History NeverLiveItDown / VideoGames

10th Dec '17 7:56:34 AM AguFungus
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** Some fans, mostly ''Paper Mario'' fans, can not get past how ''VideoGame/MarioAndLuigiPaperJam'' has no original characters, generic locations and an over abundance of Toads. This is because these are some of the flaws of the much loathed ''VideoGame/PaperMarioStickerStar''. ''Paper Jam'' has more returning characters and has much better characterisation of them (even giving personality to previously [[FlatCharacter Flat Characters]]) but ''Sticker Star'' really left a stain on the franchise few people will forget anytime soon.
** ''VideoGame/PaperMarioColorSplash'' is unable to get away from the fact that it has the much loathed gameplay of ''Sticker Star''. It fixes most of the problems that ''Sticker Star'' had and has won people over (many of whom hated ''Sticker Star'') but a lot of ''Paper Mario'' fans (including fans of the first two games) would like the series to go back to the gameplay of the first two games.

to:

** In general, such is the negative impact that ''VideoGame/PaperMarioStickerStar'' has caused, that any game after it that uses this new interpretation of ''Paper Mario'' will be doomed to this trope (even the fourth ''Smash Bros.'' wasn't safe from it), and even low sales as the following two titles can attest:
***
Some fans, mostly ''Paper Mario'' fans, can not get past how ''VideoGame/MarioAndLuigiPaperJam'' has no original characters, generic locations and an over abundance of Toads. This is because these are some of the flaws of the much loathed ''VideoGame/PaperMarioStickerStar''. ''Paper Jam'' has more returning characters and has much better characterisation of them (even giving personality to previously [[FlatCharacter Flat Characters]]) but ''Sticker Star'' really left a stain on the franchise few people will forget anytime soon.
** *** ''VideoGame/PaperMarioColorSplash'' is unable to get away from the fact that it has the much loathed gameplay of ''Sticker Star''. It fixes most of the problems that ''Sticker Star'' had and has won people over (many of whom hated ''Sticker Star'') but a lot of ''Paper Mario'' fans (including fans of the first two games) would like the series to go back to the gameplay of the first two games.
1st Dec '17 9:15:07 PM BigKlingy
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** The series itself is pretty well known for having lots of BrotherSisterIncest (And [[FlirtyStepsiblings other]] [[KissingCousins kinds]] of incest). There's a legitimate point to this, given that the [[VideoGame/FireEmblemJugdral Jugdral Chronology]] has ''lots'' of incest (one pairing as a major plot point, a few more strongly implied, and multiple incestuous pairings that players can set up themselves), but ''Genealogy of the Holy War'' is the only one where it has a bearing on the main plot.



** ChivalrousPervert Sain says "oh, beauteous one" exactly ''one time'' within the course of the game.
** Half the fandom characterizes ShrinkingViolet Florina entirely based on her fear of men.

to:

** ChivalrousPervert Sain says "oh, beauteous one" exactly ''one time'' within the course of the game.
** Half
game, but some parts of the fandom characterizes ShrinkingViolet Florina entirely based on her fear of men.treat it like his CatchPhrase.



** The series itself is pretty well known for having lots of BrotherSisterIncest (And [[FlirtyStepsiblings other]] [[KissingCousins kinds]] of incest). There's a legitimate point to this, given that the [[VideoGame/FireEmblemJugdral Jugdral Chronology]] has ''lots'' of incest (one pairing as a major plot point, a few more strongly implied, and multiple incestuous pairings that players can set up themselves), but ''Genealogy of the Holy War'' is the only one where it has a bearing on the main plot. The rest is mainly IncestSubtext thanks to BigBrotherWorship which is largely unreciprocated and a pair of maybe-too-close twins... but as it's still lots more incest than most video game series have, it does stick in the mind.
** In some circles, the games have also been accused of "rape culture" due to their being set in medieval times and the fact that some female characters have been threatened with sexual assault or being sold into prostitution (or in the case of Leen/Laylea from Seisen, actually molested). Keep in mind that these scenes are usually short and resolved quickly enough, and that there are numerous other threats leveled at the character-male *and* female, than ones involving their genitals.
** In the Jugdral Chronology, the protagonist of the first part, Sigurd, does quite a bit in the first half. At the same time, it's unlikely he'll ever shake [[spoiler:the fire jokes]].
** In ''VideoGame/FireEmblemTheSacredStones'', try to find more than one discussion involving Eirika that ''doesn't'' bring up her supposed "fail" regarding the Stone of Renais, or that doesn't passively-aggressively bring her down as "an useless leader" who "needs rescuing" for it... and sometimes blame her for things that '''other''' people have done!
** Innes tells Eirika he'll prove himself worthy of her love in their A level support. Fanfics pairing Eirika with someone else turn him into a competitive JerkAss who sees her as nothing more than a prize to be won. And fans who support Innes as Eirika's favored suitor shamelessly use Seth's A support with Eirika (in which he first tries to distance himself from her, to later confess his own love) to accuse Seth of being sexist, creepy and possessive of her. The DoubleStandard [[DieForOurShip is obvious.]]

to:

