far and away in her past (although it does affect her and the story in the present). Her one interaction with Tina amounted to an awkward hello, and although she gets her backstory, it's burned through in the space of one film with all the subtlety of a drunk mountain troll, with little explaining how the girl Newt knew in Hogwarts became the woman we finally meet in the second movie — or, for that matter, how she ended up [[SettleForSibling engaged to Theseus]], who she likely wouldn't have known at Hogwarts as he is 'several' years older than she is. It wouldn't be as bad if she became a recurring supporting character in future movies, [[spoiler:if only they didn't kill her off at the end]].

to:

** Leta Lestrange, for some people. It seemed to be that they were setting her up to be both a romantic rival to Tina and, if not an antagonist, then a morally ambiguous WildCard whose story arc and internal conflict would span most—if not all—of the pentalogy. But in this film, there doesn't seem to be much trace of the person Queenie describes. She's unambiguously TheAtoner and the DarkSecret is far and away in her past (although it does affect her and the story in the present). Her one interaction with Tina amounted to an awkward hello, and although she gets her backstory, it's burned through in the space of one film with all the subtlety of a drunk mountain troll, with little explaining how the girl Newt knew in Hogwarts became the woman we finally meet in the second movie — or, movie—or, for that matter, how she ended up [[SettleForSibling engaged to Theseus]], who she likely wouldn't have known at Hogwarts as he is 'several' years several ''years'' older than she is. It wouldn't be as bad if she became a recurring supporting character in future movies, [[spoiler:if only they didn't kill her off at the end]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** Leta Lestrange, for some people. It seemed to be that they were setting her up to be both a romantic rival to Tina and, if not an antagonist, then a morally ambiguous WildCard whose story arc and internal conflict would span most of, if not all of, the pentalogy. But in this film, there doesn't seem to be much trace of the person Queenie describes. She's unambiguously TheAtoner and the DarkSecret is far and away in her past (although it does affect her and the story in the present). Her one interaction with Tina amounted to an awkward hello, and although she gets her backstory, it's burned through in the space of one film with all the subtlety of a drunk mountain troll, with little explaining how the girl Newt knew in Hogwarts became the woman we finally meet in the second movie — or, for that matter, how she ended up [[SettleForSibling engaged to Theseus]], who she likely wouldn't have known at Hogwarts as he is 'several' years older than she is. It wouldn't be as bad if she became a recurring supporting character in future movies, [[spoiler:if only they didn't kill her off at the end]].

to:

** Leta Lestrange, for some people. It seemed to be that they were setting her up to be both a romantic rival to Tina and, if not an antagonist, then a morally ambiguous WildCard whose story arc and internal conflict would span most of, if most—if not all of, all—of the pentalogy. But in this film, there doesn't seem to be much trace of the person Queenie describes. She's unambiguously TheAtoner and the DarkSecret is far and away in her past (although it does affect her and the story in the present). Her one interaction with Tina amounted to an awkward hello, and although she gets her backstory, it's burned through in the space of one film with all the subtlety of a drunk mountain troll, with little explaining how the girl Newt knew in Hogwarts became the woman we finally meet in the second movie — or, for that matter, how she ended up [[SettleForSibling engaged to Theseus]], who she likely wouldn't have known at Hogwarts as he is 'several' years older than she is. It wouldn't be as bad if she became a recurring supporting character in future movies, [[spoiler:if only they didn't kill her off at the end]].

Top