Follow TV Tropes

Following

History HeWhoFightsMonsters / TabletopGames

Go To



*** The heroes of Ravenloft always run the risk of becoming what they had set out to destroy because every act of evil committed in the Demiplanes of Dread has a chance of drawing the attention of the Dark Powers. The more horrific the act of evil, the greater the chance that the Dark Powers will take notice. Go too far, and you may wind up a literal monster, if not a Darklord yourself.

to:

*** The heroes of Ravenloft always run the risk of becoming what they had set out to destroy because every act of evil committed in the Demiplanes of Dread has a chance of drawing the attention of the Dark Powers. The more horrific the act of evil, the greater the chance that the Dark Powers will take notice. [[MoralEventHorizon Go too far, far]], and you may wind up becoming a literal monster, if not a Darklord yourself.


*** The heroes of Ravenloft always run the risk of becoming what they had set out to destroy because every act of evil committed in the Demiplanes of Dread has a chance of drawing the attention of the Dark Powers. The more horrific the act of evil, the greater the chance that the Dark Powers will take notice.

to:

*** The heroes of Ravenloft always run the risk of becoming what they had set out to destroy because every act of evil committed in the Demiplanes of Dread has a chance of drawing the attention of the Dark Powers. The more horrific the act of evil, the greater the chance that the Dark Powers will take notice. Go too far, and you may wind up a literal monster, if not a Darklord yourself.


*** The [[BigBad main villains]] the Technocratic Union have this in their backstory. They used to be the heroic Order of Reason, a band of mages and intellectuals who came together to make life better for the little guy and overthrow the shadowy [[AncientConspiracy ancient conspiracies]] that ruled the world. [[BecameTheirOwnAntiThesis Now they are the shadowy ancient conspiracies who rule the world,]] and to a worse degree than many of the those they overthrew. The transformation isn't complete, as most rank-and-file Technocrats are usually portrayed as {{Punchclock Villain}}s at worst and at best are deliberately misled by their superiors, and often [[RootingFortheEmpire gain the support of players]]. They have done a great deal of good. It's hard to say that the guys who gave us democracy and toilet paper are all bad... but on the other hand, [[GreyAndGreyMorality they're actively withholding the cure for cancer, so it's rather difficult to unabashedly support them]]].

to:

*** The [[BigBad main villains]] villains]], the Technocratic Union Union, have this in their backstory. They used to be the heroic Order of Reason, a band of mages and intellectuals who came together to make life better for the little guy and overthrow the shadowy [[AncientConspiracy ancient conspiracies]] that ruled the world. [[BecameTheirOwnAntiThesis Now they are the shadowy ancient conspiracies who rule the world,]] and to a worse degree than many of the those they overthrew. The transformation isn't complete, as most rank-and-file Technocrats are usually portrayed as {{Punchclock Villain}}s at worst and at best are deliberately misled by their superiors, and often [[RootingFortheEmpire gain the support of players]]. They have done a great deal of good. It's hard to say that the guys who gave us democracy and toilet paper are all bad... but on the other hand, [[GreyAndGreyMorality they're actively withholding the cure for cancer, so it's rather difficult to unabashedly support them]]].


** ''TabletopGame/MageTheAscension'': The Euthanatos Tradition spends much of its time trying to clean the world of evil people that no longer serve their purpose in The Wheel, but in doing so expose themselves to a corruption known as [[TheCorruption Jhor]]. Jhor is gained by using magic to kill, killing unnecessarily, not maintaining a mundane identity with a job and friends so as to remain grounded, and so forth. People who succumb to Jhor [[EvilMakesYouUgly become pale and sallow, like they are ill]] and [[WithGreatPowerComesGreatInsanity far more extreme in measures, methods, and goals]]. They often [[WellIntentionedExtremist hold on to their original ideals and goals]] even as they continue to rationalize more drastic measures.
*** The [[BigBad main villains]] the Technocratic Union are this in their backstory. They used to be the heroic Order of Reason, a band of mages and intellectuals who came together to make life better for the little guy and overthrow the shadowy [[AncientConspiracy ancient conspiracies]] that ruled the world. [[BecameTheirOwnAntiThesis Now they are the shadowy ancient conspiracies the rule the world,]] and to a worse degree than many of the those they overthrew. It isn't complete, as most rank-and-file Technocrats are usually portrayed as {{Punchclock Villian}}s at worst and at best deliberately misled by their superiors, and often [[RootingFortheEmpire gain the support of players]]. They have done a great deal of good. It's hard to say that the guys who gave up democracy and toilet paper are all bad... but on the other hand, [[GreyAndGreyMorality they're actively withholding the cure for cancer, so it's rather difficult to unabashedly support them]]].

to:

