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** He absorbed a genome ability from Ouroboros, he activated it to create a stable time loop, you can't do this because you're not fully trained in any of the asterisk systems.
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** It's possible to destroy the crystal as soon as you hit world two, so they had to make the scene fit in case such a descision was made.
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** The vestals awaken the crystals by pulling their power from the next world in the cycle, that's what the prayers do, so theDuchy is trying to find a way to awaken them without putting a new link in the chain, which they are aware of by Yulyanna and Derosso.
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** It's probably a good thing to remember that, in the Japanese version, Ringabel/Alternis is only eighteen. Personal appearance is hardly stable during one's teen years. Alternis's journal also implies that he wears the armor almost constantly enough that going plainclothes is uncomfortable for him, so it wouldn't be a surprise if Edea hadn't seen him out of it for at least a couple of years.

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** It's probably a good thing to remember that, in the Japanese version, Ringabel/Alternis is only eighteen.sixteen. Personal appearance is hardly stable during one's teen years. Alternis's journal also implies that he wears the armor almost constantly enough that going plainclothes is uncomfortable for him, so it wouldn't be a surprise if Edea hadn't seen him out of it for at least a couple of years.
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** Put up some spoiler... [[spoiler: Bravely Second shows that the celestial that returned with Tiz in the preview AR, as shown in the replay of the AR in Bravely Second, isn't the player, but that's something you'll find out later in game. So the Bravely Second preview AR is from Tiz's point of view instead of the player]]. I'd like to think that the player's influence of their control on Tiz has small residuals which managed to save Tiz's soul, but not enough to wake him up so he's in ConvenientComa because of that.
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** Well, what does the life support cutscene and the rest of the game have in common? The player is, again, seeing the world through Tiz's perspective. He came out of the life support unscathed because the celestial came back for a new story.
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** Also, if he tells them before they're strong enough, Airy will kill them, and just continue the plan some other way. You'll note the few times characters discuss these things directly, they left Airy behind.
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** I don't think he died when he gave up the celestial spirit at the end... Or, well, it would've been fatal however he was picked up and put on life support before he actually died from whatever giving it up caused in him. Then you have the Bravely Second AR trailer taking place some time later and he's just waking up on life support.
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*** Probably the giant dragon at the end of the line that is destroying entire worlds for power.

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*** ** Probably the giant dragon at the end of the line that is destroying entire worlds for power.
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*** Probably the giant dragon at the end of the line that is destroying entire worlds for power.
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** In that case, where does the energy of the last four crystals in the final world come from?
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** Maybe the Tiz we played and seen in the AR is the only Tiz that actually died and saved by the celestial, the player while the other world's somehow had him survive by luck. That, or there are actually celestial's before the player that had done the same with the help of Airy's Sister but failed as Airy killed them.

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** Maybe the Tiz we played and seen in the AR is the only Tiz that actually died and saved by the celestial, the player while the other world's somehow had him survive by luck. That, or there are actually celestial's before the player that had done the same with the help of Airy's Sister but failed as Airy killed them. There is one AR with Airy's sister [[spoiler: (Anne)]] saying that she had been sending signals for a long time and sending the signal to the player may just be her last, so it kind of proved that there may have been celestial's before the player and only the player had succeeded.
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** Maybe the Tiz we played and seen in the AR is the only Tiz that actually died and saved by the celestial, the player while the other world's somehow had him survive by luck. That, or there are actually celestial's before the player that had done the same with the help of Airy's Sister but failed as Airy killed them.
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** The best explanation for Braev's overall attitude is basically exactly like Edea. When they get it in their heads about what's the right thing to do, they go for it without a single hint of compromise or hesitation. Like father, like daughter.
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** I'm pretty sure his thirst is connected to his frustration. When the party first showed up at his hideout he was annoyed and when they started throwing accusations and platitudes at him, he became livid, all the while yelling about his growing thirst.


