Akame ga Kiru

Yeah - Ogre was basically a dumb brute who was given his job because of his being a hatchetman for Honest.

And as for what we've seen thus far, Honest himself hasn't really done much Prime Ministering.

He eats and eats and executes people and executes people some more. Has he signed any laws? What kind of politics does he play with outside factors? He's evil on his own time, which seems...to be all the time.

Granted, the one thing he did that spoke of executive competence was disbanding his son's death squad. But the fact he couldn't control his own damn offspring speaks a lot of the truth of the matter. The Empire is too corrupt to manage its own corruption effectively.

edited 20th Dec '14 8:44:14 PM by NickTheSwing

Honest is the Big Bad, but he's almost comically weak when compared to Esdeath.

Even his anime Teigu speaks of this. Sure, it nullifies anything, but its one use and then he's stuck with a gun in a series full of highly trained super-assassins who were super before they got superpowers.

That's one of the reasons why I was outraged at Leone's death. An Ass Pull, one-use-ever weapon that was conveniently designed to remove other Teigu. THAT was a massive slap to the face.

At least give the Big Bad a powerful weapon.

I mean, just having the Big Bad keel over after using a one use power at the cost of one more good guy...that's hardly fitting at all.

That's part of why I want Honest to die before anyone else.

He's a tool who doesn't do anything befitting an actual Prime Minister, and Esdeath's reaction to his death alone is a fascinating concept.

Honest is pretty much the worst Big Bad ever. He's like what happens when you get a whole bunch of poor people to create a character that shows what makes them better than someone in a position of power. Even I think he's an insulting depiction of humans.

edited 20th Dec '14 9:27:22 PM by YuukiAsuna

I'm still bewildered at how the Emperor can trust that man.

He is smart when it comes down to it, but Honest has shown that, without Esdeath, he is nothing. Absolutely nothing. It's why I'm so eager for his death.

And if Dorothea kills him by poisoning his drink, that would be awesome.

edited 20th Dec '14 9:45:05 PM by Serocco

He's like what would happen if you crammed every single "evil rich ruler" stereotype together into one person. It would not surprise me if Honest kicked small puppies just because "Oh, a puppy dares obstruct my path!? FEEL THE WRATH OF MY BOOT!"

There is no human being who behaves like that. Syura, sadly, there is (Uday Hussein), but there is no way a public office holding Prime Minister can...well, do that. Be like that. I mean, come on Kid Emperor, look at his beard, his eyes, his girth, his hair, the fact he doesn't seem quite human, his all white ensemble, and how he eats.

Kid, are you freaking delusional?

I'm only aware of the emperor from the anime, but many abused children follow their parents' behavior when they become parents, consider it the way it's supposed to be, and apparently can still love their parents because unconditional family wub, so if the Prime Minister was at the emperor's side all the time, it's not really surprising, particularly since the emperor is still a little kid and the prime minister hasn't done something directly bad to the emperor himself(yet.)

What I'm interested in is how the prime minister got the previous emperor's trust in any form. At least considering how the shithole of an empire supposedly started being that way because THIS emperor is being manipulated.

edited 20th Dec '14 10:42:12 PM by YuukiAsuna

Actually, there was a prime minister before Honest who was assassinated. Both the manga and anime had him, and he looked pretty young - 40s is my best guess, so Honest might not have been in charge for very long. Just that he's wrecked everything in such a short time nonetheless.

There are real life people who are as bad as Honest (wow, that's an unusual pun), but they're not as cartoonish as him. Usually, they're more like the Koch brothers, who are so transparently corrupt that they now have the entire Kansas legislature under their pocket; or Jaime Dimon, who embodies the "Entitled Asshole" demeanor while thinking the poor are poor by choice; or Andrew Cuomo, who's so wealthy that he's utterly detached from reality; or Chris Christie, who's infamous for his frequent ridiculing of his own voters; and many pretend to be "nice" as a way to mock you for it.

Honest isn't like that at all. He's like a monster in a closet, who really doesn't do anything worthy of his rank, and is only said to be the Big Bad from word of mouth (they only call him the source of corruption rather than show it).

edited 20th Dec '14 10:54:22 PM by Serocco

As it stands, Honest is a Diabolus ex Nihilo, he's got no backstory, no reason, no cause, he's just there and evil.

Honest is just a hate sink, so people can hate the empire and at the same time feel sympathic for the jagers, with all the grey and black morality, you can still hate the minister without problem

Syura is a Hate Sink done right. I know people railed against Wild Hunt's very inclusion, but it's hard to deny - fans loved seeing them die. Syura and Champ, in particular, are actually listed under Complete Monster, and their deaths were wholly justified and well earned. I defend their inclusion because I think their depravity, although really in your face about it, did its job well.

