The Last Airbender

Also, fire needs to be self produced because it is the easiest element to be separated from whereas imprisoning earth benders requires to be far from land in metal, waterbenders require elaborate safety procedures, and you have to kill airbenders, stopping someone from being too close to fire is trivially easy.

When I said balance, I was referring to how fire is significantly weaker than the other 3 elements even if you have lots of fire around to control, not lack of natural fire...but...whatever.

"Every opinion that isn't mine is subjected to Your Mileage May Vary."

and you have to kill airbenders

Why not just take all their air off them?

Speaking of killing, what did everyone think to Aang not killing the fire lord in the series final? Cop out or the truer to his role as the The Keeper Of The Balance.

edited 24th Aug '11 9:15:15 PM by joeyjojo

hashtagsarestupid

Left a black mark on the entire series for me.

I mostly like the cartoon, but the ending...felt so forced....and it was so obvious because of the network the cartoon was running on.

And worst of all, the cop out they came up with just to achieve the goal.

edited 24th Aug '11 9:12:52 PM by Signed

"Every opinion that isn't mine is subjected to Your Mileage May Vary."

I don't know. I know a lot of teenage fans wanted Aang to kill the fire lord simply because they wanted the show to go there, that's not a good enough reason in my book.

I'm remember having this conversation of my girlfriend when trying to get her into the show

Girlfriend: I don't understand, if the bald guy can just everything bend, why doesn't why he just uses his powers to burn the king to death from the inside out?

Me: because it's a fucking kid's show, all right?

edited 24th Aug '11 9:32:36 PM by joeyjojo

hashtagsarestupid

I don't believe a show should become "DEATH GORE GORN!!!" too, but in this case, it was...

1) The finale

2) FIRELORD OZAI

A good kids cartoon is done well enough that the audience wouldn't notice that it is one. This is the case with Avatar for a long time*

until the very end. I mean, some characters have died in previous episodes.

I mean, even Disney allows villains to die. Look at Gargoyles.

---

Although truth be told, my main gripe was HOW Aang finished him off. It felt like they debated till the very end and had to finish it off due to deadline.

edited 24th Aug '11 9:44:35 PM by Signed

"Every opinion that isn't mine is subjected to Your Mileage May Vary."

Definitely a cop out, but I think one of the things people forget is that, in the end, it really is a kid's show. It's amazing that Avatar got away with what it did.

Aang was always really big on anti-violence throughout the series, so it would have been a huge damper for him - from his Wide-Eyed Idealist perspective, maybe even a loss - if he had to resort to murder. So the ending wouldn't have been as...happy as it was. Just because Aang wouldn't have been able to forgive himself. So from the perspective of maintaining the atmosphere, good choice.

From a technical perspective? Nonsense. He should have killed the bastard. Ozai's a powerful firebender, but he didn't become firelord because he was a bender. He's only even shown using bending in...what, four episodes? And two of them only just count. Anyway, my point is that removing his bending shouldn't technically have lost him the throne. Azula losing her mind - now there's a legitimate reason to lose a crown.

The thing is that they'd written themselves into a corner. On the one had, the bastard had to die. On the other, there's no way in hell Nickelodeon would have allowed it. So it may not have been ideal, but sometimes you just have to work with what you have.

As for that fire thing. I didn't see the movie but here's my guess: with all of the other elements, you need the element to physically be there to use it. So I guess Shyamalan figured that, well, why should fire be any different?

But here's the difference. Earth and air are everywhere. You're hard put to be anywhere without land, and if you're someplace without air your problems are a lot bigger than not being able to bend. As for water? Well, for most of the series it's true that you physically need the water, but in the third season they show that a skilled bender doesn't need that. In fact, they show that water is, by far, the most versatile of the elements. Fire is just...unless you're in a cold or dark area, you don't really need it all the time. It's just not that prevalent. And being able to create fire is basically the only reason Zuko survived the first season finale. If he'd had fire with him, it would have been a moot point.