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[[folder:Poor Communication Kills]]
* Instead of yelling about how when two people have differing ideals they must battle to the death, wouldn't make more sense for Braev to explain to the party that awakening the crystals and summoning the Pillar of Light will bring about the Harrowing and that all the violent actions seen committed by the Duchy was his underlings acting without his consent?
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[[folder:Jackal being thirsty]]
* So... why was Jackal talking about how thirsty he was when the party first meets him? At that time, he's ''staking out the oasis''. He's hanging around the oasis trying to keep people away from it. Did it not once occur to him to drink his fill? Is it implied somewhere I didn't see that it's a metaphorical thirst?
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** The Vampire sidequest literally tells you how Yulyana gained immortality - he was already extremely old but made a potion using old Orthodoxy document that would give himself immortality (or at least keep him from aging, I believe the game implies he can be killed with force). As far as DeRosso himself, the implication is that he used Ouroboros' power to reach his younger self and to give himself immortality.

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* In Chapter 6, if you do the Yulyana optional bosses, you learn that the main character from that world died and you meet all the people affected by it (i.e. Alternis, Braev, Til, Olivia, etc.). Yulyana gives the characters the option to stay in that world and live peaceful lives with their loved ones, which they refuse in order to continue their journey. Then Yulyana asks them if they want him to erase the memories of those they encountered, but Tiz says no because it will give them "a spark to keep them going." Or it could leave them in even worse shape then before, spending the rest of their lives searching for lost loved ones or wondering why they were abandoned in their time of need.

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* In Chapter 6, if you do the Yulyana optional bosses, you learn that the main character from that world died and you meet all the people affected by it (i.e. Alternis, Braev, Til, Olivia, etc.). Yulyana gives the characters the option to stay in that world and live peaceful lives with their loved ones, which they refuse in order to continue their journey. Then Yulyana asks them if they want him to erase the memories of those they encountered, but Tiz says no because it will give them "a spark to keep them going." Or it could leave them in even worse shape then before, spending the rest of their lives searching for lost loved ones or wondering why they were abandoned in their time of need. need.
** Agreed. Tiz may have good intentions, but he also has no way of judging how they would react. In all of the cases it can be seen as unintentional cruelty from the party, leaving (versions of their) loved ones longing for their return because they 'know' they are alive and well. Particularly in the case of Alternis we ''know'' from previous worlds that his SanitySlippage tends to end in tragedy (even cases where the world-hopping results in Ringabel, it is only ''because'' he suffered TraumaInducedAmnesia). When the party encounters Alternis during this subquest he is clearly suicidal, and the ease with which he treats Ringabel as a 'replacement' and suggests his counterpart be the one to kill him is quite chilling. Worse, he seems to be DrivenToSuicide regardless of whether the party intervenes - seeing Ringabel only makes Alternis sure he can leave Braev's service, ''not'' that he has somehow regained hope after crossing the DespairEventHorizon.
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[[folder:Erasing Memories]]
* In Chapter 6, if you do the Yulyana optional bosses, you learn that the main character from that world died and you meet all the people affected by it (i.e. Alternis, Braev, Til, Olivia, etc.). Yulyana gives the characters the option to stay in that world and live peaceful lives with their loved ones, which they refuse in order to continue their journey. Then Yulyana asks them if they want him to erase the memories of those they encountered, but Tiz says no because it will give them "a spark to keep them going." Or it could leave them in even worse shape then before, spending the rest of their lives searching for lost loved ones or wondering why they were abandoned in their time of need.
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[[folder:DeRosso's and Yulyana's Immortality]]
* We're told in the post-game journal entries that during the final battle with Ouroboros, Lord [=DeRosso's=] voice reached across space and time to his younger self and gave him immortality. How did he do that? How did he even have the power to do that? And also, how did Sage Yulyana gain immortality?
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** It's fairly clear from early on that while the Eternian Forces actions are terrible, that there is something else going on. Edea's black-and-white view is dangerous because it prevents her from thinking about the bigger picture. On the face of it, this seems to be a shallow justification for war when we see Kamiizumi involved in Eisenberg's civil war, but further investigation reveals that while their methods are indeed abhorrent their goals are good ones. Only when Edea discovers the reality of the situation, and the more reasonable motivations of at least some of the characters (primarily Braev and Kamiizumi) is she able to mitigate the damage done by the whole mess. It doesn't justify the Duchy's actions, but the party do what they can. Edea ultimately avoids making the same mistakes as her father, whose similar attitude leads him in multiple realities to crush Crystalism without considering the consequences. Not only does this ruthlessly punish innocent people (he seems to have utterly ignored Yulyana and DeRosso), but it's counter-productive in terms of Braev's actual goals; obtaining ''either'' ending requires a Vestal with knowledge of the Crystals.