** The series itself is pretty well known for having lots of BrotherSisterIncest (And [[FlirtyStepsiblings other]] [[KissingCousins kinds]] of incest). There's a legitimate point to this, given that the [[VideoGame/FireEmblemJugdral Jugdral Chronology]] has ''lots'' of incest (one pairing as a major plot point, a few more strongly implied, and multiple incestuous pairings that players can set up themselves), but ''Genealogy of the Holy War'' is the only one where it has a bearing on the main plot. The rest is mainly IncestSubtext thanks to BigBrotherWorship which is largely unreciprocated and a pair of maybe-too-close twins... but as it's still lots more incest than most video game series have, it does stick in the mind.
** In some circles, the games have also been accused of "rape culture" due to their being set in medieval times and the fact that some female characters have been threatened with sexual assault or being sold into prostitution (or in the case of Leen/Laylea from Seisen, actually molested). Keep in mind that these scenes are usually short and resolved quickly enough, and that there are numerous other threats leveled at the character-male *and* female, than ones involving their genitals.
** In the Jugdral Chronology, the protagonist of the first part, Sigurd, does quite a bit in the first half. At the same time, it's unlikely he'll ever shake [[spoiler:the fire jokes]].
jokes]], due to [[spoiler: his final fate]] [[ItWasHisSled being one of the most well-known aspects of the game.]]
** In ''VideoGame/FireEmblemTheSacredStones'', try to find more than one discussion involving Eirika that ''doesn't'' bring up her supposed "fail" regarding will never live down giving the Sacred Stone of Renais, or that doesn't passively-aggressively bring her down as "an useless leader" who "needs rescuing" for it... and sometimes blame her for things that '''other''' people have done!
Renais to the Demon King-posessed Lyon, allowing him to destroy it. Most of why she's such a BaseBreakingCharacter comes from ''that scene alone''.
** Innes tells Eirika he'll prove himself worthy of her love in their A level support. Fanfics pairing Eirika with someone else turn him into a competitive JerkAss who sees her as nothing more than a prize to be won. And fans who support Innes as Eirika's favored suitor shamelessly use Seth's A support with Eirika (in which he first tries to distance himself from her, to later confess his own love) to accuse Seth of being sexist, creepy and possessive of her. The DoubleStandard [[DieForOurShip is obvious.]]



** While Micaiah in ''Radiant Dawn'' is quite the WellIntentionedExtremist, from the way some fans talk you'd think that's ''all'' she was. At least among fans who bother to see her character past crying "MarySue!" over her appearance and lineage, [[DoubleStandard while the others laud Soren and Naesala for exactly the same reasons.]]



*** Sumia shows her affection to Chrom by baking pies for him and offering to do his laundry. The fans immediately pegged her as nothing more than a pie-baking housewife with no other facets to her personality and in some cases, [[DieForOurShip used it as an excuse to bash her]]. \\
\\
The fact that Sumia is [[AdorKable super nervous and awkward]] when around Chrom ''only in their shared supports'' is also blown out of proportion, and she's accused of [[TheObstructiveLoveInterest constantly clinging to Chrom and depending on him for everything.]] In reality Sumia ''barely'' mentions Chrom outside the aforementioned supports, shows insecurity and awkwardness in regards to ''other'' matters and doesn't seem to pine over him all day long... but go tell that to her haters, who will accuse Sumia of being few more than Chrom's no-life SatelliteLoveInterest. [[HypoCrite Sometimes while touting female!Avatar as the best girlfriend/wife for him.]]
*** Poor Cordelia has [[ShellshockedVeteran plenty]] [[SurvivorsGuilt more]] [[AllOfTheOtherReindeer reasons]] than "boo hoo why won't Chrom love me" to be sad, but try telling that to the "fans" who latch onto every instance of her unrequited love and ignore her ''bigger'' reasons to angst.
*** On both Sumia and Cordelia, since the first is a prospect Chrom bride and the latter is in UnrequitedLove with him, [[ShipToShipCombat the fandom is convinced]] that there's a bitter and weepy LoveTriangle between them and Chrom. In reality the game goes out of its way to ''avert'' any romantic problems between them, with Chrom never even being ''mentioned'' in their shared talks.
*** There's actually [[GoodShepherd a lot]] [[DarkAndTroubledPast more]] to Libra's character than DudeLooksLikeALady and StupidSexyFlanders, but since those two are the subject of his recuitment conversation and a support with Virion shown before the game was released, those are all fans tend to remember.
*** In regards to ''all'' the Children Characters, the fandom LOVES to focus only on [[DarkAndTroubledPast their traumas and experiences]] in the BadFuture, therefore reducing them solely to their {{woobie}} traits so they can imagine themselves "playing mommy/daddy" to the kids ''and' ignoring their surprisingly complex personalities.
*** All Inigo wants is to be manhandled, and all he ever does is try to get up girls' skirts. What StepfordSmiler reasons for acting the way he does? What shyness vs. extroversion issues? What about him being insensitized in regards to killing and feeling bad about it? Not to say of Gerome being seen only in regards to his and Inigo's relationship and the giver of a "strong, firm touch"...
*** Tharja. To fandom, she's just an abusive {{Yandere}} who hexes people. Similarly, people seem to think that the ONLY thing Noire has going on is being "the poor little victim of the evil Tharja, who does nothing but cry and weep over her evil mother". Her weak health? Her OddFriendship with Severa and own bonds with the other girls? Her bonding with Yarne and Brady over self-esteem issues, and being among the few who does '''not''' chide Yarne for being a LovableCoward? Her love of cooking and baking? Her desire to grow stronger and face her fears and traumas head-on? Her being the caretaker of [[spoiler: her little sister Morgan]] if [[spoiler: Tharja's husband is a male Avatar]]... Do they exist?

