Google "big ears"
I was just wondering the other, what's up with Underground Lake?
Such a weird stage because for the life of me i can't recall a single instance of fighting inside a gigantic cave unless maybe you count the Babidi henchmen gauntlet in early Buu saga.
I don't know, i would have any other stage like Lookout or Artic instead of Underground Lake.
Uni cat
Frieza's level 3 is kinda cool but I gotta agree that it's not super exciting.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
The fight against Beerus in Battle of Gods, specifically the movie version.
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
You know, the gameplay value could have been better, but I think making Saibaman into part of Nappa's moveset is one of the most interesting and creative things that this game did, and I wish they did more stuff like that.
Ginyu summoning the Ginyu Force is also great, but something that other games have done before, actually making the Saibamen into part of Nappa's moveset was inspired. One thing that I really wanted to see was for Cell to have something like that, with spawning Cell Jrs as a special move. He probably would have if Cell hadn't been one of the first characters developed for the game, probably long before Nappa was developed. Here's my idea for a Cell Jr move:
- Cell should have a 22L/M/H special move where he spawns a Cell Jr like how Nappa spawns Saibamen. The Cell Jrs have four attacks: a punch, a Destructo Disk, a Kamehameha, and a Kikoho (the Cell Jr is injured after using the Kikoho and vanishes). The L does punch, Destructo Disk, Kikoho. The M does punch, Kamehameha, Kikoho. The H does punch, Destructo Disk, punch, Kamehameha, Kikoho, or a mashed series of 5 buttons. For the mashing, L is punch, M is Destructo Disk, H is Kokoho, and S is Kamehameha.
The King Without a Kingdom
Goku Black and Android 18 also had lackey-summoning moves.
It's been 3000 years…
Google "big ears"
Would you really count your brother and your immortal alt version as "lackeys"?
Uni cat
Not really a lord of anything
The downside to summon based movesets is that they're very gimmicky and difficult to convert into a fun playstyle in a game as fast paced and full of mobility as this one.
Being centered around a singular gimmick tends to be a problem for characters in this game, because it's difficult to compete against the character who are just built to do everything reasonably well. And in regards to this specific gimmick, 18 is the only one with it that they made who - straight out the bat - succeeded in implementing it well. The other two needed constant fine tuning and eventually outright changes to not be terrible, and they obviously can't just keep remaking 18 exactly.
So while I would love to see more cool summon characters (I had a neat idea for a Goten + Trunks character, for instance, though I guess it was more Chang + Choi-esque
), I don't know if they should keep doing it if they have such problems handling the idea.
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
Zamasu is also barely in Goku Black's moveset, only summoned for two moves.
In other news, I'm crazy. I made a full moveset for Monkey D. Luffy as a guest fighter. Not a partial moveset like what I usually make where it's just the special moves and Supers, no, I mean a full moveset. I genuinely think Luffy would make for a really awesome and unique character in this game as a guest fighter.
Luffy
Because almost all of his Light, Medium, and Heavy moves are already long-range in some form, his Special button does Haki moves.
Super Dash: Gum-Gum Rocket. Luffy grabs his opponent with both hands during the normal start-up frames and launches forward. Luffy's arms are intangible, there's no mechanical difference between this and every other Super Dash.
Reflect: Gum-Gum Balloon.
5L/5LL: Gum-Gum Pistol/Gum-Gum Pistol Shotgun. Luffy throws a stretching punch forwards. If L is pressed again, Luffy "twangs" his arm to make his fist bounce back and forth to punch 10 times quickly. The 214X buff lasts for the 5LL.
2L: Gum-Gum Stamp. Luffy stretches his foot forward to kick the opponent.
5M: Gum-Gum Rifle. Luffy stretches his arm back while twisting it and punches forward, spinning his fist.
2M: Gum-Gum Whip. Luffy stretches his leg to do a sweeping low kick.
6M: Gum-Gum Spear. Luffy jumps into the air, puts his feet together and stabs the opponent into the ground.
5H: Gum-Gum Bazooka. Can be held for Luffy to stretch his arms back longer, making the attack fly further forward and hit harder.
