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* In "The Plan," when Debra rips into Ray for choosing Zippers the One-Man Wedding Band knowing that she'd hate it and decide to choose a DJ herself, this takes on a new dimension when you remember "The Wedding" from Season 2, which shows that Ray was extremely insecure about himself and skeptical that Debra really wanted to marry him for him and not a big fancy reception.
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* In "The Plan," when Debra rips into Ray for choosing Zippers the One-Man Wedding Band knowing that she'd hate it and decide to choose a DJ herself, this takes on a new dimension when you remember "The Wedding" from Season 2, which shows that Ray was extremely insecure about himself and skeptical that Debra really wanted to marry him for him and not a big fancy reception.
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** The depiction of TranquilFury in that very same episode. Ray was so furious at what happened that his brain couldn’t register it making him act like it was no big deal much to Debra’s frustration. It wasn’t until the wall was fixed that he had calmed down enough to actually get angry. How long did it take for the wall to get fixed it couldn’t have been healthy for Ray to be filled with such anger for so long. Also what would have happened if he had reached his RageBreakingPoint earlier.
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* When Frank and Marie crash their car through the wall Ray and Debra's house, Ray and Debra are walking upstairs. By the time the car skids to a stop, it is right when Ray and Debra were sitting less than a minute before. Had Ray and Debra not decided to go upstairs right when they did, they would have been killed.
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Changed line(s) 11 (click to see context) from:
* While PlayedForLaughs due to the DoubleStandardAbuseFemaleOnMale, when it's revealed Ray had at least attempted to coordinate with Debra in planning their wedding and she didn't like his choices so that he then deliberately screwed it up as a way for her to take the reins, it becomes FridgeHorror when you remember the Season 2 two-parter that showed their wedding and how insecure Ray was that she even wanted to marry him, the anxieties he had that he had given her an overblown proposal she couldn't say no to, and his consistent admission he knows himself to be unworthy of her, so that Debra's actions and screaming hysterics and pushing up against him as he shrinks back strays into domestic abuse territory.
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* While PlayedForLaughs due to the DoubleStandardAbuseFemaleOnMale, when it's revealed Ray had at least attempted to coordinate with Debra in planning their wedding and she didn't like his choices so that he then deliberately screwed it up as a way for her to take the reins, it becomes FridgeHorror when you remember the Season 2 two-parter that showed their wedding and how insecure Ray was that she even wanted to marry him, the anxieties he had that he had given her an overblown proposal she couldn't say no to, and his consistent admission he knows himself to be unworthy of her, so that Debra's actions and screaming hysterics and pushing up against him as he shrinks back strays into domestic abuse territory.territory.
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Changed line(s) 11 (click to see context) from:
* While PlayedForLaughs due to the DoubleStandardAbuseFemaleOnMale, when it's revealed Ray had at least attempted to coordinate with Debra in planning their wedding and she didn't like his choices so that he then deliberately screwed it up as a way for her to take the reins, it becomes FridgeHorror when you remember the Season 2 two-parter that showed their wedding and how insecure Ray was that she even wanted to marry him, the anxieties he had that he had given her an overblown proposal she couldn't say no to, and his consistent admittance that he knows himself to be unworthy of her, so that Debra's actions and screaming hysterics and pushing up against him as he shrinks back strays into domestic abuse territory.
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* While PlayedForLaughs due to the DoubleStandardAbuseFemaleOnMale, when it's revealed Ray had at least attempted to coordinate with Debra in planning their wedding and she didn't like his choices so that he then deliberately screwed it up as a way for her to take the reins, it becomes FridgeHorror when you remember the Season 2 two-parter that showed their wedding and how insecure Ray was that she even wanted to marry him, the anxieties he had that he had given her an overblown proposal she couldn't say no to, and his consistent admittance that admission he knows himself to be unworthy of her, so that Debra's actions and screaming hysterics and pushing up against him as he shrinks back strays into domestic abuse territory.