to:

** Tharja's swimsuit's SceneryCensor in the American version of Summer Scramble, to the point where it's caused the entire Fire Emblem fandom to be ''extremely'' paranoid about censorship in future games.
*** Sumia shows her affection to Chrom by baking pies for him and offering to do his laundry. The fans immediately pegged her as nothing more than a pie-baking housewife with no other facets to her personality and in some cases, [[DieForOurShip used it as an excuse to bash her]]. \\
\\
The fact
her]], despite these traits only appearing in one of her support chains, and that Sumia is [[AdorKable super nervous and awkward]] when around Chrom ''only in their shared supports'' is also blown out of proportion, and [[DoubleStandard she's accused of [[TheObstructiveLoveInterest constantly clinging to Chrom and depending on him for everything.]] In reality Sumia ''barely'' mentions Chrom outside not the aforementioned supports, shows insecurity and awkwardness only one to do laundry in regards to ''other'' matters and doesn't seem to pine over him all day long... but go tell that to her haters, who will accuse Sumia of being few more than Chrom's no-life SatelliteLoveInterest. [[HypoCrite Sometimes while touting female!Avatar as the best girlfriend/wife for him.]]
supports.]]
*** Poor Cordelia has [[ShellshockedVeteran plenty]] [[SurvivorsGuilt more]] [[AllOfTheOtherReindeer reasons]] than "boo hoo why won't Chrom love me" to be sad, but try telling that to the "fans" who latch onto every instance of her unrequited love and ignore her ''bigger'' reasons to angst.
*** On both Sumia and Cordelia, since the first is a prospect Chrom bride and the latter is in UnrequitedLove with him, [[ShipToShipCombat the fandom is convinced]] that there's a bitter and weepy LoveTriangle between them and Chrom. In reality the game goes out of its way to ''avert'' any romantic problems between them, with Chrom never even being ''mentioned'' in their shared talks.
*** There's actually [[GoodShepherd a lot]] [[DarkAndTroubledPast more]] to Libra's character
some fans she's nothing more than DudeLooksLikeALady and StupidSexyFlanders, but since those two are the subject of his recuitment conversation and a support with Virion shown before the game was released, those are all fans tend to remember.
*** In regards to ''all'' the Children Characters, the fandom LOVES to focus only on [[DarkAndTroubledPast their traumas and experiences]] in the BadFuture, therefore reducing them solely to their {{woobie}} traits so they can imagine themselves "playing mommy/daddy" to the kids ''and' ignoring their surprisingly complex personalities.
an UnrequitedTragicMaiden.
*** All Inigo wants is There's actually [[GoodShepherd a lot]] [[DarkAndTroubledPast more]] to be manhandled, Libra's character than DudeLooksLikeALady and StupidSexyFlanders, but since those two are the subject of his recruitment conversation and a support with Virion shown before the game was released, those are all he ever does is try fans tend to get up girls' skirts. What StepfordSmiler reasons for acting the way he does? What shyness vs. extroversion issues? What about him being insensitized in remember.
*** In
regards to killing ''all'' the Children Characters, the fandom LOVES to focus only on [[DarkAndTroubledPast their traumas and feeling bad about it? Not experiences]] in the BadFuture, therefore reducing them solely to say their {{woobie}} traits, ignoring their surprisingly complex personalities.
*** Inigo will never live down saying "I want to be manhandled!" [[HoYay to Gerome]] in their supports. The line actually has a very different meaning in-context: he's jealous
of [[AllGirlsWantBadBoys all the attention Gerome being seen only in regards to his gets from girls]] and Inigo's relationship and wishes the giver of a "strong, firm touch"...
ladies would fawn over ''him'' that way.
*** Tharja. To fandom, she's just an abusive {{Yandere}} who hexes people. Similarly, people People seem to think that the ONLY thing Noire has going on is being "the poor little victim of the evil Tharja, who does nothing but cry and weep over her evil mother". Her weak health? Her OddFriendship with Severa and own bonds with the other girls? Her bonding with Yarne and Brady over self-esteem issues, and being among the few who does '''not''' chide Yarne for being a LovableCoward? Her love of cooking and baking? Her desire to grow stronger and face her fears and traumas head-on? Her being the caretaker of [[spoiler: her little sister Morgan]] if [[spoiler: Tharja's husband is a male Avatar]]... Do they exist?