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** It's fairly clear from early on that while the Eternian Forces actions are terrible, that there is something else going on. Edea's black-and-white view is dangerous because it prevents her from thinking about the bigger picture. On the face of it, this seems to be a shallow justification for war when we see Kamiizumi involved in Eisenberg's civil war, but further investigation reveals that while their methods are indeed abhorrent their goals are good ones. Only when Edea discovers the reality of the situation, and the more reasonable motivations of at least some of the characters (primarily Braev and Kamiizumi) is she able to mitigate the damage done by the whole mess. It doesn't justify the Duchy's actions, but the party do what they can.can, at least somewhat. Edea ultimately avoids making the same mistakes as her father, whose similar attitude leads him in multiple realities to crush Crystalism without considering the consequences. Not only does this ruthlessly punish innocent people (he seems to have utterly ignored Yulyana and DeRosso), but it's counter-productive in terms of Braev's actual goals; obtaining ''either'' ending requires a Vestal with knowledge of the Crystals.
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** It's fairly clear from early on that while the Eternian Forces actions are terrible, that there is something else going on. Edea's black-and-white view is dangerous because it prevents her from thinking about the bigger picture. On the face of it, this seems to be a shallow justification for war when we see Kamiizumi involved in Eisenberg's civil war, but further investigation reveals that while their methods are indeed abhorrent their goals are good ones. Only when Edea discovers the reality of the situation, and the more reasonable motivations of at least some of the characters (primarily Braev and Kamiizumi) is she able to mitigate the damage done by the whole mess. It doesn't justify the Duchy's actions, but the party do what they can. Edea ultimately avoids making the same mistakes as her father, whose similar attitude leads him in multiple realities to crush Crystalism without considering the consequences. Not only does this ruthlessly punish innocent people (he seems to have utterly ignored Yulyana and DeRosso), but it's counter-productive in terms of Braev's actual goals; obtaining ''either'' ending requires a Vestal with knowledge of the Crystals.
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Example Indentation. Three bullets are rarely necessary, and anything past three shows up as three.


*** The Celestial is not Airy's sister. The end fight with Ouroboros has him reveal that he intends to invade the Celestial Realm, which shows behind him in the final battle and ultimately turns on the 3DS camera to show the player's face behind it. The Celestial keeping Tiz alive is YOU, the player

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*** ** The Celestial is not Airy's sister. The end fight with Ouroboros has him reveal that he intends to invade the Celestial Realm, which shows behind him in the final battle and ultimately turns on the 3DS camera to show the player's face behind it. The Celestial keeping Tiz alive is YOU, the player



*** In other words, Tiz dies...[[FridgeHorror BECAUSE OF YOU!]]
**** Using one of the AR cards shows Tiz dying after climbing out of the Great Chasm, only to absorb a bright light drifting down. Shortly after, you start controlling him and he's perfectly fine. In other words, Tiz lives, saves the world, falls in love, and makes all of these friends and allies across the world... [[HeartwarmingMoments because of you.]]
**** Somewhat undercut by the fact that Tiz survives in Ringabel's world (level -1?), before the player got involved.

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*** ** In other words, Tiz dies...[[FridgeHorror BECAUSE OF YOU!]]
**** ** Using one of the AR cards shows Tiz dying after climbing out of the Great Chasm, only to absorb a bright light drifting down. Shortly after, you start controlling him and he's perfectly fine. In other words, Tiz lives, saves the world, falls in love, and makes all of these friends and allies across the world... [[HeartwarmingMoments because of you.]]
**** ** Somewhat undercut by the fact that Tiz survives in Ringabel's world (level -1?), before the player got involved.



