Star Trek

Could be worse. She could have played a Vasquez character and let Crosby be the therapist. Gods, can you imagine the fanservicey outfits they would have stuck Denise Crosby in for that?

We'd have lost Troi and possibly not gotten a replacement, rather than losing Tasha and letting Worf step into his own.

Troi is one of those characters who, when she pops in for a cameo, you're like, "oh, right. Troi. I remember her." She's a potted plant. Attractive, sure. But I'm reading zero life signs.

But what do I know? I'm rewatching TNG and DS9 with family, and they think Troi and Dax (not among my favorite characters) are the best things since sliced bread.

Btw, Dax's death really stung. I was never wild about Jadzia, but after seeing her death again I felt a funereal atmosphere descend on the room. People were depressed for days afterward. I still feel a little melencholy myself. :(

edited 24th Jul '15 8:49:17 PM by johnnyfog

Jadzia's death was dramatic in that she was a main character. The script seems to say "look at this dead main character and be sad."

It's what happened afterward that sells it. The hang dog look of the entire cast as The Heart was cut out. Even Dukat has a moment of My God, What Have I Done?. And seeing both Sisko and Worf just break down. That's when the death hits hard, it's Adric's death in Doctor Who.

And then we got Genki Girl Ezri....

It was as if Wesley and Ensign Gomez had a kid....

edited 25th Jul '15 12:30:33 AM by TairaMai

Jadzia was a fan favorite, also loved by just about everyone involved with the show. Terry Farrell hates herself for leaving, she had an offer for Becker and thought it would be good for her career to explore other roles. But what made Jadzia amazing was the Dax symbiont giving her such unusual depth, she would go from decorated Starfleet science officer (as Jadzia, the current host) to getting into bar brawls with her Klingon buddies (as Curzon, prior host and highly respected ambassador to Quo'nos). There are few roles anywhere that juicy.

I don't know why she ever thought Becker of all things would jumpstart her career. As for Ezri, I liked her. If she hadn't been a replacement for Jadzia, I doubt she'd get half the annoyance from fans that she does.

Trek has a history of typecasting actors, particularly women. Comedy was a good way to round out her resume, along with horror (Hellraiser) and SF (Trek).

Ezri gave closure to Bashir, Sisko and Worf, but she's introduced too late in the game to have much impact. She's basically Sonya Gomez, so at least justice was finally served on that front.

edited 25th Jul '15 8:39:12 AM by johnnyfog

I don't know if woman got it worse, all actors on Trek had to suffer through I Am Not Spock to some degree. Jonathan Frakes said it best, "Better to be typecast than never cast." Star Trek does have a history of that, but most actors on anything successful struggle to find work beyond that.

But by the time Seven-Of-Nine came around people realized that the women on Star Trek were in charge and kicking ass. I remember a TV Guide issue on that topic, along with a reminder by Berman that Yar was a female chief of security and her leaving incidentally left the other two women on the show as caretakers.

In "Devil's Due", Ardra's last line is "Until we meet again, Jean-Luc Picard of the Starship Enterprise." Now I'm wondering if there would be a decent story in having her pop up again somewhere, the Enterprise recognize her and be certain she's running a con, but be unable to prove it.

The only thing I can think of is one of those plots where the con-artist pretends to be reformed, and the heroes refuse to believe it, only for it to seem more and more that she's is telling the truth... until the heroes finally come around and accept her, at which point she reveals that she's really was conning them all along.

But those plots tend to be cookie cutter, so that probably wouldn't have been a great idea.

edited 25th Jul '15 9:56:23 PM by KnownUnknown

"First Contact":

Lanel: "I'll help you escape if you make love to me."
Riker: "I need to get back to my people."
Lanel: "It's not too much to ask!"
Riker: "There are... differences."
Lanel: "I look forward to learning them... and it's not like you have any other options..."

And then Riker lies back and thinks of the Great Bird of the Galaxy.