Seryu is another case where you could argue she's a Hate Sink, but Mine pointed out that she has a really bad sense of judgment after being raised by a really bad man, so her psychotic sense of justice can be attributed to Ogre. I still dunno why she trusted him or Stylish, and people loved seeing her die as well, but as a character, people don't don't hold disdain for her like they do for Honest.

edited 20th Dec '14 11:01:02 PM by Serocco

with seryu you can see she cared of her teamates, is her sadicstic aproach of "justice" which make her villian.

Honest? There is nothing in him as a chararter, is just the thing peole wants dead

The problem with a Hate Sink is generally that after you've seen them get away with too much, no amount of punishment is actually going to leave you satisfied. In some people's cases, any amount of punishment is undesirable (philanthropists, for example), they just want the threat to stop being threatening.

edited 20th Dec '14 11:10:27 PM by YuukiAsuna

Maybe I'm reaching here, but I would've made things a bit more political in the capitol.

Along with Esdeath and Budo, I'd have had three other officials - a security czar like Zhou Yongkang (Chinese; he had a bigger budget than the army, which should say everything there) who actually does the State Sec and/or Secret Police thing that Wild Hunt never did. Have some sorta prison industrial complex embodied with him.

The other official would've been the exact opposite of Esdeath and Budo; he'd be a Chickenhawk, in that he's eager for war, but never had combat experienced, and is detached/uncaring of the reality of war. A coward that can actually disgust you, and probably someone who gained his position through wealth (and have him represent the "All for the Rich" ideology that Honest is supposed to embody).

The third idea is to have a military commander be The Starscream, who wants to overthrow the Prime Minister, become the Emperor, and rule as a military dictator, under the belief that "a true Emperor is a Frontline General."

Any of those would've added depth to the type of corruption in the capitol rather than having them be wanton mass murderers for the fuck of it.

Something funny, I saw seryu suffering a case of in-chararter hate sink: she see her enemies as complete monster, therefore she enjoy in a sadistic way the suffering she applies to her enemies

I know, Im reading too much and maybe Im misusing some tropes but that is how I saw her anyway

That's actually a realistic interpretation of her mindset. A lot of people do behave like her (see the unfortunate support Americans have for the CIA torture policies), but she actually does it herself, and against people who don't really deserve to die. She'd probably consider jaywalking to be a crime against humanity.

yes I saw the coment in some facebook pages and...disturbing dosent even start to describe it,ugh

And yes, you could said seryu is this trope desconstruted, is easier to wish a painfull death to everyone we consider monsters, but someone actually take this mindset is...creepy as hell

This comes a bit late, but both the manga and the anime showed Esdeath's soldiers raping some village women (the anime showed a quick shot of it in episode 9).

And while she herself did not participate in this particular crime others have already described her other atrocities.

Not to mention her kidnapping Tatsumi from the street, while the scene itself seems somewhat amusing, would be deemed a lot more disturbing if their genders were reversed.

I don't really think it would have been any more disturbing

but that's probably because I read shoujo manga

it would have been disturbing to me normally if it wasn't for how Esdeath is normally so sweet to him (even during that scene) and it highlights her rather primitive and innocent nature

Well, she does make it very clear to him that escape would not be an option for him because any tresspacer in the palace would be executed.

And imagine if a male noble would had caught a girl off the street because he liked her "pure smile". Then took her to his bedroom after knocking her out.

Perhaps I am a bit too negative here since I have no sympathy for Esdeath, because I while I find her interesting, she is just as guilty for the state of the empire as Honest and such deserves not more than he does.

Speaking of Honest, I think in the manga it was stated that he ensured the ascension of the young emperor after the passing of his parents in the struggle for power. We don't know the exact circumstances, but in the anime, in episode 23 Honest said that he cared for the emperor ever since they were victims of an "unfortunate accident", implying that he was behind their death.

Do you guys think that he might also behind their death in the manga?

edited 21st Dec '14 4:47:20 PM by Zarastro

a male noble

with a child's heart

a kickass military uniform

a pretty face

who is too caught up in being charmed to be threatening

that doesn't even do anything immediately at bed and has no plans to when facing resistance

doesn't sound that bad to me

I figured the escape not being an option for him thing wasn't relevant to what Esdeath would do but what all the guards and stuff would do seeing this dude out of nowhere

but then she can probably catch him before that even happens anyway

I checked back, and I still couldn't see any instance of rape in the anime or the manga regarding Esdeath's soldiers. I really couldn't. Maybe some poses can evoke the feeling, but those same poses can just as easily be interpreted as beatings or stabbings.

This is from a guy who's seen rape in Hentai before (not a good experience), and if I can't find definitive examples of it here, then I'll operate under the assumption that it didn't happen.

And I'll be very frank - if it was a man who did what Esdeath to does to Tatsumi, but to a girl, I'd still find it funny. You are a bit too negative on her in this instance, because she has shown that she does care about Tatsumi and wouldn't harm him unless it's in a fight.

edited 21st Dec '14 9:20:31 PM by Serocco