But if that's the reason that Shyamalan made that...really dumb decision, he kind of forgot the really important fact that fire being the only one of the four that you can actually create is true in Real Life. All of the elements are unique in their own way, and one of the things that makes fire stand out is that you don't physically need it to be there. Why? Because fire is energy anyway. It's not physical.

And if I claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that I don't know.

I can't believe it but... I agree with you Signed. And may we never speak of this again.

The Blog The Art

Disney made gargoyles? Didn't know that, then again I've still can't get my head around the fact nickelodeon made avatar.

Any way yes characters died in the show. But it's rare for cartoon characters to out right kill people. Hell even batman doesn't do that.

edited 24th Aug '11 9:53:51 PM by joeyjojo

hashtagsarestupid

That has less to do with being a cartoon character and more to do with being Batman.

edited 24th Aug '11 10:21:53 PM by BigMadDraco

I kind of enjoyed the idea of firebenders using existing fire, partially because they integrated a lot of unique tactics into their battle plan. There was one particular shot in the trailer showing a soldier riding the lizard up the wall, the wall being damaged from a flaming boulder and the soldier using that fire for ammunition. It was also suggested before the movie came out that basic infantry had self-lighting torches built into their staffs. If the movie showed more of that kind of strategy the change wouldn't have been as disliked, plus show more of the strategy inherent with such a change in tactics by having the North Pole soldiers trying to extinquish the napalm cages. That kind of stuff is what makes battles in this world different from the normal world.

The whole thing with Aang using spiritbending I felt was more based on principle of proper storytelling rather than being lazy. They've built up to a confrontation several seasons in the making and every step along the way has tried to avoid the easy way out story-wise. For example the entire second season was to show that the avatar state is not going to be a standby Deus ex Machina for the series ("Shit hits the fan, lets use the Avatar State to fix it!"). After all that having Aang just kill Ozai (no matter how long and epic the battle, no matter if the Avatar State itself was used) was going to feel lazy.

And pulling "spirit bending" completely out of their rears at the last minute didn't feel lazy to you?

The Blog The Art

Could ANYONE here actually understand that farking turtle?

Read my stories!

He probably should have shown up at the beginning of season 3. Then Aang could have sort of attempted to get the hang of spiritbending throughout the season.

I liked the conflict between Aang, his past selves, and the apparent irreconcilability between their opinions that he pulled off.

Turtle was random showing up at that point though. He could still redeem himself if he shows up in Korra though (then he will have been foreshadowed).

edited 25th Aug '11 7:02:40 AM by UltimatelySubjective

"Nullius addictus iurare in verba magistri, quo me cumque rapit tempestas, deferor hospes."

I got three questions

1. How come fire benders are hurt by other fire bending attacks I always thought it would fall under no sell terrority?

2. Would the effects of Sozin comet be permanently boost Firelord Ozia bending?

3. How come Zuko's fire bending wasn't boosted to the Phoenix King levels during the comet?

Place your past in a book burn the pages let them cook.

You're kidding, right? It's like asking why water benders aren't immune to rain.

Not permanantly but powerful enough that he would've devastated the world during the comet's passing.

Sixth ranger syndrome.

The Blog The Art

1. No entirely waterbenders control the water around them while fire benders create their own fire.

2. Thanks for the answer.

3. I guess another that was wrong with the finale.

edited 25th Aug '11 9:18:59 AM by warrior93

Place your past in a book burn the pages let them cook.

1. I always understood that a firebender can block another firebender's flame through conscious action (otherwise, every firebender who'd ever been in an Agni Ki would be sporting burns that make Zuko's look like a mild rash) but they're not "naturally" immune and a stronger bender can overcome a weaker one's defenses.

3. Zuko wasn't as strong as Ozai to begin with by a long shot, so why would he be enhanced to the same degree? He and Azula did seem to be enhanced fairly evenly (and they seemed to be about equal in power after Zuko met the dragons).