** ''TabletopGame/MageTheAscension'': ''TabletopGame/MageTheAscension'':
***
The Euthanatos Tradition spends much of its time trying to clean the world of evil people that who no longer serve their purpose in on The Wheel, but in doing so expose themselves to a corruption known as [[TheCorruption Jhor]]. Jhor is gained by using magic to kill, killing unnecessarily, not maintaining a mundane identity with a job and friends so as to remain grounded, and so forth. People who succumb to Jhor [[EvilMakesYouUgly become pale and sallow, like they are ill]] and [[WithGreatPowerComesGreatInsanity far more extreme in measures, methods, and goals]]. They often [[WellIntentionedExtremist hold on to their original ideals and goals]] even as they continue to rationalize more drastic measures.
*** The [[BigBad main villains]] the Technocratic Union are have this in their backstory. They used to be the heroic Order of Reason, a band of mages and intellectuals who came together to make life better for the little guy and overthrow the shadowy [[AncientConspiracy ancient conspiracies]] that ruled the world. [[BecameTheirOwnAntiThesis Now they are the shadowy ancient conspiracies the who rule the world,]] and to a worse degree than many of the those they overthrew. It The transformation isn't complete, as most rank-and-file Technocrats are usually portrayed as {{Punchclock Villian}}s Villain}}s at worst and at best are deliberately misled by their superiors, and often [[RootingFortheEmpire gain the support of players]]. They have done a great deal of good. It's hard to say that the guys who gave up us democracy and toilet paper are all bad... but on the other hand, [[GreyAndGreyMorality they're actively withholding the cure for cancer, so it's rather difficult to unabashedly support them]]].

Added DiffLines:

* The ''TabletopGame/{{GURPS}}'' supplement/setting book ''The Madness Dossier'' has this effect built into the mechanics. The heroic “Sandmen” are fighting the utterly inhuman and monstrous Anunnaki, but can only hope to win if they not only maintain absolute secrecy, memory-wiping and brainwashing any bystanders who blunder into their operations, but also study and employ Anunnaki powers (such as brainwashing). But it’s inherently impossible to use Anunnaki powers without thinking like them. The best that the Sandman psychologists can do is divert callousness and cruelty into fanaticism for the Sandman cause.

Added DiffLines:

* Likewise, ''TabletopGame/{{Warhammer}}'' is a case study in what happens when the Holy Roman Empire circa 1555 is dropped into a world full of fantasy monsters. With daemon-worshipping vikings to the north, unholy undead in the east, hyper-violent greenskins to the south, insane goat-headed savages to the southwest, evil ratmen literally under their feet and insidious traitors and cultists sowing discord within, the Empire represents a flickering light of human civilization fighting every day to beat back the dark forces that constantly circle, waiting to snuff it out.


* In ''TabletopGame/{{Warhammer 40000}}'', The Nighthaunter's backstory is made of this trope. Since he's the grimdark version of Franchise/{{Batman}}, what can you expect?
** Also: Radical Inquisitors, Commander Farsight some of the time...40K is the only game where even the ''monsters'' can succumb to this trope.
** The Imperium of Man itself can be this. It's a [[KnightTemplar theocratic]] {{dystopia}} that goes against the secular, rationalist utopia that their [[MessianicArchetype Emperor]] envisioned (The Emperor's Imperial Truth that promotes science and reason is now condemned as heresy, ''in his name''). Their Inquisition is apparently a power-hungry madhouse that is able to order the deaths of millions with a simple "just to be sure that there's no Chaos on the planet". Their armies are known for spreading death and destruction even to those they're helping, and will even fight amongst themselves if the situation calls for it. As a quote goes, "We used to pray for the Emperor to send us his angels. Now, we pray that he never does again."
*** Inquisitors must be sure that Exterminatus is the best and/or only option, as being baited by the Ruinous Powers into destroying your own worlds is, in fact, seen as just as bad as the world falling to Chaos. Indeed, there's at least [[VideoGame/DawnOfWar one]] canon example of a Chaos worshipper arranging for an Exterminatus ''on purpose'' so that he could dedicate the death of the planet and everything on it to the Dark Gods, an act for which he was elevated to Daemonhood.
*** When you gaze into the warp, the warp also gazes back into you...and laughs. "There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting gods."
*** Any Inquisitor will eventually become this. There are two main sects of Inquisitors, the Puritans and Radicals. Puritans believe that they must only destroy Daemons, never consort with them or use their wares (even a bolter touched by a daemon is considered tainted and must be destroyed). Radicals believe that they are allowed to use daemons against other daemons, so long as the purpose is pure. These two sects often have clashes and many of the Ordos are divided between these sects. However, all Inquisitors start as Puritans, while almost all Inquisitors die Radicals. This is because the WideEyedIdealist (and that's saying something, given the setting and [[MoralEventHorizon how they are willing to behave]]) that goes into the organization slowly sees the futility of fighting alone, and slowly rationalizes using daemons and daemonic weaponry against them. Most Inquisitors are likewise more likely killed by their own peers than the daemons of the warp, usually by trial and execution at having found to harbor daemonic artifacts.

to:

