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History Headscratchers / TheEmperorsNewGroove

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** Kuzco recalled how his last interaction with Pacha ended with a (unsuccessful) protest against the farmer's plan to terminate the latter's village in favor of Kuzcotopia. And now Kuzco is with Patcha in his village in the form of a llama. He jumps to the conclusion that Patcha turned him into a llama and smuggled him to the village without contemplating the plausibility of how he did it. As for Yzma, Kuzco gives her the benefit of a doubt throughout this whole movie. Sure, he fired her after years of going behind his back with her authority, but (as far as he knew) she was still loyal to him with virtually every bone in her body.
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** In the conversation where Pacha tells him Yzma and Kronk are trying to kill him, Kuzco says 'Kill me? Their whole world revolves around me.' It literally never occurred to him that Yzma meant him harm until he's hit with it shortly after. When he wakes up in Pacha's cart earlier, he can't seem to remember anything up to a point, not even the dinner, maybe his memories, or lack thereof, prevented him from connecting the dots.
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** Maybe Kronk feels that Tipo's misunderstanding truly is his fault, since -- as the scout master -- he's supposed to set an exemplary example and be an ideal role model for his troopers.
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*** Yzma also has the benefit of being the acting empress who can order people to do pretty much anything she wants. No doubt she would have an easier time getting into and through the palace than some peasant and his llama.
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** Kuzco is kind of a horrible person, so Kronk may not have felt all that bad about it until he really started to think about it. Alternatively, or maybe even tying in, Yzma's a very dominating personality and she clearly has to keep him on track with her evil schemes. Could be that once he was away from her, he actually started to think of the moral implications of what he was doing.
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** Kronk's kind of an idiot. He probably didn't think to tell Yzma HOW Kuzco got out of the city, and Yzma probably never bothered to ask. Once he realized that if he found that peasant, he'd find Kuzco, it was as simple as finally telling Yzma what happened and her going "Bet it was that fat guy from that place Kuzco wanted to tear down."
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** Considering how casual Kuzco is about the whole thing, even talking to her about what she'll do now that she's been put out to pasture, it doesn't seem like he had any intentions of kicking her out. He just wanted her off his big fancy chair.
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** The room they're eating in is too small to be the palace dining hall. It's Yzma's personal quarters. As for why he wouldn't suspect anything, it is literally a plot point that he could not comprehend that Yzma would want him dead until he heard it from her own mouth, even if he did fire her. After all, she's the closest thing to a parent he has, and he IS still letting her live in the palace.
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Bleh.


** For some, it doesn't get the impression that Kuzco was completely serious when he accused Pacha. But beyond that, [[JerkassBall that's the point.]] Kuzco is so self-centered that he automatically assumes that what he says is right and anyone else who goes against him is wrong. It's not so much that Pacha and Yzma both had motives for revenge, it's that Pacha tried to argue against Kuzco's verdict about destroying his home, whereas Yzma did the bare minimum to make it seem as though there were no hard feelings. As Kuzco says, Pacha is the only one who doesn't seem to "get the point" that the whole world revolves around Kuzco, so to Kuzco, he's the most obvious person to want to do him any harm. Add in the fact that Yzma "practically raised him", according to her, and that she was beneath suspicion to him should be a lot easier to grasp.

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** For some, it It doesn't get the impression that seem as though Kuzco was completely serious when he accused Pacha.Pacha; rather, it's just an empty threat he throws around when he's feeling particularly mean-spirited. But beyond that, [[JerkassBall that's the point.]] Kuzco is so self-centered that he automatically assumes that what he says is right and anyone else who goes against him is wrong. It's not so much that Pacha and Yzma both had motives for revenge, it's that Pacha tried to argue against Kuzco's verdict about destroying his home, whereas Yzma did the bare minimum to make it seem as though there were no hard feelings. As Kuzco says, Pacha is the only one who doesn't seem to "get the point" that the whole world revolves around Kuzco, so to Kuzco, he's the most obvious person to want to do him any harm. Add in the fact that Yzma "practically raised him", according to her, and that she was beneath suspicion to him should be a lot easier to grasp.
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Writing in First Person No Likey.
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Rewriting to be less first person.


*** I believe the WordOfGod from the director is that, as the film says at the beginning, it takes place Long Ago In The Jungle. Any more then that, and you're overthinking it.

