Discussion History Characters / GameOfThronesHouseStarkChildren

I support the removal of the GeniusBruiser trope. I think Show!Jon is of average intelligence -- not above or below the curve. In regard to the Tyrion example, Jon just asks him why he reads so much -- which is a fair question, Tyrion \'\'does\'\' read a lot and he answers Jon, \"What you see is a dwarf. If I\'d been born a peasant they might\'ve left me out in the woods to die. Alas, I was born a Lannister of Casterly Rock. Things are expected of me [...] I must do my part for the honor of my house, wouldn\'t you agree? But how? Well, my brother has his sword and I have my mind. And a mind needs books like a sword needs a whetstone. That\'s why I read so much.\"

That makes perfect sense -- this is Tyrion\'s focus and what he feels he can contribute. This doesn\'t say anything about Jon\'s intelligence but Tyrion\'s.

I am not arguing for the re-addition of GeniusBruiser and I agree with the AdaptationalIntelligence example as written on the page. But I definitely think calling Jon \'dumb\' is {{YMMV}} because it is an opinion, it is not stated by the show or those behind the show, and it is not representative of all views of this character. I think it\'s more an opinion, and that\'s fine. To my knowledge, his knowledge in his book studies or education is never commented on in the show as per BookDumb\'s trope description. I think Show!Jon is just of average intelligence -- not remarkable on either side of the spectrum.

Yes, in the show, Sam is the one to ask Jon to send him to the citadel but I don\'t see this as a comment on intelligence either way. It just is. Sam asks him and Jon says yes. In regard to Ramsay, Jon acts in a moment of sheer emotion and impulsiveness, definitely -- which I think is understandable because it\'s his brother being threatened and murdered. But it doesn\'t mean he, as a whole, is dumb as impulsiveness does not equal stupid. It can result in dumbass decisions and the decision to charge was a poor choice borne out of terrible circumstances. Many characters on this show, as well as people, behave rashly after a tragedy.

I would certainly not argue Jon is adept in PR or political strategy -- not all smart or average people are adept in those things. PR, political savvy, and diplomacy are skills, not a requirement of intelligence -- Jon\'s arguments are still correct: the army of the dead is coming for everyone and they need resources or they\'re all screwed.

In regard to the authenticity of the cave paintings, I have no comment. The show doesn\'t say they\'re fake and I have no argument for or against. Bran and the viewer only know the true story because Bran witnesses it via powers Jon and the rest of Westeros do not have access to.

I just think he\'s an average guy -- not nearly as smart as his book counterpart but not dumb either.

I support the removal of the GeniusBruiser trope. I think Show!Jon is of average intelligence -- not above or below the curve. In regard to the Tyrion example, Jon just asks him why he reads so much -- which is a fair question, Tyrion \'\'does\'\' read a lot and he answers Jon, \"What you see is a dwarf. If I\'d been born a peasant they might\'ve left me out in the woods to die. Alas, I was born a Lannister of Casterly Rock. Things are expected of me [...] I must do my part for the honor of my house, wouldn\'t you agree? But how? Well, my brother has his sword and I have my mind. And a mind needs books like a sword needs a whetstone. That\'s why I read so much.\"

That makes perfect sense -- this is Tyrion\'s focus and what he feels he can contribute. This doesn\'t say anything about Jon\'s intelligence but Tyrion\'s.

I am not arguing for the re-addition of GeniusBruiser and I agree with the AdaptationalIntelligence example as written on the page. But I definitely think calling Jon \'dumb\' is {{YMMV}} because it is an opinion, it is not stated by the show or those behind the show, and it is not representative of all views of this character. I think it\'s more an opinion, and that\'s fine. To my knowledge, his knowledge in his book studies or education is never commented on in the show as per BookDumb\'s trope description. I think Show!Jon is just of average intelligence -- not remarkable on either side of the spectrum.

Yes, in the show, Sam is the one to ask Jon to send him to the citadel but I don\'t see this as a comment on intelligence either way. It just is. Sam asks him and Jon says yes. In regard to Ramsay, Jon acts in a moment of sheer emotion and impulsiveness, definitely -- which I think is understandable because it\'s his brother being threatened and murdered. But it doesn\'t mean he, as a whole, is dumb as impulsiveness does not equal stupid. It can result in dumbass decisions and the decision to charge was a poor choice borne out of terrible circumstances. Many characters on this show, as well as people, behave rashly after a tragedy.

I would certainly not argue Jon is adept in PR or political strategy -- not all smart or average people are adept in those things. PR, political savvy, and diplomacy are skills, not a requirement of intelligence -- Jon\'s arguments are still correct: the army of the dead is coming for everyone and they need resources or they\'re all screwed.

In regard to the authenticity of the cave paintings, I have no comment. The show doesn\'t say they\'re fake and I have no argument for or against.

I just think he\'s an average guy -- not nearly as smart as his book counterpart but not dumb either.

I support the removal of the GeniusBruiser trope. I think Show!Jon is of average intelligence -- not above or below the curve. In regard to the Tyrion example, Jon just asks him why he reads so much -- which is a fair question, Tyrion \'\'does\'\' read a lot and he answers Jon, \"What you see is a dwarf. If I\'d been born a peasant they might\'ve left me out in the woods to die. Alas, I was born a Lannister of Casterly Rock. Things are expected of me [...] I must do my part for the honor of my house, wouldn\'t you agree? But how? Well, my brother has his sword and I have my mind. And a mind needs books like a sword needs a whetstone. That\'s why I read so much.\"

That makes perfect sense -- this is Tyrion\'s focus and what he feels he can contribute. This doesn\'t say anything about Jon\'s intelligence but Tyrion\'s.

I am not arguing for the re-addition of GeniusBruiser and I agree with the AdaptationalIntelligence example as written on the page. But I definitely think calling Jon \'dumb\' is {{YMMV}} because it is an opinion, it is not stated by the show or those behind the show, and it is not representative of all views of this character. I think it\'s more an opinion, and that\'s fine. To my knowledge, his knowledge in his book studies or education is never commented on in the show as per BookDumb\'s trope description. I think Show!Jon is just of average intelligence -- not remarkable on either side of the spectrum.

Yes, in the show, Sam is the one to ask Jon to send him to the citadel but I don\'t see this as a comment on intelligence either way. It just is. Sam asks him and Jon says yes. In regard to Ramsay, Jon acts in a moment of sheer emotion and impulsiveness, definitely -- which I think is understandable because it\'s his brother being threatened and murdered. But it doesn\'t mean he, as a whole, is dumb as impulsiveness does not equal stupid. It can result in dumbass decisions and the decision to charge was a poor choice though borne out of terrible circumstances. Many characters on this show, as well as people, behave rashly after a tragedy.

I would certainly not argue Jon is adept in PR or political strategy -- not all smart or average people are adept in those things. PR, political savvy, and diplomacy are skills, not a requirement of intelligence -- Jon\'s arguments are still correct: the army of the dead is coming for everyone and they need resources or they\'re all screwed.

In regard to the authenticity of the cave paintings, I have no comment. The show doesn\'t say they\'re fake and I have no argument for or against.

I just think he\'s an average guy -- not nearly as smart as his book counterpart but not dumb either.