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Changed line(s) 8 (click to see context) from:
* Overlaps with TearJerker, but one possible explanation for the disappearance of Shamsky could be that Robert's dog had died, especially given it was an older breeding dog before it came into Robert's ownership.
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* Overlaps with TearJerker, but one possible explanation for the disappearance of Shamsky could be that Robert's dog had died, especially given it was an older breeding dog before it came into Robert's ownership.ownership.
!!FridgeHorror
* While PlayedForLaughs due to the DoubleStandardAbuseFemaleOnMale, when it's revealed Ray had at least attempted to coordinate with Debra in planning their wedding and she didn't like his choices so that he then deliberately screwed it up as a way for her to take the reins, it becomes FridgeHorror when you remember the Season 2 two-parter that showed their wedding and how insecure Ray was that she even wanted to marry him, the anxieties he had that he had given her an overblown proposal she couldn't say no to, and his consistent admittance that he knows himself to be unworthy of her, so that Debra's actions and screaming hysterics and pushing up against him as he shrinks back strays into domestic abuse territory.
!!FridgeHorror
* While PlayedForLaughs due to the DoubleStandardAbuseFemaleOnMale, when it's revealed Ray had at least attempted to coordinate with Debra in planning their wedding and she didn't like his choices so that he then deliberately screwed it up as a way for her to take the reins, it becomes FridgeHorror when you remember the Season 2 two-parter that showed their wedding and how insecure Ray was that she even wanted to marry him, the anxieties he had that he had given her an overblown proposal she couldn't say no to, and his consistent admittance that he knows himself to be unworthy of her, so that Debra's actions and screaming hysterics and pushing up against him as he shrinks back strays into domestic abuse territory.
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* On the surface, it may seem odd if not downright sinister that Marie favors Raymond so much over Robert, her firstborn flesh-and-blood and the tougher of the two boys, until you remember from "Good Girls" that Frank and Marie couldn't wait until marriage, and so it was just the one time, then they had to get married (if the show's crazy continuity is to be believed with several different retellings to how they hooked up) - and while perhaps not intentional, it subconsciously reveals why Marie clung so tightly to Raymond, when he was conceived within wedlock, and for any misery over the years she had with her perpetually unhelpful husband, she couldn't help feeling a bit distant and isolated from Robert. Also dovetails nicely when it is revealed Frank returned from a trial separation when Ray busted his arm, so that it's revealed it wasn't Raymond, but Robert who kept them together despite being utterly unsuited to one another.
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* On the surface, it may seem odd if not downright sinister that Marie favors Raymond so much over Robert, her firstborn flesh-and-blood and the tougher of the two boys, until you remember from "Good Girls" that Frank and Marie couldn't wait until marriage, and so it was just the one time, then they had to get married (if the show's crazy continuity is to be believed with several different retellings to how they hooked up) - and while perhaps not intentional, it subconsciously reveals why Marie clung so tightly to Raymond, when he was conceived within wedlock, and for any misery over the years she had with her perpetually unhelpful husband, she couldn't help feeling a bit distant and isolated from Robert. Also dovetails nicely when it is revealed Frank returned from a trial separation when Ray busted his arm, so that it's revealed it wasn't Raymond, but Robert who kept them together despite being utterly unsuited to one another.another.
* Overlaps with TearJerker, but one possible explanation for the disappearance of Shamsky could be that Robert's dog had died, especially given it was an older breeding dog before it came into Robert's ownership.
* Overlaps with TearJerker, but one possible explanation for the disappearance of Shamsky could be that Robert's dog had died, especially given it was an older breeding dog before it came into Robert's ownership.
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* Why did Ray goes through a flanderzation? It’s probably because he was tired of always being the straight man of everybody’s problem.
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* Why did Ray goes through a flanderzation? It’s probably because he was tired of always being the straight man of everybody’s problem.problem.
