Discussion Series / TheXFactor

If it helps to add: She is now booed by the studio audience, cited as the reason for boycotts of the show, and calls for her removal from the show for Season 2 are the main topic of discussion among fans. The claim, "She's not actively disliked," is at least three weeks old.

As for Repair Dont Respond, I read that page a long time ago when I first joined, and figured this was not such an instance, because the listed category is The Ace, which Scherzinger was in the UK but is absolutely positively not now in the USA. And for most of the first season (very likely her only one, if Simon Cowell's noncommittal response to the question of her future on the show in "TV Guide" is any indication), she wasn't actively disliked. Then It Got Worse. (She actually did get death threats; she is booed by the audience; and Simon has called her "Cruella" and openly mocked her on the show.)

Anyway, if the issue is Repair Dont Respond, isn't that more simply resolved by cutting the last few words of the trope listing and the first few words of the bullet point into one, rather than deleting the bullet point over again? I'd be more than happy to do that, if that's honestly the concern.

Plus I still stand by my assertion fan blogs call her a Complete Monster, which is why it's a pothole and not a separately listed trope. And I linked to one of the more popular fan blogs which uses almost that exact wording. Jeez louise, that's enough even for The Other Wiki to go on.

Okay, first, here is the entire section, the trope itself cut because it's being disputed.

• The Ace: Nicole Scherzinger's brief turn as a guest judge had fans clamouring for her to replace Dannii or Cheryl — or even for a fifth judging category to be created — ever since the first episode she appeared in. She did eventually become a judge, albeit of the US version rather than the UK one. Unfortunately the US audiences weren't as enamoured with her as their UK counterparts; while she isn't actively disliked, most viewers and critics couldn't understand why she was supposed to be a massive improvement over Cheryl Cole.
  • Correction: She wasn't actively disliked until she voted to eliminate 14-year-old sweet Christian girl Drew just to punish Simon and received death threats afterward. The following week, she refused to vote against Elimination Houdini Marcus Canty, so as not to hurt his feelings, which caused the elimination of Badass Adorable Rachel Crow (and led to the Heartwarming Orphan falling to the stage in tears and the Crowning Moment Of Heartbreaking in which she begged her adoptive mother for forgiveness). Since then, fan opinion on Scherzinger has been split. Some consider her a Dirty Coward, whereas others insist she's a Complete Monster.

Now, the problems:

• Any entry that starts with "Correction:" calls foul of Repair Dont Respond or Justifying Edit. If a trope is incorrect, fix it or remove it. A page should flow as though one person wrote it, and that means the second bullet cannot stay for any reason whatsoever. Example Indentation has how to correctly use second bullets, but this is not an instance where it's warranted.
• See Natter and Conversation In The Main Page - a second bullet here certainly comes into those categories, and they are never allowed under any circumstances.
• We aren't interested in how other sites define or use phrases we use - our definitions are what matter. Complete Monster has a very specific definition on this site, and should not be used with another site's definition. It also doesn't apply in the slightest bit in this case; a flaw related to a TV singing contest is very much not a person with no redeeming features whatsoever. And that's aside from the fact that no real life entries are ever allowed on Complete Monster - if we won't put brutal dictators under the trope, we certainly won't put celebrities. Fanblogs calling her a Complete Monster is irrelevant to this site.

There's probably more, but I'm just back from work and very tired. Regardless, this is enough to go on for now - neither The Ace as a trope nor the correction should be added unless it becomes clear whether it applies. It may be justifiable to put it on the YMMV page, but even then a correction wouldn't be warranted.

OK. On the "Repair Dont Respond," fine. I'm a little unclear why your singling out this one instance but leaving several others on the same page (including one three tropes down the list), but I completely understand your point, and can easily fix that. No problem.

As for the use of the Pothole to "Complete Monster" - I think the issue here is, it's a pothole. Yes, I'm referencing a Bill Hicks joke (hence that pothole). Yes, I know it's hyperbolic. I read something once somewhere about this site being informal and encouraging, quote, "breezy language." And since the issue in question is not whether or not Scherzinger is a Complete Monster (which would come up if I'd listed it as a trope, which I didn't), but whether or not she was a breakout fan success in the UK version and as thoroughly and completely the opposite in the US version, as judged by how fans reacted to her, that's not a YMMV. The trope "Teens Are Monsters" lists the acts booed off the stage in the UK. Scherzinger has been booed in the US (not to mention the death threats and everything else). If you watch the show in the States, and your mileage varies, you are apparently firmly in the minority.

I can see the Elimination Houdini pothole being a YMMV thing which can be fixed easily by removing it (although the incident in question was his third consecutive time on the chopping block, which was part of the problem). I have had edits removed entirely in the past and almost always just let it go. But frankly, this circumstance, with all respect, smacks hard of inconsistent pedantry.

And for the record, I do say, "Correction," myself, about myself, in everyday speech when I realize I've misspoken or am proven incorrect or facts change. But again, that's neither here nor there. If the issue is Repair Don't Respond, I am more than happy to correct it and won't argue.

Well. With the UK and US versions separated, the simplest solution is to restore The Ace and move the bullet point to let's say Face–Heel Turn.

As this discussion has been up several days, and as there's been a lot of change to the main page, and nobody's responded to this discussion, I get the impression only two people out of thousands care. Those would be you and me. So I'm restoring The Ace to the British discussion (with minor changes), shifting the comments of her American reaction down there, and I really, genuinely, sincerely hope the edit war over a pothole is over. Brits can all still like Nicole a lot. It's cool.