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This is discussion archived from a time before the current discussion method was installed.

Silent Hunter: Vis Hole In Flag, don't restore it. I'd like to do a rename.

Luxa: Wrote some brief history and some notes. I don't really know if the history belongs here, so feel free to edit out if you wish. (Also there might be some grammar mistakes...) Being Hungarian, I'm not really qualified for writing about common tropes in foreign eyes, I simply don't know how widespread is our how-the-world-sees-us image in reality. Most Hungarians thinks it moves in the Commie Land-GulaschSuppe-Martians triangle...

Silent Hunter: The history certainly belongs here. I think Hungary during the Cold War was just seen as another pact of the Warsaw Pact. In Red Rabbit, set in Hungary, characters comment on your language and compare it to "Martian".

Köszönöm! Welcome to the site!

Luxa: Szívesen! :) Actually the Martian refences the famous anecdote with Fermi and Leó Szilárd. It is quite surprising (and funny) that it is applied to the language. Nevertheless, I've added the related trope the main article.

Fast Eddie: Pulled too-wide image. Please see Administrative Policy.



"Before we start, a couple of things Hungary isn't:

  • It isn't "Eastern European," even though technically it is. Hungarians can sometimes get a bit sensitive about this."

I'm not sure if I've written the original one before the technically addition, but perhaps I have. As I suppose we both know, the problem is that people's perception of Eastern Europe and even Europe itself vary a bit. Just take a look at the Wikipedia article, or this Economist one (it will be free for a while). Based on your edit, I suppose you think that Hungary is in Eastern Europe, while I'm not sure about this. I'm not saying it is not, I say it is not that simple and therefore "technically it is" is not true, and in this form the comment makes no sense to someone not already familiar with this problem. I propose that we either pull this whole thing out or write a description of this whole problem. What do you think?

Barano: In retropect I should've phrased it differently, but ah well, it's late now. My problem is with the "Hungary is not Eastern European" thing, and I think the best solution would be removing that section, because... well. As even the summary of the article you cite suggests (by the way, it's not free anymore), the implication, and indeed, the most popular reasoning behind "Hungary is not Eastern European!" is basically "we're better than that primitive Eastern bunch." Unfortunately too many people believe this, but regardless, I think real-life Misplaced Nationalism has no place on this website.

I personally think Hungary can be either Central or Eastern (Eastern-Central, even!) depending on the context (and it is, in fact, regarded as either or both by various organizations), but the "it's not Eastern European" claim is full of Misplaced Nationalism all sorts of Unfortunate Implications.

Luxa: Okay, I shall wait a day for further comments, then I'm removing the whole section. I can't come up with a good way to rephrase the Slavic part and it is already covered by the lovely Finno-Ugric bit. Feel free to add it back of course.

Btw, I'm surprised that the article is not accessible, I could read it even logged out. Perhaps it is an IP-based thing or a cookie... It is not that important, it was basically about how the old Eastern-Europe label isn't valid any more because of diversity and it raised some interesting points about definitions.


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