*** It could be that rather than 'our' Ringabel being unique and an anomaly in the worlds the player/Tiz goes through, he is simply an example of yet another case of how the events in the parallel worlds can differ according to circumstances. It would rely on a whole series of events playing out to result in the circumstances recorded at the end of D's Journal. As we see from Alternis's Journal the events may not always differ all that much, yet a single choice - Alternis/Ringabel choosing to go to Eisenberg - can make all the difference.

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*** ** It could be that rather than 'our' Ringabel being unique and an anomaly in the worlds the player/Tiz goes through, he is simply an example of yet another case of how the events in the parallel worlds can differ according to circumstances. It would rely on a whole series of events playing out to result in the circumstances recorded at the end of D's Journal. As we see from Alternis's Journal the events may not always differ all that much, yet a single choice - Alternis/Ringabel choosing to go to Eisenberg - can make all the difference.



*** But time travel ''didn't'' happen; it never did. The "Angel" was an Agnès from another world, not a different time. There's nothing to indicate that there's a stable time loop in place at all, except [=DeRosso=] making an IronicEcho.
**** I got the idea [=DeRosso=] locked Ouroboros' immortality into his past self to keep it out of his reach. He only asked his past self because he knew he'd say yes.

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*** ** But time travel ''didn't'' happen; it never did. The "Angel" was an Agnès from another world, not a different time. There's nothing to indicate that there's a stable time loop in place at all, except [=DeRosso=] making an IronicEcho.
**** ** I got the idea [=DeRosso=] locked Ouroboros' immortality into his past self to keep it out of his reach. He only asked his past self because he knew he'd say yes.



*** It flat out says it in D's Journal in [=DeRosso=]'s entry if you start a NG+, and he theorises that that was the case during chapter 4 when doing his sidequest.

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*** ** It flat out says it in D's Journal in [=DeRosso=]'s entry if you start a NG+, and he theorises that that was the case during chapter 4 when doing his sidequest.

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** Even when done first the Bad Ending has the characters seem somewhat shocked at the developments, even when a series of flashbacks spell out that this is what they had suspected for some time thanks to Yulyana's knowledge and Ringabel's memories. There's no real need for it to be as ambiguous as it is about what the characters ''should'' know from the main storyline (things like DeRosso and Yulyana's history is subplot). However, if it is possible to trigger the Bad Ending before knowing the full story (perhaps from Chapter 5 when Ringabel first confesses to Tiz that he is Alternis Dim) then it may be that this vagueness is intended to cater for those players who genuinely wouldn't have known what was going on. That said...the ending of Chapter 6 makes little sense if you go through the Pillar having ignored Yulyana's heavy hints about breaking a crystal. The party concludes they do it knowing they're being deceived - referring even to a 'greater enemy' when they definitely ''don't'' know about the BiggerBad if they haven't already done the Bad Ending, and Ringabel is quietly angry about the whole thing. In fact, considering both the end of Chapter 6 and the Lying Airy finale chapter, I think the player is 'intended' to trigger the Bad Ending during Chapter 6, specifically after Yulyana's revelations.

