One Piece

I feel like this entire conversation is running on false premises, so let me go over some basic points.

This one implies Oda dreamt of worldwide distribution in 2000, which feels really unrealistic. I don't know about the rest of the world, but manga only really started selling in Brazil in 2002, which's already whole two years after Ace showed off his tattoo.

There is nothing "previous" about the manji. It's not some ancient symbol that fell unused until Hitler fished it up from the depths. The manji is and always was THE Buddhist symbol, on the exact same level as the holy cross is THE Christian symbol. Just look at any map◊ and you'll manjis being used to mark the locations of Buddhist temples the exact same way crosses are used to mark the location of churches. And this is not a Japan-exclusive convention by any means. I've already seen manji being used to mark Buddhist temples on Brazilian maps, too.

I understand the HUGE difference in chronological distance that undersells this example, but this sounds exactly as fair and reasonable as saying "America sorta doesn't mind Crusader imagery" because we still use the holy cross in a lot of things.

Again, I really don't believe Oda was expecting One Piece to be printed in non-Asian lands back then, but really, this is in no way a change that happened because the West is sensitive. It's a change that happened because the West is, to this day, generally ignorant about the world's second-biggest religion. Which is an implication I was equally uncomfortable in making but I feel so proven wrong right now.

There are rumors that the anime will be getting a new Opening soon with insane animation. Also, here is a tweet from a western animator that has worked with Warner Brothers and Disney that he's submitted a cut for One Piece.

I think the Gear 5 episode(s) are going to be insane.

Heck, Oda is even just now introducing God’s Knights, so clearly he’s even willing to introduce mysteries, hints to bigger things, and holding off on certain info as long as possible even now.

Edited by electricmastro on May 28th 2023 at 10:28:17 AM

Comun. I apologize if I was "running on false premises" but I would in my defense, say I was MISTAKEN rather than lying or something like that.

Random thought: what if Vivi turns out to be a fan of Brook’s Soul King music

Don't worry about it, I never accused anyone here of lying. This is really not a conversation where I'd expect malice out of anyone. It's just the East/West cultural divide not crumbling as fast as I'd have hoped it to, I guess.

I feel sympathy for you but I dont feel its going to crumble THAT FAST. The Crusades were centuries ago and while its insanely unfair that an innocent symbol got maliciously appropiated its a bit unrealistic to just expect people to just forget that association this quickly.

Edited by AegisP on May 28th 2023 at 11:15:35 AM

Is there a trope for "main villain who starts relatively weak but goes on their own character arc to grow stronger opposite the protagonist"? It seems very specific, but Blackbeard and Shigaraki (from My Hero Academia) are two great examples and I'm wondering if there are more.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on May 28th 2023 at 11:18:51 AM

I don't think so, but I know the opposite. Villain Forgot to Level Grind. I don't think that's a common trope yet, considering Tomura's arc is the unique arrangement that made My Hero Academia feel special to me back in the day. But MHA is a huge hit series, so hopefully, Tomura is influential enough to generate more villains like this. Well, speaking of direct Tomura expies, Jujutsu Kaisen has Mahito who also evolves alongside the protagonist for a big stretch of the series but unfortunately doesn't make it to the final arc.

Hmm. I dunno if BB should really be considered the starting out weak type anyway? I think it'd be more accurate to say they just keep up with the heroes, OP does this with some defeated villains too. Then again Shiggy Diggy wasn't weak either, they just got way stronger too.

Edited by alekos23 on May 28th 2023 at 9:33:01 PM

Yeah, by "relatively weak" I just mean in comparison to how strong they will be by the end.

Blackbeard is interesting to me because I still think the introduction of Haki undid one of the things that initially made him so scary. The fact that he could just turn off devil fruits and hit logia users.

I get that turning off devil fruits is still a massive advantage, but the way it's introduced, the fact that he could hit ace was one of the big "oh shit" moments.

Rather peculiar what final villain he may turn out to be.

Yes but he easily made up for that Early-Installment Weirdness by becoming the first person to wield two devil fruits. And he did it by doing something horrifying to Whitebeard that is still chilling to this day.

I hope the final fight is just Blackbeard holding Luffy by the wrist and beating him down with his tremor-tremor infused free hand for a while. XD

Clearly he ate him if Linlin's flashback is to be believed.

Edited by GNinja on May 28th 2023 at 8:13:30 AM

I am genuinely really curious how the Dark Dark Fruit will interact with Luffy. It's not like Haki, if he touches a stretched Luffy will he simply revert to normal or will it mess him up cause humans aren't meant to be stretchy?

There's a moment in Impel Down that I think was filler but it got me thinking.

So, you know how Gear 2 involves pumping so much blood through luffy's body that it's like doping, and the only reason it works is because his arteries and veins are made of rubber and thus can stretch to accomodate the blood flow?

Does that mean if Blackbeard grabbed luffy while he's in Gear 2 his veins would explode?

Edited by GNinja on May 28th 2023 at 8:27:55 AM

The reason Blackbeard's Dark-Dark Fruit is supposed to be scary is it completely shuts down a Devil Fruit. Haki doesn't do that - Someone using Haki can hit Luffy and it'll hurt like normal, but Luffy will still be made of rubber. Water and sea prism stone doesn't do it either - Luffy will lose energy and be unable to move, but he's still made of rubber and can still be stretched, as we saw in Arlong Park.

Blackbeard's fruit goes the extra mile. While he's touching Luffy, Luffy ceases to be made of rubber anymore.

I'm pretty sure the Impel Down moment isn't filler. I remember a podcast that was reading through the manga and they commented on that scene specifically.

Edited by diddyknux on May 28th 2023 at 3:34:26 AM

does that mean if Blackbeard touches Chopper he'd become a regular reindeer again? That'd be a pretty terrifying spot.

honestly Chopper is pretty weird as far as Zoans go. We still haven't seen a fully human form right? unless there's been some SBS stuff.

Chopper's Heavy Point is his human form. He doesn't have a form that literally makes him look like a human, that's one of the things that makes his backstory so sad - after eating his Devil Fruit, he couldn't fit in anywhere, with reindeer or humans.

Blackbeard did grab Luffy in the manga:

Luffy's even in Gear 2.

Ah, so grabbing luffy while he's in gear 2 doesn't make his veins explode. A shame. I think that'd be really cool.

I do think grabbing him in Gear 3 or 4 could have some VERY bad effects, though.

I think I'd also be very concerned about what would happen to Brook if he gets caught by Blackbeard.

And even with Haki, most DF users use the powers a lot in their fighting styles, so them suddenly shutting down would be a serious challenge.