2H/2HH: Gum-Gum Volcano/Gum-Gum Battle Axe. Luffy shoots his foot into the air. Pressing 2H a second time has Luffy bring his foot down as a powerful axe-kick. The 214X buff lasts for the 2HH.
6H: Gum-Gum Bell. A command grab. Luffy grabs the front of the opponent, wrapping his arms and legs around them, stretches his head back and headbutts them, knocking them away.
j.5L: Gum-Gum Pistol. Luffy throws a stretching punch.
j.2L: Gum-Gum Pistol (aimed straight down). If enhanced with Gear 2, Luffy vanishes to be above the opponent when using this.
j.5M: Gum-Gum Whip. Luffy stretches out with a wide sweeping kick.
j.5H: Gum-Gum Spear. Luffy puts his feet together and stabs the opponent into the ground.
j.2H: Gum-Gum UFO. Luffy winds up his body and spins his legs around like a propeller, moving him forward and upwards.
j.6H: Gum-Gum Hammer. An air command grab. Luffy grabs the opponent from a distance with his legs and slams them into the ground.
5S, j.5S: Observation Haki command spot-dodge.
2S, j.2S: Observation Haki physical counter-attack.
6S, j.6S: Observation Haki command dodge. Luffy moves forward while dodging.
236S: Conqueror's Haki. A massive shockwave that stuns opponents but does no damage.
236L/M/H (Air OK): Gum-Gum Gatling. L goes half-screen, M and H are 2/3rds-screen. H version is Gum-Gum Cannon, where the Gatling is followed up with a Bazooka. The j.236L/M/H version of this move aims downwards.
214L/M/H/S (Air OK): Enhances his next L, M, or H attack with Gear 2, Gear 3, and/or Armament Haki. The start-up for all of the versions is the same, and it's fast enough that it can be used mid-combo. This move cannot be used if an effect from it is already active, with the exception of using 214H after already using 214M or 214S. Aside from 214S, this also changes Luffy's voiceline when using the enhanced attack.
- L is Gear 2. It increases damage by 10%, and makes the attack much faster and have instant travel time. Before attacking, Luffy is much faster and his forward dash, back dash, and airdash turn into a quick vanish.
- M is Gear 3. It increases damage by 20%, makes the attack gigantic, and the attack deflects weak projectiles. Before attacking, Luffy is immune to weak projectiles.
- S is Armament Haki. It increases damage by 10%, and makes the attack have 1 hit of Super Armor and do high chip damage. Before attacking, Luffy takes 50% less damage and takes no chip damage on block.
- H is both Gear 3 and Armament Haki. It increases damage by 30%, makes the attack gigantic, deflect weak projectiles, have 1 hit of Super Armor, and do high chip damage. Before attacking, Luffy is immune to weak projectiles, takes 50% less damage, and takes no chip damage on block.
214L+S Level 0.5 (Air OK): Functions like a variation of 214H. Enhances Luffy with both Gear 2 and Armament Haki. This move can be used after using 214L or 214S to add the other effect. Increases damage by 20%, makes the attack much faster, have instant travel time, have 1 hit of Super Armor, and does high chip damage. Before attacking, Luffy is much faster, his dash is a vanish, he takes 50% less damage, and takes no chip damage on block.
236L+M or 236H+S Level 1: Gum-Gum Red Hawk. Combines Gear 2 and Armament Haki (somehow getting lit on fire) for a flaming punch that releases a giant fireball on impact.
j.236L+M or j.236H+S Level 1: Gum-Gum Thor Elephant Gun. Combines Gear 3 and Armament Haki (somehow getting charged with lightning) for a giant punch from above that creates a large electric explosion on impact.
Level 3: Gear 4. Gear 4 functions like a temporary transformation Super, with a completely different and more simplistic moveset than Luffy normally has. It is designed to be overwhelmingly powerful for the short time Luffy can use it. While using either Gear 4, Luffy has infinite airdashes and double-jumps. Luffy takes reduced damage and no chip damage on block. Luffy's meter build is much slower while in Gear 4. Only one Gear 4 move actually costs meter: a cinematic Level 1 Super, which is also a finisher that automatically ends the form. Culverin can be redirected multiple times with "Python" by pressing a direction while the attack is in motion. Culverin stays out as long as the button is pressed. For 10 seconds after Gear 4 ends, Luffy cannot use any of his S moves, his Supers, or his 214H.