* In ''TabletopGame/{{Warhammer 40000}}'', Happens more than a few times in the course of ''TabletopGame/BattleTech.'' The Nighthaunter's backstory most ironic example is made probably Major Cullen Craig. He abandoned the mercenary regiment he was born into, the [[BraveScot Northwind Highlanders]], because they accepted a former Death Commando, Loren Jaffray, into their ranks due to a combination of his blood heritage descending from a renowned Highlander family and his actions that saved the regiment. Insisting that Jaffray's past as a Death Commando (widely considered the most ruthless and fanatical state-sponsored special operations group in the Inner Sphere) and a member of a Highlander family branch that did not return with the Highlanders to their native world, he did maintained that accepting Jaffray was a mistake and would lead to the unit's downfall. He joined Swann's Cavaliers to hopefully one day oppose the Highlanders and drive Jaffray out. So driven is he in his goal that he does not voice dissent when the Cavaliers then proceeded to join the Word of Blake, murder droves of civilians using their Battlemech companies in a massacre and in doing so earn massive bounties on ''all'' of their heads, and bring the fury of the entire elite 17th Recon Regiment onto them, who are now out for blood after the deaths of civilians on their home worlds. In a final fit of irony, the Highlanders never dismiss Jaffray, survive the bloody Word of Blake Jihad mostly intact, and make it out into the so called Dark Age setting as a highly respected, major faction unto themselves. On the other hand, Craig and Swann's Cavaliers, all wanted men marked for death, are never heard from again.
* ''TabletopGame/ChroniclesOfDarkness:''
** One of the subtler risks in ''TabletopGame/ChangelingTheLost'', for many reasons sometimes considered the ''bleakest'' of the TabletopGame/NewWorldOfDarkness games. As a Changeling's Wyrd (power meter, roughly akin to, say, [[TabletopGame/VampireTheRequiem Blood Potency]]) goes up, they remember their time in {{Arcadia}} more and more clearly. This is, in and of itself, frightening, but not dangerous. If their [[KarmaMeter Clarity]] hits zero, though...[[spoiler: they lose their grip on reality entirely and proceed to adopt the same BlueAndOrangeMorality as the True Fae, which is quickly followed by losing all traces of humanity and possibly ''becoming'' a new member of TheFairFolk. This probably isn't what the short-sighted, selfish Others have in mind when taking slaves (it's not the only method they have of reproduction-how a Name for one of the Keepers comes into being varies), but ''still''.]]
** ''TabletopGame/HunterTheVigil'' has
this trope. Since as an explicit risk of taking up the Vigil. Too many hunters have broken in the face of the world's supernatural threats and gone insane, becoming either maniacal killers or, worse, Slashers. The fiction for ''Slasher'' makes this explicit, as one story focuses on a hunter who started tracking down and killing mages because one of them killed his buddy; by the time he's working his way down to the grimdark version ''relatives'' of Franchise/{{Batman}}, what can you expect?
mages, however, another group of hunters tracks him down and kills him.
*** Similarly, in ''TabletopGame/HunterTheReckoning'', Hunters with very high Virtue ratings may become obsessed with that Virtue. Zealots (including Avengers, Defenders, and Judges) are particularly likely to become AxCrazy and tolerant of collateral damage.
** Also: Radical Inquisitors, Commander Farsight some ''TabletopGame/MageTheAscension'': The Euthanatos Tradition spends much of its time trying to clean the time...40K world of evil people that no longer serve their purpose in The Wheel, but in doing so expose themselves to a corruption known as [[TheCorruption Jhor]]. Jhor is the only game where even the ''monsters'' can gained by using magic to kill, killing unnecessarily, not maintaining a mundane identity with a job and friends so as to remain grounded, and so forth. People who succumb to Jhor [[EvilMakesYouUgly become pale and sallow, like they are ill]] and [[WithGreatPowerComesGreatInsanity far more extreme in measures, methods, and goals]]. They often [[WellIntentionedExtremist hold on to their original ideals and goals]] even as they continue to rationalize more drastic measures.
*** The [[BigBad main villains]] the Technocratic Union are
this trope.
** The Imperium
in their backstory. They used to be the heroic Order of Man itself can be this. Reason, a band of mages and intellectuals who came together to make life better for the little guy and overthrow the shadowy [[AncientConspiracy ancient conspiracies]] that ruled the world. [[BecameTheirOwnAntiThesis Now they are the shadowy ancient conspiracies the rule the world,]] and to a worse degree than many of the those they overthrew. It isn't complete, as most rank-and-file Technocrats are usually portrayed as {{Punchclock Villian}}s at worst and at best deliberately misled by their superiors, and often [[RootingFortheEmpire gain the support of players]]. They have done a great deal of good. It's hard to say that the guys who gave up democracy and toilet paper are all bad... but on the other hand, [[GreyAndGreyMorality they're actively withholding the cure for cancer, so it's rather difficult to unabashedly support them]]].
* In ''TabletopGame/{{Deadlands}}'', the validity of PayEvilUntoEvil allows for the existence of
a fair number of "Gray Hats". Harrowed {[[RevenantZombie revenants]] timesharing their bodies with a demon that can [[EnemyWithin potentially take them over at any moment]]) are a character type available in all settings, whilst the classic game has several practitioners of BloodMagic (including a [[DefectorFromDecadence good-hearted rogue member]] of the resident clan of inbred {{Evil Sorcerer}}s) and the ''Hell on Earth'' game has prophets of radiation and mutation. That said, there are some characters considered so dark that it's inevitable that they ''will'' become monstrous {{NPC}}s in the end, with it being a question of how much good the player can do before that happens.
** The classic WeirdWest game has the Vampire character type, who are somehow more evil and inherently corrupt than the Harrowed.
** ''Hell on Earth'' has the Anti-Templars, who draw upon the power of the Reckoners and are invariably corrupted into Servitors as a result. They're mainly fit as player characters because most of them, at least initially, [[BadPowersGoodPeople only start taking the Reckoners' power so they can be strong enough to protect others]], and that's only because they disagree with the restrictive, oft-brutal code expected of the
[[KnightTemplar theocratic]] {{dystopia}} that goes against the secular, rationalist utopia that their [[MessianicArchetype Emperor]] envisioned (The Emperor's Imperial Truth that promotes science and reason is now condemned as heresy, ''in his name''). Their Inquisition is apparently a power-hungry madhouse that is able to order the deaths of millions with a simple "just to be sure that there's no Chaos on the planet". Their armies are known for spreading death and destruction even to those they're helping, and will even fight amongst themselves if the situation calls for it. As a quote goes, "We used to pray for the Emperor to send us his angels. Now, we pray that he never does again."
*** Inquisitors must be sure that Exterminatus is the best and/or only option, as being baited by the Ruinous Powers into destroying your own worlds is, in fact, seen as just as bad as the world falling to Chaos. Indeed, there's at least [[VideoGame/DawnOfWar one]] canon example of a Chaos worshipper arranging for an Exterminatus ''on purpose'' so that he could dedicate the death of the planet and everything on it to the Dark Gods, an act for which he was elevated to Daemonhood.
*** When you gaze into the warp, the warp also gazes back into you...and laughs. "There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting gods."
*** Any Inquisitor will eventually become this. There are two main sects of Inquisitors, the Puritans and Radicals. Puritans believe that they must only destroy Daemons, never consort with them or use their wares (even a bolter touched by a daemon is considered tainted and must be destroyed). Radicals believe that they are allowed to use daemons against other daemons, so long as the purpose is pure. These two sects often have clashes and many of the Ordos are divided between these sects. However, all Inquisitors start as Puritans, while almost all Inquisitors die Radicals. This is because the WideEyedIdealist (and that's saying something, given the setting and [[MoralEventHorizon how they are willing to behave]]) that goes into the organization slowly sees the futility of fighting alone, and slowly rationalizes using daemons and daemonic weaponry against them. Most Inquisitors are likewise more likely killed by their own peers than the daemons of the warp, usually by trial and execution at having found to harbor daemonic artifacts.
Templars]].