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*** I believe the WordOfGod from the director is that, as the film says at the beginning, it takes place Long Ago In The Jungle. Any more then that, and you're overthinking it.



*** I thought the movie made it clear that it was set in the Incan Empire before the Conquistadors arrived.
*** I think the Bob's Big Boy-esque resturant might be what's throwing them off. I just think everyone should remember that [[MST3KMantra it's just an animated movie]], though.

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*** I thought Didn't the movie made it clear that it was set in the Incan Empire before the Conquistadors arrived.
arrived?
*** I think the The Bob's Big Boy-esque resturant might be what's throwing them off. I just think Assuming everyone should remember that [[MST3KMantra it's just an animated movie]], though.



[[folder: It Just Bugs Me]]

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[[folder: It "It Just Bugs Me]]Me, Literally"]]



* Where are all those servants at the dinner scene? You'd think the palace dining hall would have many people to cook and serve to Kuzco, let alone witness his llama transformation. And even if we assume that dining room is in Yzma's quarters of the palace, why would Kozco go there for dinner without suspecting she was up to something, considering that he just fired her?

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* Where are all those servants at the dinner scene? You'd think the palace dining hall would have many people to cook and serve to Kuzco, let alone witness his llama transformation. And even if we assume that dining room is in Yzma's quarters of the palace, why would Kozco Kuzco go there for dinner without suspecting she was up to something, considering that he just fired her?



* How ''did'' they get there? They certainly got me...

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* How ''did'' they get there? They certainly got me...there?...



** Well, ya got me. By all accounts, it doesn't make sense.
** I think what happened is it took quite awhile for Kuzco and Pacha to sneak into the palace just to get to Yzma's lab. It's just [[NoodleIncident that part was entirely skipped over]], giving Yzma and Kronk ample time to get in before the heroes did. Maybe the river they fell into also rushed them close to the palace beforehand.

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** Well, ya got me. By all accounts, it doesn't make sense.
** I think Maybe what happened is it took quite awhile for Kuzco and Pacha to sneak into the palace just to get to Yzma's lab. It's just [[NoodleIncident that part was entirely skipped over]], giving Yzma and Kronk ample time to get in before the heroes did. Maybe the river they fell into also rushed them close to the palace beforehand.



** I always assumed it was in case of an intruder and that Kronk constantly pulling the wrong lever was just {{Rule of Funny}}.

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** I It's always assumed it was in case of an intruder and that Kronk constantly pulling the wrong lever was just {{Rule of Funny}}.



*** I'd assume after getting dumped down there so often the crocs are used to humans now and have become more playful than vicious. Basically Kronk ruined the trap.

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*** I'd It would assume after getting dumped down there so often the crocs are used to humans now and have become more playful than vicious. Basically Kronk ruined the trap.



** Yzma raised Kuzco and was planning to use him as her PuppetKing, so I don't doubt that she, er, [[FridgeHorror removed them from the picture]].
*** is confirmed in the cartoon. Kuzco's mother died in childbirth, and his father died at sea a few months later, it's implied Yzma caused it somehow. And served as Kuczo' s regent until he came of age (which might explain him being upset over her "doing his job", espically with him being an adult). There's also a small hint that Kuczo worries about living up to his dad, who was a fantastic ruler.

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** Yzma raised Kuzco and was planning to use him as her PuppetKing, so I don't there's no doubt that she, er, [[FridgeHorror removed them from the picture]].
*** is It's confirmed in the cartoon. Kuzco's mother died in childbirth, and his father died at sea a few months later, it's implied Yzma caused it somehow. And served as Kuczo' s regent until he came of age (which might explain him being upset over her "doing his job", espically with him being an adult). There's also a small hint that Kuczo worries about living up to his dad, who was a fantastic ruler.



* During the diner scene, we witness Kronk's first working day in Mudka's Hut's kitchen. Despite being busy with Yzma and their mission to find Kuzco, it seems the restaurant finally found a cook much more skilled and lighter than the previous one. Despite the good news, he leaves the diner a few minutes later along with Yzma, her new sombrero hat and a birthday cake slice, leaving Mudka's Meat Hut without a cook and no one to replace him any sooner. I just wonder how the diner managed to keep its business running without Kronk's aid, at least before he would have decided to restart his cooking career after the ending of the first movie.

