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I feel like {{Foreshadowing}} is a trope that mostly belongs in the main page of a work. Things like [[spoiler:Sylvester\'s true identity can be summed up shortly in KingIncognito]] for instance.
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I feel like {{Foreshadowing}} is a trope that mostly belongs in the main page of a work. Things like [[spoiler:Sylvester\\\'s identity can be summed up shortly in KingIncognito]] for instance.
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Democracy didn\'t \
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Democracy didn\\\'t \\\"fail.\\\" It got blown up. Again, the \\\"problems\\\" with both the Old and New Republics weren\\\'t that the governments didn\\\'t work, it\\\'s that they were manipulated and destroyed.
You believe he\\\'ll stay dead until he doesn\\\'t. This trope page is about \\\'\\\'this\\\'\\\' movie. Not hypothetical future movies. Is ROTJ retroactively an EsotericHappyEnding because we didn\\\'t know for sure that the heroes would live happily ever after? Is \\\'\\\'every\\\'\\\' movie an EsotericHappyEnding because we don\\\'t see the full scale of their lives after the film, and therefore don\\\'t know that everything turns out OK?
She doesn\\\'t have to say anything. She certainly doesn\\\'t say, \\\"Now that Ben is gone, I am doomed to loneliness and can\\\'t have any sense of family,\\\" but you seem to be taking it as an absolute given.
Yes, she has a clear loss. But she has also very clearly gained a lot.
This does not qualify it as EsotericHappyEnding. Please read that trope more thoroughly. It\\\'s clearly when what the author intends as a happy ending is read as not happy at all. There are elements of clear, unambiguous happy ending here -- First Order and Palpatine defeated, the main trio of heroes is alive and well, the Jedi continue.
Are there elements that make it bittersweet? Yes. Yes, I agree with you that it is not a perfect, happy, storybook ending for all involved. But that makes it a BittersweetEnding -- which, again, is already on the main page -- not an EsotericHappyEnding.
You believe he\\\'ll stay dead until he doesn\\\'t. This trope page is about \\\'\\\'this\\\'\\\' movie. Not hypothetical future movies. Is ROTJ retroactively an EsotericHappyEnding because we didn\\\'t know for sure that the heroes would live happily ever after? Is \\\'\\\'every\\\'\\\' movie an EsotericHappyEnding because we don\\\'t see the full scale of their lives after the film, and therefore don\\\'t know that everything turns out OK?
She doesn\\\'t have to say anything. She certainly doesn\\\'t say, \\\"Now that Ben is gone, I am doomed to loneliness and can\\\'t have any sense of family,\\\" but you seem to be taking it as an absolute given.
Yes, she has a clear loss. But she has also very clearly gained a lot.
This does not qualify it as EsotericHappyEnding. Please read that trope more thoroughly. It\\\'s clearly when what the author intends as a happy ending is read as not happy at all. There are elements of clear, unambiguous happy ending here -- First Order and Palpatine defeated, the main trio of heroes is alive and well, the Jedi continue.
Are there elements that make it bittersweet? Yes. Yes, I agree with you that it is not a perfect, happy, storybook ending for all involved. But that makes it a BittersweetEnding -- which, again, is already on the main page -- not an EsotericHappyEnding.
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Democracy didn\'t \
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Democracy didn\\\'t \\\"fail.\\\" It got blown up. Again, the \\\"problems\\\" with both the Old and New Republics weren\\\'t that the governments didn\\\'t work, it\\\'s that they were manipulated and destroyed.
It\\\'s like arguing the human body is a failure because someone came by and shot
You believe he\\\'ll stay dead until he doesn\\\'t. This trope page is about \\\'\\\'this\\\'\\\' movie. Not hypothetical future movies. Is ROTJ retroactively an EsotericHappyEnding because we didn\\\'t know for sure that the heroes would live happily ever after? Is \\\'\\\'every\\\'\\\' movie an EsotericHappyEnding because we don\\\'t see the full scale of their lives after the film, and therefore don\\\'t know that everything turns out OK?
She doesn\\\'t have to say anything. She certainly doesn\\\'t say, \\\"Now that Ben is gone, I am doomed to loneliness and can\\\'t have any sense of family,\\\" but you seem to be taking it as an absolute given.
Yes, she has a clear loss. But she has also very clearly gained a lot.
This does not qualify it as EsotericHappyEnding. Please read that trope more thoroughly. It\\\'s clearly when what the author intends as a happy ending is read as not happy at all. There are elements of clear, unambiguous happy ending here -- First Order and Palpatine defeated, the main trio of heroes is alive and well, the Jedi continue.
Are there elements that make it bittersweet? Yes. Yes, I agree with you that it is not a perfect, happy, storybook ending for all involved. But that makes it a BittersweetEnding -- which, again, is already on the main page -- not an EsotericHappyEnding.
It\\\'s like arguing the human body is a failure because someone came by and shot
You believe he\\\'ll stay dead until he doesn\\\'t. This trope page is about \\\'\\\'this\\\'\\\' movie. Not hypothetical future movies. Is ROTJ retroactively an EsotericHappyEnding because we didn\\\'t know for sure that the heroes would live happily ever after? Is \\\'\\\'every\\\'\\\' movie an EsotericHappyEnding because we don\\\'t see the full scale of their lives after the film, and therefore don\\\'t know that everything turns out OK?
She doesn\\\'t have to say anything. She certainly doesn\\\'t say, \\\"Now that Ben is gone, I am doomed to loneliness and can\\\'t have any sense of family,\\\" but you seem to be taking it as an absolute given.
Yes, she has a clear loss. But she has also very clearly gained a lot.
This does not qualify it as EsotericHappyEnding. Please read that trope more thoroughly. It\\\'s clearly when what the author intends as a happy ending is read as not happy at all. There are elements of clear, unambiguous happy ending here -- First Order and Palpatine defeated, the main trio of heroes is alive and well, the Jedi continue.
Are there elements that make it bittersweet? Yes. Yes, I agree with you that it is not a perfect, happy, storybook ending for all involved. But that makes it a BittersweetEnding -- which, again, is already on the main page -- not an EsotericHappyEnding.