** The ''Book of Vile Darkness'' sourebook mentions an EvilCounterpartRace of halflings called the Jerren. They were once an ordinary halfling community that was regularly raided by goblinoids, until they were on the verge of extinction. In desperation, their clan leaders tapped into some source of dark knowledge that let the Jerren go on the offensive with poisons and magical plagues, which led to them JumpingOffTheSlipperySlope and committing atrocities that [[EvenEvilHasStandards sickened the goblins.]] Now the goblins are long dead and the Jerren are feared as a tribe of {{Absolute Xenophobe}}s that capture, ritually sacrifice and cannabilize anyone who enters their stretch of prairie.

to:

** The ''Book of Vile Darkness'' sourebook mentions an EvilCounterpartRace of halflings called the Jerren. They were once an ordinary halfling community that was regularly raided by goblinoids, until they were on driven to the verge edge of extinction. extinction by goblinoid raids. In desperation, their clan leaders tapped into some source of dark knowledge that let the Jerren go on the offensive with poisons and magical plagues, which led to them and when that wasn't enough they went JumpingOffTheSlipperySlope and committing committed atrocities that [[EvenEvilHasStandards sickened the goblins.]] Now the goblins are long dead and the Jerren are feared as a tribe of {{Absolute Xenophobe}}s that capture, ritually sacrifice and cannabilize cannibalize anyone who enters their stretch of prairie.



* Inverted with Dr. Rudolph van Richten of TabletopGame/{{Ravenloft}}, who started out his monster-hunting career determined to avenge his wife and son by any means necessary, but came to recognize the wrongness of this after he'd [[spoiler: sicced some zombies on a Vistani band and [[MyGodWhatHaveIDone watched them be torn to bits]]. Of course, given these were the Vistani who kidnapped his only son and sold him to a vampire to become the vampire's "bride" (a special form of spawn), and all because his efforts to treat one of their own wounded tribe members had failed and the badly injured Vistani had died, some could argue that [[KickTheSonOfABitch they had it coming]]. Still, that he is willing to realise that this is going too far is why he canonically has a Good-based CharacterAlignment]].
** The heroes of Ravenloft always run the risk of becoming what they had set out to destroy because every act of evil committed in the Demiplanes of Dread has a chance of drawing the attention of the Dark Powers. The more horrific the act of evil, the greater the chance that the Dark Powers will take notice.

to:

* ** Inverted with Dr. Rudolph van Richten of TabletopGame/{{Ravenloft}}, who started out his monster-hunting career determined to avenge his wife and son by any means necessary, but came to recognize the wrongness of this after he'd [[spoiler: sicced some zombies on a Vistani band and [[MyGodWhatHaveIDone watched them be torn to bits]]. Of course, given these were the Vistani who kidnapped his only son and sold him to a vampire to become the vampire's "bride" (a special form of spawn), and all because his efforts to treat one of their own wounded tribe members had failed and the badly injured Vistani had died, some could argue that [[KickTheSonOfABitch they had it coming]]. Still, that he is willing to realise that this is going too far is why he canonically has a Good-based CharacterAlignment]].
** *** The heroes of Ravenloft always run the risk of becoming what they had set out to destroy because every act of evil committed in the Demiplanes of Dread has a chance of drawing the attention of the Dark Powers. The more horrific the act of evil, the greater the chance that the Dark Powers will take notice.notice.
* In ''TabletopGame/LegendOfTheFiveRings'', the Kuni Witch Hunters are the people who hunt down people who have become tainted by oni/the Shadowlands. In search of these people and in search of how to destroy the Shadowlands, they frequently become tainted and summon Oni.
* In ''TabletopGame/{{Pandemonio}}'', this is part of the job description for Disciples -- you need to be willing to kill a possessed person to get at what's possessing them or sacrifice innocents for a boost if that's what it takes, or else you won't be much good at killing angels and demons. Taking this too far can invoke a literal version, however. One of the ways to raise [[TheCorruption Decay]] is to harm innocents, with a pass given to magics that harm them as a side effect of their use, such as many of the exorcism spells, or Maledictions -- the powerful magics necessary to fight some of the most powerful angels and have even a chance of winning, which are massively destructive by nature and often directly harm innocent bystanders as a side effect of use.



