What characters could possibly survive in the 41st millennium?

And you call yourself Full Paragon.

I may be a Full-Paragon, but I also believe that Renegades have the right to exist. And that they tend to be more inherently funny, and I don't think this is something we should take seriously.

The Joker would make an excellent Lord of Chaos Undivided.

This is a signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.

Okay guys. This army right here.◊

Pretty standard array of Space Marines. A few unconventional traits, but nothing we can't wrap out heads around.

What would it take to kill them? How many Stormtroopers? How many Chimaera? What kind of SMT Demons?

And don't just drop a nuke on them.

That looks like it's around 1500pts, so a standard 1500pt army should have a chance at sorting them out, and 2000-3000pts should be able to rip them apart.

So how many points is Darth Vader worth?

But given the numbers and weapons, with their current gear, I'd give Tagon's Tough's a clean win given equal numbers and they'd probably still win at two to one odds.

I'd say a single Guyver unit has the edge as well, but it might be a close thing. (The real question is how well the bio-armour could withstand Bolter fire.) The mega-smasher alone is probably enough to take everyone out if you can line up the shot. Two units and its in the bag. Aptom might be able to do it, but he'd have to abuse his regenerative abilities. A Guyver Gigantic or a Zoalord is an automatic victory.

edited 22nd Jun '13 4:31:41 PM by KnightofLsama

To be honest, when I wrote that answer, I'd forgotten this was the "what could survive" thread rather than the standard 40K thread, despite that being clearly visible on the screen, and since I hadn't moused over the links I assumed Imperial Guard stormtroopers and Chimera tanks.

Agreed with Knight of L Sama, definitely- Tagon's Toughs could stomp those guys flat, especially if they've got close-air support with gravy. Even without, their tendency towards plasma weapons could probably handle Imperial armour without even blinking. Superiour tech and soldiers that are just as super (check 'soldier boosts' in Schlock Mercenary) lets the Toughs take it at a walk.

If a less-combative option is allowed, well, The Doctor is (as has been previously mentioned) a pretty obvious choice.

SHODAN would be able to handle most of what 40k could throw at her, I think, if she was given enough time to set herself up.

And, again as previously mentioned, there's a pretty wide variety of superhero types that could do them in without any real difficulty.

... and, as a cheerfully deranged footnote; the Warner Brothers (and the Warner Sister! could give the grim darkness of the far future an atomic wedgie it would never forget (or, likely, recover from).

edited 23rd Jun '13 11:07:43 PM by TeChameleon

>If a less-combative option is allowed, well, The Doctor is (as has been previously mentioned) a pretty obvious choice.

He gets shot in the face. And then a couple more times.
Seriously, he can't do anything without Deus ex Machina handled to him. That shoehorning him into beating anything is annoying as fuck.

edited 23rd Jun '13 11:10:31 PM by Adannor

He's been doing it for decades, I think you may have missed the boat just a little bit on that one.

He has been doing it on Deus ex Machina. Nobody is handing him one anywhere else.

Go on. Tell me how he's gonna do anything big to WH 40 K with his screwdriver.

edited 23rd Jun '13 11:20:13 PM by Adannor

The Doctor might have to travel back in time to when the galaxy was less grimdark and then screw with history to avert the whole setting.

But yes, laying that aside, a guy who's known for giving hope to the downtrodden (off and on), escaping or genociding unstoppable alien menaces (but never completely, it seems) and understanding complex technology, as well as psychic and temporal phenomena, at a glance has a small chance of making strange things happen in the 41st millenium. He could probably upend great swathes of the setting by giving a few random bits and bobs from within the TARDIS to the right (or wrong, very wrong) people.

I agree with you about the Doctor's tendency towards deus ex machina to a point, but that's mainly a limitation of the format. Everything has to be solved in an hour in the show, but a hypothetical crossover has no such limitation.

Besides, 40K runs on bullshit space magic and the setting is full of literal gods in literal machines, as well as officers who don't wear their helmets and warriors who are able to slay hundreds of foes with broadswords while somehow avoiding being blown up by close air support. I see no reason that the laws of reality will mysteriously decide to assert themselves for the Doctor, of all people.

I think Lsama vastly overestimates what a Guyver is capable of. I'm not a connoisseur of the setting, but a space marine is roughly on par with the traditional Monster of the Week type creatures Guyver spends time taking on. Of course, he usually takes on two or three at once, but I see that contingent of Space Marines just rushing in an stomping him flat.

Considering the Marines have armored support, I'd say you'd need at least a dozen Bio-boosted armors to be an even chance. Unless they started pulling off crazy feats when I wasn't looking. Which is quite possible.

Isn't SHODAN just another Rogue AI? The setting is quite used to those.

As for the Toughs of Tagon that keep getting mentioned... I do not read that comic. Hmm.

^^Warhammer verse won't bend over to provide him with perfect knowledge of what and when to do and give him a convenient button to press or having all the people conveniently believe him.

>As for the Toughs of Tagon that keep getting mentioned... I do not read that comic. Hmm.

Non-Warp Teleport Spam. Pretty damn powerful plasma weapons all around.
At the current state of affairs they can take down the army posted recently, but they lost their ship and are now riding a not so good one so they won't be really taking down space armadas (with previous one, it was a simple matter of teleporting a nuke)

Heh. I did specify not dropping nukes on them, but I didn't mean it that literally.

Anything else that could take them on? Outright Zerg Rush allowed, assuming it doesn't take hundreds.

edited 24th Jun '13 12:58:02 AM by ShirowShirow

Theoretically, if you throw anything even roughly capable of combat at them in sufficient numbers, you would eventually be able to drag them down.

Fitting that quantity on the battlefield, or on the continent in extreme cases, tends to be the sticking point.