*** Henry is either a) The Creepy Blood Guy who laughs at death and blood and is completely unable to EVER be kind to others, or b) Mr. Angsty Crying Messed Up [=McTragicpast=] who fakes all his smiles and needs a certain dancer's "healing vagina" [[BroodingboyGentleGirl to make him whole again.]]
*** Similarly, hearing what fans say about Olivia would make you believe she only exists to "heal Henry's broken heart" or "be the girl who takes less time to pair up with Chrom". Nevermind that Olivia can marry other guys than Henry and Chrom, that she's in '''no''' way [[ICanChangeMyBeloved "obligated" to "heal" Henry's issues]], ''and'' that she has self-worth and social awkwardness problems to deal with.
*** Sadly, this is actually ''canon'' for poor Yarne, who has a reputation as the scared little bunny boy who runs away all the time. Which, granted, he does, but he has [[LastOfHisKind reasons for doing so]]. Not that the fandom ever forgives it either.
*** Frederick's naked poster of Chrom. Don't get us wrong, it IS an hilarious moment and the HoYay IS there, but that alone set off many a fangirl proclaiming his ultimate gayness for Chrom and ignoring the other aspects of his character. Aside from his love of starting fires. And other shipping fangirls take his {{love confession}}s to Sumia and/or Cordelia and regard him as some KnightInShiningArmor who's "destined" to rescue either girl from their "hopeless" feelings for Chrom. (While Frederick can be sappy and sentimental when declaring his romantic feelings, he doesn't "exist" solely [[RelationshipSue to rescue lovesick women from their romantic woes.]]) There's another subset of the fandom that find his S Support with Cordelia to be uncomfortable due to its shades of EntitledToHaveYou, and to them Frederick is only remembered as "that guy with the worst S Support in the game." Ignoring all of his other hundred plus supports.

to:

*** Some fans judge Henry is either a) The Creepy Blood Guy who laughs at death and blood and is completely unable entirely by the localization changes to EVER be kind to others, or b) Mr. Angsty Crying Messed Up [=McTragicpast=] who fakes his supports with Olivia, ignoring the other aspects of his character that aren't all his smiles and needs a certain dancer's "healing vagina" [[BroodingboyGentleGirl to make him whole again.]]
that different from the original Japanese version.
*** Similarly, hearing what fans say about Olivia would make you believe she only exists to "heal Henry's broken heart" or "be the girl who takes less time to pair up has a sudden FourthDateMarriage with Chrom". Chrom if you hook them up". Nevermind that Olivia can marry other guys than Henry and Chrom, that she's in '''no''' way [[ICanChangeMyBeloved "obligated" to "heal" Henry's issues]], ''and'' that she has self-worth and social awkwardness problems to deal with.
Chrom.
*** Sadly, this is actually ''canon'' for poor Yarne, who has a reputation as the scared little bunny boy who runs away all the time. Which, granted, he does, but he has [[LastOfHisKind reasons for doing so]]. Not that the fandom ever forgives it either.\n
*** Frederick's naked poster of Chrom. Don't get us wrong, it IS an hilarious moment and the HoYay IS there, but that alone set off many a fangirl proclaiming his ultimate gayness for Chrom and ignoring the other aspects of his character. Aside from his love of starting fires. And other shipping fangirls take his {{love confession}}s to Sumia and/or Cordelia and regard him as some KnightInShiningArmor who's "destined" to rescue either girl from their "hopeless" feelings for Chrom. (While Frederick can be sappy and sentimental when declaring his romantic feelings, he doesn't "exist" solely [[RelationshipSue to rescue lovesick women from their romantic woes.]]) There's another subset of the fandom that find his S Support with Cordelia to be uncomfortable due to its shades of EntitledToHaveYou, and to them Frederick is only remembered as "that guy with the worst S Support in the game." Ignoring all of his other hundred plus supports.