* ''TabletopGame/HunterTheVigil'' has this as an explicit risk of taking up the Vigil. Too many hunters have broken in the face of the world's supernatural threats and gone insane, becoming either maniacal killers or, worse, Slashers. The fiction for ''Slasher'' makes this explicit, as one story focuses on a hunter who started tracking down and killing mages because one of them killed his buddy; by the time he's working his way down to the ''relatives'' of mages, however, another group of hunters tracks him down and kills him.
** Similarly, in ''TabletopGame/HunterTheReckoning'', Hunters with very high Virtue ratings may become obsessed with that Virtue. Zealots (including Avengers, Defenders, and Judges) are particularly likely to become AxCrazy and tolerant of collateral damage.
** One of the subtler risks in ''TabletopGame/ChangelingTheLost'', for many reasons sometimes considered the ''bleakest'' of the TabletopGame/NewWorldOfDarkness games. As a Changeling's Wyrd (power meter, roughly akin to, say, [[TabletopGame/VampireTheRequiem Blood Potency]]) goes up, they remember their time in {{Arcadia}} more and more clearly. This is, in and of itself, frightening, but not dangerous. If their [[KarmaMeter Clarity]] hits zero, though...[[spoiler: they lose their grip on reality entirely and proceed to adopt the same BlueAndOrangeMorality as the True Fae, which is quickly followed by losing all traces of humanity and possibly ''becoming'' a new member of TheFairFolk. This probably isn't what the short-sighted, selfish Others have in mind when taking slaves (it's not the only method they have of reproduction-how a Name for one of the Keepers comes into being varies), but ''still''.]]
* In ''TabletopGame/LegendOfTheFiveRings'', the Kuni Witch Hunters are the people who hunt down people who have become tainted by oni/the Shadowlands. In search of these people and in search of how to destroy the Shadowlands, they frequently become tainted and summon Oni.
* ''TabletopGame/MageTheAscension'': The Euthanatos Tradition spends much of its time trying to clean the world of evil people that no longer serve their purpose in The Wheel, but in doing so expose themselves to a corruption known as [[TheCorruption Jhor]]. Jhor is gained by using magic to kill, killing unnecessarily, not maintaining a mundane identity with a job and friends so as to remain grounded, and so forth. People who succumb to Jhor [[EvilMakesYouUgly become pale and sallow, like they are ill]] and [[WithGreatPowerComesGreatInsanity far more extreme in measures, methods, and goals]]. They often [[WellIntentionedExtremist hold on to their original ideals and goals]] even as they continue to rationalize more drastic measures.
** The [[BigBad main villains]] the Technocratic Union are this in their backstory. They used to be the heroic Order of Reason, a band of mages and intellectuals who came together to make life better for the little guy and overthrow the shadowy [[AncientConspiracy ancient conspiracies]] that ruled the world. [[BecameTheirOwnAntiThesis Now they are the shadowy ancient conspiracies the rule the world,]] and to a worse degree than many of the those they overthrew. It isn't complete, as most rank-and-file Technocrats are usually portrayed as PunchclockVillians at worst and at best deliberately misled by their superiors, and often [[RootingFortheEmpire gain the support of players]]. They have done a great deal of good. It's hard to say that the guys who gave up democracy and toilet paper are all bad... but on the other hand, [[GreyAndGreyMorality they're actively withholding the cure for cancer, so it's rather difficult to unabashedly support them]]].
* In ''TabletopGame/{{Pandemonio}}'', this is part of the job description for Disciples -- you need to be willing to kill a possessed person to get at what's possessing them or sacrifice innocents for a boost if that's what it takes, or else you won't be much good at killing angels and demons. Taking this too far can invoke a literal version, however. One of the ways to raise [[TheCorruption Decay]] is to harm innocents, with a pass given to magics that harm them as a side effect of their use, such as many of the exorcism spells, or Maledictions -- the powerful magics necessary to fight some of the most powerful angels and have even a chance of winning, which are massively destructive by nature and often directly harm innocent bystanders as a side effect of use.
* Happens more than a few times in the course of ''TabletopGame/BattleTech.'' The most ironic example is probably Major Cullen Craig. He abandoned the mercenary regiment he was born into, the [[BraveScot Northwind Highlanders]], because they accepted a former Death Commando, Loren Jaffray, into their ranks due to a combination of his blood heritage descending from a renowned Highlander family and his actions that saved the regiment. Insisting that Jaffray's past as a Death Commando (widely considered the most ruthless and fanatical state-sponsored special operations group in the Inner Sphere) and a member of a Highlander family branch that did not return with the Highlanders to their native world, he did maintained that accepting Jaffray was a mistake and would lead to the unit's downfall. He joined Swann's Cavaliers to hopefully one day oppose the Highlanders and drive Jaffray out. So driven is he in his goal that he does not voice dissent when the Cavaliers then proceeded to join the Word of Blake, murder droves of civilians using their Battlemech companies in a massacre and in doing so earn massive bounties on ''all'' of their heads, and bring the fury of the entire elite 17th Recon Regiment onto them, who are now out for blood after the deaths of civilians on their home worlds. In a final fit of irony, the Highlanders never dismiss Jaffray, survive the bloody Word of Blake Jihad mostly intact, and make it out into the so called Dark Age setting as a highly respected, major faction unto themselves. On the other hand, Craig and Swann's Cavaliers, all wanted men marked for death, are never heard from again.
* In ''TabletopGame/{{Deadlands}}'', the validity of PayEvilUntoEvil allows for the existence of a fair number of "Gray Hats". Harrowed {[[RevenantZombie revenants]] timesharing their bodies with a demon that can [[EnemyWithin potentially take them over at any moment]]) are a character type available in all settings, whilst the classic game has several practitioners of BloodMagic (including a [[DefectorFromDecadence good-hearted rogue member]] of the resident clan of inbred {{Evil Sorcerer}}s) and the ''Hell on Earth'' game has prophets of radiation and mutation. That said, there are some characters considered so dark that it's inevitable that they ''will'' become monstrous {{NPC}}s in the end, with it being a question of how much good the player can do before that happens.
** The classic WeirdWest game has the Vampire character type, who are somehow more evil and inherently corrupt than the Harrowed.
** ''Hell on Earth'' has the Anti-Templars, who draw upon the power of the Reckoners and are invariably corrupted into Servitors as a result. They're mainly fit as player characters because most of them, at least initially, [[BadPowersGoodPeople only start taking the Reckoners' power so they can be strong enough to protect others]], and that's only because they disagree with the restrictive, oft-brutal code expected of the [[KnightTemplar Templars]].