* On the surface, it may seem odd if not downright sinister that Marie favors Raymond so much over Robert, her firstborn flesh-and-blood and the tougher of the two boys, until you remember from "Good Girls" that Frank and Marie couldn't wait until marriage, and so it was just the one time, then they had to get married (if the show's crazy continuity is to be believed with several different retellings to how they hooked up) - and while perhaps not intentional, it subconsciously reveals why Marie clung so tightly to Raymond, when he was conceived within wedlock, and for any misery over the years she had with her perpetually unhelpful husband, she couldn't help feeling a bit distant and isolated from Robert. Also dovetails nicely when it is revealed Frank returned from a trial separation when Ray busted his arm, so that it's revealed it wasn't Raymond, but Robert who kept them together despite being utterly unsuited to one another.
* On the surface, it may seem odd if not downright sinister that Marie favors Raymond so much over Robert, her firstborn flesh-and-blood and the tougher of the two boys, until you remember from "Good Girls" that Frank and Marie couldn't wait until marriage, and so it was just the one time, then they had to get married (if the show's crazy continuity is to be believed with several different retellings to how they hooked up) - and while perhaps not intentional, it subconsciously reveals why Marie clung so tightly to Raymond, when he was conceived within wedlock, and for any misery over the years she had with her perpetually unhelpful husband, she couldn't help feeling a bit distant and isolated from Robert. Also dovetails nicely when it is revealed Frank returned from a trial separation when Ray busted his arm, so that it's revealed it wasn't Raymond, but Robert who kept them together despite being utterly unsuited to one another.
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* Crossing over with FridgeHorror: As mentioned above, Frank's mostly a JerkWithAHeartOfGold, but he does [[BerserkButton react extremely strongly]] to a few things--his love for Marie being questioned ("A LOVELESS MARRIAGE?") and especially his parenting. A few episodes have him becoming genuinely upset to the implication that he was a bad father, with him asking "Are you saying I didn't do right by you?" when Ray and Robert discuss their childhood issues. In "Grandpa Steals," Frank's also shattered when Ally sees him react angrily to a grocery store clerk, and goes out of his way to prove he's a nice guy and not scary. All of this makes perfect sense when we learn more about Frank's past in "Boys' Therapy": his own grandfather and father (Ray and Robert's great-grandpa and grandpa, respectively), were [[AbusiveParents physically and emotionally abusive]]. Ray comments that Frank, for all of his taunting, never once hit him or Robert; Frank explains "I couldn't...I was never as strong as him." Robert counters: "Maybe you didn't want to ''be'' like him," and Frank sincerely replies "I ''didn't''." It all suggests that Frank was absolutely ''terrified'' of his grandfather and father, which is [[FreudianExcuse likely the reason]] he's so insecure about his own parenting and relationship with his grandchildren. He knows what it's like to be scared when someone comes into a room, and has spent his whole adult life trying to break that cycle.
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* Crossing over with FridgeHorror: As mentioned above, Frank's mostly a JerkWithAHeartOfGold, but he does [[BerserkButton react extremely strongly]] to a few things--his love for Marie being questioned ("A LOVELESS MARRIAGE?") and especially his parenting. A few episodes have him becoming genuinely upset to the implication that he was a bad father, with him asking "Are you saying I didn't do right by you?" when Ray and Robert discuss their childhood issues. In "Grandpa Steals," Frank's also shattered when Ally sees him react angrily to a grocery store clerk, and goes out of his way to prove he's a nice guy and not scary. All of this makes perfect sense when we learn more about Frank's past in "Boys' Therapy": his own grandfather and father (Ray and Robert's great-grandpa and grandpa, respectively), were [[AbusiveParents physically and emotionally abusive]]. Ray comments that Frank, for all of his taunting, never once hit him or Robert; Frank explains "I couldn't...I was never as strong as him." Robert counters: "Maybe you didn't want to ''be'' like him," and Frank sincerely replies "I ''didn't''." It all suggests that Frank was absolutely ''terrified'' of his grandfather and father, which is [[FreudianExcuse likely the reason]] he's so insecure about his own parenting and relationship with his grandchildren. He knows what it's like to be scared when someone comes into a room, and has spent his whole adult life trying to break that cycle.cycle.