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** Even when done first the Bad Ending has the Annoyingly, it is not. The characters seem somewhat shocked at act terribly surprised, and Tiz's lines about no-one foreseeing Airy's treachery ''directly contradict'' both what we learnt several chapters ago (Main Scenario, not sub- ones). I wonder if this was done in case anyone had gone straight to the developments, true ending without triggering the false one. But even when a series of flashbacks spell out then, doing so would have ''required'' that this is what they had suspected for some time thanks to Yulyana's knowledge and witnessed the events surrounding Ringabel's memories. There's no real need for it to be as ambiguous as it is about what the characters ''should'' know from the main storyline (things like DeRosso memories and Yulyana's history is subplot). However, if it is possible exposition (if not DeRosso's which was oddly relagated to trigger a sub-scenario). Chronologically, they knew enough to at the Bad Ending before knowing the full story (perhaps ''very least'' be suspicious, even if they refrain from Chapter 5 when accusing Airy outright (indeed, Ringabel first confesses seems to Tiz that he is Alternis Dim) then it may be that this vagueness is intended struggling with having to cater for those players who genuinely wouldn't have known what was going on. That said...the ending of Chapter 6 makes little sense if you go through the Holy Pillar having ignored Yulyana's heavy hints about breaking a crystal. time and again). The party concludes they do characters' lack of understanding at the ending is rather confusing; the information was there, we had their reactions (many times, if we include the false ending) it's as though the writers decided to ignore all of it knowing they're being deceived - referring even to a 'greater enemy' when they definitely ''don't'' know about it came to the BiggerBad if they haven't already done the Bad Ending, and Ringabel is quietly angry about the whole thing. In fact, considering both the end of Chapter 6 and the Lying Airy finale chapter, I think the player is 'intended' to trigger the Bad Ending during Chapter 6, specifically after Yulyana's revelations.game's climax.
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*** It could be that rather than 'our' Ringabel being unique and an anomaly in the worlds the player/Tiz goes through, he is simply an example of yet another case of how the events in the parallel worlds can differ according to circumstances. It would rely on a whole series of events playing out to result in the circumstances recorded at the end of D's Journal. As we see from Alternis's Journal the events may not always differ all that much, yet a single choice - Alternis/Ringabel choosing to go to Eisenberg - can make all the difference.
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** Even when done first the Bad Ending has the characters seem somewhat shocked at the developments, even when a series of flashbacks spell out that this is what they had suspected for some time thanks to Yulyana's knowledge and Ringabel's memories. It's a lot more ambiguous with regards to what the characters ''should'' know from the main storyline (it's not like DeRosso and Yulyana's backstories which is a subquest) than it really should be. However, if it is possible to trigger the Bad Ending before knowing the full story (perhaps from Chapter 5 when Ringabel first confesses to Tiz that he is Alternis Dim) then it may be that this vagueness is intended to cater for those players who genuinely wouldn't have known what was going on. That said...the ending of Chapter 6 makes little sense if you go through the Pillar having ignored Yulyana's heavy hints about breaking a crystal. The party concludes they do it knowing they're being deceived - alluding even to a 'greater enemy' when they definitely ''don't'' know about the BiggerBad if they haven't already done the Bad Ending, and Ringabel is quietly angry about the whole thing.

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** Even when done first the Bad Ending has the characters seem somewhat shocked at the developments, even when a series of flashbacks spell out that this is what they had suspected for some time thanks to Yulyana's knowledge and Ringabel's memories. It's a lot more There's no real need for it to be as ambiguous with regards to as it is about what the characters ''should'' know from the main storyline (it's not (things like DeRosso and Yulyana's backstories which history is a subquest) than it really should be.subplot). However, if it is possible to trigger the Bad Ending before knowing the full story (perhaps from Chapter 5 when Ringabel first confesses to Tiz that he is Alternis Dim) then it may be that this vagueness is intended to cater for those players who genuinely wouldn't have known what was going on. That said...the ending of Chapter 6 makes little sense if you go through the Pillar having ignored Yulyana's heavy hints about breaking a crystal. The party concludes they do it knowing they're being deceived - alluding referring even to a 'greater enemy' when they definitely ''don't'' know about the BiggerBad if they haven't already done the Bad Ending, and Ringabel is quietly angry about the whole thing.thing. In fact, considering both the end of Chapter 6 and the Lying Airy finale chapter, I think the player is 'intended' to trigger the Bad Ending during Chapter 6, specifically after Yulyana's revelations.

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* How is it possible that after being told, explicitly, that Airy is evil and killed everyone, the ''whole party'' is floored when Airy reveals herself to be evil and tries to kill them? As in, even Ringabel is stunned when she starts in with the EvilGloating about how gullible they all are, and he's the one who ''told them all this''. (This on top of the information they have from de Rosso and Yulyana.) It's facepalm-inducing when Tiz goes around saying that it's nobody's fault and they couldn't possibly have seen this betrayal coming, because they saw it coming from literally worlds away. Is it different if you do the Bad Ending first?

