The Scrappy Cleanup

I'm fairly certain Vanille also has more than enough fans that disqualify her as The Scrappy. Heck, I think she's quite popular among Yuri fans, because the games heavily imply that she and Fang are a couple.

Everywhere I read she was hated for her annoying voice and perky attitude.

Might be a good idea to try and track down popularity polls in Japan to see how popular she is in her game's home country. I'm fairly certain that she has enough fans that she would be considered a Base-Breaking Character at worst.

Still, it'd probably be best for other people to weigh in on Vanille as well.

one more thing: why was the linearity such a big deal for people? Final Fantasy X was just as linear, if not even more so, and it's still regarded as one of the best in the series.

You're probably better off asking in the Final Fantasy general thread than here.

yeah...i thought so. i just didn't know about that one.

It's a presentation thing; some games are better at hiding their linearity than others. XIII was exceptionally bad at it, to the point that the game has been called "the giant hallway" (or something along those lines) for how obvious the railroading was.

To keep this on-topic, XIII and its sequels seem to be pretty divisive in general so I'm not sure if anybody qualifies.

edited 2nd Nov '16 8:00:28 PM by Karxrida

If a tree falls in the forest and nobody remembers it, who else will you have ice cream with?

Sorry to interrupt the conversation, but I have an example that I want to see:

Iceman and the New Mutants seem to be a Base-Breaking Character, thanks to their Crazy Awesome tendencies. But they're listed simultaneously as Base-Breaking Character and The Scrappy. I don't really enter the fanbase of the show much, so any opinions?

Was a long time since I watched X-Men: Evolution or partook in any fandom, but my impression is that the only scrappy there is Spyke. Then he got put on a bus for a while (specifically/partially because of his impopularity, IIRC), and when he came back he was pretty much Rescued from the Scrappy Heap. So I don't think Iceman or Boom-Boom fits either. The part about "the New Mutants in general" is just not allowed.

My impressions of that fandom are probably out-dated and limited, though. It's an old show, after all.

For the Final Fantasy characters, I'm not sure any of the recently mentioned characters fit. They all have their fans, and it's gone up and down. I mean, to take Vanille as an example, she got a lot of flak in the beginning for her "fake" Australian accent (in a universe where Australia doesn't exist), but then when people found out exactly why her accent was as it was, they thought it made a lot of sense, and was well-acted.

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I didn't trust it. Bobby's going back to Base-Breaking Character.

Ethnic Scrappy has some problems. I think it's supposed to portray when characters are portrayed in an offensive way, but some of them are just placed there merely because of their ethnicity. For Example:

• "Some fans of Cat Dog loathe Lola the bird, although only part of it has to do with her being a Latin-American stereotype, and another part is that she was sometimes a Creator's Pet."
• "In Defenders of the Earth, Mandrake the Magician had an adopted Asian son named Kshin."
• Jasper, Brian's gay cousin, is considered by many as a "Gay Scrappy." (Er, last I checked, homosexuality wasn't an ethnicity)
• There's also Mort Goldman, who gradually devolved into a walking Jew caricature. Lampshaded in the episode "Road to Germany", when an antisemitic caricature in Nazi Germany looks exactly like him.
• Consuela the Mexican maid.
• Fouad, the Arab who's continually amused by (and explains) Peter's American humor.
• Generally averted by Tricia Takanawa despite being referred to every time as "Asian reporter Tricia Takanawa."

These are only a few examples, but all in all I think people are confusing it for "Characters we hate who happen to be an ethnic minority" The reason for this being is they just lay down a character, their ethnicity, and expect people to understand that. Also, regardless of the troper's intentions, sometimes the example is written so that it makes it seem as though people are just offended by the ethnicity. Unfortunate Implications begin to pop up...

The way I read that trope is that it's an offensively stereotypical caricature of a character that's also The Scrappy.

That means we can probably cut any example not meeting the same requirements we have for The Scrappy, and cut or comment out those without context about how their ethnicity plays into the trope.

Since The Scrappy is a supertrope in this case, we should probably move the characters fitting Ethnic Scrappy to that page from The Scrappy.

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So which should we cut?

I feel that Severa from FE Awakening wasn't liked and wasn't well-recieved in the Western fan-base, even though she was popular in Japan. So, she should be counted as a scrappy.

That sounds like a classic example of Americans Hate Tingle which, last I checked, was a trope that's mutually exclusive with The Scrappy.

they/them || "Forgive me, regent of queer amphibians" - Lt.BGob

It is. A character that's disliked in their home country, however, and liked somewhere else, can be The Scrappy. The trope is not mutually exclusive with Germans Love David Hasselhoff, but is mutually exclusive with Americans Hate Tingle.

Oissu!

And vice versa (A character that's liked in their home country, however, and disliked somewhere else, can be The Scrappy), right?

Nope, because that's the Americans Hate Tingle trope.

Oissu!

I wasn't aware that Germans Love David Hasselhoff wasn't mutually exclusive from The Scrappy.

It's not, we ruled that pretty decisively when Rose was brought up. The Scrappy in Japan, Base-Breaking Character in the west.

edited 14th Nov '16 4:24:36 PM by PhiSat

Oissu!

Can it be ruled as this: Severa being The Scrappy in America, while being more positively recieved in Japan?

That would still be more Americans Hate Tingle, since Severa was well-received enough to rank high in a popularity poll in Japan, where she was created. And it's already been established that anyone that falls under Americans Hate Tingle cannot be The Scrappy.

Why can't it?

Dude, you are really, REALLY starting to be a Single-Issue Wonk over The Scrappy for Fire Emblem characters. Didn't shit like this get you suspended LAST time?

I wasn't trying to be a Single-Issue Wonk, okay? I was talking about Severa. She wasn't liked in the Western fanbase, so she could technically be a scrappy.

edited 15th Nov '16 9:47:44 PM by TheNohrianDarkKnight