Added DiffLines:

* ''TabletopGame/{{Warhammer 40000}}'':
** The Imperium of Man itself can be this. It's a [[KnightTemplar theocratic]] {{dystopia}} that goes against the secular, rationalist utopia that their [[MessianicArchetype Emperor]] envisioned (The Emperor's Imperial Truth that promotes science and reason is now condemned as heresy, ''in his name''). Their Inquisition is apparently a power-hungry madhouse that is able to order the deaths of millions with a simple "just to be sure that there's no Chaos on the planet". Their armies are known for spreading death and destruction even to those they're helping, and will even fight amongst themselves if the situation calls for it. As a quote goes, "We used to pray for the Emperor to send us his angels. Now, we pray that he never does again."
** Inquisitors must be sure that Exterminatus is the best and/or only option, as being baited by the Ruinous Powers into destroying your own worlds is, in fact, seen as just as bad as the world falling to Chaos. Indeed, there's at least [[VideoGame/DawnOfWar one]] canon example of a Chaos worshipper arranging for an Exterminatus ''on purpose'' so that he could dedicate the death of the planet and everything on it to the Dark Gods, an act for which he was elevated to Daemonhood.
** Any Inquisitor will eventually become this. There are two main sects of Inquisitors, the Puritans and Radicals. Puritans believe that they must only destroy Daemons, never consort with them or use their wares (even a bolter touched by a daemon is considered tainted and must be destroyed). Radicals believe that they are allowed to use daemons against other daemons, so long as the purpose is pure. These two sects often have clashes and many of the Ordos are divided between these sects. However, all Inquisitors start as Puritans, while almost all Inquisitors die Radicals. This is because the WideEyedIdealist (and that's saying something, given the setting and [[MoralEventHorizon how they are willing to behave]]) that goes into the organization slowly sees the futility of fighting alone, and slowly rationalizes using daemons and daemonic weaponry against them. Most Inquisitors are likewise more likely killed by their own peers than the daemons of the warp, usually by trial and execution at having found to harbor daemonic artifacts.
** The Night Haunter's backstory is made of this trope. Since he's the grimdark version of Franchise/{{Batman}}, what can you expect?
** Also: Radical Inquisitors, Commander Farsight some of the time... 40K is the only game where even the ''monsters'' can succumb to this trope. When you gaze into the warp, the warp also gazes back into you...and laughs. "There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting gods."


** The ''Book of Vile Darkness'' sourebook mentions an EvilCounterpartRace of halflings called the Jerren. They were once an ordinary halfling community that was regularly raided by goblinoids, until they were on the verge of extinction. In desperation, their clan leaders tapped into some source of dark knowledge that let the Jerren go on the offensive with poisons and magical plagues, which led to them JumpingOffTheSlipperySlope and committing atrocities that [[EvenEvilHasStandards sickened the goblins.]] Now the goblins are long dead and the Jerren are feared as a tribe of {{Absolute Xenophobe}}s that capture, ritually sacrifice and cannabilize anyone who enters their stretch of prairie.



--> While the powers of the Old Ones bring death and decay, [[InvokedTrope sometimes it is necessary to use the weapons of evil to defeat evil]].

to:

--> ---> While the powers of the Old Ones bring death and decay, [[InvokedTrope sometimes it is necessary to use the weapons of evil to defeat evil]].