This is a shockingly adult moment for TNG. And I don't think it gets the respect it deserves. I've heard it referred to as Riker having a James Bond "seduce the girl, get the key" moment in a positive way, and I've heard it referred to as "horndog Riker gets what he wants and then gets what he wants", and neither is at all the case.

The hell kinda person wants to bang an alien though?

Like yeah Riker is pretty damn hot but still.

Oh, I understand that. It's just so explicit that Riker is having sex extorted from him.

Boldly Coming is a trope in and of itself and predates Star Trek. John Carter of Mars, most pulp sci-fi, of course it would extend the other way.

However, most of the time it's a Green-Skinned Space Babe and not the Starfish Aliens, expect for Galaxy Quest.

edited 27th Jul '15 11:29:51 PM by TairaMai

So Riker has three skills, then: glowering, shouting, and having alien chicks force him to have sex.

One of the funniest moments in TNG is that time Riker tried to trick Picard into doing the same on Risa.

edited 27th Jul '15 11:39:14 PM by KnownUnknown

He plays a mean trombone too.

Four skills. And that last one is a real Jonathan Frakes skill to boot. Also, to the alien sex thing, I'd say PART of Mass Effect's popularity is in being able to seduce an alien as well. As long as sex is possible with someone, and they're capable of giving informed consent, you'll have people who both want and have the right to bang them. If it bothers you, best to just not think about it, or else think of the practical issues that could be a problem for the rest of the world, like social complications if it's a race that institutionalizes rape, or diseases that could cross the species barrier.

You guys forgot The Offspring: After Riker flirts with Data's daughter Lal, she decides to see what this "kissing" thing is about by frenching Riker in Ten Foward. She kissed him so hard and fast that poor Guinan is left shouting "Lal! LAL!".....

...just as Data walks in and says "Commander, what are your intentions toward my daughter."

This is a Papa Wolf who can bend metal bars with his bare hands.

Riker's deer in the headlights look is priceless.

I don't know how much of a Papa Wolf he would have been. Between Riker being his friend and Data not necessarily entirely getting things, Riker could have talked his way out of that with the truth. Or if he had intentions, he could have reminded Data of what he went through with Tasha. Until Data installed his emotions chip, he wouldn't be in touch with his feelings on the matter and might have thought lighter of things than a human would.

^ How would Riker know about Tasha/Data, at that point? She made it pretty explicitly clear that she didn't want a single word spoken of that particular rendezvous.

(Unless I'm totally misremembering, since it's been almost 2 decades since I've seen any TNG outside the movies.)

He sorta hinted at it at the hearing with Maddox regarding whether or not he was a toaster.

Picard entered the contents of Data's "leaving Starfleet" suitcase into evidence for the defense. One of them was a holoportrait of Tasha (it looks like it's from her memorial program, but I don't know where they got the proper angles for the shots you see her face), and he asked why.

"I promised I would not discuss it with anyone else."

"Data, under the circumstances, I don't think Tasha would mind."

"She and I were... intimate."

Reaction shot of Riker's jaw dropping.

I saw Riker's look in that episode as more of a "what... the... fuck..." expression than an Oh, Crap! expression. He looked like he decided to just stop trying to process what was going on in front of him and go away.

A little of both, but more the former.

On Trek.FM's TNG discussion podcast, there was a comment that they reference Tasha at least once a season, which... I guess pretty much? (I've also heard her mentioned along with Q in the "coming back every now and then to check up on how the show is evolving" aspect)

S1: Tasha is at Tactical

S2: Measure of a Man callback, Shades of Gray flashback

S3: Yesterday's Enterprise, I think it gets mentioned in The Most Toys that Worf only gets promotions when people die

S4: Legacy, Sela appearances in The Mind's Eye and Redemption I

S5: Sela appearances in Redemption II and Unification

S6: I don't have anything

S7: All Good Things

First Contact: the fullness of Data's functionality was last employed eight-odd years ago