214L+M Level 3: Boundman. Boundman is much larger than normal. Boundman has Super Armor on all attacks. Luffy takes 75% less damage while using Boundman. If Luffy is hit by an attack while in Boundman, it knocks the opponent back. Luffy can input 214L+M again to cancel out of Boundman early. Luffy can input 214H+S to change to Snakeman for 1 bar of meter. Changing to Snakeman adds 3 seconds to the time limit.
- L and j.L: Gum-Gum Kong Gun.
- M and j.M: Gum-Gum Rhino Schneider.
- H and j.H: Gum-Gum Leo Bazooka.
- S and j.S: Gum-Gum Culverin. Python attacks slow down a little each time they're redirected.
- 236L/M/H (Air OK): Gum-Gum Kong Organ.
- 236L+M or 236H+S (Air OK): Gum-Gum King Kong Gun.
214H+S Level 3: Snakeman. Snakeman is slightly smaller than Boundman. Snakeman is much faster than Boundman, but doesn't have Super Armor. Luffy takes 50% less damage while using Snakeman. I had to make up moves for Snakeman's L, M, and H moves. Luffy can input 214H+S again to cancel out of Snakeman early. Luffy can input 214L+M to change to Boundman for 1 bar of meter. Changing to Boundman adds 3 seconds to the time limit.
- L and j.L: Gum-Gum Cobra
- M and j.M Gum-Gum Jet Rhino Schneider
- H and j.H: Gum-Gum Jet Leo Bazooka
- S and j.S: Gum-Gum Jet Culverin. Python attacks speed up each time they're redirected.
- 236L/M/H (Air OK): Gum-Gum Black Mamba.
- 236L+M or 236H+S (Air OK): Gum-Gum King Cobra.
Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Mar 12th 2020 at 5:11:24 AM
A guest character would work as someone who fits on neither the hero or villain sides.
Not really a lord of anything
Didn't Arc Sys already make a crossover game between Dragon Ball and One Piece?
I could see them doing Luffy as a callback to that.
This song needs more love.
I think you mean Extreme Butoden and that One Piece 3DS fighter. They had some connectivity, yeah.
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
Yes, and I constantly bring that up as an argument for why the next anime Arcsys game might be a Fighterz-esque One Piece game meant to have cross-play with Fighterz.
Google "big ears"
Granblue Fantasy Versus already beat you to it
Uni cat
It ain't anime unless there are air dashes.
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
In what way? Granblue started as a game series, and while it has an anime, it's so far removed from Dragon Ball and One Piece that it's hardly comparable. Maybe a One Piece game won't be "the next" anime fighting game by Arcsys, but that's just nitpicking, you know that's not what I meant.
What I was clearly saying was "instead of a Fighterz 2, I think the follow-up to Fighterz could be a One Piece game with cross-play between the two".
Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Mar 12th 2020 at 6:06:27 AM
Google "big ears"
Eh, to each their own. I would rather they stick to Fighterz.
Although i won't deny a OP game would be really cool
Uni cat
On the crossover track, I wonder if Blue could be Arale...
Another one that's probably no chance, but still. Fun to think about.
Goku Black doesn't have a summon. He has what is effectively a full screen grab with a cool decal. It's like how Tien doesn't actually multiply himself in gameplay, just has regular moves that use the idea as flavor.
Edited by KnownUnknown on Mar 12th 2020 at 9:28:58 AM
"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
IHE
I also wanted to point out that Zamasu doesn't even have hurtbox.
I forgot if the Ginyu Force doesn't have one either. The only thing I know for sure is that Burter & Jeice's Hurricane move is completely invincible.
I would just for the sake of being an ass.
Granted, I didn't play enough CVS 2 to know if they were either busted or trash & the game is very different from Fighterz, but if CVS can do it then why couldn't Fighterz pull it off?