As for "doesn't take hundreds", that rules out about half the Tyranid tactics in the 40K 'verse.

edited 24th Jun '13 1:00:19 AM by CountDorku

Well, not that many. Tyranids are vicious, vicious creatures.

It's true that you could kill them by swamping them with bottom feeders, but I'm wondering how many bottom feeders it would take.

I mean take Imperial Stormtroopers for instance. You'd need to send in at least a hundred infantrymen and a dozen AT-ST's by my estimate. Less AT-ST's if they could bring about Shocktrooper heavy weapons specialists, who would be semi-useful against the bulky Space Marines themselves.

Faction Paradox is a Doctor Who spinoff from the nineties that at times out-grimdarks Warhammer 40k by a fair bit.

The Doctor's likelihood to get shot depends on a variety of factors. He did used to be a soldier, in the Last Great Time War, something where things a lot worse than Chaos Gods were mucking about. So called Deus ex Machina were everywhere. Everytime a side lost, they'd go back and undo it. There were attempts to weaponize paradoxes like Bad Wolf, and technology like the Void Ship, Genesis Ark and Reality Bomb at all corners. The Doctor survived that mess, and actually ended up ending it and everyone else.

...Of course, since he was a soldier for one of the major warring sides involved, he likely had better equipment and less compunction about using it than he does now. If he was dropped into the 40K setting unprepared on a battlefield, and simply tried to give the Oncoming Storm speech to the nearest marine without a plan in mind, he'd get shot and he'd deserve it.

But the Doctor's fundamental qualities are a certain amount of luck, charisma, and intelligence. He's physically able, with superhuman physical abilities compared to the average unaltered homo sapiens, but those don't matter as much as his ability to think, plan, macguyver or talk his way out of problems. These traits put him at a severe disadvantage in a setting as focused on open warfare as Warhammer. Because the biggest threat to him is scared people, like the average soldier. People doing what they think is right for themselves or their families, people too paranoid or set in their ways to trust some madman strutting in like he owns the place. That's the big problem he has, and the reason the "base under siege" format was so prolific and padded, because the writers knew that there were situations that made things harder.

If he landed in the no-man's land, he's screwed. If he was nearby someone relatively bluffable, he'd last much better. Or if realized how awful and unsalvageable the setting was very early on, and he could find a nearby superweapon he could rewire to his own purposes. The Warhammer setting certainly has an abundance of superweapons. Granted, he could probably weaponize the Sonic Screwdriver if he felt like it. Sound waves are capable of doing awful things to organic matter.

edited 24th Jun '13 5:28:26 AM by unnoun

They would probably think that the TARDIS was a self-contained bit of webway with a mobile gate.

Actually, I think you're underestimating what a Guyver is capable of. The original OA Vs had some interesting stats on both the Zoanoids and the Guyver unit and what they're capable of. The point is that Sho and Agito don't really use their units to full capacity most of the time. Sho lacks the killer instinct and early on isn't used to fighting. Agito is more ruthless but tends to be a bit of a show off (though that's at least partly psychological warfare).

The main reason I give the even a single Guyver unit the edge are two reasons.

• 1) The Gravity Medal allows the Guyver flight capability (up to Mach 1) and the sensors on the head means they can pull some fairly tight turns and nape of the earth flying without losing too much speed if needed.
• 2) The Mega-Smasher. It's capable of vapourising everything for several hundred metres along its line of fire at full power. Even at lower power settings (that don't need as long to charge and can be fired on the go), it's going to ruin even a Space Marine's day. The difficulty in this case is lining things up to make the most effective use of this weapon, which is why I said it's a close thing. The Guyver may have more power, but the SM's numbers provide tactical flexibility, which is why I said you need two units to make it a certain win (one to cover the other while charging the mega-smasher).

The Guyver Gigantic's forcefield negates these problems since it can protect itself while charging the Giga-Smasher.

You know, it's odd, but I'd be really interested in seeing an Eldar or Ork using a Guyver-unit, if that's possible.

You really, really should- check it out. Just... be warned that the early art is really, really awful. The writing, however, is most emphatically not, and the art catches up after a few years. Just don't go in when you don't have some free time- it's been running daily for thirteen years now, and it's never missed an update. Ever. The closest it's ever come is when the hosting servers exploded (literally), so that the comic... was updated late. And the author apologised for that O.o

I'm pretty sure I mentioned it before, but the Gutsy Geoid Guard (GGG) would make life very, very interesting (and short) for anything smaller than about battalion-size (or equivalent) that they encountered, especially if it was the GGG from later in the series. GOOOOOLLLDIOOOON HAMMER!!!!

edited 26th Jun '13 10:10:52 PM by TeChameleon

The question is if it would have the same effect. It's implied that since we were created as a base for bio-weapons like the Zoanoids, the power boost human get out of the Guyver units is far in excess that it's creators do.

Of course, that would suggest scary things about a bio-boosted Ork.

Hmm, how about Kamen Rider?.. Some are probably gonna count as "dropping a nuke on them" - Ultimate Kuuga, Shining Agito (finishing moves are potentially Exterminatus in power), Hyper Kabuto, Gatack or Caucasus (Time control), Decade (having powers of all the previous ones), maybe Infinity Wizard. Maybe some others that I didn't watch yet.

Not-ubers could probably deal with Marines one on one.

edited 25th Jun '13 12:02:10 AM by Adannor

My money is on boatload of Chimera.

If one dude with balls-o-steel can completely turn the tide of the Chimera Invasion of England, how are they gonna defeat an entire army of similarly steel-balled individuals?

"Oh, an army of post-human cyborg soldiers with homing rifles and spike ball grenades. Must be Wednesday!

edited 3rd Jul '13 9:08:45 PM by MachineMan1992

MIND BULLETS