* Why did Ray goes through a flanderzation? It’s probably because he was tired of always being the straight man of everybody’s problem.
* Why did Ray goes through a flanderzation? It’s probably because he was tired of always being the straight man of everybody’s problem.
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* In flashbacks, Marie is shown to be an easy-going, supportive parent who is hesitant to meddle in her children's lives. On its face, this just seems to serve as ironic humor since it contrasts so sharply with Marie's present-day personality. But listen to Marie's speech in "Robert's Divorce." She declares that she is "through sitting idly by" and that "somebody has to protect their family." Perhaps Marie didn't just evolve into a meddlesome parent, but rather decided right then and there that she needed to take an active role in her family's affairs. That scene in "Robert's Divorce" was actually Marie's EstablishingCharacterMoment, presented via {{Retcon}}.
to:
* In flashbacks, Marie is shown to be an easy-going, supportive parent who is hesitant to meddle in her children's lives. On its face, this just seems to serve as ironic humor since it contrasts so sharply with Marie's present-day personality. But listen to Marie's speech in "Robert's Divorce." She declares that she is "through sitting idly by" and that "somebody has to protect their family." Perhaps Marie didn't just evolve into a meddlesome parent, but rather decided right then and there that she needed to take an active role in her family's affairs. That scene in "Robert's Divorce" was actually Marie's EstablishingCharacterMoment, presented via {{Retcon}}.{{Retcon}}.
* Crossing over with FridgeHorror: As mentioned above, Frank's mostly a JerkWithAHeartOfGold, but he does [[BerserkButton react extremely strongly]] to a few things--his love for Marie being questioned ("A LOVELESS MARRIAGE?") and especially his parenting. A few episodes have him becoming genuinely upset to the implication that he was a bad father, with him asking "Are you saying I didn't do right by you?" when Ray and Robert discuss their childhood issues. In "Grandpa Steals," Frank's also shattered when Ally sees him react angrily to a grocery store clerk, and goes out of his way to prove he's a nice guy and not scary. All of this makes perfect sense when we learn more about Frank's past in "Boys' Therapy": his own grandfather and father (Ray and Robert's great-grandpa and grandpa, respectively), were [[AbusiveParents physically and emotionally abusive]]. Ray comments that Frank, for all of his taunting, never once hit him or Robert; Frank explains "I couldn't...I was never as strong as him." Robert counters: "Maybe you didn't want to ''be'' like him," and Frank sincerely replies "I ''didn't''." It all suggests that Frank was absolutely ''terrified'' of his grandfather and father, which is [[FreudianExcuse likely the reason]] he's so insecure about his own parenting and relationship with his grandchildren. He knows what it's like to be scared when someone comes into a room, and has spent his whole adult life trying to break that cycle.
* Crossing over with FridgeHorror: As mentioned above, Frank's mostly a JerkWithAHeartOfGold, but he does [[BerserkButton react extremely strongly]] to a few things--his love for Marie being questioned ("A LOVELESS MARRIAGE?") and especially his parenting. A few episodes have him becoming genuinely upset to the implication that he was a bad father, with him asking "Are you saying I didn't do right by you?" when Ray and Robert discuss their childhood issues. In "Grandpa Steals," Frank's also shattered when Ally sees him react angrily to a grocery store clerk, and goes out of his way to prove he's a nice guy and not scary. All of this makes perfect sense when we learn more about Frank's past in "Boys' Therapy": his own grandfather and father (Ray and Robert's great-grandpa and grandpa, respectively), were [[AbusiveParents physically and emotionally abusive]]. Ray comments that Frank, for all of his taunting, never once hit him or Robert; Frank explains "I couldn't...I was never as strong as him." Robert counters: "Maybe you didn't want to ''be'' like him," and Frank sincerely replies "I ''didn't''." It all suggests that Frank was absolutely ''terrified'' of his grandfather and father, which is [[FreudianExcuse likely the reason]] he's so insecure about his own parenting and relationship with his grandchildren. He knows what it's like to be scared when someone comes into a room, and has spent his whole adult life trying to break that cycle.