I also could've sworn someone fought like that in the new Granblue fighting game.
Why would they need to be neutral exactly?
Yes, and I constantly bring that up as an argument for why the next anime Arcsys game might be a Fighterz-esque One Piece game meant to have cross-play with Fighterz.I really rather have Arc develop the next Jump crossover game.
One Piece isn't in dire need of a good game.
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
Why would they need to be neutral exactly?
Because the CSS is divided in halves with one half being heroes and the other half being villains. Although, that doesn't completely hold true, given that 18 is on the villains' side for some reason. They could easily just add villains and rearrange the CSS again to put her on the good guy's side.
The Head of the Hydra
Actually One Piece's recent game librarary isn't the best.
Pirate Warriors are enjoyable for the most part but their warrior games so they get pretty stale easy, Burning Blood made no impact at all despite trying to be a fighting game, & World Seeker was a complete letdown.
OP could use a real quality game.
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
There is (though it's worth noting that Granblue is a significantly more traditional fighter than anything else Arcsys has ever made), but there's a lot of good differences there that show why Lowain (and 18) worked and guys like Nappa and Ginyu needed a lot of work to keep from being a mess.
Ever since Faust (and later Jack-O) in Guilty Gear, Arcsys games have traditionally each had a character whose gimmick is that they put a lot of stuff on the screen that acts independently of the character. Those characters sometimes have a hint of randomness to them, sometimes don't, but it's always either in the name of set-up or screen control.
Lowain is a lot like 18. While both can use their stuff-on-screen to zone and such, they're there to lock the opponent down and cover the characters' other stuff. It's not that that particular approach is the way to go, but that the big difference is that with Lowain (and 18) that had a very strong idea of what they wanted all that stuff-on-screen to do and made sure the character could do that first and foremost, so that it all worked with the character.
Ginyu on the other hand was meant for screen control, but one of his primary problems from the beginning was that he had next to nothing outside of the specific Force gimmick, which he had only partial control over and which he could only use one at a time, making it less than optimal for controlling the screen (not helped by the limited range of things he could do with the Force at first, meaning it was easier for the opponent to just get around them). He was bad at doing the thing he was specifically made to do. Nearly all the tweaks he's ever gotten (including finally getting a proper level 3) have been attempts to both give him stuff he can actually do and make each member of the Force better at actually affecting the screen. It took a lot of work.
Nappa had the same problem. The Saibamen just weren't good at the thing they were implemented to accomplish, and Nappa himself had little options outside of that because he was made specifically for the gimmick, requiring lots and lots of re-design and patches.
"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
The Head of the Hydra
Wait was Nappa's gimmick? It's just the Saibamen?
Edited by slimcoder on Mar 13th 2020 at 1:07:43 AM
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
IHE
Well for me it wasn't, but the Saibaman gimmick did make me glad I did make him my main. Even though I don't use it often.
But yea, it does pop a lot on why Nappa isn't worth it. That being said, unlike Ginyu I always thought Nappa never had to rely on the Saibaman to be a fun character.
That so trivial. If there's a guest character they could easily just place them in the middle.
Actually One Piece's recent game librarary isn't the best.
Pirate Warriors are enjoyable for the most part but their warrior games so they get pretty stale easy, Burning Blood made no impact at all despite trying to be a fighting game, & World Seeker was a complete letdown.
OP could use a real quality game.
Huh, didn't know that.
Regardless, I still rather Arc develop a Jump game than a One Piece.
Just googled him.
Man, he would not be out of place in GG.
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
New V-Jump scans for UI Goku. Seems like he might be a stance-focused character, with dodges, counters, invincible reversals, and combo moves. The only move mentioned in the magazine that isn't from UI Goku appears to be that unblockable move with the multiple ki balls, that's something base Goku used against Rozie.
Well, I'm pretty sure Cage of Light didn't have a ceiling in the anime, it just went all the way up. At least, a ceiling was never a plot point, so it wouldn't make sense to be part of the move in a fighting game context.
One idea I considered was having Grand Death Beam and Cage of Light being Golden Freeza-exclusive moves, making the cost to unlock them higher.