*** Similarly, all boy!Morgan has going on for him according to fandom is being a MommasBoy, and many fanworks will crank up his thoughts on his mother to downright obsessive and creepy levels. [[spoiler: (Not helped by him being an enemy boss in the Future Past DLC, serving Grima after it takes over the Avatar.)]] Just like Lucina is seen as having an ElectraComplex, boy!Morgan's supposed "OedipusComplex" is so bad in fanon that, in said works, he seems to be just an extension of his mother's person and nothing else. (And has earned Morgan the derisive FanNickname "the pet poodle", as said interpetation is often compared to a lapdog.)
*** While girl!Morgan can be very InnocentlyInsensitive to her love interests, the fans exaggerate this and portray her as a self-absorbed and cruel FilleFatale[=/=]GoldDigger rather than [[InnocentlyInsensitive the sweet yet tactless]] DaddysGirl she actually is. Oddly, fans avert making her a no-life DaddysGirl. (Probably because many of the people who "poodle-fy" Morgan are fangirls who project on [[spoiler: Female Avatar]], who in-game can't be girl!Morgan's mother.)
*** The game itself might as well be called ''FireEmblem: Self-Insertion Fanservice Adventure'' according to the fans, completely ignoring the other aspects of the plot ''and'' how the Avatar's issues and heritage run ''much'' deeper than "LOL CanonSue!".
*** The female Avatar is screamed at and accused of being an abusive, entitled, annoying {{tsundere}} harpy and prospect "waifu" MarySue, because of her supports with Chrom. (Nevermind that she can marry ''other'' guys than him if the player desires, that her dynamics with said guys are ''very'' different to those she has with Chrom, ''and'' that you can have her marry Chrom ''without'' going through the "offending" supports with a bit of planning.) The male version doesn't have it ''that'' bad, but due to some... self-projection prone Chrom/male!Avatar and Chrom/[[spoiler: Lucina]] fans, many people peg him as either some [[WimpiFication wangsty, weepy, co-dependent wimp]] with endless {{gayngst}} over Chrom, or a creepy StalkerWithACrush who has been brewing a WifeHusbandry deal towards [[spoiler: Lucina]] ever since years ago.
*** Fandom seems to believe that Nah is nothing but a bitchy TinyTyrannicalGirl who forces all her eventual boyfriends into marriage via threatening them to eat them alive. The only support chain where she does so is Inigo's; in the others she is ''at most'' kinda bossy, but never to such a degree. (She's pretty gentle to boy!Morgan and Yarne, her bossy tendences are PlayedForLaughs with Laurent, her bugging Gerome is treated as playful rather than mean-spirited.)
*** Cynthia will always be remembered as "the brainless ditz who was tricked into thinking a bandit leader was Chrom -- and even worse when Chrom's her dad". Nevermind that Cynthia was likely a tiny kid when [[spoiler: Chrom was murdered in the Bad Future]] whether he was her father or not, that ''other'' Chrom potential kids also have their doubts when they meet with Chrom (specially in the case of a Chrom!Brady), or that ''a whole village'' thinks the bandit is Chrom... Unsurprisingly, those who bring this scene up the most tend to be people who [[DieForOurShip hate her mother Sumia]] for ShipToShipCombat reasons and desperately try to use Cynthia to discredit her.
*** ''Awakening'' is also accused of taking "a step backward" by only allowing opposite-sex marriages and focusing so much on marriage and children. It's been accused of sexism and homophobia despite having plenty of physically, mentally ''and'' emotionally strong female characters ''and'' the marriage-and-children mechanic being optional (Lucina's the only plot-important kid).
** Tharja's swimsuit's SceneryCensor in the American version of Summer Scramble, to the point where it's caused the entire Fire Emblem fandom to be ''extremely'' paranoid about censorship in future games.

to:

*** Similarly, all boy!Morgan has going on for him according to fandom is being a MommasBoy, and many fanworks will crank up his thoughts on his mother to downright obsessive and creepy levels. [[spoiler: (Not helped by him being an enemy boss in the Future Past DLC, serving Grima after it takes over the Avatar.)]] Just like Lucina is seen as having an ElectraComplex, boy!Morgan's supposed "OedipusComplex" is so bad in fanon that, in said works, he seems to be just an extension of his mother's person and nothing else. (And has earned Morgan the derisive FanNickname "the pet poodle", as said interpetation is often compared to a lapdog.)
*** While girl!Morgan can be very InnocentlyInsensitive to her love interests, the fans exaggerate this and portray her as a self-absorbed and cruel FilleFatale[=/=]GoldDigger rather than [[InnocentlyInsensitive the sweet yet tactless]] DaddysGirl she actually is. Oddly, fans avert making her a no-life DaddysGirl. (Probably because many
To some sects of the people who "poodle-fy" Morgan are fangirls who project on [[spoiler: fandom, the Female Avatar]], who in-game can't be girl!Morgan's mother.)
*** The game itself might as well be called ''FireEmblem: Self-Insertion Fanservice Adventure'' according to the fans, completely ignoring the other aspects of the plot ''and'' how the Avatar's issues and heritage run ''much'' deeper than "LOL CanonSue!".
*** The female
Avatar is screamed at and accused of being an abusive, entitled, annoying {{tsundere}} harpy and prospect "waifu" MarySue, because of defined by her awkward BelligerentSexualTension supports with Chrom. (Nevermind that Chrom, even though she can marry ''other'' other guys than him if the player desires, that her dynamics with said guys are ''very'' different to those she has with Chrom, ''and'' that you (and can have her marry Chrom ''without'' without going through the "offending" these supports with a bit of planning.) The male version doesn't have it ''that'' bad, but [[GuideDangIt if you know how his auto-marriage works]]), and the Male Avatar is defined by the fact he can romance his best friend's daughter. (Albeit it's LessDisturbingInContext due to some... self-projection prone Chrom/male!Avatar and Chrom/[[spoiler: Lucina]] fans, many people peg him as either some [[WimpiFication wangsty, weepy, co-dependent wimp]] with endless {{gayngst}} over Chrom, or a creepy StalkerWithACrush who has been brewing a WifeHusbandry deal towards [[spoiler: Lucina]] ever since years ago.
TimeTravelRomance)
*** Fandom seems to believe that Nah is nothing but a bitchy TinyTyrannicalGirl who forces all her eventual boyfriends into marriage via threatening them to eat them alive. The only support chain where she does so is Inigo's; in the others she is ''at most'' kinda bossy, but never to such a degree. (She's pretty gentle to boy!Morgan and Yarne, her bossy tendences are PlayedForLaughs with Laurent, her bugging Gerome is treated as playful rather than mean-spirited.)
)
*** Cynthia will always be remembered as "the brainless ditz who was tricked into thinking a bandit leader was Chrom -- and even worse when Chrom's her dad". Nevermind that Cynthia was likely a tiny kid when [[spoiler: Chrom was murdered in the Bad Future]] whether he was her father or not, that ''other'' Chrom potential kids also have their doubts when they meet with Chrom (specially in the case of a Chrom!Brady), or that ''a whole village'' thinks the bandit is Chrom... Unsurprisingly, those who bring this scene up the most tend to be people who [[DieForOurShip hate her mother Sumia]] for ShipToShipCombat reasons and desperately try to use Cynthia to discredit her.\n*** ''Awakening'' is also accused of taking "a step backward" by only allowing opposite-sex marriages and focusing so much on marriage and children. It's been accused of sexism and homophobia despite having plenty of physically, mentally ''and'' emotionally strong female characters ''and'' the marriage-and-children mechanic being optional (Lucina's the only plot-important kid).\n** Tharja's swimsuit's SceneryCensor in the American version of Summer Scramble, to the point where it's caused the entire Fire Emblem fandom to be ''extremely'' paranoid about censorship in future games.