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* During the diner scene, we witness Kronk's first working day in Mudka's Hut's kitchen. Despite being busy with Yzma and their mission to find Kuzco, it seems the restaurant finally found a cook much more skilled and lighter than the previous one. Despite the good news, he leaves the diner a few minutes later along with Yzma, her new sombrero hat and a birthday cake slice, leaving Mudka's Meat Hut without a cook and no one to replace him any sooner. I It's just a wonder how the diner managed to keep its business running without Kronk's aid, at least before he would have decided to restart his cooking career after the ending of the first movie.



* I was wondering what Yzma was still doing inside the palace at dinnertime (DINNERTIME!) if Kuzco had already fired her earlier that day...
** Well, since she was a royal advisor--if not THE royal advisor--I always assumed she just lived in the palace like most of the other servants. She probably made some excuse about needing time to get her things, clear out her old room, etc.

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* I was wondering There's a thought on what Yzma was still doing inside the palace at dinnertime (DINNERTIME!) if Kuzco had already fired her earlier that day...
** Well, since she was a royal advisor--if not THE royal advisor--I always advisor--it's assumed she just lived in the palace like most of the other servants. She probably made some excuse about needing time to get her things, clear out her old room, etc.



** Just because Kronk didn't know who Pacha was at the time doesn't mean that Yzma wouldn't know him. IIRC Pacha was a village chief, so there might possibly have been records on him and she might know him by description, as well as that he was summoned to the palace on the same day that she turned Kuzco into a llama. If that's the case, Kronk could describe him to her (especially since he was able to get a good look at him this time) and she would be able to connect the dots. Then Kronk's EurekaMoment is less that they know exactly where to go at that moment and more that the peasant who carted Kuzco off was still with Kuzco, and would be easier to track down with their resources than a stray llama.

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** Just because Kronk didn't know who Pacha was at the time doesn't mean that Yzma wouldn't know him. IIRC To recall, Pacha was a village chief, so there might possibly have been records on him and she might know him by description, as well as that he was summoned to the palace on the same day that she turned Kuzco into a llama. If that's the case, Kronk could describe him to her (especially since he was able to get a good look at him this time) and she would be able to connect the dots. Then Kronk's EurekaMoment is less that they know exactly where to go at that moment and more that the peasant who carted Kuzco off was still with Kuzco, and would be easier to track down with their resources than a stray llama.



** I would assume that it sets up a subversive jab at how romantic subplots are to be expected from most Disney movies. The film sets up the introduction to the brides like at least one of them will wind up being important, but Kuzco doesn't show an ounce of attraction to any of them and none of them ever come back into play again. It's the movie letting the audience know early on that this won't be the typical Disney film.

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** I It would assume be assumed that it sets up a subversive jab at how romantic subplots are to be expected from most Disney movies. The film sets up the introduction to the brides like at least one of them will wind up being important, but Kuzco doesn't show an ounce of attraction to any of them and none of them ever come back into play again. It's the movie letting the audience know early on that this won't be the typical Disney film.



[[folder: Why did Kronk suddenly grow a conscious?]]

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[[folder: Why did Kronk suddenly grow a conscious?]]conscience?]]



** For me, at least, I didn't get the impression that Kuzco was completely serious when he accused Pacha. But beyond that, [[JerkassBall that's the point.]] Kuzco is so self-centered that he automatically assumes that what he says is right and anyone else who goes against him is wrong. It's not so much that Pacha and Yzma both had motives for revenge, it's that Pacha tried to argue against Kuzco's verdict about destroying his home, whereas Yzma did the bare minimum to make it seem as though there were no hard feelings. As Kuzco says, Pacha is the only one who doesn't seem to "get the point" that the whole world revolves around Kuzco, so to Kuzco, he's the most obvious person to want to do him any harm. Add in the fact that Yzma "practically raised him", according to her, and that she was beneath suspicion to him should be a lot easier to grasp.