** ''ForgottenRealms'' has an elven god, [[http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Shevarash Shevarash]], dedicated to nothing more than hatred and vengeance to Lolth and drow (though he readily beats anything AlwaysChaoticEvil in the absence of drow targets). Aside of other traits "endearing" to Seldarine and other "good guys", he's a little too close to the [[BigBad main, local, dark deity]] who makes Lolth look like a nice and caring mom by contrast. Elves who aren't immediately endangered and don't desire vengeance aren't too enthusiastic about his followers either. "The holy symbol of the faith is a broken arrowshaft that has been dipped in drow blood and blessed by a priest of Shevarash." (''Demihuman Deities'')

to:

** ''ForgottenRealms'' ''TabletopGame/ForgottenRealms'' has an elven god, [[http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Shevarash Shevarash]], dedicated to nothing more than hatred and vengeance to Lolth and drow (though he readily beats anything AlwaysChaoticEvil in the absence of drow targets). Aside of other traits "endearing" to Seldarine and other "good guys", he's a little too close to the [[BigBad main, local, dark deity]] who makes Lolth look like a nice and caring mom by contrast. Elves who aren't immediately endangered and don't desire vengeance aren't too enthusiastic about his followers either. "The holy symbol of the faith is a broken arrowshaft that has been dipped in drow blood and blessed by a priest of Shevarash." (''Demihuman Deities'')

Added DiffLines:

** The [[BigBad main villains]] the Technocratic Union are this in their backstory. They used to be the heroic Order of Reason, a band of mages and intellectuals who came together to make life better for the little guy and overthrow the shadowy [[AncientConspiracy ancient conspiracies]] that ruled the world. [[BecameTheirOwnAntiThesis Now they are the shadowy ancient conspiracies the rule the world,]] and to a worse degree than many of the those they overthrew. It isn't complete, as most rank-and-file Technocrats are usually portrayed as PunchclockVillians at worst and at best deliberately misled by their superiors, and often [[RootingFortheEmpire gain the support of players]]. They have done a great deal of good. It's hard to say that the guys who gave up democracy and toilet paper are all bad... but on the other hand, [[GreyAndGreyMorality they're actively withholding the cure for cancer, so it's rather difficult to unabashedly support them]]].


** One of the subtler risks in ''TabletopGame/ChangelingTheLost'', for many reasons sometimes considered the ''bleakest'' of the TabletopGame/NewWorldOfDarkness games. As a Changeling's Wyrd (power meter, roughly akin to, say, [[VampireTheRequiem Blood Potency]]) goes up, they remember their time in {{Arcadia}} more and more clearly. This is, in and of itself, frightening, but not dangerous. If their [[KarmaMeter Clarity]] hits zero, though...[[spoiler: they lose their grip on reality entirely and proceed to adopt the same BlueAndOrangeMorality as the True Fae, which is quickly followed by losing all traces of humanity and possibly ''becoming'' a new member of TheFairFolk. This probably isn't what the short-sighted, selfish Others have in mind when taking slaves (it's not the only method they have of reproduction-how a Name for one of the Keepers comes into being varies), but ''still''.]]

to:

** One of the subtler risks in ''TabletopGame/ChangelingTheLost'', for many reasons sometimes considered the ''bleakest'' of the TabletopGame/NewWorldOfDarkness games. As a Changeling's Wyrd (power meter, roughly akin to, say, [[VampireTheRequiem [[TabletopGame/VampireTheRequiem Blood Potency]]) goes up, they remember their time in {{Arcadia}} more and more clearly. This is, in and of itself, frightening, but not dangerous. If their [[KarmaMeter Clarity]] hits zero, though...[[spoiler: they lose their grip on reality entirely and proceed to adopt the same BlueAndOrangeMorality as the True Fae, which is quickly followed by losing all traces of humanity and possibly ''becoming'' a new member of TheFairFolk. This probably isn't what the short-sighted, selfish Others have in mind when taking slaves (it's not the only method they have of reproduction-how a Name for one of the Keepers comes into being varies), but ''still''.]]


** One of the subtler risks in ''TabletopGame/ChangelingTheLost'', for many reasons sometimes considered the ''bleakest'' of the NewWorldOfDarkness games. As a Changeling's Wyrd (power meter, roughly akin to, say, [[VampireTheRequiem Blood Potency]]) goes up, they remember their time in {{Arcadia}} more and more clearly. This is, in and of itself, frightening, but not dangerous. If their [[KarmaMeter Clarity]] hits zero, though...[[spoiler: they lose their grip on reality entirely and proceed to adopt the same BlueAndOrangeMorality as the True Fae, which is quickly followed by losing all traces of humanity and possibly ''becoming'' a new member of TheFairFolk. This probably isn't what the short-sighted, selfish Others have in mind when taking slaves (it's not the only method they have of reproduction-how a Name for one of the Keepers comes into being varies), but ''still''.]]

to:

** One of the subtler risks in ''TabletopGame/ChangelingTheLost'', for many reasons sometimes considered the ''bleakest'' of the NewWorldOfDarkness TabletopGame/NewWorldOfDarkness games. As a Changeling's Wyrd (power meter, roughly akin to, say, [[VampireTheRequiem Blood Potency]]) goes up, they remember their time in {{Arcadia}} more and more clearly. This is, in and of itself, frightening, but not dangerous. If their [[KarmaMeter Clarity]] hits zero, though...[[spoiler: they lose their grip on reality entirely and proceed to adopt the same BlueAndOrangeMorality as the True Fae, which is quickly followed by losing all traces of humanity and possibly ''becoming'' a new member of TheFairFolk. This probably isn't what the short-sighted, selfish Others have in mind when taking slaves (it's not the only method they have of reproduction-how a Name for one of the Keepers comes into being varies), but ''still''.]]


