edited to add this information, since this is going to be a long clean-up
"Donald Trump, as with any other current political figure, should not be a subject of any trope example on the wiki, except:
- When the work in question specifically mentions the RL individual.
- When the entirety of the example has to do with the portrayal of that individual in the work.
- When the work is fictional.
All three of these must apply.
Alternatively:
- When the RL individual has a creative role themselves, such as writing or acting in a work. In this sense we give them no more nor less treatment then we would any other creator.
Additionally, please make sure to take out any examples of "Funny Aneurysm" Moment, Harsher in Hindsight, or Hilarious in Hindsight regarding these political figures. A political event that may be seen positively by some people may be seen negatively by others.
We're starting with the wicks to Donald Trump (There were 751 of them at the starting point of this count.)
Wicks have already been checked and cleared up to
2/14/17 Inherent in the System
Given the current political climate, talking about Donald Trump on this Wiki is a very sensitive topic and pretty much any comment on him could easily end up violating the Rule of Cautious Editing Judgment. I talked it over on Ask a Troper and a moderator gave me permission to start this topic. I feel it will be necessary to make sure any mention of him is safe and avoids politically charged or biased opinions. Right now, we need to stick to facts, not opinions.
Edited by SeptimusHeap on Jul 27th 2020 at 2:06:58 AM
Like reflections in the glass!
Found (and cut) this on Jimmy Neutron's YMMV page (again a Hilarious in Hindsight subullet).
- This strong resemblance
to Donald Trump's tactics.
- This strong resemblance
There have been a lot of edits regarding the The Hall of Presidents YMMV.Disney Theme Parks.
Any advice on that?
Heel
The Disney Theme Parks thing is simply a statement of how people are reacting to him and doesn't take an explicitly pro-Trump or anti-Trump position. And it's directly about him and his animatronic. I feel this one's appropriate and can be kept. Describing Trump as "extremely polarizing" is not taking a stance on him.
Ax the Neutron thing. It's one of the least controversial things about him, but it has little to do with him.
I no longer edit on TV Tropes but will continue as an occasional forum poster.
Blapper of Water
You're right in that describing someone as "extremely polarizing" is not taking a stance on that person. However, the entry reads "contemptible, extremely polarizing nature." That's clearly taking a stance on the person.
I think the example could just be "This can take a hideously political turn for some whenever an animatronic of the newly-elected U.S. President is added to The Hall of Presidents at WDW's Magic Kingdom. Audience members would actually boo whenever said animatronic gave their speech at the end of the show." Or to cut off the entry after the part about Bush to show a specific example. The part about the boiling point isn't necessary, imo.
Look at all that shiny stuff ain't they pretty
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
"Contemptible" has been removed.
A thought I had: since this thread seems to have progressed from "Trump" to "all recently active politicians" (a good move IMO), I was thinking a useful thing to define might be "how recent is recent?" Reagan and Thatcher are still flame wars waiting to happen thirty years on, after all.
Like reflections in the glass!
I;d say from 1940 onward might be a good first estimate.
edited 21st Jul '17 7:06:06 PM by MorningStar1337
That far back? I was going to propose "since Nixon" myself, since there's... very little debate on the kind of person he was.
Like reflections in the glass!
That does seem more reasonable.
What about this from NightmareFuel.Scary Stories To Tell In The Dark?
- Might be Hilarious in Hindsight (Harsher in Hindsight? "Funny Aneurysm" Moment?) when compared with this photo◊ of Donald Trump.
- Might be Hilarious in Hindsight (Harsher in Hindsight? "Funny Aneurysm" Moment?) when compared with this photo
I know you said to remove any and all hindsight examples from YMMV pages, but I'm just checking...
I cut it. Didn't get it, natter, and shoehorned in.
Migrated to Chloe Jessica!
There's a Hindsight entry on the YMMV.Al Franken page. I would just cut it, but it's the only entry on the page, so the whole page would need to be cut, and I'm not sure how to (or even if I can) do that myself. (Also, aren't real people not supposed to have YMMV pages in the first place?)
ETA: Should the Counterpart Comparison entry on YMMV.Batman The Telltale Series be cut? I haven't played the games so I don't know if it's running afoul of ROCEJ for Trump to be compared to Dent.
Also, I cut Hindsight entries on YMMV.Arrested Development, YMMV.Black Mirror Series Two, YMMV.Doctor Who S 29 E 12 The Sound Of Drums, YMMV.Elysium, YMMV.Epic Rap Battles Of History, YMMV.Game Of Thrones S 6 E 6 Blood Of My Blood, YMMV.Gangs Of New York, YMMV.Gate, and YMMV.Batman Returns.