''All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us..."

Thanks for the answers Master

However I have another question and this is for everybody on this thread.

What would ya'll do if ya'll found out that Mr. M Night Shamyalia Ding Dong aka Mr. What A Twist. Was going to direct the live action movie verison of The Legend of Korra?

edited 25th Aug '11 12:15:04 PM by warrior93

Place your past in a book burn the pages let them cook.

Lazier than just writing "Aang kills Ozai" after all the drama he went through? No.

I'm not saying spiritbending was the most logical conclusion, but I haven't heard any suggestions that would be a more satisfactory way of concluding that fight.

edited 25th Aug '11 12:39:23 PM by KJMackley

Technically yes it was a cop-out,but I like it. Him killing Ozai would've murdered the atmosphere of the show,and made a Broken Aesop anyway,and honestly it would've ruined the joke Foreshadow at the beginning of SC (The glue-bending dialogue).Although Ozai losing the thrown becuase of no firebending was a cop out that sucks.

Also no interaction with Katara until the last second,really? I mean yes it was seen in earlier episodes,but that should only prove to add more to it.It's even worse with Katara who showed no tension in Part I,claimed to be "confused" even earlier,and then didn't interact whatsoever with only one perhaps implied reference on Appa with Zuko which looked more like a concerned mother. And then they just kiss again??????? If anything the Ship was reversing entirely until that point,the Last-Minute Hookup is a WallBanger. It's too the point that even M. Night himself could make it more believable.

Zutara only doesn't work becuase of all the ridiculous amount of malice (That IS NOT Belligerent Sexual Tension) and because Maiko actually developed in a believable way (despite the Strangled by the Red String feel at "The Awakening")

This "Batman doesn't kill people" bogus comes from the Silver Age,which got revived with the Timmverse,for proof just watch the REAL Batman film with Michael "Evil Grin" Keaton and Jack "The Real Joker" Nicholson.Keaton killed everyone left and right and so did the original

Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter

Having never quite gotten to the finale, is it actually stated anywhere that Ozai losing his bending meant losing the throne?

thought he just gave away the throne to Azula...who lost the throne to Zuko...because she fought two benders in a 2 on 1 fight.

"Every opinion that isn't mine is subjected to Your Mileage May Vary."

Don't you mean 1 on 1 fight? But yeah, Azula pretty much forfeit the Agni Kai when she shot at Katara, not that there was a referee or anything.

It's never stated that losing bending equals losing the throne, but it was a coup, so I don't think it really matters. I imagine there must have been plenty of Fire Nation citizens who wouldn't object to Ozai getting imprisoned, but there are probably plenty that were still loyal. We may see something like that in the upcoming Avatar comic.

And about the firebending; another thing to consider is that it depends on breath. Firebenders can easily wear themselves out and have to catch their breath, which weakens them. Good breath control keeps you fighting longer, and lets firebenders create more fire. So their ability to create fire is based on their inner chi, the heat inside their bodies as well as from the sun and surroundings, and from their breath. Through the magic of the Avatar universe, this allows them to combine these three things and create fire on their own. So to sum it up, I guess you could say they can ignite the chi that they release through the bending. From there it's just a matter of controlling and propelling. Bending manifests as a telekinetic force for water and earthbenders. Airbenders have it different, since they don't quite "grab" their element, they usually just propel it.

edited 25th Aug '11 9:00:45 PM by StarOutlaw

Thunder, Thunder, Thunder...

Actually Signed, Aang taking Ozai's powers away was in the original pitch, but there was no Lion Turtle and Spirit Bending really did get pulled out of his ass.

Also, Male Toph that Katara had a romantic interest in, Iroh was evil and trained Zuko wrong firebending as a joke, season 2's ending was less Empire Strikes Back and the Earth King actually succeeded in getting an army out towards the Fire Nation and Appa would have been captured by Zuko and sent to Ozai's palace in Season 2 only to be found towards the series finale.