*** Camilla is a {{Yandere}} who's obsessed with protecting the Avatar, so of course her detractors refuse to believe she has depth and actual ''reasons'' for being the way she is (hint: [[BrokenBird she]] was ''horrifyingly'' broken in her early years). She was already hated for her MsFanservice design and compared unfavorably to TomboyPrincess Hinoka.



*** Oboro's initial character description was two things: her hatred for Nohr and her feelings for Takumi, the prince she serves. More aspects of her personality were revealed over time (i.e her TeamMom tendences, her love of fashion in general, etc.), as well as the translation of her supports that explain her hatred of Nohr and [[spoiler:have her working on it by supporting and potentially marrying two Nohrian guys in the ''Birthright'' path, and fully overcoming it via supporting with other two Nohrian guys and a Nohrian woman more in ''Revelation'']]... but her detractors still only see her as a shrieking banshee who makes angry faces if someone so much as ''mentions'' anything to do with Nohr and only exists to be obsessed with Takumi.
*** The Avatar shows a lot of angst and fear in their supports with Azura during the Nohr path, which is apparently all fans even on ThisVeryWiki need to declare the game "biased against Nohr because the Avatar is a weak-willed mess who regrets their choice". This despite the Avatar not showing as much of this during the main story save for when they have to fight their Hoshido siblings, and still being determined to stick with their choice and see the campaign through to the end no matter what.
*** The introduction of the child mechanic was somewhat rushed and the explanation for the children is clumsily handled and contrived, but the child characters themselves are fleshed out and well-developed. Unfortunately, this isn't enough to stop a lot of the fandom from bashing them and defining them by the clumsy mechanic rather than as characters...or from turning on the parent characters and denouncing them as abusive and neglectful rather than [[ParentsAsPeople human beings who had children before the time was quite right and did what they felt was best to protect them]]. The fact that this is addressed in-game and dealt with naturally doesn't mitigate the fans' anger.

to:

*** Oboro's initial character description was two things: her hatred for Nohr and her feelings for Takumi, the prince she serves. More aspects of her personality were revealed over time (i.e her TeamMom tendences, her love of fashion in general, etc.), as well as the translation of her supports that explain her hatred of Nohr and [[spoiler:have her working on it by supporting and potentially marrying two Nohrian guys in the ''Birthright'' path, and fully overcoming it via supporting with other two Nohrian guys and a Nohrian woman more in ''Revelation'']]... but her detractors still some only see remember those initial traits. Also, her as a shrieking banshee who makes angry faces if someone so much as ''mentions'' anything to do feelings for Takumi aren't mentioned often outside of her supports with Nohr Takumi himself (obviously) and only exists to be obsessed with Takumi.Hinata (Takumi's retainer who already knows about her crush).
*** The Avatar shows Azura is a MrsExposition, so she explains a lot of angst and fear in their supports with Azura during plot points over the Nohr path, which is apparently all fans even on ThisVeryWiki need to declare course of the game "biased against Nohr because the Avatar is a weak-willed mess who regrets their choice". game. This despite includes two of the Avatar not showing as much of this during game's more controversial ones (namely [[spoiler: the main story save for when they have to fight their throne of Hoshido siblings, and still being determined required to stick expose the fake Garon's true form, resulting in Hoshido's invasion on the Conquest path]] and [[spoiler: the curse on Valla preventing anyone from mentioning it by name]]), and this colored the fandom's opinion of her quite badly, with their choice and see the campaign through to the end no matter what.
some even ''blaming'' her for those contrived plot points.
*** The introduction of the child mechanic was somewhat rushed and the explanation for the children is clumsily handled and contrived, but the child characters themselves are fleshed out and well-developed. Unfortunately, this isn't enough to stop a lot of the fandom from bashing them and defining them by the clumsy mechanic rather than as characters...characters, or from turning on the parent characters and denouncing them as abusive and neglectful rather than [[ParentsAsPeople human beings who had children before the time was quite right and did what they felt was best to protect them]]. neglectful. The fact that this is addressed in-game and dealt with naturally doesn't mitigate the fans' anger.