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* How is it possible that after being told, explicitly, that Airy is evil and killed everyone, the ''whole party'' is floored when Airy reveals herself to be evil and tries to kill them? As in, even Ringabel is stunned when she starts in with the EvilGloating about how gullible they all are, and he's the one who ''told them all this''. (This on top of the information they have from de Rosso and Yulyana.) It's facepalm-inducing when Tiz goes around saying that it's nobody's fault and they couldn't possibly have seen this betrayal coming, because they saw it coming from literally worlds away. Is it different if you do the Bad Ending first? first?
** Even when done first the Bad Ending has the characters seem somewhat shocked at the developments, even when a series of flashbacks spell out that this is what they had suspected for some time thanks to Yulyana's knowledge and Ringabel's memories. It's a lot more ambiguous with regards to what the characters ''should'' know from the main storyline (it's not like DeRosso and Yulyana's backstories which is a subquest) than it really should be. However, if it is possible to trigger the Bad Ending before knowing the full story (perhaps from Chapter 5 when Ringabel first confesses to Tiz that he is Alternis Dim) then it may be that this vagueness is intended to cater for those players who genuinely wouldn't have known what was going on. That said...the ending of Chapter 6 makes little sense if you go through the Pillar having ignored Yulyana's heavy hints about breaking a crystal. The party concludes they do it knowing they're being deceived - alluding even to a 'greater enemy' when they definitely ''don't'' know about the BiggerBad if they haven't already done the Bad Ending, and Ringabel is quietly angry about the whole thing.

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[[/folder]]

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** The story seems to try to get around this by using the journal as a 'travel diary' (early on, Edea even suggests that's what it is) informing them of destinations and a route to take. This is tenuous to begin with given Alternis's attitude in the journal, but does fall apart entirely later on.
** On the subject of the first journal, how was Alternis able to make those final entries? His TraumaInducedAmnesia came about because he found Edea dead, but after that he presumably wouldn't have ''remembered'' what caused her death in order to...draw a picture of it.]]
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[[/folder]]
[[folder:Let's keep trusting Airy!]]
* How is it possible that after being told, explicitly, that Airy is evil and killed everyone, the ''whole party'' is floored when Airy reveals herself to be evil and tries to kill them? As in, even Ringabel is stunned when she starts in with the EvilGloating about how gullible they all are, and he's the one who ''told them all this''. (This on top of the information they have from de Rosso and Yulyana.) It's facepalm-inducing when Tiz goes around saying that it's nobody's fault and they couldn't possibly have seen this betrayal coming, because they saw it coming from literally worlds away. Is it different if you do the Bad Ending first?
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[[folder:This Apocolyptic Log is an excellent guide!]]
* Why do they think that following D's Journal is a good idea? Even if Ringabel isn't letting the others read ahead, it seems like ''he's'' read the whole thing... and it's extremely creepy. As early as Ancheim it's painting Agnes as some kind of evil messiah inflaming a "glassy-eyed mob" (even if the actual context of the event isn't so bad, [[UnreliableNarrator the original Dim]] sure paints it that way) and ends with doom, destruction, a horrible monster and [[ThatWasTheLastEntry ends with an ominous splatter]]. You'd think he would be ''relieved'' when events start deviating from its "predictions".
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** Accepting that there are many worlds that Airy was done with before the heroes of light were born, and even ignoring the question of how Tiz, Agnes, and Edea became friends in all of them without Airy, what's RINGABEL doing in any of them? Out Ringabel isn't from the same world as out Tiz, Agnes, or Edea, but from the previous world, and directly because of Airy's meddling. It could be that in the other worlds Alternis got used to having no armor on and joined the others, but IIRC he is always referred to as Ringabel, which makes no sense. Plus, in one scene from a different world, we see Alternis and Ringabel on Grandship, something that should not be possible without Airy because they're the same guy!

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