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** For me, at least, I didn't some, it doesn't get the impression that Kuzco was completely serious when he accused Pacha. But beyond that, [[JerkassBall that's the point.]] Kuzco is so self-centered that he automatically assumes that what he says is right and anyone else who goes against him is wrong. It's not so much that Pacha and Yzma both had motives for revenge, it's that Pacha tried to argue against Kuzco's verdict about destroying his home, whereas Yzma did the bare minimum to make it seem as though there were no hard feelings. As Kuzco says, Pacha is the only one who doesn't seem to "get the point" that the whole world revolves around Kuzco, so to Kuzco, he's the most obvious person to want to do him any harm. Add in the fact that Yzma "practically raised him", according to her, and that she was beneath suspicion to him should be a lot easier to grasp.
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** For me, at least, I didn't get the impression that Kuzco was completely serious when he accused Pacha. But beyond that, [[JerkassBall that's the point.]] Kuzco is so self-centered that he automatically assumes that what he says is right and anyone else who goes against him is wrong. It's not so much that Pacha and Yzma both had motives for revenge, it's that Pacha tried to argue against Kuzco's verdict about destroying his home, whereas Yzma did the bare minimum to make it seem as though there were no hard feelings. As Kuzco says, Pacha is the only one who doesn't seem to "get the point" that the whole world revolves around Kuzco, so to Kuzco, he's the most obvious person to want to do him any harm. Add in the fact that Yzma "practically raised him", according to her, and that she was beneath suspicion to him should be a lot easier to grasp.
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** Maybe since Kuzco HatesBeingTouched, it could be that he doesn't like having his dinnertime crowded up with a bunch of unnecessary servants when it's really just him who's there to eat. And as Yzma spells out, only she, Kronk, and Kuzco know that she was fired earlier, so to everyone else in the palace, she would still have the authority to tell them to stay out of the dining area in order to ensure there were no witnesses.

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[[/folder]]

[[folder: Kuzco never suspected Yzma?]]
* It's peculiar that it never occurred to Kuzco that Yzma was the one who turned him into a llama. There were actually quite a few hints before he found out at the diner. He fired her earlier, and it's easy to conclude that she might be angry at him for doing that. Plus, he even knows about her secret lab and transformation potions and focuses on relying on her to change him back. Also, he original blamed Pacha for transforming him. But how could Pacha have done it? He's a peasant and would probably not have access to anything that could transform him.
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** And Yzma is RIGHT IN FRONT OF HIM. Double crossing your boss with her looking is a BAD IDEA!

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** And Yzma is RIGHT IN FRONT OF HIM. Double crossing your PRESENT at the dinner scene! Who wants to double cross their boss with right under her looking is a BAD IDEA!
nose?!
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** And Yzma is RIGHT IN FRONT OF HIM. Double crossing your boss with her looking is a BAD IDEA!
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* Where are all those servants at the dinner scene? You'd think the palace dining hall would have many people to cook and serve to Kuzco, let alone witness his llama transformation."

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* Where are all those servants at the dinner scene? You'd think the palace dining hall would have many people to cook and serve to Kuzco, let alone witness his llama transformation." And even if we assume that dining room is in Yzma's quarters of the palace, why would Kozco go there for dinner without suspecting she was up to something, considering that he just fired her?
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* Where are all those servants at the dinner scene? You'd think the palace dining hall would have many people to cook and serve Kuzco, let alone witness his llama transformation."

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* Where are all those servants at the dinner scene? You'd think the palace dining hall would have many people to cook and serve to Kuzco, let alone witness his llama transformation."
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[[folder: Dinner Time!]]
* Where are all those servants at the dinner scene? You'd think the palace dining hall would have many people to cook and serve Kuzco, let alone witness his llama transformation."
[[/folder]]
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* Does ''Disney/TheEmperorsNewGroove'' take place in a Flintstone-like anachronistic past, or does it take place in a village of present-day Native Mexicans?