*** Takumi is a BaseBreakingCharacter, and his detractors treat him as though all he did was yell at and hate the Avatar before going BrainwashedAndCrazy in ''Conquest''.
*** [[spoiler: Even though Laslow has matured quite a bit from Inigo in ''Awakening'', he still does flirt. Inigo's detractors in ''Awakening'' are quick to treat Laslow as though he hasn't changed or grown a bit.]]

to:

*** Takumi is a BaseBreakingCharacter, and his detractors treat him as though all he did was yell at and hate the Avatar before going BrainwashedAndCrazy in ''Conquest''.
*** [[spoiler: Even though Laslow has matured quite a bit from Inigo in ''Awakening'',
''Conquest''. Some also find it hard to forgive his shooting of Elise. (Never mind that he still does flirt. Inigo's detractors in ''Awakening'' are quick to treat Laslow as though he hasn't changed or grown a bit.]]was under the aforementioned BrainwashedAndCrazy at the time)



** The franchise starting with ''Awakening'' has received quite a severe BrokenBase from elitists who feel that the games have abandoned everything the franchise was known (such as removing perma-death and a much more "anime" based aesthetic) in order to pander to a lower crowd. This ignores that: that the older games already had many animesque tropes, practically all the AntiFrustrationFeatures can be disabled, the games still make frequent references to prior entries and the elements alienated Japanese gamers and newcomers, leading a severe decline in sales and what would of been the series cancellation had ''Awakening'' not done as well as it did.
25th Nov '17 9:08:05 PM Ferot_Dreadnaught
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** In-game example: Cecil attacks Mysidia [[JustFollowingOrders under the (false) King Baron's command]]. When he returns, everyone hates him for it while he's walking around in Dark Knight armour. Some of them even [[BalefulPolymorph curse him]]. Understandable. They ''keep cursing him'' , even ''after'' he's become a Paladin and started fighting alongside them. May fall under WhatTheHellTownspeople, but it still qualifies.

to:

** In-game example: Cecil attacks Mysidia [[JustFollowingOrders under the (false) King Baron's command]]. When he returns, everyone hates him for it while he's walking around in Dark Knight armour. Some of them even [[BalefulPolymorph curse him]]. Understandable. They ''keep cursing him'' , even ''after'' he's become a Paladin and started fighting alongside them. May fall under WhatTheHellTownspeople, but it still qualifies.
6th Nov '17 12:12:28 AM BigKlingy
Is there an issue? Send a Message


*** Frederick's naked poster of Chrom. Don't get us wrong, it IS an hilarious moment and the HoYay IS there, but that alone set off many a fangirl proclaiming his ultimate gayness for Chrom and ignoring the other aspects of his character. Aside from his love of starting fires. And other shipping fangirls take his {{love confession}}s to Sumia and/or Cordelia and regard him as some KnightInShiningArmor who's "destined" to rescue either girl from their "hopeless" feelings for Chrom. (While Frederick can be sappy and sentimental when declaring his romantic feelings, he doesn't "exist" solely [[RelationshipSue to rescue lovesick women from their romantic woes.]])

to:

*** Frederick's naked poster of Chrom. Don't get us wrong, it IS an hilarious moment and the HoYay IS there, but that alone set off many a fangirl proclaiming his ultimate gayness for Chrom and ignoring the other aspects of his character. Aside from his love of starting fires. And other shipping fangirls take his {{love confession}}s to Sumia and/or Cordelia and regard him as some KnightInShiningArmor who's "destined" to rescue either girl from their "hopeless" feelings for Chrom. (While Frederick can be sappy and sentimental when declaring his romantic feelings, he doesn't "exist" solely [[RelationshipSue to rescue lovesick women from their romantic woes.]])]]) There's another subset of the fandom that find his S Support with Cordelia to be uncomfortable due to its shades of EntitledToHaveYou, and to them Frederick is only remembered as "that guy with the worst S Support in the game." Ignoring all of his other hundred plus supports.
2nd Nov '17 3:48:55 PM Steven
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* Gunpei's protege, Yoshio Sakamoto, will never live down the fact that he was responsible for the [[BrokenBase highly divisive]] ''VideoGame/MetroidOtherM'', despite being the person behind the beloved ''VideoGame/SuperMetroid'' and the other 2D Metroid games, the ''VideoGame/WarioWare'' games and the ''VideoGame/RhythmHeaven'' series. And when Sakamoto doesn't receive the hate for the game, most of the time is because [[ScapegoatCreator the blame is directed towards Team Ninja instead]].

to:

* Gunpei's protege, Yoshio Sakamoto, will never live down the fact that he was responsible for the [[BrokenBase highly divisive]] ''VideoGame/MetroidOtherM'', despite being the person behind the beloved ''VideoGame/SuperMetroid'' and the other 2D Metroid games, the ''VideoGame/WarioWare'' games and the ''VideoGame/RhythmHeaven'' series. And when Sakamoto doesn't receive the hate for the game, most of the time is because [[ScapegoatCreator the blame is directed towards Team Ninja instead]]. Even though Sakamoto did bounce back with the critically acclaimed ''VideoGame/MetroidSamusReturns'', many people still won't forgive him for ''Other M'' or pretend that he didn't have any involvement with ''Samus Returns''.


