Misused: Arc Words get usage counts
Deadlock Clock: 26th Oct 2013 11:59:00 PM

Total posts: [72]
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26 AnotherDuck4th Sep 2012 05:34:53 AM from Stockholm , Relationship Status: In season
No, the other one.
Either this, or some kind of prophecy. How is it presented in the book?
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27 Xtifr4th Sep 2012 01:44:42 PM , Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
World's Toughest Milkman
Definitely not a prophecy. It's a fairly experimental and episodic book, and the first time you see this, you think it's just some scenes the author's going to return to later, but by the fourth or fifth time you see it, unchanged, it begins to puzzle you. Finally, of course, he does come back and develop the scenes.

As I say, if it weren't so long, I'd be certain that it fits.

edited 4th Sep '12 1:45:37 PM by Xtifr

"Existential Despair" is an oxymoron.
28 AnotherDuck4th Sep 2012 02:16:42 PM from Stockholm , Relationship Status: In season
No, the other one.
Then I'd say it fits. I don't think length is a disqualifying factor. It's just that very few authors use that long phrases as Arc Words.
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Is it actually said/heard by the characters, or is it just repeated in the text?

Note: I'm not necessarily saying Arc Words have to be in-universe, I'm just wondering.
30 Xtifr4th Sep 2012 04:44:54 PM , Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
World's Toughest Milkman
[up]Good question! Definitely not quotes. It's there to screw with the reader, not the characters, which might be an important distinction.

There is currently an example from Creatures of Light and Darkness on the trope, which was there before I created a page for the work, but I think it's technically misuse. My example is closer, but I'm still undecided.
"Existential Despair" is an oxymoron.
31 lu12721st Sep 2012 09:49:57 AM from 七夜 , Relationship Status: Loves me...loves me not
Somehow a post had made it into the crowner...deleted.

If we do the Trope Transplant, what is the misuse we're trying to cover?
小さく揺れた向日葵
32 AnotherDuck21st Sep 2012 11:03:57 AM from Stockholm , Relationship Status: In season
No, the other one.
I believe it's Arc Catch Phrase vs Enigmatic Arc Words, though I wasn't involved in the original dicussion.

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33 Noaqiyeum27th Sep 2012 01:33:22 PM from a thought-experiment gone horribly wrong , Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The it-thingy
...is this ready to be called?
Liberté, Égalité, Absurdité
[up][up]We already have Sharephrase. I suggest Meaningful Sharephrase to clarify the difference. Edit: Now I see that you did not propose a rename, but my point about the definition still stands.

edited 27th Sep '12 2:18:49 PM by Lophotrochozoa

35 Noaqiyeum27th Sep 2012 02:20:22 PM from a thought-experiment gone horribly wrong , Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The it-thingy
Is Arc Catchphrase what Arc Words is used to mean right now? It's not that intuitive to me.

(Note: Enigmatic Arc Words can also be related to Sigil Spam.)
Liberté, Égalité, Absurdité
Welcome, traveller, welcome to Omsk
[up]I agree: Arc Catchprase doesn't feel intuitive to me. Whether or not you stick "arc" in front of it, to me "catchphrase" means something that just one character says, and that often doesn't have any kind of deep meaning.
It does not matter who I am. What matters is, who will you become? - motto of Omsk Bird
We still have to define how Arc Words in the new meaning is distinct from Sharephrase.
Welcome, traveller, welcome to Omsk
[up]I think there's a clear difference, but it's harder to put in words than I thought. As far as I can tell, Arc Words are a kind of non-musical Leitmotif that sum up the meaning of a work (at least one meaning). Sharephrase doesn't have any such deep meaning.
It does not matter who I am. What matters is, who will you become? - motto of Omsk Bird
Dragon Writer
^ I agree, and that is a very important distinction.
40 Noaqiyeum11th Nov 2012 05:12:27 PM from a thought-experiment gone horribly wrong , Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The it-thingy
Thematic Phrase, perhaps, in that case?

It could be connected to The Hollywood Formula - the dynamic character in that model is the one who articulates the theme to the protagonist, whereas in this case the same articulation recurs independently of that particular conversation.
Liberté, Égalité, Absurdité
41 AnotherDuck11th Nov 2012 05:28:35 PM from Stockholm , Relationship Status: In season
No, the other one.
If a name collects enough misuse for us to transplant the original trope to a different name it's probably a bad idea to change the original name for the new trope it was misused as.
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Dragon Writer
Yeah, "Arc Words" is a rather catchy title for an arc motif ... just that's not the actual definition on the page.
43 Noaqiyeum11th Nov 2012 08:39:51 PM from a thought-experiment gone horribly wrong , Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The it-thingy
Oops, sorry - I misunderstood the previous two posts. >_<
Liberté, Égalité, Absurdité
44 lu1277th Dec 2012 06:36:07 AM from 七夜 , Relationship Status: Loves me...loves me not
It's a terrible idea to not include what we're redefining the thing into on the crowner. It's just confusing. What would be the redefined tropes?
小さく揺れた向日葵
45 Noaqiyeum1st Feb 2013 03:06:29 PM from a thought-experiment gone horribly wrong , Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The it-thingy
A phrase repeated throughout the work (often in a variety of contexts or situations) with great significance to either the theme or the plot (oftentimes both)?

Such as, for example, "Bump".
Liberté, Égalité, Absurdité
46 SeptimusHeap1st Feb 2013 03:09:38 PM from Zurich, Switzerland , Relationship Status: Mu
While that is a good start, we need a longer than laconic description, considering that I can barely expand descriptions.

edited 1st Feb '13 3:09:55 PM by SeptimusHeap

What about "Arc Words" for words that are repeated through an arc, and "Enigmatic Words" for words that are enigmatic?

Explains itself.
48 Noaqiyeum10th Apr 2013 08:41:52 AM from a thought-experiment gone horribly wrong , Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The it-thingy
...are Enigmatic Words tropeworthy?

...are we still arguing about the title? I thought we were moving on to the description.
Liberté, Égalité, Absurdité
49 Willbyr6th Jun 2013 04:07:49 AM from North Little Rock, AR , Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
With Mod Hat On
Calling this one in favor of the leading option. Make it so.
Hm, Recurring Phrase for the misuse? That seems to be what it's used for.

Alternative Titles: Arc Words
8th Jun '13 3:28:22 AM
Vote up names you like, vote down names you don't. Whether or not the title will actually be changed is determined with a different kind of crowner (the Single Proposition crowner). This one just collects and ranks alternative titles.
At issue:
Previous crowner decided to repurpose Arc Words into the literal meaning it was misused for and to transplant the current trope to a new name. This crowner is for deciding which name to use for the current trope.

Total posts: 72
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