ETA (2): There's a Hindsight entry on YMMV.D Generation X, but it's not related to Trump becoming President and it seems to me like it should stay. There are similar entries on the Hilarious in Hindsight.Film page. Thoughts?
edited 24th Jul '17 11:27:08 AM by razorrozar7
Migrated to Chloe Jessica!
... why would that YMMV.Al Franken example have to be cut? There's nothing remotely objectionable there. It's a Hilarious in Hindsight example that mentions Donald Trump, but Trump isn't Gamer Gate, we don't overtly delete every mention of him.
Migrated to Chloe Jessica!
^ Yeah, fair point. I was being overzealous, I suppose. (Though I am pretty sure I read somewhere that real people are only supposed to have Creator, Useful Notes, or Trivia pages...)
Migrated to Chloe Jessica!
Lost in Space
Well, for one thing, Creator articles aren't allowed to have YMMV subpages unless it's specifically about their work. In this case, the fact that Franken won a U.S. Senate seat isn't a valid use of Hilarious in Hindsight since he has not nor apparently plans to run for President, and the thing about Clinton making him her VP is way too tenuous a connection.
edited 24th Jul '17 1:47:29 PM by Fighteer
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
But him winning a seat in elected office is 100% valid HIH since he previously wrote a comedy book about him being elected to office.
Found a Youtube Channel with political stances you want to share? Hop on over to this page and add them.
Blapper of Water
RE: 231, about YMMV.Disney Theme Parks: My complaint focused more on "nature" than "contemptible." It's a step up to remove the word "contemptible" but it's still judging the person to say that the hall was almost shut down "simply because of his extremely polarizing nature." It was almost shut down because of the people complaining about an animatronic depicting Trump, not because of anything Trump did in regards to the hall.
Look at all that shiny stuff ain't they pretty
Acknowledged; I considered just deleting the entire entry but decided not to. It's not exactly ideal as it is, but a single mention of Trump doesn't merit a nuke. I removed "contemptible" for being completely unnecessary and negative.
Blapper of Water
I never suggested to nuke the example. I suggested to cut a portion of the example.
Look at all that shiny stuff ain't they pretty
Nightmare
Got a question/appeal
On the Prez (2015) page, someone deleted the following entry
- Harsher in Hindsight: Word of God declares he wrote this set in a Post-Trumpian America, way before the elections made it real. Make of that what you will.
But the author, Marc Russell, did mention this was his intention in the Off-Panel Podcast
http://sktchd.libsyn.com/off-panel-96-the-vw-bus-life-with-mark-russell
I don't have the timestamp to the exact moment where he said it, but it's there.
In light of this, can I put this trope back onto the page?
And there is always someone who will take it upon himself. Always. Always. Always. I have become evil, but once I, too, was good...
Blapper of Water
It says in the stickied comment: "please make sure to take out any examples of "Funny Aneurysm" Moment, Harsher in Hindsight, or Hilarious in Hindsight regarding these political figures. A political event that may be seen positively by some people may be seen negatively by others." The example that you're asking about can be cut simply on account of it being a HIH trope and of it being about a political figure.
That said, it seems to be distorting a Word of God example into a Harsher in Hindsight example. I think it could at least be made more neutral and put in a Word of God bullet, if it actually can be shown to come from the creator (and nobody wants to listen to the entire 54-minute-45-second podcast to find out so please help us find the quotation in that haystack).
Look at all that shiny stuff ain't they pretty
Nightmare
How about this under Trivia
Word of God: On an interview on the Off-Panel podcast, Marc Russell explains he based Prez on the idea of a post-Donald Trump presidency society... even though at the time he wrote Prez, the race to be the candidates for the political parties was barely starting to shape up.
I think I wrote it in a very neutral manner.
Also, what if instead of being a HIH, could it be a Funny Aneurysm Moment? It's a more neutral trope as well.
And I'll try to get the timestamp for the comment on Trump
edited 25th Jul '17 7:43:34 AM by Klaudandus
And there is always someone who will take it upon himself. Always. Always. Always. I have become evil, but once I, too, was good...
Blapper of Water
I think that's fine, though it would need the timestamp in parentheses so people could find it (I think one of the original issues was that there wasn't evidence the creator had said that). Also, there needs to be editing for grammar before it's put anywhere on the wiki.
That trope is specifically listed in the stickied comment.
Look at all that shiny stuff ain't they pretty
Nightmare
Ok, I'll have it just in trivia then — and for the record its at the 14:00 mark and onward
And there is always someone who will take it upon himself. Always. Always. Always. I have become evil, but once I, too, was good...
And that's besides the fact that Trump isn't portrayed in the work and thus breaks the first and second bullet points of the stickied comment.
edited 18th Jul '17 11:47:16 AM by WaterBlap
Look at all that shiny stuff ain't they pretty