Added DiffLines:

* With Lara looking at her hands and [[MyGodWhatHaveIDone wondering why she killed Larson]] in ''VideoGame/TombRaiderAnniversary'', people will only remember her just for that one scene and think she's full of {{Wangst}} whenever she kills someone. This is ignoring the fact that Larson is the only person she killed in the game and she mostly got over her killing by the end of the game.
2nd Nov '17 2:55:26 PM Steven
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* Minfilia in ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyXIV'' is a leader of a group of talented individuals where said talents can help deal with the primals and the empire. Because Minfilia gets captured twice and lacked the ability to fight back, people flanderized her into someone who gets kidnapped all the time like [[Franchise/SuperMarioBros Princess Peach]] while barking orders at the player character. This is ignoring how in both kidnappings, Minfilia refused to give her captors what they wanted knowing she could be killed for it and the fact that Minfilia is the only one willing and able to do the boring political wetwork behind the scenes while the talents of the player character and the rest of her people can be put to good use where they're needed.

to:

* ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyXIV'':
**
Minfilia in ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyXIV'' is a leader of a group of talented individuals where said talents can help deal with the primals and the empire. Because Minfilia gets captured twice and lacked the ability to fight back, people flanderized her into someone who gets kidnapped all the time like [[Franchise/SuperMarioBros Princess Peach]] while barking orders at the player character. This is ignoring how in both kidnappings, Minfilia refused to give her captors what they wanted knowing she could be killed for it and the fact that Minfilia is the only one willing and able to do the boring political wetwork behind the scenes while the talents of the player character and the rest of her people can be put to good use where they're needed.needed.
** Similarly, Alphinaud once dove right into the GloryHound and tried to get the city state leaders to do what he suggested for the betterment of Eorzea. After some really nasty things went down because of him, he ate a huge slice of HumblePie tried to better himself by listening to everyone and actively supporting his allies in the field. Despite his CharacterDevelopment, people will only remember him for his pre character development days.
31st Oct '17 8:42:58 PM ChrisX
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** They actually did surprise and impress gamers with the attention to ''Super VideoGame/{{Bomberman}} R'', which did come as a surprise that they thought Bomberman was one of those titles that was left in the dust, and it was surprisingly true to the franchise's original spirit as opposed to ''MGS'' above. Still, in the wake of tons and tons of questionable work ethics that was revealed, there's just as much as people who can easily forget about these good little things they did to Bomberman.

to:

** They actually did surprise and impress gamers with the attention to ''Super VideoGame/{{Bomberman}} R'', which did come as a surprise that they thought Bomberman was one of those titles that was left in the dust, and it was surprisingly true to the franchise's original spirit as opposed to ''MGS'' above. Still, in the wake of tons and tons of questionable work ethics that was revealed, there's just as much as people who can easily forget about these good little things they did to Bomberman.Bomberman, like nothing short of 'selling all their properties to other beloved companies or [[MyRealDaddy original makers]] and then commit a company-wide seppuku' will suffice as atonement for their antics above.
30th Oct '17 1:28:55 AM ChrisX
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

** They actually did surprise and impress gamers with the attention to ''Super VideoGame/{{Bomberman}} R'', which did come as a surprise that they thought Bomberman was one of those titles that was left in the dust, and it was surprisingly true to the franchise's original spirit as opposed to ''MGS'' above. Still, in the wake of tons and tons of questionable work ethics that was revealed, there's just as much as people who can easily forget about these good little things they did to Bomberman.
20th Oct '17 8:04:22 AM KingLyger
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** Terra is sometimes remembered as an ActualPacifist, or as someone who despises violence so strongly that she'll refuse to fight even if there's no other choice. This is based on her scenes when she's found in the World of Ruin, where she struggles with her [[MamaBear growing feelings of maternal love for some orphaned children]]. However, that same game also shows her [[CharacterDevelopment growing through this mental block]] and becoming a BadassPacifist instead, using her strength to protect the people she cares about. Terra's characterization in the ''[[VideoGame/DissidiaFinalFantasy Dissidia]]'' series turns her into a straight-up ApologeticAttacker, despite the crux of her character development in ''VI'' itself revolving around getting over this.

to:

** Terra is sometimes remembered as an ActualPacifist, or as someone who despises violence so strongly that she'll refuse to fight even if there's no other choice. This is based on her scenes when she's found in the World of Ruin, where she struggles with her [[MamaBear growing feelings of maternal love for some orphaned children]]. However, that same game also shows her [[CharacterDevelopment growing through this mental block]] and becoming a BadassPacifist MartialPacifist instead, using her strength to protect the people she cares about. Terra's characterization in the ''[[VideoGame/DissidiaFinalFantasy Dissidia]]'' series turns her into a straight-up ApologeticAttacker, despite the crux of her character development in ''VI'' itself revolving around getting over this.
17th Oct '17 8:01:34 AM KingLyger
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

** Locke's sidequest in the World of Ruin revolves around him trying to find the Phoenix magicite to bring his dead fiancée Rachael back to life. Due to some of the language used during the quest, Locke came off to a few players as a bit creepy and clingy, and being incapable of letting go. But the way some fans hold this over his head, one would think Locke was a [[ILoveTheDead necrophiliac]].
This list shows the last 10 events of 674. Show all.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=NeverLiveItDown.VideoGames