* In the ''TabletopGame/{{Pathfinder}}'' Adventure Path ''Second Darkness'', the Elven noble Allevrah Azrinae hunted the Drow with such passion and hatred that she ''turned into one'' (''[[OurElvesAreBetter Pathfinder]]'' [[OurElvesAreBetter Elves do that]]).

to:

** The heroes of Ravenloft always run the risk of becoming what they had set out to destroy because every act of evil committed in the Demiplanes of Dread has a chance of drawing the attention of the Dark Powers. The more horrific the act of evil, the greater the chance that the Dark Powers will take notice.
* In the ''TabletopGame/{{Pathfinder}}'' Adventure Path ''Second Darkness'', the Elven noble Allevrah Azrinae hunted the Drow with such passion and hatred that she eventually ''turned into one'' (''[[OurElvesAreBetter Pathfinder]]'' [[OurElvesAreBetter Elves do that]]).


** One of the subtler risks in ''TabletopGame/ChangelingTheLost'', for many reasons considered the ''bleakest'' of the NewWorldOfDarkness games. As a Changeling's Wyrd (power meter, roughly akin to, say, [[VampireTheRequiem Blood Potency]]) goes up, they remember their time in {{Arcadia}} more and more clearly. This is, in and of itself, frightening, but not dangerous. If their [[KarmaMeter Clarity]] hits zero, though...[[spoiler: they lose their grip on reality entirely and proceed to adopt the same BlueAndOrangeMorality as the True Fae, which is quickly followed by losing all traces of humanity and ''becoming'' a new member of TheFairFolk. In fact, this is the whole ''point'' of turning humans into changelings in the first place -- it's the only way the True Fae can '''reproduce'''.]]
*** Note that given the sandbox nature of the nWoD, this is the "point" of making Changelings only if the Storyteller wants it to be. True Fae are canonically capricious, selfish beings. They likely care nothing about the eventual consequences of their actions. That is simply the effect of the Wyrd of Arcadia on a human soul.

to:

** One of the subtler risks in ''TabletopGame/ChangelingTheLost'', for many reasons sometimes considered the ''bleakest'' of the NewWorldOfDarkness games. As a Changeling's Wyrd (power meter, roughly akin to, say, [[VampireTheRequiem Blood Potency]]) goes up, they remember their time in {{Arcadia}} more and more clearly. This is, in and of itself, frightening, but not dangerous. If their [[KarmaMeter Clarity]] hits zero, though...[[spoiler: they lose their grip on reality entirely and proceed to adopt the same BlueAndOrangeMorality as the True Fae, which is quickly followed by losing all traces of humanity and possibly ''becoming'' a new member of TheFairFolk. In fact, this is This probably isn't what the whole ''point'' of turning humans into changelings short-sighted, selfish Others have in the first place -- it's mind when taking slaves (it's not the only way the True Fae can '''reproduce'''.]]
*** Note that given the sandbox nature
method they have of reproduction-how a Name for one of the nWoD, this is the "point" of making Changelings only if the Storyteller wants it to be. True Fae are canonically capricious, selfish beings. They likely care nothing about the eventual consequences of their actions. That is simply the effect of the Wyrd of Arcadia on a human soul. Keepers comes into being varies), but ''still''.]]


*** Any Inquisitor will eventually become this. There are two main sects of Inquisitors, the Puritans and Radicals. Puritans believe that they must only destroy Daemons, never consort with them or use their wares (even a bolter touched by a daemon is considered tainted and must be destroyed). Radicals believe that they are allowed to use daemons against other daemons, so long as the purpose is pure. These two sects often have clashes and many of the Ordos are divided between these sects. However, all inquisitors start as Puritans, while almost all inquisitors die Radicals. This is because the WideEyedIdealist (and that's saying something, given the setting and [[MoralEventHorizon how they are willing to behave]]) that goes into the organisation slowly sees the futility of fighting alone, and slowly rationalise using daemons and daemonic weaponry against them. Most inquisitors are likewise more likely killed by their own peers than the daemons of the warp, usually by trial and execution at having found to harbor daemonic artifacts.

to:

*** Any Inquisitor will eventually become this. There are two main sects of Inquisitors, the Puritans and Radicals. Puritans believe that they must only destroy Daemons, never consort with them or use their wares (even a bolter touched by a daemon is considered tainted and must be destroyed). Radicals believe that they are allowed to use daemons against other daemons, so long as the purpose is pure. These two sects often have clashes and many of the Ordos are divided between these sects. However, all inquisitors Inquisitors start as Puritans, while almost all inquisitors Inquisitors die Radicals. This is because the WideEyedIdealist (and that's saying something, given the setting and [[MoralEventHorizon how they are willing to behave]]) that goes into the organisation organization slowly sees the futility of fighting alone, and slowly rationalise rationalizes using daemons and daemonic weaponry against them. Most inquisitors Inquisitors are likewise more likely killed by their own peers than the daemons of the warp, usually by trial and execution at having found to harbor daemonic artifacts.

Showing 15 edit(s) of 20

Top

How well does it match the trope?

Example of:

/

Media sources:

/

Report