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* In flashbacks, Marie is shown to be an easy-going, supportive parent who is hesitant to meddle in her children's lives. On its face, this just seems to serve as ironic humor since it contrasts so sharply with Marie's present-day personality. But listen to Marie's speech in "Robert's Divorce." She declares that she is "through sitting idly by" and that "somebody has to protect their family." Perhaps Marie didn't just evolve into a meddlesome parent, but rather decided right then and there that she needed to take an active role in her family's affairs. That scene in "Robert's Divorce" was actually Marie's EstablishingCharacterMoment, presented via {{Retcon}}.
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This is complete conjecture and paints an image that does not make sense with what the show is trying to convey. Ray and Debra are clearly noted to be in a happy marriage, albeit one with a lot of fights.
Deleted line(s) 4 (click to see context) :
* Why would Ray be so against Marie and Debra's plan to get Robert and Amy back together via jealousy? Because Ray's in [[HenpeckedHusband an unhappy marriage]] that happened for the wrong reasons (remember Debra's near-insane enthusiasm for having a big fancy wedding, which came off like she just wanted to get married for the sake of the wedding), and doesn't want Robert to go through the same thing (well, again).
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* It may seem rude for Frank to ask Marie for food when she's upset or angry, but Marie loves to cook, so Frank may very well be trying to calm her down and/or try to get her mind off what's making her upset by getting her to do something she loves. JerkWithAHeartOfGold indeed.
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* It may seem rude for Frank to ask Marie for food when she's upset or angry, but Marie loves to cook, so Frank may very well be trying to calm her down and/or try to get her mind off what's making her upset by getting her to do something she loves. JerkWithAHeartOfGold indeed.indeed.
* Why would Ray be so against Marie and Debra's plan to get Robert and Amy back together via jealousy? Because Ray's in [[HenpeckedHusband an unhappy marriage]] that happened for the wrong reasons (remember Debra's near-insane enthusiasm for having a big fancy wedding, which came off like she just wanted to get married for the sake of the wedding), and doesn't want Robert to go through the same thing (well, again).
* Why would Ray be so against Marie and Debra's plan to get Robert and Amy back together via jealousy? Because Ray's in [[HenpeckedHusband an unhappy marriage]] that happened for the wrong reasons (remember Debra's near-insane enthusiasm for having a big fancy wedding, which came off like she just wanted to get married for the sake of the wedding), and doesn't want Robert to go through the same thing (well, again).
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!1FridgeBrilliance
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!1FridgeBrilliance
* In the epilogue to "The Angry Family", we learn that Michael's story was based on an animated TV series called "Monster Maniacs", not the Barones. Suddenly it all makes sense why a character based on Robert wasn't in Michael's book: There probably wasn't a fifth character in that "Monster Maniacs" show.
* It may seem rude for Frank to ask Marie for food when she's upset or angry, but Marie loves to cook, so Frank may very well be trying to calm her down and/or try to get her mind off what's making her upset by getting her to do something she loves. JerkWithAHeartOfGold indeed.
* In the epilogue to "The Angry Family", we learn that Michael's story was based on an animated TV series called "Monster Maniacs", not the Barones. Suddenly it all makes sense why a character based on Robert wasn't in Michael's book: There probably wasn't a fifth character in that "Monster Maniacs" show.
* It may seem rude for Frank to ask Marie for food when she's upset or angry, but Marie loves to cook, so Frank may very well be trying to calm her down and/or try to get her mind off what's making her upset by getting her to do something she loves. JerkWithAHeartOfGold indeed.