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* Does ''Disney/TheEmperorsNewGroove'' the film take place in a Flintstone-like anachronistic past, or does it take place in a village of present-day Native Mexicans?
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**** He does take time during the dinner scene, though, to ensure that Kuzco gets the poisoned drink and discreetly warns Yama not to drink hers after he divides the poison among the three cups. So he knew what he was doing on some level.
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** The movie makes it pretty clear that Kronk’s [[DumbMuscle a bit slow on the update.]] He only felt guilt after he had already thrown Kuzco in the river. He also exclusively focuses on the dinner when they’re plotting to kill Kuzco. This could interpreted as apathy, but the fact that his Shoulder Angel says “You’re not just gonna let him die out there, are you?” may imply that he didn’t really understand that he was murdering Kuzco.
*** Plus, after he throws Kuzco in the river he says a quick remark (mission accomplished) and then starts to feel guilt. When Kuzco passes out, he also gives a quick remark. If Kuzco had actually been poisoned, and then he started to “get rid of the body” like Yzma said, his Shoulder Angel and Devil might have appeared.
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[[/folder]]

[[folder: Why did Kronk suddenly grow a conscious?]]
* He took issue with throwing Kuzco into a river and letting gravity do the killing, but had no qualms with actually serving him a cup of poisoned wine? Why didn’t his shoulder-angel-and-devil show up at any point during the dinner scene?
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** Could be that being the "emperor's assistant" affords her just as much influence and luxury as being empress does, but without having to worry about the actual responsibility for things that go wrong, since that would technically fall to Kuzco. But when Kuzco fires her, that means she loses all that power, and thus, killing him before anyone finds out he fired her is the only way for her to keep her position. It was basically a matter of not acting before she absolutely needed to.
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** It helps to establish how normal Kuzco's jerkishness is. It's not just towards peasants, it's not the first time he's made such a blatant moral mistake, and it's something he feels no guilt for and immediately goes back to jerkishness afterwards. This is something that everyone around him has had to put up with, for a long time. It doesn't surprise any of them in the least. Also, the window-throwing was played at least slightly for BlackComedy. The brides thing is more personally hurtful, and can't be handwaved by DeliberateValuesDissonance. It has more of an impact on the viewer. The filmmakers wanted to cut off ''any possibility'' of RonTheDeathEater.
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[[folder: Why don't you just shoot him?]]
* If Yzma is so ambitious and so old, why hasn't she attempted to usurp an emperor before? Yeah, Kuzco is an obedient puppet, but she seems much happier when the murder makes her supremacy explicit.
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** Also possible is that Kuzco wasn't actually as heartless as he'd implied when he threatened to leave Pacha tangled in the bridge ropes. He might've reasoned that Pacha would be able to free himself without any help, and decided that a struggle of that caliber would be a worthy-enough punishment for Pacha "kidnapping" him.
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** I would assume that it sets up a subversive jab at how romantic subplots are to be expected from most Disney movies. The film sets up the introduction to the brides like at least one of them will wind up being important, but Kuzco doesn't show an ounce of attraction to any of them and none of them ever come back into play again. It's the movie letting the audience know early on that this won't be the typical Disney film.
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[[/folder]]

[[folder: What was the point of the bride scene?]]
* Maybe more of a Doylist question, but what was the point? It comes right after a big song number and sets up a love plot point that never happens before cutting away. If the idea was to set up Kuzco to be a jerk it seems a little belated, considering he just had a man thrown out of a building.
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** I think what happened is it took quite awhile for Kuzco and Pacha to sneak into the palace just to get to Yzma's lab. It's just [[NoodleIncident that part was entirely skipped over]], giving Yzma and Kronk ample time to get in before the heroes did. Maybe the river they fell into also rushed them close to the palace beforehand.
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** Just because Kronk didn't know who Pacha was at the time doesn't mean that Yzma wouldn't know him. iirc Pacha was a village chief, so there might possibly have been records on him and she might know him by description, as well as that he was summoned to the palace on the same day that she turned Kuzco into a llama. If that's the case, Kronk could describe him to her (especially since he was able to get a good look at him this time) and she would be able to connect the dots. Then Kronk's EurekaMoment is less that they know exactly where to go at that moment and more that the peasant who carted Kuzco off was still with Kuzco, and would be easier to track down with their resources than a stray llama.

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** Just because Kronk didn't know who Pacha was at the time doesn't mean that Yzma wouldn't know him. iirc IIRC Pacha was a village chief, so there might possibly have been records on him and she might know him by description, as well as that he was summoned to the palace on the same day that she turned Kuzco into a llama. If that's the case, Kronk could describe him to her (especially since he was able to get a good look at him this time) and she would be able to connect the dots. Then Kronk's EurekaMoment is less that they know exactly where to go at that moment and more that the peasant who carted Kuzco off was still with Kuzco, and would be easier to track down with their resources than a stray llama.

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