I would like to renominate Prometheus/Adrian Chase give how he spends most of his time crossing Moral Event Horizon
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We already discussed him in the thread two weeks after the season 5 finale, in June 2017. As despicable as Adrian Chase is—and dear God, he is fucking despicable—he is still a villain defined by the Avenging the Villain trope. It is very difficult, if not outright impossible, for any fictional character who is Avenging the Villain to qualify as a Conplete Monster, because their revenge-driven rampage is born out of love for another character (as is the nature of the trope), thus demonstrating Even Evil Has Loved Ones. There were a few other reasons people disqualified him (the lower scope of his crimes compared to previous Big Bads, still seeming to have genuine love for his wife despite killing her anyway, etc.) but ultimately it's the fact that his rampage is motivated by seeking revenge for his father. He's a 99% monster, but not 100%.
If it's any consolation, Ricardo Diaz may ultimately end up counting, depending on what he gets up to in season 7.
Eobard Thawne is a complete monster in my book. But you, people, must know better, right?
Edited by WindowsXP Hide / Show Replies
He's way too Affably Evil to be CM. That's MY opinion. Besides Zoom out-evils him by far.
Following the season 1 finale of The Flash we approved him initially, but cut him following his Pet the Dog moment in the season 2 premiere. We discussed this in the thread a number of times, and ultimately decided that no, he does not count, taking everything into consideration.
Edited by speyeker
He might count in the future though. Plus Eobard is Faux Affably Evil defined, way too sociopathic to be an example of Affably Evil. Every kind word he says is fake.
Edited by miraculous "That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
This is true, miraculous. My comment above was from May 2017, following season 2 of Legends of Tomorrow, where his characterization is basically consistent with that of The Flash: an absolutely selfish, despicable human being, but not without redeeming qualities and one who isn't motivated by sadism or the pursuit of power but rather for self-preservation only (thus his end goals are nowhere near as despicable as other Arrowverse baddies like Zoom or Vandal Savage, even though he crosses horrific lines to attain these comparatively banal goals). However, in November of 2017 he appeared in Crisis on Earth-X where he appeared to discard most of his former redeeming qualities and upped his heinousness significantly, if that's even possible; so, while we still haven't proposed him yet, we're keeping a very close eye on him for possible future appearances.
Would Clifford De Voe from Flash's season 4 count as one? He started off well-intended then became a monster by the end of the season.
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Probably, but the deliberation for that starts on Tuesday, June 5th. We'll have to be patient before then.
Potential candidates can't be discussed until two weeks after the end of their story arc. It's to make sure everyone in the thread catches up and limits the number of people who end up having the story spoiled. It also allows everyone to get their thoughts straight before discussion.
Someone had added two of the main villains of the Earth-X event in the YMMV page. I deleted them nonetheless, but I just wanted to clear it up with you guys if they qualify or not?
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Neither of them qualify. Earth-X!Oliver Queen explixitely loves his wife and was friend with Earth-X!Tommy Merlyn which is unquestionably redeeming.
Earth-X!Quentin Lance doesn't count because his murder of his daughter is Offscreen Villainy and barely a blip in the heniousness of the arrowverse.
So will Hunter Zolomon and/or Vandal Savage be added to this section soon? Both qualify as Complete Monsters, given the number and depth of their atrocities, their lack of redeeming qualities (even their "romantic" aspects were presented as sick and terrible), and their respective shows having played their threats seriously.
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Vandal already has entry on Legends page, he should be here. As for Hunter he barely escapes being complete monster when Caitlin asks him to spare Barry and he complies. He's still monster but there was small hint of humanity left. Lewis Snart on the other hand...
Actually we added Hunter. Any redeeming qualities he has are gone in the finale.
Lewis isnt going up though. Sure he doesnt have any redeeming qualities but hes also severly outclassed by a ton of other villains.
Edited by miraculous "That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
I'd like to again submit Prometheus. He brutaully tortured Oliver, kidnapped his son, and will kill anyone without hesitation.
Only mods can edit Monster pages. We'll have a discussion in the cleanup thread two weeks following the season finale—June 7th—with an effortpost drafted by Mirai Yuji (https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Sandbox/CompleteMonsterDiscussionDates)
. If there are enough votes in favour, Mirai Yuji will draft an effortpost, and once that's all well and good, then yes, Prometheus may be added. Or, if there are enough "No" votes, then he won't be. But no discussing until June 7th, period. That's our formal process on this site for approving and adding new Complete Monsters. :)
Considering the multiverse has opened up to include multiple worlds with characters who have this status, shouldn't they be added to this page?